APORDE Podcast Series

Aporde
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The African Programme on Rethinking Development Economics (APORDE) is a high high-level training programme in development economics targeting policy-makers, researchers, academics and civil society representatives from Africa and other developing countries. The programme has been running since 2007 and is a joint initiative between the South African Department of Trade, Industry and Competition (the dtic) and Trade and Industrial Policy Strategies (TIPS). As part of APORDE’s agenda of influencing, educating and reaching a wider audience, it has introduced an APORDE podcast series. This series draws on the community of those that have participated directly in both the international and national APORDE network of heterodox development economists and social scientists.

  1. Oct 5

    20 Years of APORDE: in conversation with Dr. Nimrod Zalk and Prof. Nicolas Pons-Vignon

    Twenty years on, what happens when you sit down with two of the people who helped build APORDE and ask them what they were actually trying to change? In this episode of the APORDE Podcast, Thobani K is joined by Professor Nicolas Pons-Vignon and Dr. Nimrod Zalk for a wide-ranging conversation about the origins of the African Programme on Rethinking Development Economics, the battle of ideas around industrial policy, and why training a new generation of economists and policymakers became part of a much bigger strategy for change. The conversation moves from the dominance of neoliberal economics and the influence of the “Chicago Boys” to South Africa’s own industrial policy journey, the role of the state, and the tension between ambitious policy and the resources available to actually implement it. Along the way, they reflect on APORDE’s impact across Africa and the network of policymakers, academics and practitioners it has helped build over two decades. It’s also a conversation about what comes next: why rethinking development economics remains necessary, why industrial policy alone cannot answer every social challenge, and why APORDE must continue creating space for new ideas, arguments and people. Want to be part of it? Keep an eye out for the next APORDE call for applications, subscribe to the mailing list for programme updates, and follow the APORDE Alumni Network on LinkedIn. More information, previous seminars and episodes are available through the APORDE website. Credits: Host: Thobani K Guests: Dr. Nimrod Zalk and Prof. Nicolas Pons-Vignon  Producer: Niki Cattaneo Researcher: Niki Cattaneo  Editorial Reviewer: Nokwanda Maseko  Audio Recording: Thobani K Audio Editing and Engineering: Richard Rumney  Photography: Thobani K Graphic Design: Thobani K Social Media Distribution: Thobani K

    20 Years of APORDE: in conversation with Dr. Nimrod Zalk and Prof. Nicolas Pons-Vignon

  2. Jan 8

    Professor Mushtaq Khan on Governance, Corruption and Industrial Policy

    In this episode of the APORDE Podcast Series, host Thobani K speaks with Professor Mushtaq Khan of SOAS University of London about governance, corruption, and why many development and industrial policies fail at the point of implementation. Professor Khan introduces his influential concept of political settlements and explains why effective governance reforms must be pragmatic, incremental, and aligned with existing power structures. The discussion challenges moralistic approaches to corruption, rethinks anti-corruption strategies, and explores how industrial policy can succeed when designed around feasible enforcement and real incentives.

    Professor Mushtaq Khan on Governance, Corruption and Industrial Policy

  3. 11/11/2025

    Prof. Mwangi Wa Gĩthĩnji on Decolonial Paths to Development at APORDE 2025

    In this episode, Prof. Mwangi Wa Gĩthĩnji (University of Massachusetts Amherst) challenges the idea that there’s a single road to “modernity.” Drawing on his co-edited trilogy Decolonial Reconstellations—especially Volume II, Dissolving Master Narratives—he argues for development defined as expanding people’s possibilities in their own historical and ecological context. That means industrialising under climate constraints, negotiating transformation within democratic politics, and learning from others without copy-pasting their models. The conversation then turns to AfCFTA: why tariff cuts alone won’t deliver structural transformation and may entrench uneven development if stronger economies simply supply weaker ones. Prof. Wa Gĩthĩnji makes the case for planned specialisation, reciprocity, and honest compensation mechanisms—starting with clear regional compacts that align industrial policy across countries. It’s a pragmatic roadmap for integration that respects politics on the ground while aiming for shared prosperity.

