Do You Even Lit?

cam and benny feat. rich
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stemcel tragics use THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP to read litfic and classics

  1. 6월 22일

    Middlemarch, part 2: Pity the man with the young hot wife

    "In such a crisis as this, some women begin to hate." Let's go baby, things are getting steamy.  Rich isn't sure if he's turned on or terrified by Dorothea, Cam can't figure out whether he'd take blood money, and Ben is torn about whether marrying a psychopath is worth it if she's a hottie.  The middle section of this 800-page whopper is a tournament of injured pride. Casaubon exits early, Will (stupidly?) can't take or give a hint, Rosamund becomes Lydgate's worst nightmare, and Fred ... somehow fumbles his way back into credibility??  Question of the ep: Is Mary Garth a stand in for George Eliot who, as it happens, was described by Henry James as "magnificently ugly, deliciously hideous."  Listener mail: a non-native English speaker writes in to say Cam's sentences are hard to follow. Cam accepts the feedback with unusual grace. Full transcript for this episode (and every episode) is available at doyouevenlit.com, where you can filter and search by key ideas, authors, etc. (00:00:00) fiction as thought experiment (or: anti-thought experiment?) (00:07:44) Dorothea's arc: the crisis of rejection (00:18:00) Will Ladislaw in the vicinity (00:26:23) Bulstrode's pawnbroker past revealed (00:30:51) would you take the blood money? (00:37:40) Featherstone's will surprise — enter Rigg (00:44:45) Fred finds his feet with Caleb Garth (00:47:56) Farebrother's impossible magnanimity (00:51:36) is Mary Garth a George Eliot stand-in? (00:55:03) Lydgate and Rosamund: the marriage goes off a cliff (00:59:40) the sexual politics of Lydgate's mistake (01:06:05) listener mail: Cam gets roasted Write Us We love listener feedback. Send us a note at douevenlit@gmail.com to correct our hot takes, add your own, or ask a question. Next up  - Finish Middlemarch  - ???

    1시간 21분

  2. 6월 8일

    Middlemarch, part 1: A wish-fulfilment fantasy for spergy scholars

    For our big summer read we're cracking into Middlemarch, the 1871 doorstopper written by Mary Ann Evans under her pen name George Eliot. This chat covers the first 30 chapters. Not a whole lot has happened so far but it's a very cosy read. On Eliot and Tolstoy: which way does the influence go? How does this compare with our beloved Anna Karenina? Worst honeymoon ever: did we buy Dorothea and Casaubon as a couple? how were age-gap relationships treated in ye olden days? Did they even bone? And if girls like Dorothea exist in real life, where might we find them today? Lydgate and Rosamond: who he will vote for as chaplain at the new hospital? Tyke or Farebrother? The stakes are higher than they might first appear. Fred and the Garths: a charming failson coasting on a rich uncle's dangled inheritance. We debate whether every heir ought to be lightly humiliated before they're allowed to inherit. Plus, from the listener mailbag: have the boys ever read a book by a black person? Full transcript for this episode (and every episode) is available at doyouevenlit.com, where you can filter and search by key ideas, authors, etc. CHAPTERS: (00:00:00) the guardian's #1 novel, aka English Anna Karenina (00:10:40) Dorothea as wish-fulfilment fantasy for sperges (00:20:08) Elliot's language: the civilised art of the subtextual dagger (00:29:50) worst honeymoon ever (00:34:06) Casaubon is a little too much like us (00:41:48) Lydgate the ambitious outsider (00:58:39) TYKE VS FAREBROTHER!!!! hold onto your seats (00:58:39) Fred the affable failson (01:16:29) Listener mail: on the merits of assigning authors by race WRITE US: We love listener feedback. Send us a note at douevenlit@gmail.com to correct our hot takes, add your own, or ask a question. NEXT ON THE READING LIST: - The rest of Middlemarch ???

    1시간 27분

  3. 5월 27일

    Raymond Carver: Cathedrals even for those without eyes to see

    Raymond Carver's Cathedral might be one of the most simple and beloved American short stories, but Benny is determined to overthink it anyway. On meta-deception: before we dive in, Benny obsesses over “meta-deception” and feels betrayed by magicians. On jealousy: is it OK for your wife to write intimate poetry about another man tenderly stroking her face? Also, what does it take to be a good host? Moment of transcendence: what is the narrator transformed by drawing the cathedral, or is this just an over-interpreted moment in American fiction? We talk about sincerity, empathy, and seeing other people. Full transcript for this episode at doyouevenlit.com enriched with links, ideas, authors, etc. CHAPTERS: (00:00:07) benny mad at magicians using magic (00:04:55) carver’s plain writing (00:07:19) poetry not the first thing we pick up (00:07:48) tribulations of being a good host (00:12:46) getting reality from tv (00:17:12) boundaries on friend zones (00:20:41) dining in the dark (00:26:42) winding down for the night (00:28:24) describing cathedrals (00:35:23) on gaining empathy (00:38:02) what we get from cathedrals (00:41:17) on still being a good host (00:44:54) benny still not getting it (00:49:20) next book announcement WRITE US: We love listener feedback. Send us a note at Some say it's good.)

