Beyond the Resume

Chris Papa and Lisa Flicker
  • 4.5 (8)
  • Careers
  • Updated Weekly

Co-hosted by industry veterans, Chris Papa and Lisa Flicker, the weekly Beyond the Resume Podcast features interviews with some of the best known real estate experts in the U.S. By exploring how they built their successful careers and the impact they have made to the communities around them we hope to educate and inspire anyone building or thinking of building a career in real estate. Join us as we go Beyond the Resume.

  1. 2d ago

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Russell Lang (Holy ground, affordable homes)

    In this episode of Beyond the Resume, we sit down with Russell Lang, President and CEO of Catholic Homes New York, for a wide-ranging conversation about affordable housing development, nonprofit leadership, community impact, and building a meaningful career in real estate.Russell shares the history of Catholic Homes New York, from parish-led housing development in the 1970s to its current portfolio of approximately 3,000 affordable housing units. He discusses the organization’s work with seniors, families, and residents who need supportive services, as well as its connection to Catholic Charities and a broader network of mission-aligned social service providers.The conversation also explores Russell’s professional journey through public agencies, nonprofit organizations, affordable housing finance, construction, and real estate development. Russell also offers practical advice for students and professionals interested in affordable housing careers. He explains why financial literacy, legal fluency, intellectual curiosity, adaptability, and a genuine commitment to serving communities are essential for successful developers and nonprofit executives. He also discusses what he looks for when hiring, the importance of building a strong team, and the mentors who helped shape his career.Chapters(00:00) The History and Mission of Catholic Homes New YorkRussell explains how parish-owned land and community needs led to the creation of Catholic Homes and its growing affordable housing portfolio.(03:07) Expanding Grand Street and Serving New York CommunitiesA look at the Grand Street Guild campus, new family and senior housing, and the geographic footprint Catholic Homes serves.(05:02) Leading an Affordable Housing NonprofitRussell discusses improving organizational performance, strengthening the resident experience, and positioning Catholic Homes for continued growth.(07:08) Housing, Social Services, and Catholic CharitiesHow Catholic Homes works with affiliated agencies to connect residents with foster care, mental health, family, and supportive services.(10:08) Russell’s Path into Community DevelopmentRussell reflects on Amherst, working in Bill Clinton’s post-presidency office, studying urban planning at NYU Wagner, and discovering affordable housing.(15:22) Finance, Tax Credits, and Public-Private PartnershipsThe importance of understanding low-income housing tax credits, eligible basis, construction, government programs, and the financial structure of affordable housing.(19:10) New York Housing Policy and Nonprofit DevelopmentRussell discusses limited resources, rising development costs, government partnerships, nonprofit participation, and the long-term value of community-based institutions.(21:27) What Makes a Strong Developer and CEO?Why curiosity, continuous learning, mission alignment, team building, and the willingness to understand every part of a project matter.(26:03) Career Advice for Future Affordable Housing LeadersRussell shares the skills aspiring executives should develop, including finance, legal knowledge, transparency, and comfort working directly with communities.(30:10) Memorable Projects, Mixed-Use Development, and Community ImpactRussell revisits formative projects involving affordable housing, retail spaces, daycare providers, grocery stores, and institutional partners.(34:02) Hiring for Curiosity, Ambition, and Career StoryWhat Russell looks for on a résumé, how he evaluates candidates, and why a coherent professional journey can lead to a strong interview.(35:53) Mentors Who Shaped Russell’s CareerRussell recognizes the colleagues, developers, finance professionals, and construction leaders who gave him opportunities to learn and grow.LINKSYouTube: https://youtu.be/gK8p14c1oH4Spotify: https://bit.ly/beyondtheresume-spotifyApple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3I3nkG9

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Russell Lang (Holy ground, affordable homes)

  2. Jul 19

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Ada Arevalo (Raise capital, lower barriers)

