Zombie History Podcast

Ron Stauffer

Interviews with dead people from history, by Ron Stauffer. zombiehistory.com

Episodes

  1. 03/30/2025

    David Livingstone: Explorer of Africa

    An interview with David Livingstone, the Scotsman, Christian missionary, medical doctor, anti-slavery abolitionist, and almost-discoverer of the source of the Nile river in Africa. He left behind a complicated legacy as a man of many talents, skills, and passions, but has mixed reviews on his overall effectiveness, yet his name can still be found across the African continent. In this episode, I'm interviewing David Livingston, Dr. Livingston, the Victorian-era African explorer, medical doctor, and random dude from Scotland who somehow ended up almost discovering the source of the Nile, but not quite. For this interview, we're sitting outdoors on the African savanna, watching the sun set and sipping on brandy while warming up near a crackling wood fire. For all my life, I've been a huge fan of travel, discovery, and exploration, and this guy, Dr. Livingston, is someone I've heard about many times over the years, but I just can't quite grasp exactly what his legacy was or what drew him to Africa in the first place. Let's find out together as I talk to the man who was probably the person most famous for what he almost did than what he actually did. Ladies and gentlemen, Dr. David Livingston! Good evening, my friend. It's a pleasure to sit here with you amidst the splendor of the African savannah. Ron Stauffer: Well, let's jump right in, as we say in America. Where are you originally from, and how on earth, literally, did you end up all the way across the world in Africa? What brought you here? I hail from Blantyre, Scotland. My journey to Africa was driven by a desire to explore uncharted territories and to spread the message of Christianity. I was also deeply committed to ending the East African slave trade, and my passion for discovery led me to undertake many expeditions across this vast and beautiful continent. Ron Stauffer: Okay, why do people call you Dr. Livingston? Were you a medical doctor? Yes, indeed. I studied medicine in Glasgow and became a qualified physician. My medical knowledge proved invaluable during my travels, allowing me to treat the sick and injured among the local populations and my fellow explorers. This combination of medicine and missionary work earned me the title of doctor. Ron Stauffer: What kind of doctor were you? Were you any sort of specialist or just kind of a general practice doctor? I was a general practitioner, skilled in various aspects of medicine. My training covered a broad range of medical knowledge, which enabled me to address a wide variety of ailments and injuries that I encountered during my travels. This generalist approach was crucial in the remote regions of Africa where specialized medical care was not available. Ron Stauffer: Yeah, that sounds like that’s a very important skill for an explorer. That almost makes me wonder, did you originally intend to be an explorer yourself, or were you intending on becoming a medical doctor who would assist an explorer? You know, were you like the Navy corpsman, for example, in your mind where you would be the medical help that helps the Marines or something like that? My original intention was to become a missionary, combining my faith with my medical skills to help those in need. The call to explore and discover new lands came as a natural extension of my work. As I ventured into uncharted regions, I realized the importance of exploration in spreading knowledge and understanding. In that sense, I became both an explorer and a healer, driven by my desire to serve humanity in multiple ways. Ron Stauffer: Why did you specifically choose Africa rather than, say, China or India, for example? I chose Africa because I felt a strong calling to explore its vast, uncharted regions and to engage with its diverse cultures. At the time, much of the interior of Africa was still unknown to the Western world, and I saw an opportunity to combine exploration with my missionary work. I was driven by a desire to spread Christianity, promote legitimate commerce, and help end the slave trade. My choice was influenced by my belief that my work could make a meaningful difference in Africa. Additionally, I was inspired by the rich history and natural beauty of the continent, which fueled my passion for exploration and discovery. While other regions, such as China or India, were also of interest. Africa presented unique challenges and opportunities that aligned with my goals and aspirations. Ron Stauffer: What was the state of medicine when you went to Africa, and how well did your training help you in Scotland? So, for example, you know, sometimes in America we joke about, I went to the Caribbean and I came home with a rare tropical disease, or something like that, right? The point being that other countries or other regions of the world might have sickness that our medicine can't cure or we don't even know what it is. Did that happen often to you, or