More or Less

Dave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin

Dave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin have debated the future of Silicon Valley and tech as the closest of friends for the last 15 years. Now six companies, two venture funds and more than a decade at Google, Apple and Facebook later, they are opening up the debate. From The Information, Offline Ventures, and Slow Ventures. Follow the crew: http://x.com/davemorin http://x.com/brit http://x.com/lessin http:/x.com/jessicalessin Follow the pod: https://moreorlesspod.com/ http://youtube.com/moreorlesspod https://x.com/moreorlesspod

  1. 1D AGO

    Paramount vs Netflix: Who Really Wins Warner Bros And What's Next?

    This week’s a big one: the squad kicks it off with Starlink on planes, Zoox vs. Waymo, and YouTube’s skinny bundle before taking the big swing — data centers in space as the emerging SpaceX-IPO narrative. Sam and Dave break down the real entrepreneurship skill: tell the huge story, earn the trust multiple, and consistently deliver “20 cents on the dollar” to keep the flywheel of cash spinning (re: Elon Musk and Sam Altman but thread lightly, you don't want to end up like Elizabeth Holmes or Sam Bankman-Fried). Jess celebrates a win with The Information after getting CNBC to correct their reporting. Then they touch on how the backlash against AI is growing as the 101 billboards fill up with more AI company ads. From Sorkin’s 1929 zeitgeist to smuggling Nvidia chips into China to “IPO everything and pray the American economy survives,” it’s never a dull episode with Brit, Dave, Jess, and Sam. Stay tuned for next week’s 2026 predictions… and drop yours in the comments.Chapters:05:50 Netflix vs Paramount - Who's going to win the deal and is this an Inverse AOL-Time Warner?16:56 Golden Globes nominees and Disney+'s Taylor Swift docuseries17:49 Bundling unbundling YouTube’s skinny bundle and sports21:29 Starlink on planes = fewer redeyes24:55 Zoox vs Waymo28:15 Space GPUs and the data centers in space33:57 The modern entrepreneurship skill: narrative flywheel41:38 Jess’s and The Information's win correcting CNBC's refuted chip story46:04 AI narrative in China vs US47:16 AI backlash: energy prices, water restraints, and kid's mental health52:06 The 101 Billboard Bubble Index57:17 Will the SpaceX, OpenAI, Anduril, or Anthropic IPOs save the economy?58:30 Sorkin’s book predicted the AI bubble?We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessYouTube: https://youtu.be/RiKVJD_3ziMConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

    1h 4m

  2. DEC 5

    Code Red, Bitcoin Costs, AWS Resurgence, and Waymo Safety (Not About AI... ish)

    Bitcoin’s down, so the Lessins turned down the heat and pulled out their winter gear. The More or Less squad jumps from SF’s drone-powered crime-fighting memes (Daniel Lurie’s “no drugs” moment) to how creator-content strategy now drives real deal flow. Jess says 2026 will split the AI tide (we unfortunately did have to touch on AI), with Meta’s missing enterprise story dragging its CapEx dreams, while AWS is suddenly courting founders again. From Apple’s design chief Alan Dye jumping to Meta to questioning whether OpenAI’s “code red” was a decoy, the squad never misses when it comes to the latest thinking in Silicon Valley. Buy Slow's Modern Etiquette book: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0G4HSKSY5 Chapters: Chapters:01:10 Kudos to SF Mayor, Daniel Lurie!07:14 Doom scrolling on a Garmin watch12:34 Holiday gift guides: AI robots, Duolingo piano, Matic vac mop, etc14:30 The creator-VC playbook 21:27 Instagram RTO 5 days per week leadership reality check22:08 Alan Dye leaves Apple for Meta 26:09 Jess' 2026 prediction: The Big Tech divergence is coming27:46 Meta’s enterprise gap28:46 AWS outreach to Sam: Bedrock Nova and startup credits31:45 Sam Altman's code red memo -- is it a decoy?33:51 Gemini latency vs GPT why speed matters for Brit (Ad opp?)44:39 Is Aaron Levie for or against AI?46:40 Waymo's safety report and Dave's FSD usage51:21 Recapping the Slow holiday party + Offline's next58:28 Slow's Modern Etiquette Book plug (Link to purchase: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0G4HSKSY5) We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessYouTubeConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

    1 hr

  3. NOV 28

    OpenAI vs Google vs Meta: Business Model War

    Pre-Thanksgiving chatter from the Lessins’ Surf Shack: Jess, Brit, Dave, and Sam pinball from holiday-card automation to trillion-dollar AI geopolitics. Brit trades Minted for Canva+GPT, Jess admits to maintaining a 600-row address spreadsheet, Sam unveils Slow’s Etiquette Book, and Dave still can’t believe we can’t pay in USDC. Don’t worry this year's Thanksgiving edition will live up to its hype, the crew gets into the real stuff too: Google’s TPU push vs. Nvidia’s moat, Meta reportedly buying billions in TPUs, whether Google can shave 10% off Nvidia’s revenue, and more.Chapters:06:45 The San Francisco consensus and Silicon Valley’s real innovation marketing 11:10 Elon Zuck and megaphone-powered distribution 14:30 Why interface distribution will decide AI winner 17:20 Memory isn’t real lock-in switching between ChatGPT and Gemini 21:40 OpenAI’s identity crisis: Apple-style computer vs Meta-style attention 26:30 Google complex vs OpenAI complex how the narrative flipped 29:10 Google TPUs vs Nvidia Meta’s rumored buying spree 33:20 AI infrastructure economics depreciation CapEx margins 36:00 Macro vs micro elections risk cycles 40:10 DOE’s Genesis Mission and where the analogy breaks 44:00 OpenAI's Jony Ive device timeline 48:30 Why distribution still beats novelty 53:15 Final takeaways: marketing distribution and business-model warsWe’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessYouTube: https://youtu.be/7BbWHm3KODwConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