    Ada Arevalo’s career demonstrates how the right opportunity, mentor or unexpected pivot can completely change a professional trajectory. In this episode of Beyond the Resume, Chris Papa and Lisa Flicker sit down with Ada, interim Chief Operations Officer of the Los Angeles County Affordable Housing Solutions Agency, or LACAHSA. Ada explains how the agency is creating a collaborative platform for jurisdictions across Los Angeles County to work together to address homelessness and the lack of affordable housing. She discusses her role in building the operational, technological and investment systems that allow LACAHSA to deploy capital and execute its mission. Ada also explains how sales tax funding, social bonds and future capital allocations can support the development and preservation of affordable housing throughout Los Angeles County. The conversation follows Ada’s journey from being born and raised in Mexico and immigrating to the United States at age 10 to studying finance, beginning her career in public accounting and joining a startup investment management firm. She shares how an unexpected choice between a CFO path and capital raising launched her into capital markets, investor relations and fund management. Ada breaks down what capital raising actually involves, describing it as a relationship-driven and educational role rather than simply a sales function. She explains why financial fluency builds investor trust and why professionals must learn how to communicate value, listen with curiosity and develop meaningful networks. The episode also explores mentorship, Latinx representation in commercial real estate and Ada’s work as the founding chair of the Real Estate Association of Latinx Professionals. She discusses the need to create clearer pathways into real estate investment roles, particularly for Latino and Latina professionals who remain underrepresented in the industry. Ada also shares her leadership philosophy, including setting high expectations, building accountability systems, creating psychological safety and asking her team for feedback. She explains why leaders must be willing to reassess their ideas, let go of the need to be right and focus on helping their teams succeed. This episode is a powerful conversation about affordable housing, impact investing, capital raising, professional networking, mentorship, representation and the people who change careers by recognizing potential and acting on it. CHAPTERS (00:00) Meet Ada Arevalo and LACAHSA (03:36) Building a Startup Government Agency (04:33) A Countywide Affordable Housing Strategy (08:22) From Mexico to Public Accounting (10:20) Choosing Capital Markets Over the CFO Track (18:53) What Capital Raising Actually Involves (23:48) Why Your Network Outlasts Your GPA (27:29) Representation, Leadership and Recognizing Potential LINKS YouTube: https://youtu.be/6euQ3uvki6I Spotify: https://bit.ly/beyondtheresume-spotify Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3I3nkG9 --- KEYWORDS Ada Arevalo, LACAHSA, affordable housing, Los Angeles County housing, capital raising, impact investing, Latinx professionals, commercial real estate, executive leadership, professional networking

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Ada Arevalo (Raise capital, lower barriers)

  3. Jul 13

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Rodger Brown (Build what matters)

    In this episode of we speak with Rodger Brown, Managing Director of Real Estate Development at Preservation of Affordable Housing, about his unconventional career path and decades of leadership in affordable housing and community development. Rodger explains how Preservation of Affordable Housing grew from approximately 800 units into a nonprofit with roughly 14,000 homes across 14 states and Washington, D.C. He discusses the organization’s origins in preserving Section 8 housing, its use of HUD financing tools, and its evolution from rehabilitation projects into comprehensive neighborhood transformation. The conversation centers on the organization’s work in Chicago’s Woodlawn community, where a distressed housing development became the foundation for new affordable homes, workforce training, a grocery store, youth programming, senior housing, local businesses, and transit-oriented development. Rodger also shares his journey from IBM to Boston City Hall, MIT, and nonprofit real estate development. His advice for aspiring developers emphasizes financial fluency, communication, relationship-building, collaboration, and learning by doing. He reflects on supporting developers of color, hiring mission-driven teammates, asking for help, learning from mentors, and pursuing work that leaves communities better than he found them. CHAPTERS (00:00) Rodger Brown and Preservation of Affordable Housing Rodger introduces the organization, its mission, and its origins. (02:25) Preserving Section 8 Housing How nonprofit ownership and HUD financing helped protect affordable homes. (05:00) Growing to 14,000 Homes The organization expands across 14 states and Washington, D.C. (07:17) Transforming Chicago’s Woodlawn Community A distressed property becomes the foundation for neighborhood revitalization. (12:05) Housing, Jobs, Education, and Opportunity Rodger discusses workforce training, youth programming, retail, and mixed-use development. (16:55) Leading Real Estate Development Rodger explains how he deploys resources, supports teams, and responds to changing policies. (19:18) From IBM to Affordable Housing His path through City Hall, MIT, and early nonprofit development work. (24:05) Skills Every Developer Needs Financial knowledge, communication, relationships, and learning by doing. (30:33) Purpose, Resilience, and Giving Back Rodger reflects on meaningful work, failure, and charitable cycling. (35:07) Collaboration, Hiring, and Mentorship Why mission alignment, humility, teamwork, and mentors matter. -- YouTube: https://youtu.be/rxvhyH4FLvw Spotify: https://bit.ly/beyondtheresume-spotify Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3I3nkG9

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Rodger Brown (Build what matters)

