Difficult Conversations

National Association of Evangelicals
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Welcome to Difficult Conversations, a podcast series from the National Association of Evangelicals, hosted by NAE President Walter Kim. In a world that often feels divided — at the dinner table, in church, or on social media — this podcast explores how we ended up so polarized and what the role of Christians is in bringing peace. Through compelling stories and expert insights, Difficult Conversations will equip you with the tools to step into hard but transformative conversations and become the peacemakers Jesus calls blessed. Subscribe today and start your journey toward reconciliation and unity.

Episodes

  1. Ep. 7 | Apologetics for a Divided World

    11/21/2024

    Ep. 7 | Apologetics for a Divided World

    When it’s about winning people for Jesus. The Greek word for “apologetics” means “to give a defense” and comes from 1 Peter 3:15–16, which starts “But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have…” Apologetics in this passage begins with reverence for Christ, and its focus isn’t on defeating others but providing hope. There is no more consequential conversation than the one about who Jesus is and what he wants for us. Still, we tend to think of apologetics conversations with a battle mentality. In this final episode of Difficult Conversations, experienced apologists show us a better way — one that’s not about winning arguments, but winning hearts and minds for Jesus. Sean McDowell, a Christian apologist out of Biola University, unpacks perspective-taking, cancel culture, and how to diffuse conversations that go off the rails. Podcast host Justin Brierley shares lessons learned from two decades of hosting hundreds of high-profile debates between Christians, atheists and agnostics. And, you’ll hear a powerful testimony from Preston Perry, co-host of With the Perrys alongside Jackie Hill Perry, on how God transformed his life by showing him the very heart of what it means to be a Christian. Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts.  Do you like the podcast? Give us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. This is the best way for others to discover this series. If you listen on Spotify, give us a follow and hit the notification bell to be sure you never miss an episode. And don’t forget to pass your favorite episodes along to friends and family. Resources Full interview with Sean McDowell on YouTubeFull interview with Justin Brierley on YouTubeFull interview with Preston Perry on the Maybe God Podcast“End the Stalemate: Move Past Cancel Culture to Meaningful Conversations” by Sean McDowell and Tim Muehlhoff“The Surprising Rebirth of Belief in God: Why New Atheism Grew Old and Secular Thinkers Are Considering Christianity Again” by Justin Brierley“How to Tell the Truth: The Story of How God Saved Me to Win Hearts – Not Just Arguments” by Preston PerryHow the Gospel Answers Culture’s Questions, NAE podcast with Rebecca McLaughlin“The Secular Creed: Engaging 5 Contemporary Claims” article by Rebecca McLaughlin Show Notes: http://NAE.org/apologetics-podcast

    59 min
  2. Ep. 6 | Spiritual Battles or Culture Wars?

    11/19/2024

    Ep. 6 | Spiritual Battles or Culture Wars?

    Over the past century, American Christians — along with others — have largely embraced the culture war model, bringing a particular edge to the way we engage with the world. The list of topics in which we argue over — both within and outside the faith — seems endless. What can we do about the argumentative spirit present in our churches? In this episode of Difficult Conversations, host Walter Kim interviews Dr. Darrell Bock, one of today’s leading biblical scholars. Together they explore lessons from Scripture on how we can realign our approach to the way of Jesus, holding true to our faith and presenting a compelling witness to the world. You’ll also hear observations from Robert Cunningham, vicar of Church of the Good Shepherd in Charlottesville, Virginia, and Frankie Powell, a pastor to pastors and leader of the Global Church Network, on navigating church life in the midst of culture wars. Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts.  Do you like the podcast? Give us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. This is the best way for others to discover this series. If you listen on Spotify, give us a follow and hit the notification bell to be sure you never miss an episode. And don’t forget to pass your favorite episodes along to friends and family. Show Notes: http://nae.org/culture-war-podcast Resources Full interview with Dr. Darrell Bock on YouTubeFor further study, see 1 Peter 3, Ephesians 6, Romans 1, Luke 4 and Acts 4List of Dr. Darrell Bock’s books“Biblical Faith for Our Common Life in Complex Times” article by Walter Kim“The Secular Creed: Engaging 5 Contemporary Claims” article by Rebecca McLaughlinLove and Truth in the Most Difficult Issues, NAE podcast with Justin Giboney