    51분

  4. 5월 14일

    Walking away from 'The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas'

    Ursula K. Le Guin's 1973 story The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas has been discussed to death, but the boys have finally cracked the ONE TRUE reading. huddle in Rich remembered this being a glorified trolley problem that would allow us to settle the question of 'who is the most utilitarian-brained of us all' but it's not! It's about politics, and capitalism, and bold utopian leaps! On the real-world parallels: does western prosperity actually depend on the suffering of the global south? Is there a difference between culpability and moral luck? Is there such thing as ethical consumption under capitalism? Fighting the hypothetical: Benny has largely solved moral philosophy and finds the story less compelling the second time around. Also, Omelas is not very revealing as a thought experiment. We talk about how thought experiments fail, and compare with Nozick's experience machine. On those who walk away: morally serious dissenters, or virtue-signalling posers? Is Le Guin really so against incrementalism that she has set up the experiment so it's impossible? We manage to find an optimistic reading lurking in there too. Plus: Why can't kids these days read good? We debate whether it's a moral panic, if the use of LLMs helps or hinders, and how f*****g stupid you'd have to be to try and start a literature podcast in a post-literate society. Full transcript available at doyouevenlit.com — you can sort all episodes by ideas, authors, and more. CHAPTERS: (00:00:00) this is a running podcast now (00:05:50) Impressions vs the first time we read the story (00:09:30) synopsis: a utopian city with a dirty little secret (00:17:50) FIGHTING THE HYPOTHETICAL (00:25:00) The case against thought experiments: If magic was real, would you grant that magic was real? (00:28:00) Is walking away a moral act or empty posturing (00:30:42) Le Guin's true motive: socio-political critique or glorified trolley problem (00:35:00) is Omelas actually an anarchist utopia? (00:43:01) is there such thing as ethical consumption under capitalism (00:52:28) moral luck vs. culpability (EA is good akshully) (01:02:00) The stickiness of the Omelas story (01:05:00) Eric T's listener mail: can kids still read good? (01:18:00) on the stupidity of starting a lit podcast in a post-literate age   WRITE US: We love listener feedback. Send us a note at douevenlit@gmail.com to correct our hot takes, add your own, or ask a question.   NEXT ON THE READING LIST: Cathedral — Raymond Carver Middlemarch — George Eliot

    1시간 28분

  5. 4월 29일

    American Pastoral, part 2: The Indigenous American Berserk

    Wrapping up our discussion of Philip Roth's American Pastoral, in which the Swede is finally reunited with his missing daughter. it's bleak. On losing your daughter: Can you save people from themselves? Should the Swede have dragged Merry out by the hair? Did he do anything wrong, or is he torturing himself for nothing? The American berserk: Was '60s counterculture violence a freak aberration, or just a manifestation of the undercurrent that lies beneath the pastoral dream? Is Roth an old man shaking his fist at clouds? Or is he making a clever point about the obliviousness of those who live behind white picket fences? Plus: Roth vs Dostoevsky, in praise of blue-haired activist types, and the problem of assimilation. CHAPTERS: (00:00:00) Roth vs Dostoevsky (00:10:00) Merry's motivations and lack of interiority (00:16:52) Coercing loved ones to save them from themselves (00:23:53) Champagne socialists are good akshully (00:26:20) Violence in america always has been meme (00:40:25) Roth's pessimism about assimilation (00:45:20) Roth's pessimism about knowing your fellow man (00:55:10) next book(s) announcement   WRITE US: We love listener feedback. Send us a note at douevenlit@gmail.com to correct our hot takes, add your own, or ask a question.   NEXT ON THE READING LIST: The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas - Ursula K. Le Guin Cathedral — Raymond Carver

    59분

  6. 4월 17일

    American Pastoral, part 1: Baby's First Lit Fic

    The Swede was the poster boy for the American dream. Football star. Marine. Marries a beauty queen. Inherits dad's glove factory and treats the workers like family. Buys the stone farmhouse in Old Rimrock, New Jersey. Loves his daughter unconditionally. Protests the Vietnam War in his own measured way, just to show her he's on her side. Then his precious little girl blows up the local post office and kills a man. "This says a lot about Society."—Philip Roth In this episode, covering the first five chapters of Roth's Pullitzer prize-winning novel, we find ourselves a book club divided. Rich hated the opening frame story. Nathan's over-interpretation of the Swede's every fart is written that way on purpose but that doesn't make it any less of a suffocating 80 pages to wade through. File under 'writers wanking themselves off about writing'. meanwhile Ben is deeply moved. He defends the frame story and mounts a convincing case that it's doing real work on memory, regret, and mortality. Cam is kind of on the fence but overall he likes the book. "I like the book."—Cam Opinions will no doubt change as we move into the second half but there's one thing we can say for sure: Basketball was never like this, Skip. CHAPTERS: (00:00:00) hot takes: mid-wit or masterpiece? (00:03:35) synopsis and the Zuckerman frame story (00:07:48) the Swede as WASP-adjacent golden boy (00:13:59) is the American Dream ever not a fantasy (00:17:21) Merry gets radicalised: a parent's worst nightmare (00:25:2) Rich rant on Zuckerman/Roth's cloying line-by-line exegesis (00:31:50) Benny's defence of the frame story (00:36:18) would you go to your 50-year high school reunion? (00:44:37) Woolf did it better tho   WRITE US: We love listener feedback. Send us a note at douevenlit@gmail.com to correct our hot takes, add your own, or ask a question.   NEXT ON THE READING LIST: The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas - Ursula K. Le Guin