    1h 9m

  4. NOV 21

    Google Just Won AI, TikTok’s “Self-Control Badges”, ChatGPT Enters Group Chats

    Jessica kicks things off with Brit’s five-hour Brit-chella extravaganza—red latex, Light Balance blackout choreo, Ke$ha surprise, and more. The crew checks in on Jessica’s IG detox, TikTok's new "self control badges", ChatGPT launching group chats, Google Gemini taking the lead, and why “just be Google” might be the winning AI brand strategy as AI melts into UX. Sam calls 2026 OpenAI’s make-or-break year and trashes their consumer subscription thesis; Jessica argues ad/commerce is the only viable lane. Markets stay frothy (Nvidia), hyperscaler debt risk rises, the White House preempts 50-state AI chaos, and Coinbase x Kalshi turns prediction markets into a spectator sport. Meme corner closes the loop and a possible Femme-etiquette school spinoff make its debut. Chapters: 00:37 Intro and Brit-Chella Recap 10:33 Jessica’s Instagram detox check-in and what changed 15:59 TikTok’s anti screen-time badges 17:48 ChatGPT launches group chats; why Meta missed its chance 20:51 Google Gemini takes the lead in the AI race 23:37 OpenAI’s monetization problem; no one buys the consumer story 29:14 Just be Google — higher brand credibility, revenue streams, and distribution 39:33 Breaking: Nvidia earnings are still growing 43:14 White House EO to preempt state AI regulation; why federal matters 48:06 Coinbase and Kalshi prediction markets, culture, and compliance 53:12 Meme Corner: RIP 6–7, hello 41 56:03 Make SF Dress Up Again: Femme-Etiquette School We’re also on ↓ X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspod Instagram: https://instagram.com/moreorless YouTube: https://youtu.be/ahZTkLfJTyk Connect with us here: 1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin 2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin 3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin 4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

    1 hr

  5. NOV 14

    Apple’s iPhone Sock, Waymo's Bay Area Expansion, and AI Wearables

    The squad is complete again! We get into AI wearables: rings, necklaces, even earrings, after Dave hints his stealth ring startup is almost ready. Waymo quietly rolls out SF–San Jose service (still no freeways), while private-jet owners email senators about the shutdown. The squad goes over Andy Rubin’s humanoid robotics launch, Sam’s backwards Panopticon sign, Apple’s Issey Miyake iPhone “sock/pocket,” and that Slow’s etiquette school is now getting international interest. We wrap with Janitor AI’s romance boom, Sam building an AI kids-podcast pipeline with ElevenLabs, Brit wanting McConaughey to voice romance, Jess taking an Instagram detox, and more. Chapters: 01:18 AI in interior design and AI slop; Why AI commerce still feels broken 04:59 Apple week iPhone Air vs Pro 08:49 Wearable AI flood Ray-Bans, rings, and other wearables 15:32 Jess deletes Instagram and maybe email 21:05 Multitasking vs focus 23:32 Andy Rubin’s new robotics company 27:15 SORON reveal and home deterrence roadmap 29:15 Military research to practical deterrent systems 30:29 Panopticon conference room and GDPR simplification 32:29 Waymo expansion and route quirks 35:35 Apple Issey Miyake iPhone pocket sock 38:40 Slow's Etiquette Finishing school goes global 44:50 The Lessin Family AI generated kids podcast 49:06 BBC scandal media bias and blowback 54:12 Lawfare the financialization of lawsuits We’re also on ↓ X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspod Instagram: https://instagram.com/moreorless YouTube: https://youtu.be/pA20Sk63yYE Connect with us here: 1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin 2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin 3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin 4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

    59 min

  6. NOV 7

    Apple Chooses Gemini, Sequoia's Leadership Shake-up, and Meme Coins

    It’s Etiquette Finishing School Day at Slow Ventures, Sam dials in from the Four Seasons in a Brioni suit to recap Slow’s first-ever Etiquette School—covering caviar bumps, sommelier tips, and the “low heart rate” approach to leadership. The crew argue that etiquette now matters in tech because trust is scarce and “PMF-only” is an outdated YC-era story. Jess also unpacks details from Apple’s Gemini deal, Sequoia’s leadership shuffle, Anthropic’s latest numbers, and crypto’s meme-driven chaos. Watch till the end for free No Kings and Queens of Corbet protest tees from Sam. Chapters: 02:33 Etiquette Day at Slow — Sam’s recap from the Four Seasons 07:00 Why etiquette matters for founders in 2025 13:20 Apple x Google: Gemini to power Siri 17:24 Apple’s AI strategy: Restricting Spend on AI 20:04 LLMs vs search the new user behavior shift 27:40 Sequoia’s leadership handoff 36:44 Meme coin corner Jelly’s 400M rise and community-led products 47:55 Waymo swarms El Camino AI meets the real world 50:30 Sam's "No Kings and Queens" merch We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessYouTube: https://youtu.be/zv4VdtKpQQkConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

