Ethical Exits

Hosted by Hannah Sandmeyer
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Welcome to "Ethical Exits," a podcast dedicated to mission-driven entrepreneurs exploring the path of ethical business transactions. In this podcast, we'll delve into the often opaque world of mergers and acquisitions, a landscape filled with secrecy, uncertainty, and complex decisions. We'll share compelling stories from entrepreneurs who have successfully navigated ethical exits and provide insights from active sellers seeking a responsible transition. Join us as we uncover the principles and practices that make these transactions both impactful and integrity-driven.

  1. Recovery Hardware: Building & Selling a Business That Heals

    JAN 26

    Recovery Hardware: Building & Selling a Business That Heals

    What does it actually look like to build a business that heals and then sell it without breaking what made it matter? In this episode of Ethical Exits, Hannah sits down with Gina Schaefer, founder and retired CEO of a $50M, 13-location Ace Hardware business based in Washington, DC. Gina didn’t set out to build a movement. She opened a hardware store to pay a mortgage after she was laid off and serve her neighborhood. But a single, practical decision—removing the felony checkbox from job applications—quietly reshaped the culture of the business, the lives of its employees, and the legacy it would leave behind. Years later, the community gave the business a name Gina never would have chosen for herself: Recovery Hardware. This episode explores how culture is built through decisions, not decks—and how selling a business can be a joyful opportunity to amplify what it has already become. To learn more about Gina’s work, hire her as your keynote speaker, or order her book, visit her ⁠website⁠ or connect with her on ⁠LinkedIn⁠. At Ethical Exits, we champion profit-for-purpose capitalism—leveraging business as a force for scaling philanthropy and meaningful change. In each episode, we ask guests to highlight a cause close to their heart. For Gina, that cause is ⁠Rasa Legal⁠ — a nonprofit using technology to help people expunge criminal records and remove barriers to employment, housing, and opportunity. Rasa Legal’s work directly extends the values Gina lived inside her business. Creating second chances, restoring dignity, and expanding access to economic participation. 🔗 Learn more or support their work: ⁠https://rasa-legal.com/

    1h 5m
  2. From Kale to Data Node: What Happened When Amazon Bought Whole Foods

    12/22/2025

    From Kale to Data Node: What Happened When Amazon Bought Whole Foods

    What happens when a mission-driven company becomes infrastructure? In this narrative episode of Ethical Exits, we tell the full story of Whole Foods, from a single community-rooted grocery store in Austin to its $13.7B acquisition by Amazon. This isn’t a story about villains. It’s a story about pressure. We unpack why the sale happened so fast, what changed for workers and vendors after the deal, and what founders should learn when growth, capital, and values collide. Because exits are never neutral. Someone’s values always shape what comes next.

    1 hr
  3. The Next Evolution of Employee Ownership: Chris Fredericks and the Diversified ESOP Holding Company Model

    11/26/2025

    The Next Evolution of Employee Ownership: Chris Fredericks and the Diversified ESOP Holding Company Model

    With a career rooted in finance, strategic growth, and the belief that business can be a force for good, Chris Fredericks is redefining what happens after an exit. As founder and CEO of Empowered Ventures, he transformed a traditional specialty materials company into a fully employee owned firm through an ESOP in 2010. Ten years later, he launched the diversified holding company model to scale that ownership across multiple businesses, protect jobs, deepen wealth creation for employees, and keep prosperity local. Chris’ story starts in Indiana, where as CFO of TVF he saw firsthand both the dignity work can bring and the risk of concentrated ownership. He built a model focused on diversification, shared prosperity and long term thinking. In his words, employee ownership is not only a powerful exit strategy, it is a growth engine. It is a strategy where integration begins with a clear commitment to do no harm and where worker empowerment sits at the center of every acquisition. In this episode we dig into how ESOPs work, the trade offs among ESOPs, co-ops and EOTs, and how an empowerment first acquisition strategy can deliver both high performance and high purpose. To learn more about Chris’ work, visit Empowered Ventures or connect with him on LinkedIn. _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________ At Ethical Exits, we champion profit-for-purpose capitalism—leveraging business as a force for scaling philanthropy and meaningful change. In each episode, we ask guests to highlight a cause close to their heart. For Chris, that cause is GiveDirectly — a direct-cash charity committed to data-driven cash transfers to people living in poverty; Chris says the most effective impact often comes when you trust people with resources, rather than impose more structure.