    Prof. Mwangi Wa Gĩthĩnji on Decolonial Paths to Development at APORDE 2025

  4. 11/11/2025

    Rethinking Policy with Dr. Seeraj Mohamed at APORDE 2025

    Host Thobani K sits down with Dr. Seeraj Mohamed (Deputy Director for Economics, South African Parliamentary Budget Office; Adjunct Professor, UWC) to unpack what sets heterodox/decolonial economics apart from the mainstream. Dr. Mohamed traces the shift from political economy’s focus on production, reproduction, and distribution to neoclassical models centred on markets and “rational” agents—showing what gets left out: unpaid care work, environmental costs, power, institutions, and collective dynamics (think Ubuntu) that shape real economies. The discussion then turns to South Africa’s macro policy since 1994—from GEAR and inflation targeting to capital-account liberalisation—and why headline GDP growth can mask speculative bubbles, inequality, and jobless outcomes. Dr. Mohamed argues for policy that prioritises productive investment, employment, and social capability, with the state using fiscal and financial tools alongside monetary policy to build an inclusive, resilient economy.

    Rethinking Policy with Dr. Seeraj Mohamed at APORDE 2025

  5. 10/31/2025

    Rethinking Development & Industrial Policy — Prof. Fiona Tregenna on APORDE’s Impact

    In this episode, Thobani K speaks with Prof. Fiona Tregenna (University of Johannesburg; SARChI in Industrial Development) about the evolution and significance of APORDE—the African Programme on Rethinking Development Economics. Prof. Tregenna reflects on two decades of the programme, why exposure to plural and heterodox perspectives matters, and how APORDE and its sister course IPPM (Industrial Policy for Policymakers) build lasting professional networks across the continent. The conversation then turns to why industrial development and industrial policy remain central to Africa’s growth—what went wrong with premature de-industrialisation, how to rebuild capabilities, and why state capacity is best developed through “learning by doing.” From trade and green transition to technological upgrading and regional integration, this episode maps a practical path for policymakers, researchers, and practitioners committed to transformative development.

    Rethinking Development & Industrial Policy — Prof. Fiona Tregenna on APORDE’s Impact

  6. 12/02/2024

    An Interview with Zeinab Camara, Aporde 2024 alumni

    With Aporde 2024 having recently taken place, we are pleased to present a series of interviews with some of this year's lecturers and attendees.. These interviews are hosted and conducted by Trade & Industrial Policy Strategies (TIPS) Communications Officer Nondwe Majundana and feature a diverse range of specialists in the field of development economics. Honorable Zeinab Camara is a prominent Guinean political leader, senior international consultant, and partner in a strategy and advisory firm specializing in governance, development, and the extractive industries in Africa. With nearly two decades of experience across public, private, and non-governmental sectors, she is renowned for her expertise in designing and managing public-private partnerships in large infrastructure projects within the extractive industry. A former Guinean public servant and mining expert, she was recognized among the Global 100 Most Influential Women in Mining by the International Women in Mining Association. Camara's impressive career includes serving as Chief of Staff for the Ministry of Higher Education and Scientific Research, a board member of the National Institute of Mining and Geology, and a member of the Guinean National Assembly representing Boffa, an extractive resources prefecture. Zeinab Camara has also played a pivotal role in advancing social and economic development. She was instrumental in establishing Guinea’s National Agency for Civil Services to combat youth unemployment and has been a driving force in community engagement and social compliance initiatives within the mining sector. A transformative leader, she founded Women in Mining Guinea and developed the "Women in Mining Africa Index." She also serves on the boards of Africa 2.0 Governing Council and the Guinea Mining Club. Currently, she leads groundbreaking initiatives as the founder of L’Institut Poliethic for Leadership and Governance Fit for Purpose and the AI Revolution Africa Movement, reflecting her commitment to innovation and empowerment across the continent.

