In this episode of Faith & Clarity, Dr. Mark Turman is joined by author and attorney Talmage Boston for a conversation on leadership, history, and faith, drawing on Talmage's book How the Best Did It, which examines eight of America's top-ranked presidents based largely on C-SPAN historian polls. Talmage explains why he studies history not just for facts, but for wisdom, and how that approach makes the leadership lessons of past presidents surprisingly relevant for today's challenges. He and Mark dig into George Washington's singular legacy as the unanimous choice for four nation-shaping roles, exploring his gift for unifying collaboration, his humility, and his quiet but steady faith, while also acknowledging the hard complexities of his relationship to slavery. The conversation then turns to Abraham Lincoln, whose unmatched breadth of leadership traits—magnanimity, equanimity, and resilience—were shaped by a difficult marriage, profound personal loss, and a faith that deepened over time, culminating in the haunting humility of his second inaugural address. They close with a look at John F. Kennedy, tracing his growth as a leader after the failure at the Bay of Pigs, his steady crisis leadership during the Cuban Missile Crisis, his moral framing of the civil rights movement, and the unique pressures of leading in a new media age as the nation's first Catholic president. Talmage ends with a call for listeners to lead with integrity and pursue bridge-building in an age of deep polarization. Topics(0:00) Introduction (4:34) Early leadership fascination (9:11) Why leadership matters (12:58) Washington leadership traits (19:52) Washington slavery tension (24:30) Washington faith influence (26:48) Lincoln genius and humility (30:13) New Lincoln book honesty (47:21) JFK learning curve (54:23) Celebrity presidency era (57:11) First Catholic president (1:00:04) Choosing leaders today (1:04:35) Conclusion ResourcesTalmage BostonAsk Us Anything: info@denisonforum.orgSign-up for a Denison Forum newsletter: DenisonForum.org/subscribeAbout Talmage BostonTalmage Boston has spent the last 48 years balancing two high-profile careers: one of Dallas's top commercial litigators and an acclaimed author of books on baseball, law, and the American presidency. A partner at Shackelford, Bowen, McKinley & Norton, LLP, he has been board certified in Civil Trial Law and Civil Appellate Law by the Texas Board of Legal Specialization, and has prevailed in trials and appellate courts throughout Texas, including the Texas Supreme Court and the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit. He has been named a Texas Super Lawyer every year since 2003 and listed among the Best Lawyers in America every year since 2013. Boston's unique footing in both law and history made him uniquely qualified to write his latest book, How the Best Did It: Leadership Lessons From Our Top Presidents, which draws leadership lessons from America's greatest presidents and applies them to leaders today. His other acclaimed books include Cross-Examining History (foreword by Ken Burns), Raising the Bar (foreword by former U.S. Attorney General Dick Thornburgh), Baseball and the Baby Boomer (foreword by Frank Deford), and 1939: Baseball's Tipping Point (foreword by John Grisham). He received both his undergraduate and law degrees from the University of Texas at Austin. About Dr. Mark TurmanDr. Mark Turman serves as the Executive Director of Denison Forum, where he leads with a passion for equipping believers to navigate today’s complex culture with biblical truth. He is best known as the host of the Faith & Clarity podcast and the lead pastor of the Possum Kingdom Lake Chapel, the in-person congregation of Denison Ministries. Dr. Turman is the coauthor of Sacred Sexuality: Reclaiming God’s Design and Who Am I? What the Bible Says About Identity and Why it Matters. He earned his undergraduate degree from Howard Payne University in Brownwood, Texas, and received his Master of Divinity degree from Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in Fort Worth. He later completed his Doctor of Ministry degree at George W. Truett Theological Seminary at Baylor University in Waco. Before joining Denison Forum, Mark served as a pastor for thirty-five years, including twenty-five years as the founding pastor of Crosspoint Church in McKinney, Texas. Mark and his high school sweetheart, Judi, married in 1986. They are proud parents of two adult children and grandparents to three grandchildren. About Denison ForumDenison Forum exists to thoughtfully engage the issues of our day from a biblical perspective, helping believers discern today’s news and culture through the lens of faith. Led by Dr. Jim Denison and a team of contributing writers, we offer trusted insight through The Daily Article, a daily email newsletter and podcast, along with articles, podcasts, interviews, books, and other resources. Together, these form a growing ecosystem of Christ-centered content that equips readers to respond to current events not with fear or partisanship, but with clarity, conviction, and hope. To learn more visit DenisonForum.org. All episodes are produced by Sound of a Rose. For more information, you can visit soundofarose.com.