what level of your Scottish medical training helped you in Africa? The state of medicine in the mid-19th century was quite different from what we know today. My training in Scotland provided a solid foundation in general medicine, but I quickly realised that the diseases and conditions I encountered in Africa were often unfamiliar and challenging. Tropical diseases such as malaria, dysentery, and sleeping sickness were common, and my knowledge of these illnesses grew through experience and collaboration with local healers. My medical training allowed me to treat many conditions, but it was often a combination of Western medicine and local knowledge that proved most effective. The experience taught me the importance of adaptability and learning from the people I encountered along the way. Ron Stauffer: Were you primarily responsible for discovering any particular ailments or any particular cures or anything like that? While I didn't discover specific ailments or cures in the formal sense, my observations and documentation of diseases in Africa contributed to a better understanding of them. For instance, my accounts of Malaria and its symptoms helped to inform future research and treatment. My experiences also highlighted the importance of quinine as a treatment for malaria. In that way, my work helped to bridge the gap between Western medicine and the realities of healthcare in Africa. Ron Stauffer: I'm still trying to follow your journey. You wanted to be a Christian missionary. So you went to medical school. But the thing that you're most famous for is being an explorer. And I don't just mean an explorer who went once. I think you went many, many times to Africa, right? Into the deepest, darkest, furthest regions that were totally off the map. Am I correct? Indeed, you are correct. My initial intention was to serve as a missionary and physician, but my passion for exploration grew as I ventured deeper into the continent. I undertook several expeditions, mapping vast regions and discovering geographical features such as the Zambezi River and Victoria Falls, which I named in honour of Queen Victoria. These journeys were not without hardship, but my dedication to both exploration and the welfare of the people I encountered drove me to continue. My expeditions contributed significantly to the world's understanding of the African interior, and I became known for my efforts to combine exploration with humanitarian work. Ron Stauffer: Who sent you? Did you primarily fund your own trip, or were you sent by a missionary society, a church, or a denomination? I was initially sent by the London Missionary Society, which supported my early expeditions and missionary work in Southern Africa. Over time, my explorations took on a more independent nature, and I relied on a combination of funding from the Society, private sponsors, and my own resources. My determination to explore and document the African continent often required resourcefulness and adaptability in securing the necessary means to continue my work. Ron Stauffer: At the time, wasn’t Africa mostly or mainly colonized by Britain? So would you have considered Africa a natural extension of Great Britain, or would it have been considered visiting another country? At the time of my explorations, much of Africa was not yet colonized by European powers. My journeys took me through regions that were largely uncharted and inhabited by diverse indigenous peoples. While there were British colonies in some parts of Africa, the interior remained largely unknown to Europeans. Therefore, my expeditions were considered voyages into unknown territories rather than extensions of British dominion. My goal was to explore, map, and understand these regions and to bring attention to the rich cultures and natural beauty of Africa. Ron Stauffer: How many total trips did you take from the mainland, as it were, to the African continent? I made several journeys to Africa over the course of my life. My major expeditions included my early mission to southern Africa in the 1840s, my exploration of the Zambezi River and its tributaries in the 1850s, and my later expeditions in the 1860s and 1870s to find the source of the Nile. Each expedition involved multiple trips back and forth between Africa and Europe, and my work in Africa spanned more than three decades. These journeys established me as one of the foremost explorers of my time. They contributed greatly to the world's understanding of the African continent. Ron Stauffer: Okay, you said the London Missionary Society, right? What was your goal there? Was it to translate the Bible into African languages or just evangelize and create converts or to establish churches? Like, were you sent there with a particular goal in mind as a missionary? My primary goal with the London Missionary Society was to spread Christianity and establish churches among the local populations. This involved evangelizing and creating converts, as well as working to translate the Bible into local languages. My mission was also to improve the welfare