    An Interview with Zeinab Camara, Aporde 2024 alumni

  7. 11/19/2024

    An Interview With Adeyemi Dipeolu, Aporde 2024 Lecturer

    With Aporde 2024 having recently taken place, we are pleased to present a series of interviews with some of this year's lecturers and attendees.. These interviews are hosted and conducted by Trade & Industrial Policy Strategies (TIPS) Communications Officer Nondwe Majundana and feature a diverse range of specialists in the field of development economics. Adeyemi Dipeolu is an economist, diplomat, and public administrator. Until May 2023, he served as Special Adviser to the President on Economic Matters in the Office of the Vice President Osinbajo of Nigeria. Prior to this, Dr Dipeolu was at the UN Economic Commission for Africa where he served as Coordinator of the Africa Trade Policy Centre, Chief of Staff and Director of the Capacity Development Division respectively. While at ECA he led work on Transformative Industrial Policy and on Conflict and Development in Africa. He was also Head of Secretariat of the High-Level Panel on Illicit Financial Flows from Africa and lead author of its Final Report.  Before joining ECA, Dr Dipeolu was in the Nigerian Foreign Service where he rose to the rank of Ambassador and served in Caracas, Addis Ababa, Pretoria and Geneva respectively. He was also deployed from the Foreign Service as a Special Assistant, Economic Coordination and Policy in the Office of the Chief of Staff to President Obasanjo.  Dr Dipeolu is a Fellow of the Nigerian Economic Society and studied at the Universities of Ife, Oxford, Cambridge and South Africa. He is a Special Adviser to the Coalition for Dialogue on Africa (Addis Ababa), an Adjunct Professor at the Nelson Mandela School of Public Governance of the University of Cape Town, a Fellow of the Development Leadership Dialogue Institute of the School of Oriental and African Studies, University of London, a Member of the AfCFTA Trade and Industrial Policy Advisory Council (Accra) and Member of the Board of the Centre for African Development and Investment (Abu Dhabi).  Photo used courtesy of the Nelson Mandela School of Governance.

    An Interview With Adeyemi Dipeolu, Aporde 2024 Lecturer

  8. 11/18/2024

    An Interview with Echezona Asuzu, Aporde 2024 alumni

    With Aporde 2024 having recently taken place, we are pleased to present a series of interviews with some of this year's lecturers and attendees.. These interviews are hosted and conducted by Trade & Industrial Policy Strategies (TIPS) Communications Officer Nondwe Majundana and feature a diverse range of specialists in the field of development economics. Comrade Echezona Asuzu serves as the Principal Assistant General Secretary of the Nigeria Labour Congress (NLC) and is the National Coordinator of its Climate Change, Green Jobs, and Just Transition Program. With a Master’s degree in Industrial and Employment Relations from the University of Turin, his expertise centers on Just Transition and organizing. He is an integral member of Nigeria’s National Steering Committee on Climate Change and related initiatives, collaborating with the Federal Ministry of Labour and Employment, employers’ organizations, and other governmental bodies to address climate change and promote a sustainable future. Comrade Asuzu has led training programs for NLC-affiliated unions and played a pivotal role in advocating for the NLC’s inclusion as a State Negotiating Partner at international forums like COP28. In 2024, he will facilitate NLC’s hosting of two side events at COP29 in Baku, Azerbaijan. A fellow of the DfID Change Champions Program and South Africa’s APORDE initiative, he is recognized for his leadership in development economics and climate-related advocacy. He resides in Abuja, Nigeria, with his family.

    An Interview with Echezona Asuzu, Aporde 2024 alumni
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About

The African Programme on Rethinking Development Economics (APORDE) is a high high-level training programme in development economics targeting policy-makers, researchers, academics and civil society representatives from Africa and other developing countries. The programme has been running since 2007 and is a joint initiative between the South African Department of Trade, Industry and Competition (the dtic) and Trade and Industrial Policy Strategies (TIPS). As part of APORDE’s agenda of influencing, educating and reaching a wider audience, it has introduced an APORDE podcast series. This series draws on the community of those that have participated directly in both the international and national APORDE network of heterodox development economists and social scientists.

Information

  • Creator
    Aporde
  • Years Active
    2023 - 2026
  • Episodes
    22
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © 2026 APORDE Podcast Series
  • Show Website
    APORDE Podcast Series