ValuationPodcast.com - A podcast about all things Business + Valuation.

Melissa Gragg
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Valuation Podcast.com - A video and audio podcast on all topics concerning business owners and valuations. Melissa Gragg is a Business Valuation Expert in St. Louis and the host, she interviews CPAs, company valuation experts, testifying experts, marketing experts, divorce expert witnesses, estate planning experts, management consulting experts, strategic planning experts, business lawyers and covers business topics pertaining to company owners and attorneys. http://www.ValuationPodcast.com (314) 541-8163 or email hello@valuationpodcast.com

  1. Valuation Decisions That Shape Family Wealth

    JAN 30

    Valuation Decisions That Shape Family Wealth

    Hi, welcome back to ValuationPodcast.com — a podcast and video series about all things business and valuation. I’m Melissa Gragg, a financial mediator and business valuation expert in St. Louis, Missouri. Today I’m joined by Jeff Condren, an advisor to family business owners in the Chicagoland area who specializes in next-generation transitions and building the right team to make those transitions successful. In this episode, we’re digging into a topic that doesn’t get talked about enough: how valuation decisions shape the entire family wealth system — from retirement planning and risk balancing, to succession, fairness among siblings, taxes, and even family harmony. 5 Key Takeaways Valuation is a family systems decision, not just a number.  How you value the business influences retirement planning, sibling expectations, governance, and future conflict.Regular valuations prevent stalled deals and “money left on the table.”  Overvaluing can kill interest; undervaluing can cost millions — being prepared protects leverage.Business risk changes how owners invest outside the business.  Many owners take big risk inside the company, then prefer a more conservative investment portfolio to balance total risk.Next-gen transitions require early exposure, not holiday dinner conversations.  Families need a multi-year plan to share information, clarify values, and create ownership structures that don’t explode later.The right accountability team reduces taxes and reduces family conflict.  Coordinated planning with a CFO/treasurer, CPA/auditor, estate planner, financial advisor, and valuation expert prevents legal, tax, and sibling-war landmines.Q&As from the episode: Q1: Why do family business owners need regular business valuations? A: Regular valuations help owners set a realistic price if a buyer approaches, avoid over- or undervaluing the company, and plan retirement and succession with credible numbers. Q2: How does business valuation affect family wealth planning? A: The valuation influences estate planning, gifting decisions, tax strategy, portfolio risk, and how “fair vs. equal” is structured among children and heirs. Q3: What happens if a business owner undervalues their company during a sale? A: Undervaluing can leave millions on the table, weaken negotiating power, and create a sale price that doesn’t match the real economic value of the business. Q4: Why do business owners delay succession planning? A: Many owners are emotionally attached to the business, unsure what they’ll do after exiting, and focused on day-to-day operations instead of long-term transition strategy. Q5: Who should be on the team for a family business transition? A: Typically: an internal CFO/treasurer, an external CPA/auditor, a valuation expert, an estate planner, and a financial advisor to coordinate taxes, ownership, and post-sale planning. LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/condren/ Website: https://www.mesirow.com/bio/jeff-condren Jeffrey Condren is a Senior Vice President and Wealth Advisor in Mesirow Wealth Management. With two decades of experience in the financial industry, Jeff has solidified his reputation as a seasoned expert in wealth management and financial planning. Jeff joined Mesirow in 2015 and has 20 years in the financial services industry. Throughout his career, he has provided invaluable guidance to a diverse clientele, navigating them through various economic landscapes and market fluctuations. Melissa Gragg https://www.valuationmediation.com/ Support the show

    38 min
  2. Before the Sale: Building Trust Around Family, Money, and the Next Generation