    1h 16m
  2. 11/24/2024

    Evel Knievel: American Daredevil

    An interview with Robert “Evel” Knievel, the adrenaline junkie, stunt performer, and daredevil who became a motorcycle cowboy and inspired generations of children to leave the earth and use their bicycles to fly. His groundbreaking, record-breaking, and bone-breaking career paved the way for today’s X Games and Freestyle motocross. In this episode, I’ll be interviewing Evel Knievel, the ultimate stuntman and crazy psycho who defied death on a daily basis. Over and over, he zoomed his motorcycle at great speed up ramps and flew through the air, over rows of cars and even school buses, often crashing and breaking multiple bones in the process… yet somehow, he never died from his wounds. In this interview, we’re both sitting in an empty arena right after he completed yet another wild motorcycle stunt. In this case, no cigars are needed: there’s plenty of smoke still lingering from the air from all the pyrotechnics that exploded when he hit the air and from his motorcycle’s tailpipe. Let’s see what he has to say about what he does, what drives him to do it, and why he never stopped his crazy stunts despite all the pain and suffering. Ladies and gentlemen… Evel Knievel! Ron Stauffer: Alright, let's get started. First of all, what is your real name, and how did you get this crazy nickname, Evil Knievel? Well, my real name’s Robert Craig Knievel, but the nickname “Evel” came from a night I spent in jail back in Butte, Montana. They threw me in the same cell as a guy named “Awful Knofel.” The jailer thought it was funny to call me “Evil Knievel” to match him. It stuck, and the rest is history. Ron Stauffer: Wait, what? Hold on, you were in jail? For what? Oh yeah, that story always gets a reaction. I did spend a night in jail back in Butte, Montana, when I was a young guy. It wasn’t for anything too serious—just a little mischief. I got picked up for reckless driving, which shouldn’t surprise you, given who I am. I was always a bit of a wild one, even before the stunts. The jailer that night stuck me in a cell with a guy named “Awful Knofel,” and he thought it’d be funny to call me “Evil Knievel” to match the rhyme. It stuck, but I changed the spelling to “Evel” later because I didn’t want to sound like a full-blown villain. It’s kind of fitting, though—I’ve always been a little on the edge of what’s right and wrong, daring the world to keep up with me. Ron Stauffer: Did you have any other scrapes with the law throughout your lifetime? Oh, I had my fair share of run-ins with the law over the years, no doubt about it. Most of them were tied to my wild streak and larger-than-life personality. There were a few arrests for things like reckless driving and disturbing the peace when I was younger—nothing too serious. But later in life, I got into some bigger trouble. One of the most infamous incidents was in 1977 when I got into a fight with my former publicist, Sheldon Saltman. He wrote a book about me that I didn’t like, and, well, I let my temper get the better of me. I ended up attacking him with a baseball bat, which landed me in legal hot water and actually got me sentenced to six months in jail, though I didn’t serve the full time. That said, most of my scrapes with the law were tied to my fiery personality, not anything malicious. I lived life with the throttle wide open, and sometimes, that meant stepping over the line. But I owned up to it and kept moving forward, just like I did with everything else in life. Ron Stauffer: Where are you from, and how did you first get your start riding motorcycles? Were you a normal kid like me who grew up jumping off of bicycle ramps out in the front yard? I'm from Butte, Montana, a mining town, tough as nails, just like me. As a kid and from a young age, I was always pulling stunts. I started out like any kid, on a bicycle, jumping over crates, rocks, whatever I could find. Once I got my first motorcycle, though, that's when everything clicked. I started popping wheelies, riding fast, and trying jumps with no real plan. It was all guts and instinct. Eventually, I figured out I could turn this wild streak into a show. That's when I started dreaming of bigger jumps, ones that would leave people breathless. It wasn't just writing anymore. It was about making history. Ron Stauffer: Who were some of your influences? I grew up in the 1980s, if we were jumping our bicycles in the front yard off of plywood ramps, and we were, and saying, hey, look at me, I'm Evel Knievel, who were you looking at as inspiration when you were a child? Well, when I was a kid, I didn’t have anyone doing what I ended up doing—no big motorcycle stunt guys to look up to. My influences were more rugged types, like daredevils from the circus or the rodeo cowboys I saw growing up. I admired anyone who pushed themselves to the edge, who had guts. Guys like Joie Chitwood, who did car stunt shows, were big for