    46 min
  3. Special Message from NAE President Walter Kim

    11/08/2024

    Special Message from NAE President Walter Kim

    It’s no accident that we produced the Difficult Conversations series during an election season, with its heightened tensions and palpable polarization. In this special message, NAE President Walter Kim takes a few minutes to speak to this moment following the election. However you may be feeling about the election results, God remains our refuge. His kingdom is greater, higher than any earthly kingdom. Now having concluded one set of difficult conversations leading up to the election, we embark on another set of difficult conversations with new opportunities to be the peacemakers that Jesus called blessed.  Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts.  Do you like the podcast? Give us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. If you listen on Spotify, give us a follow and hit the notification bell to be sure you never miss an episode. This is the best way for others to discover this series too. And don’t forget to pass your favorite episodes along to friends and family. Click Here for Show Notes Resources A Call to Prayer for President-Elect Trump and All Elected Leaders, NAE statementFor the Health of the NationRightNow Media + NAE video curriculum on For the Health of the NationFollowing the God Who Transforms, NAE 10-day devotionalHow to Live Well With Enemies edition of the NAE magazine

    5 min
  4. Ep. 5 | How Should Christians Engage Politically?

    11/04/2024

    Ep. 5 | How Should Christians Engage Politically?

    Neither political idolatry nor political disengagement make for peace. What does? If we’re all reading the same Bible, why do Christians disagree when it comes to politics? If we worship the same God, how can we come to such different conclusions? And why have so many Christians in America given up on voting altogether? This episode of Difficult Conversations opens with stories from pastors on what this election season has been like for them. It also features an in-depth conversation between Brent Leatherwood, president of the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission, an organization that helps Southern Baptist churches apply Christian principles to questions of public policy, and Kaitlyn Schiess, author of “The Ballot and the Bible” and co-host of The Holy Post podcast.  Though Kaitlyn and Brent often speak to different populations of Christians, they come to some surprising areas of agreement on political idolatry, political disengagement, and the biblical mandate for our participation in politics. This episode also brings in important insights from leaders like Dr. Christina Edmondson and Agustín Quiles on how different lived experiences yield different decisions at the ballot box. Plus, Pastor Derwin Gray of Transformation Church shares his perspective on political idolatry and what we can do to be peacemakers in our country. Show Notes: https://www.nae.org/ep5-christians-politics-brent-leatherwood-kaitlyn-schiess-difficult-conversations-podcast/ Resources For the Health of the NationFull conversation with Brent Leatherwood and Kaitlyn Schiess on YouTubeFull interview with Pastor Derwin Gray on YouTubeHow to Live Well With Enemies edition of the NAE magazineSpiritual Formation for Public Life, NAE podcast with Kaitlyn Schiess“The Bible and the Ballot” by Kaitlyn SchiessThe Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission of the Southern Baptist Convention

    47 min
  5. Bonus Episode | God on the Move with Daniel Yang

    10/30/2024

    Bonus Episode | God on the Move with Daniel Yang

    In this bonus episode, Daniel Yang shares his family’s refugee journey from Laos to Thailand and finally to East Moline, Illinois, where a church welcomed and helped them navigate life in the United States. Daniel’s father soon became a Christian, and in just seven years, the family was an integral part of a Hmong church plant. Daniel is now the national director of Churches of Welcome at World Relief, and previously served as the director of the Church Multiplication Institute at the Wheaton College Billy Graham Center. His story demonstrates how crossing boundaries in Jesus’ name can transform lives and bear fruit for generations to come. Along with Host Walter Kim, Daniel explores our responsibility to welcome the most vulnerable, the role of immigrant and multiethnic churches in American Christianity, and how we should always keep our focus on the vision of the greater Church that is to come.  Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts.  Do you like the podcast? Give us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. If you listen on Spotify, give us a follow and hit the notification bell to be sure you never miss an episode. This is the best way for others to discover this series too. And don’t forget to pass your favorite episodes along to friends and family. Find Show Notes Here: NAE.org/b2-global-church-daniel-yang-difficult-conversations-podcast/ Resources Churches of Welcome, a World Relief initiative“Inalienable: How Marginalized Kingdom Voices Can Help Save the American Church” by Daniel Yang, Eric Costanzo and Matthew Soerens“The Multiethnic Church Movement Hasn’t Lived up to Its Promise” article by Korie Little EdwardsA Multicultural Vision for the Church edition of the NAE magazineI Am Your Immigrant Neighbor video series

    44 min
  6. Ep. 4 | Are Multiethnic Churches the Answer to Division?

    10/24/2024

    Ep. 4 | Are Multiethnic Churches the Answer to Division?

