Real World Behavioural Science Stu King

In this episode of the Real World Behavioural Science Podcast, my colleague Dr Tiago Moutela Tiago Moutela and I get geeky with Pete around behavioural science and transport. ​
​A self-confessed “transport enthusiast”, Pete’s work has spanned the private sector; as one of the founding team members of the Ogilvy UK Behavioural Science Team, to the public sector; building a team of behavioural scientists at the Government's Department for Transport (DfT), United Kingdom, and finally to academia at the University of Bath; where he’s seeking to understand more about the psychology of decision making around transport. ​
​Having co-authored a book with behavioural science advertising oracle, Rory Sutherland, Pete is one of the UK’s foremost experts in designing transport solutions in response to human behaviour. ​
​The aim of his latest research is to provide a more accurate picture of what is going on – albeit a much messier, more complex, and nuanced picture - from which decision makers can base investment and design decisions. ​
​Some of the key points the discussion covers includes:​
👉 The often-false assumptions around behaviour relating to travel​
👉The importance of reframing & asking the right questions​
👉The social implications & influences affecting the way we travel​
👉The importance of diversity in decision making​
👉 Managing stakeholder expectations relating to behavioural science​
👉 The importance of collaboration between transport & health​
​Pete remains excited about how much more we could understand about people from the data we could access. We look forward to following his work at Bath University!​
​The podcast is delivered as usual in partnership with the Behavioural Science and Public Health Network (BSPHN).

Dr Rachel Carey is back for the second of two podcasts, hosted by Stuart King and Dr Tiago Moutela. The first podcast (episode 26) was recorded back in 2021, and Rachel kindly came back on the podcast to update us on progress at ZINC VC.
Now Chief Scientist at ZINC VC, Rachel is a behavioural scientist with a background in health psychology. Following on from our previous conversation about how she applies (and advocates for the application of) behavioural science within start-up environments, Rachel talks about her experiences of and challenges with the often-binary perception of “academia” and “industry”.


Rachel, Stuart and Tiago discuss:
Putting research & evidence at the core of new ventures Benefits and challenges of moving from academia into “industryExperts vs generalistsChanging the narrative around career paths for researchersRobustness and rigour of research  Ultimately seeking to help mission-driven individuals to unlock their own impact, Rachel and the growing team at ZINC VC are doing fascinating and exciting work.

You can find out more about them here: https://www.zinc.vc/ or contact Rachel directly on twitter via @Rach_Carey.

Dr Rachel Carey is this episode’s guest - and this is the first of two podcasts with Rachel, which were previously recorded back in 2021 - hosted by Stuart King and Dr Tiago Moutela.

This fascinating conversation covers Rachels career; from academia into the world of applied behavioral science in the field of science-based, mission-driven, tech start-ups.


We explore how Rachel utilizes behavioural science frameworks in her work, the importance of behavioural science at the beginning of the start-up journey, and how we can promote the adoption of mission-driven behavioural science in public health.


Dr Rachel Carey is a behavioral scientist with a background in health psychology. Following the competition of her PHD at the National University of Ireland in Gallway, Rachel took up a post at UCL in 2014 working with Profession Susan Michie on the theories and techniques of beahviour change project.


In 2016, Rachel joined BUPA, as a senior behavior change research advisor where she led a collaborative programme of work with UCL.


Over the past 5 years as Zinc VC's Chief Scientist, Rachel has built an ever-growing inter-disciplinary research & development team who work with start-ups founders to create new, scalable and impact driven innovations.


Rachel describes the way she uses behavior change frameworks including COM-B, the behavior change wheel, and the behavior change techniques taxonomy, as an objective and structured way to challenge assumptions, and make the product development process more efficient.


She advocates for the need to incentivise and support the involvement of behavioral science in a start-up environment for big impact, but also the cross fertilization, learning and networking of applied behavioral scientists for all sectors.

Professor Marie Johnston is our guest on the first episode back, hosted by Stuart King and Dr Tiago Moutela…what a start!

Marie epitomises what this show is all about. Her passion, dedication and steadfast commitment to her values shine through as she describes her journey to where she is today. 

A Registered Health and Clinical Psychologist, and Professor Emeritus of Health Psychology at the University of Aberdeen, Marie has been at the forefront of health psychology for five decades and was described by a colleague as having “kept health psychology in the UK on a scientific foundation.”

Marie conducts research on behaviour change in health and healthcare contexts and on disability (theory, measurement and intervention). 
 
She is a Fellow of the Royal Society of Edinburgh, the Academy of Medical Sciences, the Academy of Learned Societies for the Social Sciences the Royal College of Physicians of Edinburgh and Honorary Fellow of the British Psychological Society, European Health Psychology Society and the Health Psychology and Public Health Network. 

 Marie shares her career journey; from the University of St Andrews, Royal Free Hospital and Oxford University, having completed her BSc at the University of Aberdeen and PhD at the University of Hull. 
 
Having had many decisions to make, Marie describes the core values that have guided her throughout:


1.     Make a difference: it must have practical implications or influence policy

2.     High quality: it must be intellectually valid and use the very best methodology

Stuart and Marie discuss a wide range of topics including:


The role of self-efficacy in predicting health outcomes for people with impairmentsExamples of successful working between academia and medicine, resulting in significant impactAdvice to people starting out in careers who want to get into applied behavioural psychology The role of behaviour change in the reduction of COVID transmission
Ultimately Marie promotes working with quality, integrity, purpose, and mutual respect. 