me later on. But really, I just wanted to be the guy people would look up to. I didn’t just want to jump off ramps—I wanted to fly further than anyone thought possible. Ron Stauffer: What did your parents think about that? You must have absolutely given them a heart attack. Oh, my parents were beside themselves half the time. My mom worried constantly. She hated seeing me come home scraped up and bruised, and she knew I wasn't going to stop. My dad, he was tougher about it, probably figured I was either going to make it big or wipe out trying. I think I gave them more heartburn than they'd care to admit. But in the end, they couldn't hold me back. I had a fire in me to push limits, and I think deep down they understood that. I wasn't going to live a quiet, safe life. I think they saw that I had this drive to do something bigger than myself, even if it scared them. They might not have agreed with all my choices, but I think they were proud that I was chasing something no one else dared to do. It wasn't just stunts, it was about proving that anything was possible if you had the guts to go for it. Ron Stauffer: What were some of the first big stunts that you did, and at what age did you actually get a motorcycle? Were you doing big, crazy, dangerous stunts before you got a motorcycle, or only afterwards? I got my first motorcycle when I was about thirteen. But even before that, I was already pulling stunts on my bicycle—jumping over crates, barrels, anything I could stack up. The danger didn’t start with the motorcycle; it just got bigger. My first real stunt on a motorcycle was jumping over a twenty-foot box of rattlesnakes and two mountain lions—I was in my twenties then. Crazy, right? But that’s what hooked me. It wasn’t about the size of the jump; it was the thrill of surviving it. Ron Stauffer: That sounds ridiculous. You're saying you literally had live animals, like inside crates? Did you borrow them from a zoo or something? No, no crates—these animals were live and out in the open! I borrowed them from a local animal trainer. The rattlesnakes were in a clear box, but the mountain lions were standing right there, tethered on chains. It was part of the spectacle—who’s crazy enough to jump over wild animals on a motorcycle? Me, of course. People thought I was nuts, but that’s what sold tickets. It wasn’t just a stunt; it was pure showmanship. Ron Stauffer: Wow, that's fascinating. So, this bizarre obsession you had with spectacle, was it mostly about bragging rights and being just a tough guy, or was it about making money? It was both, no question. I mean, yeah, I wanted to be the toughest, the guy nobody could outdo. But let’s be real—showmanship doesn’t pay the bills unless you know how to sell it. I wasn’t just jumping for bragging rights; I was building a career. The bigger the spectacle, the bigger the crowd, and the more money I made. But at the heart of it, it wasn’t just about the money—it was about proving I could pull off the impossible and making sure everyone remembered my name. Ron Stauffer: At what point did you start charging? Did you say you were 13 when you started doing these crazy jumps on your motorcycle? Were you charging people money for that? No, I wasn’t charging people at thirteen—that was just me being a wild kid, trying to impress anyone who’d watch. But by the time I hit my twenties, I started realizing I could turn this into something bigger. My first real paid stunt was in 1966, in Moses Lake, Washington. I put together my own show, rented a venue, and started charging admission. That’s when it all clicked—I could take my crazy ideas, package them as entertainment, and make money doing what I loved. Ron Stauffer: It's hard to imagine that something like that could even happen today. We live in such a risk-averse culture here in America with so much liability and legal issues and it's a litigious society. Was there a point where people started telling you, you can't do that because you might hurt yourself or other people? In other words, was the liability always something that you could accept and the venues you booked were okay with that or did they ever say, no way, that's way too crazy? You’re absolutely right—what I did would be nearly impossible today with all the lawyers, insurance, and red tape. Back then, liability wasn’t the monster it is now. Sure, people told me I was crazy—friends, family, even venue owners—but that never stopped me. Venues weren’t always thrilled about the risks, but I convinced them the crowds and ticket sales were worth it. I carried the liability on my own shoulders. If I wiped out, it was on me. I accepted the danger as part of the job. I think that’s what made it so exciting for the audience—knowing it was real, raw, and anything could happen. No safety nets. Ron Stauffer: You literally never had any sort of safety measures at all? Was it always literally just you jumping over crazy things and if you fell y