  4. Jul 6

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Allen Feliz (The human side of housing technology)

    In this episode of *Beyond the Resume*, we sit down with Allen Feliz, Vice President of Affordable and Public Housing Solutions at MRI Software, for a conversation about affordable housing, public housing, real estate technology, leadership, and mission-driven career growth. Allen explains how MRI Software supports organizations that build, finance, manage, and operate housing communities. From property management and compliance tools to asset management software, data insights, and housing authority program administration, Allen describes the role technology can play in helping affordable housing professionals make better decisions and work more efficiently. The episode also traces Allen’s personal and professional journey: growing up in the South Bronx as the son of Dominican immigrant parents, earning a scholarship to boarding school, studying political science at Brown, beginning his career in affordable housing finance, helping grow TCAM, and eventually stepping into a leadership role at MRI Software after TCAM’s acquisition. Along the way, Allen reflects on AI, PropTech, change management, compliance, data reporting, mentorship, civic engagement, and what it takes to build a meaningful career in housing. He also shares practical advice for anyone looking to enter the field, including the value of Excel, comfort with numbers, strong communication skills, humility, and a genuine commitment to the mission. CHAPTERS (00:45) Meet Allen Feliz and MRI Software (03:48) Investment Central, TCAM, and Asset Management (05:15) Allen’s Bronx Origin Story (08:56) Starting Out in Affordable Housing Finance (10:27) AI, Innovation, and Real Estate Technology (11:46) Moving From Real Estate Into PropTech (15:51) Technology Adoption and Change Management (19:44) Compliance, Data, and Reporting Tools (22:00) Career Advice for Breaking Into Housing (24:54) Baseball, Family, and the Hot Seat (28:14) Book and Podcast Recommendations (34:23) How Personal History Shapes the Mission (36:27) Mentorship, Leadership, and Paying It Forward YouTube: https://youtu.be/MijmCzmhH8Q Spotify: https://bit.ly/beyondtheresume-spotify Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3I3nkG9

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Allen Feliz (The human side of housing technology)

  5. Jun 29

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Judy Herbstman (Trust is the foundation)

    In this episode of *Beyond the Resume*, we sit down with Judy Herbstman, President of Settlement Housing Fund, for a conversation about affordable housing, mission-driven leadership, nonprofit development, and building a career rooted in public service.Judy shares how Settlement Housing Fund continues its work as a nonprofit affordable housing developer serving residents across the Bronx, Manhattan, and Brooklyn, while also expanding into supportive housing and resident services. She reflects on her path from mental health advocacy to housing, including formative experiences at HUD, graduate school at NYU, and early affordable housing development work in New York City.The conversation also explores Judy’s transition from running real estate development to leading an organization, the learning curve of executive leadership, the value of project management, and the importance of clear communication, collaboration, and mission alignment. Judy offers thoughtful advice for young professionals entering the affordable housing field, emphasizing respect for residents, understanding personal strengths, and developing the skills needed to contribute meaningfully.Chris and Judy also discuss hiring, mentorship, direct feedback, work-life balance, and the leaders who helped shape Judy’s approach to management and service.CHAPTERS(00:45) Meet Judy Herbstman and Settlement Housing Fund(02:55) Serving residents and expanding supportive housing(04:25) Moving from development leader to president(06:40) Learning executive leadership on the job(08:45) A mission-driven path shaped by service(10:55) From mental health advocacy to housing(12:50) HUD, NYU, and learning affordable housing development(15:35) Nonprofit vs. for-profit affordable housing work(17:35) Collaborative leadership and stakeholder trust(20:00) Growth, preservation, and the future of affordable housing(21:15) Advice for emerging affordable housing professionals(23:50) Books, routines, parenting, and staying grounded(26:15) Hiring for mission alignment and respect for residents(27:40) Mentorship, feedback, and leadership lessonsYouTube: https://youtu.be/hPTtcUz0rY4Spotify: https://bit.ly/beyondtheresume-spotifyApple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3I3nkG9

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Judy Herbstman (Trust is the foundation)

  6. Jun 22

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Ken Clark (A greater sense of purpose)

