Building Better CMOs and Marketing Leaders

MMA Global / LightningPod
  • 5.0 (15)
  • MARKETING
  • UPDATED BIWEEKLY

Marketing leaders are facing constant new challenges. If you want to stay ahead of the curve, listen to Building Better CMOs, from the nonprofit thinktank MMA Global. It's a podcast about the future of marketing and how marketers can get smarter & stronger, hosted by MMA CEO Greg Stuart. Greg interviews some of the wisest and most successful CMOs in the business, who share crucial insights about what their industry gets wrong, how to get to the C-Suite, and how to unlock the true power of marketing. You'll gain a deeper understanding of the evolving purpose of marketing leaders, and learn actionable strategies to overcome obstacles. Produced by LightningPod.fm. For transcripts and more, visit bettercmos.com

  1. Embracing Measurement and Building Trust with New York Life's Amy Hu

    APR 29

    Embracing Measurement and Building Trust with New York Life's Amy Hu

    Being under the microscope during a corporate audit doesn’t have to be a source of friction for marketing leaders. Amy Hu, CMO at New York Life, argues that a foundation of curiosity and a commitment to delivering genuine value can transform these evaluations into strategic opportunities. Rather than viewing audits as a threat, she says, top-tier CMOs lean into the process to identify blind spots and refine their programs. "Any other way is going to enhance the doubt," she says. "And you are trying to say, Yeah, that's great. What can we do to satisfy what you need? And maybe there is a better way." Today on Building Better CMOs, Amy and Greg talk about her career journey as the CMO and Senior Vice President of New York Life, one of the nation's largest mutual insurance companies. She discusses how to navigate the complexities of legacy financial institutions, how to turn difficult jobs into growth and wisdom, and why CMOs need to be more adaptable to business needs. Chapters: 0:00 Introduction 1:40 The Mission of New York Life 4:10 "More Powerful, Together" 9:07 From Philosophy Major to Critical Thinker 12:32 Developing Financial Fluency 18:37 Proving Marketing Value to Skeptical CFOs 23:38 The Relationship Between Brand and Performance 29:52 Embracing an Audit and Measurement Culture 32:18 The Challenges of the Dynamic CMO Role 36:01 Hiring for Completeness and Competency Gaps 41:21 The Different Types of Marketing Leaders 45:37 Building Peer Alignment and Better Teams 49:49 The Nuance and Art of Senior Marketing Leadership Full transcript This episode was produced and edited by Eric Johnson from LightningPod Follow Building Better CMOs in your podcast app⁠⁠⁠ Rate and review the podcast Amy's LinkedIn Greg's LinkedIn

    54 min
  2. Get Specific About Marketing Results with Matt Lieberman

    APR 15

    Get Specific About Marketing Results with Matt Lieberman

    All marketers have to find the balance between subjective feelings and objective metrics, and Cooley's Matt Lieberman is no exception. As the elite law firm's Chief Marketing and Business Development Officer, and the former CMO of PwC, Matt says the professional services industry comes with unique challenges and high stakes. That means he sometimes has to challenge coworkers on the value of certain activations, or the language they use. "I joke at Cooley that one of the things that we're really good at here is using adjectives," he says. "When I say how was an event or what was a piece of content, they say it was amazing. It was awesome. It was excellent. And I don't mean to be flippant, but I was like, can you please tell me what 'amazing' or 'awesome' mean?" Today on Building Better CMOs, Matt and Greg talk about the "ongoing journey" of integrating data into a legacy business culture; how professional services firms and their partners can better communicate their value to clients; and why, in your career, "it's often good to take a step laterally down ... in order to get to the next step where you want to get to." Chapters: 0:00 Introduction 2:37 From Hollywood Creative to Business Consultant 4:53 Cooley and Law Firm Marketing 7:01 The Evolution of Professional Services Marketing 8:51 The Challenges of Marketing for Individual Partners 13:17 Turning Regulations into Client Insights 15:46 Differentiating Firm Personalities and Culture 19:53 Career Advice: Running To vs. Running From 24:43 Being a Lifelong Student in B2B Marketing 29:52 Upskilling Teams Through "Infinite Learning" 33:14 Aligning Marketing Strategy with Firm Goals 37:09 Moving Beyond Vanity Metrics 43:02 Advanced Personalization and Targeting 49:17 The Impact of AI on Marketing Full transcript⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ This episode was produced and edited by Eric Johnson from ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LightningPod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Follow Building Better CMOs in your podcast app⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Rate and review the podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Matt's LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Greg's LinkedIn