    1h 3m
  3. 10/17/2024

    Kurt Cobain: Screamer From Seattle 🅴

    An interview with Kurt Cobain, the Nirvana frontman from the Pacific Northwest who struck a match and lit a generation on fire. As he says, “I was just a guy who screamed his guts out because that’s what I needed to do to get through the day. If that connected with people, then I’m grateful, but I never felt comfortable being put on that pedestal.” In this episode, I’m interviewing Kurt Cobain (“Kurdt Kobain”), founder and lead singer of the grunge, pop, rock—whatever you want to call it—band from Seattle: Nirvana. For this interview, we’re both seated in chairs at an empty concert stage. He’s smoking a cigarette and drinking a Rolling Rock beer, his very favorite. And I’m asking questions, sipping on tea. Why not? Kurt Cobain, to me, was one of the most confusing musical figures of my lifetime. I didn’t understand almost anything about him or his band or his music or his lyrics. And as a guitar player, I had a really hard time understanding why he was so bad and seemed to care so little. Now I can hopefully get my questions answered from the man himself. Let’s hear what Kurt has to say. Ron Stauffer: Hi Kurt, how’s it going? Hey, man. It’s going, you know. Same old chaos. What about you? What’s on your mind? Ron Stauffer: Well, I mean, let’s start with the basics. First of all, you were what seemed to be a very, very angry person. Why were you so angry all the time? Was your life really that bad? It wasn’t so much anger as it was frustration, you know? I just felt like I didn’t fit in anywhere. The world’s full of hypocrisy and b******t, and I was sick of it. I didn’t have the worst life, but growing up, I felt really alienated, and that sticks with you. The music was my way of screaming back at everything that didn’t make sense, and it felt like no matter what I did, there was always this pressure to conform. I hated that. The music industry, society, all of it, trying to push you into a box. It’s suffocating. I wasn’t trying to be some angry spokesperson, but I guess people latched onto that because the music hit a nerve. It wasn’t really about anger, it was about feeling trapped and not knowing how to deal with it. Ron Stauffer: What were you trapped by? Trapped by, what, an expectation to be maybe a straight-A student or something like that, or just a normal American kid? Exactly. Trapped by all that crap, like the expectation to fit into this perfect mold of what people think you should be. Be a good student, go to college, get a job, whatever. That wasn’t me. I never cared about that. I didn’t relate to what people around me valued. I was more into music and art, but in small towns, that makes you a freak. You get labeled, and then it’s like you’re stuck in that label forever. Ron Stauffer: What were your parents’ expectations of you? What was it that they wanted you to do that you wanted to rebel against? My parents just wanted me to be, I don’t know, normal. After they divorced, things got weird. My mom wanted me to be this responsible, well-behaved kid, and my dad was more into sports, you know? He wanted me to be this tough, all-American boy, but I was never into that. I hated that whole “be a man” attitude. I was into music, art, and just doing my own thing, but they didn’t get it. It’s like they wanted me to follow this script, and I just didn’t fit. So yeah, I rebelled against it, all of it. Ron Stauffer: I guess that makes sense. What were your friends doing? Were you kind of a social outcast all by yourself, or were you part of a sort of grungy subculture of a whole bunch of peers who were experiencing the same thing at the same time? It was a mix, really. I mean, for a while, I was kind of an outcast on my own, especially in high school. I didn’t have a lot of close friends who got me. But eventually, I found people who were into the same stuff—music, punk, counterculture. We were all kind of misfits, you know? There wasn’t this big “grunge” thing back then; we were just a bunch of weird kids who liked making noise. The whole scene grew out of that. We didn’t really fit anywhere else, so we made our own space. Ron Stauffer: Okay, you said punk. Now, “punk” is a very specific term, both in terms of a subculture and in terms of music, right? How did you fit into that, and was punk something that started before you, and you kind of fit into that, or did you help launch punk as a certain aesthetic, at least here in America? Yeah, punk was already a thing before me. I grew up listening to bands like The Sex Pistols, The Clash, Black Flag—those guys laid the groundwork. Punk, for me, wasn’t just the sound, though. It was the attitude, the DIY ethic, the rebellion against polished, commercial music. I loved that it wasn’t about being perfect; it was about being raw and real. We didn’t start punk, but I’d say Nirvana helped bring that punk attitude into the