    JAN 21

    Before the Sale: Building Trust Around Family, Money, and the Next Generation

    Hi, and welcome back to ValuationPodcast.com — the podcast and video series where we talk about business, valuation, and the real-life issues that come with both. I’m Melissa Gragg, a financial mediator and business valuation expert in St. Louis. Today I’m joined by Emily Bouchard — family transition specialist, author, and speaker — and we’re going beyond the numbers. Our topic is: Before the Sale: Building Trust Around Family, Money, and the Next Generation. Because when a founder-led or multi-generational company is heading toward a transition — whether it’s a sale, gifting, or passing leadership — it’s never just a transaction. It’s identity, legacy, fairness, transparency, and trust… all at once. If your family business is thinking about “what’s next,” this conversation is for you. 5 Key Takeaways A business sale is an identity event, not just a financial event. Founders often need emotional preparation for “who am I after this?”Role clarity prevents resentment. Ownership, leadership, employment, and “perks” must be defined before trust fractures.Transparency needs structure. Families need governance (owners council, board, family assembly) to decide who knows what, when, and why.Fair isn’t always equal — but it must feel fair. Especially when some heirs work in the business and others don’t.Capture the legacy before the doors close. After a clean sale, access ends — archive stories, artifacts, lessons, and values before you exit.Q&As from this episode Q1: What should a family business do before selling a company? A: Before selling, families should align on legacy goals, clarify roles and ownership expectations, and set a communication plan so trust doesn’t break during the transaction. Q2: Why do business owners regret selling their company after a sale? A: Many owners regret selling because they weren’t emotionally prepared for the identity shift and loss of purpose that can happen within 6–12 months post-sale. Q3: How do you build trust between siblings in a family-owned business? A: Trust grows through transparency, clear governance, role definition, and shared agreements on distributions, perks, and decision-making—so assumptions don’t turn into resentment. Q4: What’s the difference between fair vs equal in family business inheritance? A: Equal means everyone gets the same. Fair means the structure reflects contributions, roles, and needs—especially when some heirs work in the business and others are passive owners. Q5: When should you tell family members you’re planning to sell the business? A: Families should start with shared values and legacy conversations early, then disclose sale discussions in a structured setting (like a family assembly) so everyone hears it at the same time. Emily Bouchard: https://emilybouchard.com/ As a fractional Chief Learning Officer and Family Dynamics Advisor for Family Offices and Financial Advisory Firms, I bring over 20 years of experience working with multigenerational families of wealth. My role is to empower clients and their advisors with knowledge and skills to maximize the benefits, while minimizing the pitfalls, associated with financial wealth.  With a background in social work and marital and family therapy, I focus on the human, social, intellectual and spiritual capitals to make sure the financial capital is a force for good for families and the communities they love." Melissa Gragg https://www.valuationmediation.com/ Support the show

    25 min
  3. The Future of Leadership: Self-Awareness, Authenticity, and Human Connection

    JAN 2

    The Future of Leadership: Self-Awareness, Authenticity, and Human Connection

    The Future of Leadership: Self-Awareness, Authenticity, and Human Connection with Emily Bouchard and Akasha Welcome back to ValuationPodcast.com, where we explore business, valuation, and the human side of leadership. In this episode, Melissa Gragg, financial mediator and valuation expert, is joined by Emily and Akasha for a powerful conversation on leadership, self-awareness, authenticity, and integration — and why these qualities matter more than ever in today’s rapidly changing world. As AI, remote work, and global complexity reshape organizations, traditional leadership models are no longer enough. This conversation explores how leaders — especially in corporate, family business, and legacy environments — can evolve by becoming more self-aware, emotionally intelligent, and authentically human. We discuss: Why leadership is shifting from control to connectionThe cost of inauthenticity and identity projectionMasculine and feminine integration in leadershipHow vulnerability builds trust, innovation, and resilienceWhy seeing and being seen may be the most critical leadership skill of our timeThis episode moves beyond tactics and metrics into the inner development work required to lead people — not just systems. If you’re a leader, advisor, family business owner, or someone navigating identity and purpose at work, this conversation will challenge and expand how you think about leadership. 5 Key Takeaways The future of leadership is inner development  Self-awareness, emotional intelligence, and authenticity are now essential leadership capabilities.Inauthenticity has a real energy cost  Leaders burn out by maintaining identities that don’t reflect who they truly are.Leadership is about seeing and being seen  Trust, influence, and collaboration grow when people feel genuinely recognized.Integration beats polarization  The most effective leaders integrate masculine and feminine qualities rather than suppressing either.Safe spaces unlock innovation and growth  Psychological safety allows people to take risks, share perspectives, and lead as whole humans.Q&As from the episode: Q1: Why is self-awareness important for leadership today?  A: Self-awareness allows leaders to adapt, communicate effectively, and build trust in increasingly complex and human-centered environments. Q2: How does authenticity impact leadership effectiveness?  A: Authentic leaders use less emotional energy managing perceptions, which leads to better decision-making, resilience, and team engagement. Q3: What role does emotional intelligence play in modern leadership?  A: Emotional intelligence enables leaders to navigate conflict, motivate teams, and create cultures of psychological safety and collaboration. Q4: Why are traditional leadership models failing?  A: Models based on control, hierarchy, and suppression don’t align with today’s need for connection, adaptability, and meaning. Q5: How can leaders create safer, more innovative teams?  A: By modeling vulnerability, validating diverse perspectives, and encouraging curiosity over certainty. Q6: What does it mean to lead as a whole human being?  A: Leading as a whole human means integrating personal values, empathy, awareness, and purpose into professional leadership roles. https://emilybouchard.com/ https://www.cultivatingleadership.com/ https://www.valuationmediation.com/ Support the show