    57 min

  7. OCT 31

    Stuart Landesberg's Plan to Save the American West from Wildfires

    With Jess running The Information's massive WTF conference and Sam off-grid on a mountain, Brit and Dave hold down the fort with Stuart Landesberg, CEO of Seneca, a Slow- and Offline-backed startup building autonomous firefighting drones. Between deep tech inside jokes, Stuart coins pro-America tech and breaks down how Seneca’s five-drone strike teams deploy 500 lbs of foam across 30 square miles in under ten minutes—even at night. Wildfires now drain over a trillion dollars a year from the U.S. economy, and Seneca’s model of detect early, respond fast, outperforms retrofitting homes or relying on pilots. With demand rising from cities, utilities, and insurers protecting $5T in assets, Stuart’s focused on building long-term enterprise value, not chasing the AI hype cycle. Join the Seneca team: https://seneca.com/careers/ Chapters:03:28 Stuart’s path to Seneca and the wildfire problem10:36 The true economic cost of wildfires12:10 Prevention vs. suppression; prescribed burns and costs16:19 Exponential fire growth; strike teams and early knockdowns19:46 Autonomy + sensors; choosing actions in real time20:45 Five drones, 30 square miles, sub-10-minute response22:20 Night ops: why autonomy wins when pilots can’t fly25:42 Regulators, HOAs, utilities: who’s pulling adoption forward27:40 Capital, AI hype, and choosing long-term partners31:32 Founder advice; unexpected demand from private stakeholders39:38 Culture: Stoicism, Amor Fati, learning from crashes We’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessSpotify: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/moreorlesspod Connect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

    43 min

  8. OCT 24

    TPUs Are Winning? Gemini + Anthropic vs NVIDIA, and OpenAI’s Atlas Explained

    The gang is back with a spicy opener: Brit calls out Dave for dismissing her “AI-assisted” doc as work slop, while Sam argues lowbrow culture now imitates machines and highbrow culture resists them. We break down OpenAI’s early, hallucination-prone Atlas browser and debate whether it’s a real agent platform, just memory capture, or total $$$ burn. Sora hype is cooling as TPUs rise—with Jessica noting how The Information's TPU scoop even nudged NVIDIA to move faster. OpenAI’s compute could approach ~$45B/year at ~3 GW, forcing new financing models and tough research vs GTM trade-offs—Sam calls it Pascal’s Wager for Big Tech. We close on AWS outages, crypto leverage swings, and why “swag is dead,” replaced by bespoke gifting as the new status move. Just another week of your favorite Technology podcast with the Morins and Lessins.Chapters:00:38 — Gang is back: notes on last episode and Yasso bars01:20 — Revisiting last week's “AI Work Slop”: Brit vs. Dave 03:49 — Culture vs. LLMs: highbrow resists, lowbrow imitates07:16 — Bot etiquette: Bot joining Zoom calls and writing thank you letters12:16 — OpenAI Atlas: early tests, hallucinations & agency potential17:29 — Sora hype cools: the consumer AI novelty cycle19:47 — The TPU plot twist: NVIDIA gets pushed to move faster22:40 — $45B compute future: Pascal’s Wager for Big Tech29:05 — AWS outages: one-offs vs systemic risk33:29 — The X Game: Mr.Beast, “manual slop,” and the screenshot era43:38 — Swag is dead: bespoke gifting = new status flex53:43 — Sports, socials & 2026 predictionsWe’re also on ↓X: https://twitter.com/moreorlesspodInstagram: https://instagram.com/moreorlessYouTube: https://youtu.be/VDYdIoHe4XAConnect with us here:1) Sam Lessin: https://x.com/lessin2) Dave Morin: https://x.com/davemorin3) Jessica Lessin: https://x.com/Jessicalessin4) Brit Morin: https://x.com/brit

    55 min
See All (130)

4.1
out of 5
93 Ratings

About

Dave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin have debated the future of Silicon Valley and tech as the closest of friends for the last 15 years. Now six companies, two venture funds and more than a decade at Google, Apple and Facebook later, they are opening up the debate. From The Information, Offline Ventures, and Slow Ventures. Follow the crew: http://x.com/davemorin http://x.com/brit http://x.com/lessin http:/x.com/jessicalessin Follow the pod: https://moreorlesspod.com/ http://youtube.com/moreorlesspod https://x.com/moreorlesspod

Information

  • Creator
    Dave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin
  • Years Active
    2023 - 2025
  • Episodes
    130
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © Dave Morin, Jessica Lessin, Brit Morin, and Sam Lessin
  • Show Website
    More or Less

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