    57 min
  4. The B Corp Founder as Buyer: When Purpose Shows Up as the Acquirer

    10/24/2025

    The B Corp Founder as Buyer: When Purpose Shows Up as the Acquirer

    What happens when a creative agency founder turns to M&A not as a growth hack, but as a tool for collective impact? In this powerful episode, Hannah and Caitlin sit down with Peter Georgariou, founder and CEO of Karma Dharma, a B Corp–certified creative and strategy agency that’s redefining what it looks like when a mission-driven founder becomes the buyer. Peter isn’t waiting for big capital to rewrite the rules. He’s actively acquiring values-aligned companies to build what he calls a “Deloitte for do-gooders”: a collective of purpose-driven agencies that share back-end resources, preserve culture, and amplify impact. We unpack: - How Peter reframed M&A as a force for good rather than a corporate takeover - His philosophy on transparency, trust, and treating employees like adults - Why B Corps can’t stay small if we want to reshape capitalism - How following the “energy trail” guides his dealmaking process - How culture, not just contracts, determines the success of an acquisition Peter’s radical candor, deep humanity, and ambitious vision offer a fresh counter-narrative to traditional dealmaking. If you’ve ever wondered what it looks like when purpose shows up as the acquirer, this is the episode for you. ________________________________________________________________________ At Ethical Exits, we champion profit-for-purpose capitalism—leveraging business as a force for scaling philanthropy and meaningful change. In each episode, we ask guests to highlight a cause close to their heart. For Peter, that cause is Philadelphia FIGHT, a federally qualified health care provider in downtown Philadelphia. What began as an AIDS support organization in the 1980s now provides primary health care for thousands of marginalized people each year. As Peter shared, organizations like Philadelphia FIGHT are facing growing threats from funding cuts and policy shifts—changes that could deepen health care deserts across the U.S. Coming from Canada, where health care is treated as a right, Peter is deeply committed to supporting efforts that expand access for those who need it most.

    1 hr
  5. EOTs vs ESOPs: What Every Founder Should Know

    09/28/2025

    EOTs vs ESOPs: What Every Founder Should Know

    Chris Michael, founder of EOT Advisors, has dedicated his career to ensuring that employee ownership isn’t just a technical option—it’s a viable, dignified path for founders who want their life’s work to stand on its own two feet. As the person who introduced the Employee Ownership Trust (EOT) to the U.S., he’s facilitated more than $750M in capital transfers to over 3,000 workers, making him one of the movement’s most influential architects. In this episode, Chris breaks down the differences between EOTs and ESOPs—and offers perspective on cooperatives—explaining why each model exists, where they work best, and why simplicity, speed, and sustainability matter when transitioning ownership. From “naked in, naked out” profit sharing to the “cabin in Minnesota” analogy, he makes a complex subject approachable while underscoring why employee ownership is more than a structure—it’s a cause worth supporting. For founders weighing their options, this conversation offers more than a comparison of models. It’s a vision for how business legacies can be preserved, employees empowered, and missions locked in for generations. To explore Michael’s work and the future of Employee Ownership Trusts, visit ⁠eotadvisors.com⁠ or connect with him on ⁠LinkedIn⁠. ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ At Ethical Exits, we champion profit-for-purpose capitalism—leveraging business as a force for scaling philanthropy and meaningful change. In each episode, we ask guests to highlight a cause close to their heart. For Chris, that cause is employee ownership itself—ensuring businesses can be transitioned into structures that protect mission and values for generations of workers. Instead of pointing to one organization, Chris encourages listeners to think about supporting the broader employee ownership movement—whether through philanthropic dollars directed to groups advancing this work, or by exploring how their own businesses might transition into an Employee Ownership Trust or Perpetual Purpose Trust.