    1h 6m
  4. Who Owns Your Digital Empire? Protect & Value Your Invisible Assets Before You Sell Your Business

    12/12/2025

    Who Owns Your Digital Empire? Protect & Value Your Invisible Assets Before You Sell Your Business

    Who Owns Your Digital Empire? Protect & Value Your Invisible Assets Before You Sell Your Business Welcome to ValuationPodcast.com—your go-to resource for navigating the world of business growth and valuation. I’m Melissa Gragg, a financial mediator and business valuation expert in St. Louis, Missouri. In this episode, I sit down with Paige Wiest, CEO of Tree Ring Digital, to uncover one of the biggest blind spots business owners face today—digital asset ownership, continuity, and valuation. If you think “I know where my website is,” or “my marketing team handles that,” this conversation will open your eyes. Paige breaks down the hidden digital assets that can make or break your valuation, delay due diligence, trigger legal conflicts, or even destroy a deal entirely. We talk about: ✔️ What digital assets actually are (it’s far more than a website) ✔️ Why owners lose control of their online presence without realizing it ✔️ How digital chaos affects valuation, due diligence & post-transaction headaches ✔️ Business continuity, digital continuity & avoiding operational breakdowns ✔️ The rising importance of AEO (AI Engine Optimization) ✔️ How small oversights—like a past employee’s phone number—can cost you thousands ⭐ 5 Key Takeaways 1. Most business owners do NOT own or control all their digital assets. Logins, domains, hosting, ad accounts, social profiles, CRMs, and tools are often scattered, vendor-owned, or tied to former employees. 2. Due diligence can break down without digital asset clarity. Buyers lose confidence when ownership is unclear—leading to retrades, lower valuations, or stalled deals. 3. Digital continuity is as critical as operational continuity. If a vendor disappears or an employee leaves, businesses can lose access to websites, analytics, systems, or customer funnels. 4. AI-driven search (AEO) will not replace SEO—but requires a clean, authoritative digital foundation. Without SEO fundamentals and trustworthy structured data, AEO strategies fall flat. 5. Digital asset audits need to happen BEFORE going to market. Fixing gaps can take months (or legal battles), so owners should inventory and secure everything early. If you’re preparing for a sale, planning expansion, or simply want to protect what you’ve built, this episode gives you the blueprint to regain control of your digital empire. Learn More & Download Paige’s Digital Asset Protection Checklist: treeringdigital.com/valuation Paige Wiese (W-ee-s) is the founder and CEO of Tree Ring Digital, a top-ranked Denver-based marketing agency that develops high performance websites and digital marketing strategies for businesses nationwide. With 16 years of industry experience, Paige has seen companies and CEOs struggle to manage and maintain their assets through growth or transition. She has recently developed a proprietary digital asset management service to track and protect companies’ over 200 data points. Paige is a dedicated speaker and mentor on the topics of brand protection and business growth. https://www.linkedin.com/in/paigewiese/ https://www.treeringdigital.com/ Connect with Melissa: Melissa Gragg   Expert testimony for financial and valuation issues   Bridge Valuation Partners, LLC   melissa@bridgevaluation.com   http://www.BridgeValuation.com   Cell: (314) 541-8163 Support the show