    57 min
  3. Build Something or Fix Something with Instructure CMO Armin Molavi

    FEB 4

    Build Something or Fix Something with Instructure CMO Armin Molavi

    Armin Molavi spent 20 years working in agencies before transitioning to client-side marketing at Hilton, then building a successful fractional CMO practice serving private equity-backed companies. Currently, he's the CMO at Instructure, which makes the ubiquitous learning management system Canvas."25 years of B2C, and this is my very first B2B gig, so I've been learning a lot," Armin says. "What's the saying? Like drinking from a fire hydrant?"But at a fundamental level, he explains, B2B is not so different from what he's spent most of his career doing."At the end of the day, I have to convince people that if they give up their budget for what I have to sell, it's going to make their life better at work," he adds. "That's what marketing is."Today on Building Better CMOs, Armin and Greg Stuart discuss what marketers should know about working with private equity firms, why agencies and clients both need to be better partners to each other, and the life-changing career advice he received from Kellyn Kenny. They also discuss why marketers need to drop the jargon and start connecting their work to enterprise value if they want a seat at the table. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Full transcript⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ This episode was produced and edited by Eric Johnson from ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LightningPod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠Follow Building Better CMOs in your podcast app⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠Rate and review the podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Armin's LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠Greg's LinkedIn

    59 min
  4. Following People & Finding Purpose with Snap CMO Grace Kao

    JAN 21

    Following People & Finding Purpose with Snap CMO Grace Kao

    Grace Kao has served as a marketing leader at some of the most influential consumer tech companies of our time, including Yahoo, Pandora, Instagram, Spotify, and now Snap, where she is the CMO. But one of the most important things for her career growth has been following people, rather than job titles. "You want to go to a company that you believe in the company values, but believing in the people and understand that the people have the same values as you do, that has always been important to me," she says. Today on Building Better CMOs, Grace and Marketing + Media Alliance CEO Greg Stuart talk about the power of marketing to mindsets instead of demographics, and the advice from her mom that still guides her today: don't be afraid to fail. They also discuss what marketers can learn from Gen Z's entrepreneurial creativity, the upcoming relaunch of Snap's AR glasses Specs, and CEO Evan Spiegel's "shots to goal" philosophy. ⁠⁠⁠⁠Full transcript⁠⁠⁠⁠ This episode was produced and edited by Eric Johnson from ⁠⁠⁠⁠LightningPod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠Follow Building Better CMOs in your podcast app⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠Rate and review the podcast⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Grace's LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠Greg's LinkedIn

    53 min
  5. Every Touchpoint Tells a Story with The New York Times CMO Amy Weisenbach

    JAN 7

    Every Touchpoint Tells a Story with The New York Times CMO Amy Weisenbach

    Amy Weisenbach, CMO of The New York Times, recalls some crucial advice she received early in her career: "Don't come to me and say, how do I do this? Come to me and say, here's the problem. Here's what I think I should do. What do you think?" After cutting her teeth at companies like Jim Beam and Unilever — where she helped build one of the most provocative brands of the early 2000s, Axe Body Spray — Amy now leads marketing at one of the world's most storied media companies. Along the way, she's learned that the best brands understand everything communicates, from a Memorial Day sale to a Super Bowl spot. Today on Building Better CMOs, Amy talks with MMA Global CEO Greg Stuart about the hard-won journey from 2 million to 12 million subscribers, why the Times' leadership chose to invest in journalism when others were cutting, and the "Truth Is Worth It" campaign that made journalists proud of their marketing team for the first time. They also discuss the secret to hiring performance marketers who care about brand, as well as the value of trusted, human-reported journalism in an age of AI-generated content. ⁠⁠⁠Full transcript⁠⁠⁠ This episode was produced and edited by Eric Johnson from ⁠⁠⁠LightningPod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠Follow Building Better CMOs in your podcast app⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠Rate and review the podcast⁠⁠ ⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Amy's LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠Greg's LinkedIn

    1 hr
  6. Brand Over Time, Sales Overnight with Starbucks' Tressie Lieberman

    12/17/2025

    Brand Over Time, Sales Overnight with Starbucks' Tressie Lieberman

    Starbucks Global Chief Brand Officer Tressie Lieberman learned early in her career that building a brand requires balancing two timelines: "brand over time and sales overnight." It's a philosophy she's carried through leadership roles at Pizza Hut, Taco Bell, and Chipotle, and now applies to one of the most watched brand transformations in business. Tressie joined Starbucks a year ago as part of CEO Brian Niccol's turnaround team, overseeing everything from menu innovation and digital experience to the company's ready-to-drink beverages. Her mission: reignite the soul of Starbucks and bring the brand back to its coffeehouse roots. Today on Building Better CMOs, she and Marketing + Media Alliance CEO Greg Stuart talk about what causes iconic brands to lose their way, how to harness customer-generated trends like the viral glass “bearista,” and why curiosity is the number one trait she hires for. They also discuss embracing change as a career imperative, the entrepreneurial mindset she brings to big companies, and why marketers must treat customers as co-creators rather than passive audiences. ⁠⁠Full transcript⁠⁠ This episode was produced and edited by Eric Johnson from ⁠⁠LightningPod⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠Follow Building Better CMOs in your podcast app⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠Rate and review the podcast⁠ ⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠Tressie's LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠Greg's LinkedIn

    1h 1m
  7. Branding, Beverages, and Breakthroughs with Keurig Dr Pepper CMO Drew Panayiotou

    12/03/2025

    Branding, Beverages, and Breakthroughs with Keurig Dr Pepper CMO Drew Panayiotou

    "Being a public company CMO is very different than being a CMO in a private entity ... you need to deliver earnings. And I'd say this, any CMO that is not focused on driving revenue will not be there a long time," says Drew Panayiotou, the CMO of Keurig Dr Pepper. "You have to drive revenue, no if, ands, or buts." Consistently driving revenue gets even harder when, like Drew, you are stewarding 125 brands, including Yoohoo, Hawaiian Punch, Canada Dry, Keurig, Dr Pepper, and 7-Up. Drew believes in focusing on building emotional connections and cultural relevancy, driving raving fans to perpetuate the brand’s growth and significantly impacting revenue. Today on Building Better CMOs, he talks with Marketing + Media Alliance CEO Greg Stuart about harnessing digital transformation to fuel marketing initiatives, the importance of internal alignment and communication, and the role of emotional connections in brand loyalty. ⁠Full transcript⁠ This episode was produced and edited by Eric Johnson from ⁠LightningPod⁠⁠ Follow Building Better CMOs in your podcast app⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Rate and review the podcast ⁠⁠Drew's LinkedIn⁠⁠ Greg's LinkedIn

    1h 5m
  8. From Candy to Credit with Natasha Madan of Intuit Credit Karma

    11/19/2025

    From Candy to Credit with Natasha Madan of Intuit Credit Karma

    "If you don't drive, you will be driven," says Natasha Madan, the head of marketing at Intuit Credit Karma. "You have to play offense, you cannot be playing defense." That leadership philosophy has helped Natasha navigate from marketing candy brands at Nestlé to building Prime's brand strategy at Amazon, and now helping millions of people make financial progress. She believes marketers struggle to connect brand marketing with growth marketing, creating a gap that limits their impact. Today on Building Better CMOs, she and Marketing + Media Alliance CEO Greg Stuart discuss why marketing needs to bridge brand and performance, how understanding consumer psychology drives breakthrough creative, and why leadership means making tough decisions people may not initially like. They also explore the deep relationship people have with money, the power of AI-driven personalization, and why clarity is kindness in both parenting and managing teams. Full transcript This episode was produced and edited by Eric Johnson from LightningPod Follow Building Better CMOs in your podcast app⁠⁠⁠ Rate and review the podcast Natasha's LinkedIn Greg's LinkedIn

    53 min
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About

Marketing leaders are facing constant new challenges. If you want to stay ahead of the curve, listen to Building Better CMOs, from the nonprofit thinktank MMA Global. It's a podcast about the future of marketing and how marketers can get smarter & stronger, hosted by MMA CEO Greg Stuart. Greg interviews some of the wisest and most successful CMOs in the business, who share crucial insights about what their industry gets wrong, how to get to the C-Suite, and how to unlock the true power of marketing. You'll gain a deeper understanding of the evolving purpose of marketing leaders, and learn actionable strategies to overcome obstacles. Produced by LightningPod.fm. For transcripts and more, visit bettercmos.com

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