    Turning the script on the most segregated hour.When Martin Luther King Jr. famously called the 11 o’clock hour on Sunday the most segregated hour in America, it illuminated the great division in our country. Decades after the Civil Rights Movement, churches remain more segregated than neighborhoods and public schools. How does this play into the polarized climate of our nation today? What would happen if Christians bridged the gap? This episode of Difficult Conversations features candid discussions between members and leaders of Mosaic Church, a multiethnic church in Little Rock, Arkansas, on the messiness and the beauty that comes from working and worshiping with people from different backgrounds. And Pastor Mark DeYmaz shares what compelled him to leave a comfortable, culturally homogenous church to plant Mosaic in the first place. You’ll also hear Pastor Derwin Gray’s journey from pro-football player to multiethnic church planter and his challenge for Christians to view the world through the lens of Jesus’ kingdom — not race, politics or any other thing. Lisa Fields, president of Jude 3 Project, calls attention to why this matters for the Church’s witness. Show notes here: https://nae.org/multiethnic-church-podcast  Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts.  Do you like the podcast? Give us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. If you listen on Spotify, give us a follow and hit the notification bell to be sure you never miss an episode. This is the best way for others to discover this series too. And don’t forget to pass your favorite episodes along to friends and family. Resources  Full interview with Pastor Derwin Gray on YouTubeA Multicultural Vision for the Church edition of the NAE magazine“Building a Healthy Multi-Ethnic Church” by Mark DeYmaz“How to Heal Our Racial Divide” by Derwin GrayFrom Deconstruction to Reconstruction, NAE podcast with Lisa FieldsJude 3 ProjectNAE Racial Justice & Reconciliation CollaborativeCultural Intelligence Center

    59 min
  7. Ep. 3 | What’s Christian Nationalism Anyway?

    10/17/2024

    Ep. 3 | What’s Christian Nationalism Anyway?

    In 2020, Pastor Caleb Campbell watched Christian nationalism take over large swaths of his congregation in Phoenix, Arizona. He thought about giving up on the church, but over the years, he came to see himself as a missionary to Christian nationalists. In Episode 3 of our Difficult Conversations series, Caleb shares his journey from skinhead to pastor, and from accusations of demonic influence to restored relationships. Along with Dr. Sheila Heen at Harvard Negotiation Project, he offers a hopeful way to engage with those who hold extreme views. And you'll also hear Gabriel Salguero of National Latino Evangelical Coalition describe his own encounter with extreme views. Listen on your favorite podcast app. Show notes here: http://nae.org/christian-nationalism-podcast #difficultconversations #peacemakers #polarized #divided #church #christiannationalism

    56 min
  8. Bonus Episode | Understanding the Rural Experience With Carl Greene

    10/09/2024

    Bonus Episode | Understanding the Rural Experience With Carl Greene

    In this bonus episode, NAE President Walter Kim hosts an extended conversation with Carl Greene on the shifts that have been happening in rural America. Carl is a rural ministry researcher and advocate, having served as a rural pastor with his family and enjoyed life as a dairy farmer in partnership with his father and brother. Carl talks about his experience growing up in Upstate New York and how he has grappled with his identity as a rural white American. He also sheds light on the complexities and diversity within rural America, the sense of loss that many rural residents feel, and the lure of Christian nationalism as a response to that loss. This conversation peels back misconceptions of rural-urban divide and offers greater clarity for those seeking to be peacemakers among Americans with different lived experiences.   Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts.  Do you like the podcast? Give us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. If you listen on Spotify, give us a follow and hit the notification bell to be sure you never miss an episode. This is the best way for others to discover this series too. And don’t forget to pass your favorite episodes along to friends and family. Go to Show Notes Watch More Are You TRAPPED in High Conflict? | Amanda Ripley Dr. Francis Collins Talks With Outspoken COVID Response Critic

    42 min
  9. Ep. 2 | The Pandemic Divide

    10/03/2024

    Ep. 2 | The Pandemic Divide

    From mask mandates and school closures to social distancing and vaccines, COVID brought about one of the most contentious divides we have experienced in recent American history. Countless relationships between families and friends and within churches and communities were tested, and many of those relationships remain fractured. This episode of Difficult Conversations features two Christians who sat on opposite sides of the COVID divide. As director of the National Institutes of Health from 2009 to 2021, Dr. Francis Collins played a pivotal role in the COVID response. Wilk Wilkinson, who lives in rural Minnesota, was intensely critical of how the government handled COVID and is the host of Derate the Hate podcast. You’ll also hear from Amanda Ripley, a New York Times bestselling author and contributor for The Washington Post, about conflict entrepreneurs, the role of the media, and how to turn high conflict into good conflict.  What can we learn from how we handled COVID in our churches, communities and national discourse? Is repair possible for the relationships that remain fractured? Our guests say that it’s not only possible but it’s essential to overcome the deep polarization in our country. Go to Show Notes Go to full interview of Amanda Ripley Go to full interview of Dr. Francis Collins & Wilk Wilkinson Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts.