    54 min
  5. The Unexpected Cost of Not Planning Your Exit

    12/03/2025

    The Unexpected Cost of Not Planning Your Exit

    The Unexpected Cost of Not Planning Your Exit | ValuationPodcast.com with Mark Howley Welcome to ValuationPodcast.com—your go-to resource for navigating the world of business growth and valuation. I’m Melissa Gragg, a financial mediator and business valuation expert in St. Louis, Missouri. In today’s episode, I’m joined by returning guest Mark Howley — entrepreneur, former business owner, consultant, and podcaster — to break down the unexpected cost of NOT planning your exit. Mark shares stories from scaling and selling his packaging business, navigating specialty vs. commodity markets, avoiding the “Walmart Trap,” managing cash flow during growth, and positioning a company to command a premium valuation. Melissa adds expert perspective from the buyer’s valuation lens — highlighting the hidden red flags, financial pitfalls, and negotiation mistakes she sees over and over. If you’re thinking about selling your company in the next 2–5 years (or you just want to run it better today), this episode is a must-listen. 5 Key Takeaways If you don’t plan your exit, the market will discount you. Buyers price RISK. Customer concentration, declining margins, weak processes, and lack of strategy directly reduce valuation. Niche companies win — generalists get crushed. Going “too broad” dilutes brand, increases operational complexity, and creates inefficiency. Premium buyers pay for specialization. Cash flow tells the real story. Inventory cycles, receivables vs. payables, and cash timing matter more than revenue. Poor cash management kills deals — and value. Sophisticated buyers out-negotiate unprepared owners. They use Quality of Earnings reviews, reps/warranties, and escrow holdbacks to lower price. Owners need financial representation. You must stay focused on the business during the sale. Running your own sale process distracts you — and if performance dips, buyers will retrade or walk away. Q&As from the episode: 1. What is the biggest risk of not planning your business exit? The biggest risk is valuation loss. Without planning, owners face declining margins, customer concentration, poor documentation, and unprepared financials — all of which reduce what buyers will pay. 2. How do you build a company that commands a premium sale price? Premium companies have: consistent cash flow, diversified customers, strong margins, documented processes, niche positioning, and clean financials backed by professional valuations. 3. Why do buyers discount businesses with customer concentration? When one customer represents too much revenue, buyers see elevated risk. If that customer leaves (or pushes down price), the entire company becomes unstable — lowering valuation multiples. 4. How do business owners decide which markets to expand into? Owners should evaluate market size, competition, pricing power, and alignment with their niche. Expanding into poorly matched or commoditized categories leads to margin erosion and operational strain. Connect with Mark Howley: https://www.themarkhowleyshow.com/ Connect with Melissa: Melissa Gragg   Expert testimony for financial and valuation issues   Bridge Valuation Partners, LLC   melissa@bridgevaluation.com   http://www.BridgeValuation.com   Cell: (314) 541-8163 Support the show

    1h 6m
  6. Women, Wealth & the Future of Art Value: Galleries, Online Sales & Legacy