Marie is not particularly active on social media, but you can contact her on her via email: m.johnston@abdn.ac.uk

Professor Angel Chater is a Chartered Psychologist, Associate Fellow of The British Psychological Society and a Health & Sport & Exercise Psychologist with the Health & Care Professionals Council. She is a Professor in Health Psychology and Behaviour Change at the University of Bedfordshire, where she leads the centre in health, wellbeing and behaviour change. She is also an Honorary Senior Lecturer in Health Psychology and Behavioural Medicine at UCL and past Chair of the British Psychological Society Division of Health Psychology and passionate about the scientific application of health psychology to public health and its role in intervention design.  
Professor Falko Sniehotta is Director of the NIHR Policy Research Unit for Behavioural Science, past President of the European Health Psychology Society, associate editor of The Health Psychology Review and member of the editorial board of Psychology & Heath and British Journal of Health Psychology. His work is recognised through honorary fellowships at the Academy of Social Science, the European Health Psychology Society, the American Psychological Association and the UK Behavioural Science in Public Health Network. His international research programme aims at developing and testing interventions to change behaviours relevant to health and healthcare. 
A multidisciplinary opportunity…
Professor Sniehotta explains the implied idea that behavioural science and medicine are both multidisciplinary areas, not necessary distinctly different, and how the terms have been adapted through the years away from the medical to understanding in the way of behaviour. Both he and Professor Chater discuss the exciting opportunities that come from collaboration across the disciplines, how 'coming out of the ivory towers' of Universities can extend science in this way and make real positive change. 
Changing the conversation…
Professor Chater explains times in her career where behaviour change work has had a direct, positive impact on people and populations from both a lobbying perspective and a research perspective, with the the Active Herts programme as a successful example of how behaviour change research helped develop a programme to encourage physical activity.  
Examples of ‘Bench to Bedside’ translation…
From this Professor Sniehotta adds about his ‘bench to bedside’ work with Professor Roy Taylor, Professor of Medicine and Metabolism at Newcastle University, to understand how to deliver an intervention that is powerful enough to achieve substantial weight loss in people living with Type-II Diabetes and how to implement this in primary care practices which has been a great success.  
Teaching the foundations of behavioural science at schools…
Stu and Angel debate the benefits that could arise as adults if we had learnt the foundations of behavioural science and health psychology as children at school. Could this limit those engaging in negative behaviours when they’re older? Could this tear down more barriers to leading healthier, happier lifestyles as adults?
Falko expands on this by adding that to make real changes there are often three issues; funding, the narrative and the methods.
Contact
Professor Angel Chater: Twitter / Linkedin
Professor Falko Sniehotta: Twitter / Linkedin

Maddy Arden is Professor of Health Psychology and Director of the Centre for Behavioural Science and Applied Psychology (CeBSAP) at Sheffield Hallam University.  She is a Chartered Psychologist, a full member of the DHP, and a Registered Health Psychologist (HCPC). Maddy is co-editor of the British Journal of Health Psychology and director of the Behavioural Science Consortium, which provides expertise to government on the application of behavioural science to public policy issues and is co-chair of the Yorkshire and Humber Behavioural Science hub.
Greg Fell is the Director of Public Health in Sheffield. He graduated from Nottingham University with a Degree in Biochemistry and Physiology in 1993 and since then has had various roles including a Social Researcher in a maternity ward as well as a number of roles in Health Promotion and Public Health. Since 2016, Greg has worked as the Director of Public Health for Sheffield. 
Behavioural Science in the fight against Covid-19
Professor Arden talks about how everything she does is underpinned by the theories of Health Psychology and Behavioural Science and how these can be put into practice in the real world. She explains how using these theories and frameworks, in relation to Covid-19, was helpful early on to predict what might be useful and what might happen.
Underestimating the complexity of behavioural science 
She goes on to discuss how many can often underestimate the complexity of behavioural science and how she’s fed up of people using the phrase ‘common sense’, questioning what exactly we mean by it and how we need to consider that people can sometimes make decisions without a conscious rationale. In reference to this, she adds that there needs to be an awareness of the different factors influencing behaviour and more insightful conversations around this.  
Thinking outside of ‘common sense’…
Greg Fell explains how he works to convince people to think outside of their own ‘common sense’. Sticking to weight, Greg discusses decision making and how we all make rational and irrational choices, in the 'here and now', not thinking about what might happen in the future. How we’re products of our environment and how this can influence the choices we make, with reference to the recent junk food advertising ban and the work he has done in the past regarding smoking cessation.  Both go on to debate the similarities and differences between smoking cessation and weight loss barriers strategies. 
Takeaway Thoughts
Professor Maddy Arden summarises the need to create awareness of how broadly behavioural science can be used and highlight the basic knowledge to know how widely it can be applied. 
Greg adds that behavioural science has positively begun to be applied across the Council and in agreement with Maddy, states how important it is to point out that the behavioural science ‘toolbox’ is out there, it exists and it can be used practically to solve problems. 
Contact
Professor Madelynne Arden
Twitter / Linkedin
Greg Fell
Twitter / Linkedin
Links:
www.bsphn.org.uk