mainstream, especially with Nevermind. People slapped the “grunge” label on us, but at its core, it was just a messy, punk spirit. We didn’t care about fitting into genres. We just wanted to make noise that felt honest. Ron Stauffer: That certainly makes sense. I mean, the Sex Pistols are probably the best example of that I can think of. If I recall correctly, I don’t even think Sid Vicious knew how to play the bass guitar at all, right? Just some record executives gave him a bass and said, look tough for the camera, right? Yeah, exactly. Sid wasn’t really about skill—he was about the image, the attitude. That’s what punk was in a lot of ways: it wasn’t about being technically good. It was about the energy, the rebellion. And that’s kind of what we were about too. I mean, I didn’t consider myself a great guitarist or anything, but I didn’t care. It was more about the feeling, the raw emotion, and not giving a damn if it was perfect or polished. That’s what connected us to punk, even if we didn’t sound exactly like those early bands. Ron Stauffer: Okay, now you say you weren’t so great at playing the guitar, but actually, I heard Pat Metheny one time say that you were actually kind of a virtuosic guitar player. I think your punk aesthetic belied your innate sense of music and musical artistry, right? I appreciate that, but I don’t really see myself as a virtuoso. I wasn’t into the whole technical side of things like some guitar players who were shredding solos or whatever. I kept things simple because that’s what felt right to me. But I definitely had a sense of melody and structure that maybe people didn’t always notice because the songs were loud and raw. I didn’t want to be lumped in with grunge because it became this label for a whole scene, and a lot of it was just noise with no heart. I wasn’t about just making a racket for the sake of it. I cared about songwriting. I wanted every song to mean something, even if it was chaotic. So, I guess, in a way, maybe I was more thoughtful about the music than people gave me credit for. But I never wanted to be seen as some guitar hero or anything like that. I just wanted to make something real. Ron Stauffer: Now you said “songs with heart.” That’s kind of ironic because a lot of your imagery was filled with death and suffering and corpses and dead bodies. So what would you say is a “song with heart” in that sense? Yeah, it’s ironic, but that was kind of the point, you know? The darkness, the death, the suffering—that was just part of how I saw the world, or at least how I processed it. Life is messy and painful, and I didn’t want to hide that in the music. But when I say “songs with heart,” I mean they were honest. Even if they were about dark things, they came from a real place. Take “Heart-Shaped Box,” for example. It’s filled with dark imagery, but it’s about vulnerability, obsession, and longing. It’s a love song, in a way. Or “All Apologies,” which is more about feeling inadequate and confused but still searching for some kind of peace. The heart comes from the honesty behind it, not the happy-go-lucky themes. I wasn’t going to write bubblegum pop. I was going to write about what I felt. Ron Stauffer: Who were the artists of the time that came before you that you were explicitly trying not to be? Just name maybe a couple of genres or record labels or particular bands or acts that represented what you didn’t like and didn’t want for yourself musically. Definitely the whole glam rock scene. Bands like Mötley Crüe, Poison—all that flashy, overproduced stuff. It was all about image, sex, drugs, and excess, and it felt so fake to me. Those guys were playing into the whole rock star fantasy, and I wanted nothing to do with that. Then there were bands like Bon Jovi, who represented that commercial, radio-friendly rock. I couldn’t stand how polished it all was. It felt like music made just to sell records, not to say anything real. That’s exactly what I didn’t want Nirvana to be—a packaged product. We were the opposite of that. Real, messy, flawed—that’s what mattered to me. Ron Stauffer: Why then, no offense, did you sign up with Sub Pop Records and eventually whoever else the big record company was, I think it was Geffen at some point, right? Weren’t you kind of walking into the dragon’s lair at that point and selling out and joining the enemy? If your focus was all about being independent and avoiding flashy radio hits, I don’t know that you accomplished your goal… or did you? Yeah, man, I get that. It’s a fair point. With Sub Pop, we thought we were staying true to that underground DIY ethic. They were small at the time, and they had that rough, raw vibe that matched what we were doing. But as things grew, we kind of outgrew them too. And yeah, signing with Geffen… that was complicated. It felt like we were walking into the machine, but we also wanted to reach more people. We didn’t want to