    10/27/2025

    Women, Wealth & the Future of Art Value: Galleries, Online Sales & Legacy

    Women, Wealth & the Future of Art Value: Galleries, Online Sales & Legacy | ValuationPodcast.com In this episode of ValuationPodcast.com, Melissa Gragg speaks with Ann Priftis, CEO of a group of seven contemporary art galleries across the U.S. and Canada and an art advisor/appraiser—about how value is created (and preserved) in today’s art market. You’ll hear how galleries are shifting from the classic “white box” model to hybrid sales (in-person + OVR/online viewing rooms), why many serious purchases still require human advisory (not “Buy Now” buttons), and what collectors should know about stewardship, appraisal, and estate planning. Anne also unpacks how women and next-gen collectors are changing taste, discovery (social media), and resale behavior—and why most art should be bought for love first, returns second. 5 Key Takeaways Hybrid is the new normal: Galleries pair brick-and-mortar with online viewing rooms and consultative sales—especially effective when buyers already know an artist’s work.Human trust drives high-value sales: For five-figure (and up) works, collectors still want storytelling + expert guidance, not a one-click cart.Art fairs & real estate are squeezing the old model: Costs (booths, travel, staffing, leases) are pushing galleries to rethink where and how they sell.Buy for passion; manage like an asset: Most art won’t outperform financial markets. Enjoy it—and maintain it (storage, conservation, crating, insurance) and appraise periodically to support lending, gifting, or estate decisions.Women & next-gen are reshaping demand: More diverse boards and curators, social discovery, willingness to try lesser-known artists, and a trade/refresh mindset versus holding forever. Q&As From Episode: Q1: Are people really buying expensive art online now? A: Yes—when they already know the artist or have an advisor guiding them. Online viewing rooms plus live consultant chats create enough confidence for significant purchases. Q2: What’s the practical difference between décor and collecting? A: Décor solves a design need (size, color, space). Collecting builds a point of view: artist research, provenance, condition, and a plan for care, documentation, and potential deaccession. Q3: Is art a good investment? A: For most buyers, buy for love, not ROI. A small slice of blue-chip work can appreciate, but markets are illiquid and costs (fees, storage, conservation) matter. Treat returns as a bonus. Q4: How do artists move from $5k to $150k+ price tiers? A: Consistent quality, institutional validation (exhibitions, collections), press, and strong gallery/advisor placement. Scarcity and sustained demand—not hype alone—support durable pricing. Q5: What should families do with sizable collections? A: Get periodic appraisals, document condition/provenance, budget for stewardship (storage, conservation, crating/shipping), and build an estate/legacy plan (donations, loans, or sales) so heirs aren’t forced into rushed decisions. Connect with Ann: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ann-priftis/ Ann's website: https://clarkpriftisart.com/ Connect with Melissa: Melissa Gragg   Expert testimony for financial and valuation issues   Bridge Valuation Partners, LLC   melissa@bridgevaluation.com   http://www.BridgeValuation.com   Cell: (314) 541-8163 Support the show

    48 min
  7. Inside the ESOP Deal: How Value, Regulation, and Exit Really Work

    09/30/2025

    Inside the ESOP Deal: How Value, Regulation, and Exit Really Work

    In this episode of ValuationPodcast.com, host Melissa Gragg sits down with Kelly Finnell, one of the nation’s top ESOP consultants with over 40 years of experience. Together, they uncover insider strategies behind ESOP valuation, regulations, financing, and exit planning. From misconceptions about fair market value to how ESOP-owned companies merge, this discussion helps business owners, advisors, and valuation professionals understand what really happens inside an ESOP deal. Whether you’re considering selling your business, exploring employee ownership, or advising clients on exit strategies, this episode will help demystify ESOPs and show why they’re booming among baby boomer founders. 👉 Learn about valuation misconceptions, financing structures, regulatory complexity, and opportunities for valuation professionals in this fast-growing space. ⭐ Key Takeaways ESOP valuations don’t set the price—they establish the maximum fair market value trustees can pay.ESOPs can pay as much as private equity buyers, contrary to common belief.Complex ESOP-on-ESOP transactions require specialized structuring and valuation expertise.Financing typically comes from cash, bank loans, and seller notes (with attractive returns).ESOPs are a flexible exit strategy, not a lifetime commitment, offering both liquidity and employee benefits.Success depends on specialized advisors (valuation, legal, and lending) with deep ESOP experience.Growing demand for ESOPs is fueled by baby boomer business exits.Valuation professionals have opportunities for recurring ESOP work through annual valuations. Q1: What is an ESOP and how does it work in a business sale? A: An Employee Stock Ownership Plan (ESOP) allows a business owner to sell their company to employees through a trust. The trustee ensures the ESOP pays no more than fair market value, providing owners with liquidity, tax benefits, and a structured succession plan. Q2: How is fair market value determined in an ESOP transaction? A: A valuation advisor hired by the trustee analyzes the business and sets the maximum price the ESOP can pay. The trustee then negotiates with the seller, aiming for a price close to but not above that maximum. Q3: Can ESOPs pay as much as private equity firms? A: Yes. Contrary to common misconceptions, ESOPs often match or even exceed private equity offers. This surprises many owners who assume ESOPs undervalue companies. Q4: How are ESOP transactions typically financed? A: Most ESOP deals use a mix of company cash, bank loans, and seller notes. Seller financing often provides a strong return—sometimes around 12%—making it a valuable investment for owners post-sale. Q5: Why are ESOPs growing in popularity right now? A: The rise in ESOPs is driven largely by baby boomer business owners seeking succession options. Unlike short-term tax law booms, this trend is sustained by demographics and the need for liquidity. Connect with Kelly Finnell: https://execfin.com/team/kelly-o-finnell/ https://www.linkedin.com/company/efsesopconsultants/ Melissa Gragg is a seasoned financial mediator and business valuation expert with over 20 years of experience. She specializes in helping couples and business partners navigate complex financial disputes during divorce and separation. As the founder of Bridge Valuation Partners and a key member of The Divorce Allies, Melissa offers neutral, third-party services including business valuations, pension assessments, income analysis, and strategic settlement planning.  Connect with Melissa: Melissa Gragg   Expert testimony for financial and valuation issues   Bridge Valuation Partners, LLC   melissa@bridgevaluation.com   http://www.BridgeValuation.com   Support the show