    49분

  7. 4월 8일

    Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde: Thank God for Incognito Mode

    Robert Louis Stevenson's 1886 novella The Strange Case of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde really gets the juices flowing. Rich tells on himself big time, we find out we're all faking our authentic selves, and Benny is forced to bite some weird philosophical bullets. The Ring of Gyges: Are all men secretly depraved? How much bad stuff would you actually do if you had total anonymity? Rich says a lot; Benny is suspiciously optimistic. A typology of evil: Teasing out the banality of evil vs sociopathic indifference vs pure sadism. Where does Hyde fit? How does someone develop a taste for cruelty? On the opponent process model, why serial killers escalate, and our porn viewing habits. Virtue ethics vs utilitarian brain: Rich is losing faith in galaxy-brained consequentialist reasoning. Can you corrupt yourself by consuming bad things even if no one is harmed? On the Westworld problem, violent video games, and other gnarly thought experiments. Incongruous f*ggots: do we feel like a unified self or a coalition of competing entities? Why does Cam hide his books when his uncle comes to visit? On code-switching and the different masks we wear. CHAPTERS: (00:00:00) Listener mail: Nicole and Stefan (00:06:48) synopsis and the big twist (00:16:25) The perfect crime (00:21:53) Hyde's sordid pleasures (00:24:16) the Ring of Gyges: are people good when no one's watching? (00:29:43) A typology of evil (00:38:49) Developing a taste for sin (00:51:14) utilitarian brain vs virtue ethics (01:05:34) Is there anything beneath the mask   WRITE US: We love listener feedback. Send us a note at douevenlit@gmail.com to correct our hot takes, add your own, or ask a question.   NEXT ON THE READING LIST: American Pastoral — Philip Roth

    1시간 16분

  8. 3월 26일

    Atomised, part 2: Sympathy for the Incel

    IMMORTAL ASEXUAL CLONES: YES NO? Did aella's birthday g******g generate positive externalities? Why is Cam's fridge full of dead chickens? These are the big questions of our age and we are the only ones brave enough to tackle them. Join us as we wrap up our discussion of Houellebecq's Atomised (also known as The Elementary Particles). The sexual marketplace has no safety net: Houellebecq says individualism devours the rational structures meant to protect us. Rich argues we've already mostly solved this problem in the economic realm. Sex is harder tho. Are there any positive-sum status games to play here?Why do we tolerate redistributive policy for wealth but not for sex? Is Freddie deBoer a hypocrite for clowning on incels?  Bruno visits the Lieu de Changement: A sex commune with much kindly compassion for the outcasts masturbating on the fringes. Could this scale beyond extremely rule-following Germans? Is enforced monogamy the real solution, or has that ship long since sailed? Houellebecq's rhetorical sleight of hand: is paternal love purely instrumental? Do hippies really have a direct lineage to sadists and serial killers? Is the hedonic treadmill of transgression a real thing? probably not but we love our cheeky boy. One trillion identical Cams: Michel's solution is to eliminate sexual reproduction, individuality, and desire entirely. Would this even work? Is H being serious or just proving the problem is insoluble? What happens to science and progress in a world with no genetic or ideological diversity? CHAPTERS: (00:00:00) penis size chat (00:05:41) Brave New World and other failed utopias (00:15:30) The intractable problem of inceldom (00:25:58) Sexual social democracy and compassion for the lone masturbator (00:37:22) Houellebecq's rhetorical sleight of hand (00:41:30) the hedonic treadmill of transgression: hippies to serial killers (00:47:25) positive externalities of aella's birthday g******g and other status games (00:54:01) Rich rants about positivism and quantum physics woo (01:00:22) the third metaphysical mutation: asexual immortal clones (01:11:12) Next book announcement   WRITE US: We love listener feedback. Send us a note at douevenlit@gmail.com to correct our hot takes, add your own, or ask a question.   NEXT ON THE READING LIST: Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde — Robert Louis Stevenson American Pastoral — Philip Roth

    1시간 13분
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stemcel tragics use THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP to read litfic and classics

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    cam and benny feat. rich
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