    In this episode of Beyond the Resume, Chris Papa and Lisa Flicker sit down with Ken Clark, COO of Columbia Residential, for a thoughtful conversation about affordable housing, leadership, career pivots, mixed-income development, AI, mentorship, and the deeper purpose behind mission-driven work. Ken shares the winding path that led him from Morehouse College to law firm operations, accounting, the Atlanta Housing Authority, consulting, and eventually Columbia Residential, where he now helps lead one of the Southeast’s major affordable and mixed-income housing organizations. He reflects on the influence of Columbia Residential founder Noel Khalil, whose belief that the company builds “cathedrals for God’s children” continues to shape the organization’s commitment to quality housing. The conversation also explores Atlanta’s transformation, the role of public housing authorities, the future of mixed-income housing, and why the Low-Income Housing Tax Credit remains one of the most reliable tools for affordable housing development. Ken also discusses how AI may improve routine processes in housing while emphasizing that people, judgment, and human-centered leadership remain essential. In one of the episode’s most personal moments, Ken opens up about the loss of his son in 2014 and how that tragedy deepened his commitment to service, family, and helping people thrive. He also shares the routines that keep him grounded, the mentors who shaped his leadership, and the books and podcasts that continue to influence how he leads. CHAPTERS (01:00) Columbia Residential’s mission and affordable housing work (03:10) Ken’s unexpected path into business, real estate, and housing (06:05) From Atlanta Housing Authority to real estate and consulting (09:40) A personal tragedy that deepened Ken’s sense of purpose (12:20) What a COO actually does: people, process, systems, and execution (15:30) AI, affordable housing, and why people still matter (18:10) Mixed-income housing, tax credits, and financing challenges (22:25) Resident services, relocation, and supporting communities (24:15) How Atlanta has transformed through housing and redevelopment (28:10) Ken’s personal connection to public housing revitalization (29:30) The Hot Seat: books, podcasts, mindfulness, and daily routines (34:25) Mentorship, service, and investing in people (37:00) Closing reflections and lifelong relationships LINKS -- YouTube: https://youtu.be/ijJfuIQmUI8 Spotify: https://bit.ly/beyondtheresume-spotify Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3I3nkG9

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Ken Clark (A greater sense of purpose)

  7. Jun 15

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Jennifer Litwak (An affordable housing PEP talk)

    In this episode of Beyond the Resume, hosts Chris Papa and Lisa Flicker sit down with Jennifer Litwak, President and CEO of PEP Housing, a nonprofit affordable housing development company headquartered in Sonoma County. Jennifer shares how her path from law, child advocacy, and policy work led her into affordable housing, and why she sees housing not just as real estate, but as a matter of social justice, health, education, stability, and human dignity. The conversation explores PEP Housing’s 48-year legacy, its 23-property portfolio, and its deep expertise in senior affordable housing. Jennifer discusses the growing urgency around senior homelessness in California, the gap between independent affordable housing and affordable assisted living or skilled nursing, and the policy and funding reforms needed to create a more complete continuum of housing for aging residents. She also breaks down the operational realities of senior affordable housing, from long waitlists and resident services to compliance, maintenance, and aging-in-place challenges. The episode also moves into Jennifer’s leadership outside of PEP Housing, including her work with ULI, Globe Street Women of Influence, women-led investment groups, giving circles, and efforts to elevate more women into corporate boardrooms. To close, Jennifer shares her personal grounding practices, including daily meditation, gratitude, and sailing, before offering direct career advice for young professionals: be prepared, do your research, send the thank-you note, and show employers that you understand both the role and the organization. CHAPTERS (02:31) Affordable Housing as Social Justice Jennifer explains how her background as an attorney and child advocate connects to her belief that housing is a human right and that safe, affordable, stable housing shapes health, education, and life outcomes. (05:14) From Big Law to Housing Policy Jennifer reflects on leaving the traditional law firm path, moving into housing and homelessness policy work, and realizing that affordable housing developers needed to be part of the solution-oriented conversations around homelessness. (08:42) The Senior Housing Cliff The conversation turns to senior homelessness, affordable senior housing, and the gap that appears when residents need more support than independent living can provide but cannot afford assisted living or skilled nursing. (13:11) HUD, Assisted Living and Policy Reform Jennifer discusses her “magic wand” idea: revisiting programs and funding models that could help convert certain HUD-funded senior housing into assisted living and create more affordable options across the senior housing continuum. (16:27) The Reality of Operating Senior Housing Jennifer explains the operational complexity of senior affordable housing, including seven-year average waitlists, resident services, compliance, in-unit modifications, maintenance needs, and the importance of experienced long-term ownership. (25:09) Women, Capital and Leadership Access Jennifer talks about advancing women in commercial real estate through Globe Street Women of Influence, women-led investment groups, giving circles, and corporate board advocacy, while Lisa and Chris discuss mentorship, sponsorship, and male allies. (32:11) Gratitude, Sailing, Hiring and Mentorship In the hot seat, Jennifer shares podcast recommendations, her daily meditation and gratitude practices, her love of sailing, what she looks for when hiring, and the mentors who shaped her leadership. -- Jennifer Litwak, PEP Housing, Beyond the Resume podcast, affordable housing, senior affordable housing, workforce housing, senior homelessness, housing policy, women in commercial real estate, ULI -- YouTube: https://youtu.be/SwowwurzBxA Spotify: https://bit.ly/beyondtheresume-spotify Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3I3nkG9