    36 min
  8. The Biggest Challenges When Scaling a Business (and How to Overcome Them)

    09/23/2025

    The Biggest Challenges When Scaling a Business (and How to Overcome Them)

    The Biggest Challenges When Scaling a Business (and How to Overcome Them) Scaling a business is never easy—especially when you’re also planning for an eventual exit. In this episode of ValuationPodcast.com, host Melissa Gragg talks with Mark Howley, seasoned CEO and strategist, about the biggest challenges business owners face when scaling and selling their companies. They cover everything from chasing growth vs. focusing on profits, using debt wisely, building management teams, preparing for due diligence, and knowing when it’s time to sell. If you’re a business owner aiming to grow beyond $1M to $10M in revenue or preparing for a sale, this conversation is packed with insights you can apply right now. Welcome to ValuationPodcast.com—your go-to resource for navigating the world of business growth and valuation. I’m Melissa Gragg, a financial mediator and business valuation expert in St. Louis, Missouri. In today’s episode, I’m joined by Mark Howley, financial strategist, CEO, and podcast host of The Mark Howley Show.  Mark built, scaled, and sold his company and now shares candid insights on the real challenges of scaling, preparing for sale, and building businesses with lasting value. Whether you’re growing past the $1M mark, aiming for $10M+, or planning your exit, this conversation offers practical lessons every business owner needs. Topics Covered: How to avoid “growth traps” and focus on profitabilityThe right time to hire leadership and delegate controlWhy due diligence uncovers more than owners expectGood vs. bad debt in business growthThe emotional side of scaling and selling 5 Key Takeaways Profit over Growth Hype – Scaling isn’t just about getting bigger; it’s about sustaining profitability and making calculated moves.Focus Over Diversification – Owners often get distracted by chasing too many markets; success comes from doubling down on core strengths.Build a Team That Replaces You – A business dependent on the owner has little transferable value; scalability requires strong middle management.Prepare for Due Diligence Early – Clean books, accurate inventory, and separation of personal vs. business expenses are non-negotiable for a successful sale.Timing Your Exit Is Critical – The best time to sell is when growth is strong, systems are in place, and the future looks promising to buyers. Q&As Q1: What is the biggest mistake business owners make when scaling? A: Many chase growth at all costs, spreading into too many markets. The smarter path is focusing on profitable niches and building operational systems before expanding. Q2: Why should owners prepare their business for sale even if they’re not selling? A: Buyers want businesses that run without the owner. Pre-sale preparation—like clean financials, a strong team, and documented processes—makes a company more valuable and easier to run. Q3: How can small business owners use debt wisely? A: Debt is useful when tied to revenue-generating investments (like marketing or production capacity). It’s dangerous when used for overhead, perks, or non-essentials. Q4: What surprises owners most during due diligence? A: The depth of scrutiny. Buyers dig into financials, inventory, tax returns, and operations. Personal expenses hidden in the business often reduce value dramatically. Q5: How do you know if it’s time to sell your business? A: Compare the lump sum offer to expected profits over the next 5–10 years. If the offer provides greater certainty and value than holding, it’s likely the right time. Connect with Mark Howley: https://www.themarkhowleyshow.com/ Connect with Melissa: Melissa Gragg   Expert testimony for Support the show

    1h 16m
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Valuation Podcast.com - A video and audio podcast on all topics concerning business owners and valuations. Melissa Gragg is a Business Valuation Expert in St. Louis and the host, she interviews CPAs, company valuation experts, testifying experts, marketing experts, divorce expert witnesses, estate planning experts, management consulting experts, strategic planning experts, business lawyers and covers business topics pertaining to company owners and attorneys. http://www.ValuationPodcast.com (314) 541-8163 or email hello@valuationpodcast.com

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