    1h 1m
  6. From Earth Mamas to Perpetual Purpose Trust: Brenna Davis and Organically Grown Company

    08/28/2025

    From Earth Mamas to Perpetual Purpose Trust: Brenna Davis and Organically Grown Company

    Some companies follow a path. Others create one. Organically Grown Company didn’t just adopt an ownership model — they invented a new one. When their ESOP no longer fit, they pioneered the nation’s first Perpetual Purpose Trust, building the blueprint as they went and openly sharing it with anyone who wanted to learn. That ingenuity seeded an entire movement. Today, more than 50 companies — including Patagonia — have followed their lead. And OGC continues to advocate, educate, and push the boundaries of what steward ownership can look like. In this episode, CEO Brenna Davis takes us inside the story: from a co-op of farmers and Earth Mamas, to a radical new ownership model that locks mission in place, shares profits with coworkers and community, and sets a powerful precedent for purpose-driven business everywhere. To dive deeper into Brenna’s work, check out Leading Through Fire, her international bestselling book on resilient leadership, and visit brennadavis.com for more on her writing and speaking. You can also follow her leadership journey at organicallygrown.com or connect with her on LinkedIn. ____________________________________________________________________ At Ethical Exits, we champion profit-for-purpose capitalism—leveraging business as a force for scaling philanthropy and creating meaningful change. In every episode, we invite our guests to highlight a charity or organization that holds special significance to them and is making a real impact in solving global challenges. Brenna gives her time and support to the Purpose Trust Ownership Network, which helps companies adopt steward-ownership structures that keep mission locked in for generations. She’s equally passionate about Friends of Noise, a nonprofit dedicated to amplifying youth voices by providing safe, all-ages spaces for music and performance.

    51 min
  7. Rigged by Design: How Private Equity Killed Toys “R” Us

    08/13/2025

    Rigged by Design: How Private Equity Killed Toys “R” Us

    When Toys “R” Us shuttered its doors, the popular narrative pointed fingers at Amazon and the rise of online shopping. But the real story ran much deeper: one involving a leveraged buyout, billions in borrowed money, and a private equity playbook designed to extract value at all costs. In this episode, we break down exactly how the deal was structured, explaining private equity terms in plain language and revealing how the strategy left Toys “R” Us burdened with unsustainable debt — and why similar tactics are impacting other industries today. Whether you’re a founder, investor, or mission-driven buyer, you’ll come away with a clearer understanding of how capital moves behind the scenes, and how to structure growth so it protects your purpose instead of undermining it.

    59 min
  8. When Democracy Inherits the Business: John Abrams and the Blueprint for the CommonWealth Company

    07/30/2025

    When Democracy Inherits the Business: John Abrams and the Blueprint for the CommonWealth Company

    In this episode of Ethical Exits, we sit down with John Abrams, founder of South Mountain Company—one of the first worker-owned B Corps in the U.S.—to explore how business can be a tool for long-term impact. From transitioning to employee ownership to mentoring other founders, John’s story is part strategy, part legacy, and all heart. We talk about: -Why democratic workplaces make better businesses—and better citizens -How to design a net-positive exit, not just a clean one -What can go wrong (and right) when founders try to let go -The trillion-dollar opportunity to transfer wealth for the common good If you’re wrestling with what comes next—or how to leave something behind without selling it out—this one’s for you. To learn more about John and his incredible work, visit ⁠Abramsangell.com⁠ or connect with him on ⁠LinkedIn.⁠ ____________________________________________________________________________ At Ethical Exits, we champion profit-for-purpose capitalism—leveraging business as a force for scaling philanthropy and creating meaningful change. In every episode, we invite our guests to highlight a charity or organization that holds special significance to them and is making a real impact in solving global challenges. John supports the ⁠Kachuwa Impact Fund⁠, a mission-driven investment fund that backs businesses and organizations building a more just, sustainable, and inclusive economy. Focused on long-term impact over short-term gain, Kachuwa invests in companies that prioritize social and environmental returns—proving that capital can serve community, not just shareholders.

    1 hr
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About

Welcome to "Ethical Exits," a podcast dedicated to mission-driven entrepreneurs exploring the path of ethical business transactions. In this podcast, we'll delve into the often opaque world of mergers and acquisitions, a landscape filled with secrecy, uncertainty, and complex decisions. We'll share compelling stories from entrepreneurs who have successfully navigated ethical exits and provide insights from active sellers seeking a responsible transition. Join us as we uncover the principles and practices that make these transactions both impactful and integrity-driven.

Information

  • Creator
    Hosted by Hannah Sandmeyer
  • Years Active
    2024 - 2026
  • Episodes
    21
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Show Website
    Ethical Exits