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Jennifer Litwak (An affordable housing PEP talk)

  8. Jun 8

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Jennifer Clausen (Raising Capital, Building Trust)

    In this episode of Beyond the Resume, we sit down with Jennifer Clausen, Partner at LEM, for a wide-ranging conversation about commercial real estate, capital raising, investor relations, value-add multifamily investing, leadership, succession planning, workforce housing, and the relationships that drive long-term success in real estate private equity. Jennifer shares how her career moved from communications and Hispanic studies to currency trading, office brokerage, hedge fund capital raising, and ultimately into multifamily investing at LEM. She explains why capital raising is less about quick wins and more about building cycle-resilient relationships that can last 10 to 20 years. From investor transparency and bespoke presentations to quarterly investor letters and understanding the needs of high-net-worth investors versus public pensions, Jennifer breaks down what it actually takes to earn trust in the capital markets. The conversation also explores LEM’s evolution from a founder-led firm to the next generation of leadership, including the challenges of moving from peer to leader, building culture inside a 20-person firm, and executing succession planning in a thoughtful way. Jenniferalso discusses LEM’s focus on value-add multifamily, growth markets, workforce housing, lowercase affordable housing, and why housing supply remains central to the affordability conversation. The episode closes with Jennifer’s perspective on hiring, mentorship, women in real estate, relationship-driven leadership, and why “DPI is the new IRR.” CHAPTERS (01:32) From Fund IV To Fund VII Jennifer introduces her role at LEM, where she became a partner in 2022 after nearly a decade with the firm, leading capital raising, investor relations, and operations. (02:32) LEM’s Value-Add Multifamily Focus Jennifer explains LEM’s 25-year history, its shift from structured debt to equity after the GFC, and its focus on value-add multifamily investments in growth markets. (03:40) From Romance Languages To Real Estate Jennifer traces her path from communications and Hispanic studies to currency trading for a Mexican bank, office brokerage in San Diego, hedge fund capital raising, and eventually LEM. (07:29) Capital Raising Is An Ultra-Marathon Jennifer breaks down why capital raising is not a quick transaction, but a long-term process built on trust, transparency, investor education, and relationships that can last decades. (12:02) Learning The Product, Leading The Team Jennifer discusses why asset management or portfolio management can be a powerful foundation for capital raising, and how she learned by asking questions and staying curious. (13:14) Founder Culture To Next-Gen Leadership Jennifer shares how LEM evolved from a founder-led culture into the next generation of leadership, including the challenge of moving from peer to leader and building a collaborative team culture. (24:38) Workforce Housing, NOAA, And Supply Jennifer discusses LEM’s growth markets, workforce housing renter profile, lowercase affordable housing, municipal tax structures, and why supply is central to the national affordability challenge. ---- Jennifer Clausen, Beyond the Resume, LEM, commercial real estate, capital raising, investor relations, value-add multifamily, workforce housing, affordable housing, real estate private equity, succession planning, women in real estate -- YouTube: https://youtu.be/tZ0uwcwklpI Spotify: https://bit.ly/beyondtheresume-spotify Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3I3nkG9

    Beyond the Resume podcast with Jennifer Clausen (Raising Capital, Building Trust)
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Ratings & Reviews

4.5
out of 5
8 Ratings

About

Co-hosted by industry veterans, Chris Papa and Lisa Flicker, the weekly Beyond the Resume Podcast features interviews with some of the best known real estate experts in the U.S. By exploring how they built their successful careers and the impact they have made to the communities around them we hope to educate and inspire anyone building or thinking of building a career in real estate. Join us as we go Beyond the Resume.

Information

  • Creator
    Chris Papa and Lisa Flicker
  • Years Active
    2022 - 2026
  • Episodes
    133
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © Chris Papa and Lisa Flicker
  • Show Website
    Beyond the Resume

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