    59 min
  10. Ep. 1 | Why Are We So Polarized?

    09/27/2024

    Ep. 1 | Why Are We So Polarized?

    The primary allegiances of Americans used to be to country and religion. Now Americans’ primary allegiance is to their political party. How did that happen? And what has it done to the state of conversations in our country? What has it done to our churches? Is there hope for the next generation? In this inaugural episode of Difficult Conversations, host Walter Kim interviews Dr. Jonathan Haidt, one of the world’s top experts on the psychology of morality and politics, to explore how we ended up so divided, including how technology and social media has shaped us and is shaping the next generation. You’ll also meet Heather Zempel, discipleship pastor at National Community Church, located in the heart of Washington, D.C. Over the years, NCC has successfully encouraged church members, from both sides of the aisle, to engage with one another through small groups and Bible studies. But as she shares, that’s gotten more difficult as our world has become more polarized.  Both Jonathan and Heather leave those who want to be peacemakers in our divided country with some practical next steps. Their recommendations may surprise you. Go to show notes Go to full interview

    50 min

  11. 09/19/2024

    Introducing Difficult Conversations

    A deeper look at a new podcast series on polarization and our call to be peacemakers. As a nation we are playing cultural and political Whac-a-Mole. On college campuses, at workplaces, in houses of worship, and even at the Thanksgiving table, it’s not just the ideas that we are trying to beat back. We’re using verbal mallets to pummel people because of their different views about the world or perceived threats to our identity. As we’ve become more polarized and divided than ever, it feels like meaningful, respectful conversations between people who disagree have become a thing of the past. Is it still possible to have difficult conversations with people who see the world differently from us without sacrificing our deep convictions and beliefs? What is the role of Christians in this moment? How can Christians be peacemakers within their churches, and among the larger society? From the National Association of Evangelicals comes a new podcast series, Difficult Conversations. It’s an exploration of how we ended up so polarized, and how Christians can become the peacemakers that Jesus called blessed. Hosted by NAE President Walter Kim, this series will share incredible stories of people who’ve stepped into enemy territory for the sake of building bridges, and you’ll hear from experts on why difficult conversations are so hard, how to have them, and why they matter for the kingdom of God. The series features: Jonathan Haidt, renowned social psychologist and author of “The Anxious Generation”Dr. Francis Collins, acclaimed scientist and served as director of the National Institutes of Health during the COVID pandemicDerwin Gray, lead pastor of Transformation Church in Indian Land, NCKaitlyn Schiess, public theologian and author of “The Ballot and the Bible”Christina Edmondson, author and cohost of the Truth’s Table podcastMark DeYmaz, founder of Mosaic Church of Central ArkansasSean McDowell, apologist, podcaster and author of “End the Stalemate”and many more… Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts. The full series launches on September 26. To find found more: http://difficultconversationspod.org/ Do you like the podcast? Give us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. If you listen on Spotify, give us a follow and hit the notification bell to be sure you never miss an episode. This is the best way for others to discover this series too. And don’t forget to pass your favorite episodes along to friends and family.

    11 min

  12. 09/17/2024

    Trailer | Welcome to Difficult Conversations

    Welcome to Difficult Conversations From the National Association of Evangelicals comes a new podcast series, Difficult Conversations. It’s an exploration of how we ended up so polarized, and how Christians can become the peacemakers that Jesus called blessed. Hosted by NAE President Walter Kim, this series will share incredible stories of people who’ve stepped into enemy territory for the sake of building bridges, and you’ll hear from experts on why difficult conversations are so hard, how to have them, and why they matter for the kingdom of God. Subscribe today wherever you listen to podcasts. Do you like the podcast? Give us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. If you listen on Spotify, give us a follow and hit the notification bell to be sure you never miss an episode. This is the best way for others to discover this series too. And don’t forget to pass your favorite episodes along to friends and family. CLICK HERE TO FIND OUT MORE! Coming September 19, 2024!

    3 min

Trailer

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out of 5
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About

Welcome to Difficult Conversations, a podcast series from the National Association of Evangelicals, hosted by NAE President Walter Kim. In a world that often feels divided — at the dinner table, in church, or on social media — this podcast explores how we ended up so polarized and what the role of Christians is in bringing peace. Through compelling stories and expert insights, Difficult Conversations will equip you with the tools to step into hard but transformative conversations and become the peacemakers Jesus calls blessed. Subscribe today and start your journey toward reconciliation and unity.

Information

  • Creator
    National Association of Evangelicals
  • Years Active
    2K
  • Episodes
    12
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © Copyright 2025 Difficult Conversations
  • Show Website
    Difficult Conversations

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