    1h 7m
  4. 09/28/2024

    Johann Sebastian Bach: Baroque Star

    An interview with J.S. Bach: musical genius, composer extraordinaire, and unbelievably influential dude. This organ-playing wizard wrote over 1,000 musical works, fathered 20 children, once spent a month in prison, and has a legacy still holding strong 275 years after his death. You probably like Bach’s music more than you even know. Let’s talk to him and see if you end up liking Bach himself as well. I sure did. I’m a big fan of many different artists and composers over the multiple eras of Western music, and one of the greatest figures of the past few centuries is Johann Sebastian Bach. J.S. Bach, or just “Bach” as we tend to call him, despite what you may think, was more than a stodgy Baroque-era composer who played the organ and wrote music for uber-formal church choirs wearing choristers robes and poofy, white neck ruffs… Actually, Mr. Bach is, in my opinion, the first rock star—or “ba(roque)” star, if you will—a superhero of the musical world, someone who laid the foundation for so much of the music we appreciate today and an innovator whose legacy is so large that we can’t even see it from our vantage point today because we live in the thick of it. I really like Johan Sebastian Bach, and the odds are, you do, too. I grew up singing his songs in the local children’s chorus and practiced his melodies when learning to play the piano, trumpet, and tuba. …and almost everybody in the Western world likes Bach and what he did, whether they know it or not. Want proof? If you, at any point, have had an appreciation for: * Complex harmonies * Polyphony * Counterpoint * Improvisation * Electronica * Pop * Rock * …or even Jazz Or, if you like relatively recent bands and musicians, including: Emerson Lake and Palmer, Deep Purple, Billy Joel, Led Zeppelin, and yes, even The Beatles… then you like Bach! You just didn’t know it. There are a lot of works by Bach that you probably already know. How about: * The Brandenburg Concertos * Prelude in C Major (Ave Maria) * Jesu Joy of Man’s Desiring * Sheep May Safely Graze * Air on the G String * …and, of course, Toccata and Fugue in G Minor Have I convinced you yet? I am biased, of course: I’m a fan, in part, because he reminds me of me! Like Bach, I am also a man of German heritage, a Christian, a father, a musician, and a student of music, theology, and multiple languages, including German, Italian, French, and Latin. We have a lot in common. I think Bach was awesome, and for my money, I think he’s right up there with Wagner, Beethoven, Schubert, and Mozart. I’m telling you: You should listen to more Bach, starting now. I am certain it will enrich your life. But, enough about his musical works and legacy, now let’s take the time to get to know Bach, the person, shall we? Let’s listen to the man himself, The German Genius, from beyond the grave and see what his life was like and what he’d say if I were interviewing him today. Ron Stauffer: Hello, Mr. Bach. What should I call you? Can I call you Joe? Ah, Joe! That’s quite amusing! In my day, I was more accustomed to “Herr Bach” or “ Kapellmeister.” But, seeing as we’re sharing cigars and whiskey in your modern den, Joe will do just fine, my friend. What’s your first question for me, Ron? Ron Stauffer: You were an unbelievable composer, very famous today in the 21st century, but during your lifetime, you were kind of unknown, right? Weren't you just, like, the local organ player at your church in your own neighborhood? Ah, yes, you’re quite right, Ron. During my lifetime, I wasn’t a famous composer like you know me today. I was really more of a church musician, primarily known for my skills as an organist. I worked in various towns, playing in churches, leading choirs, and writing music for the services. I wasn’t some grand figure in the musical world at the time—just doing my duties, keeping things running. Many of my compositions were simply for practical purposes, not for fame. I suppose you could say I was just the local organ guy! Ron Stauffer: That sounds almost impossible to believe today. It almost seems like having Michael Jordan be your son's middle school basketball coach. What level of fame and, you know, how notorious were you during your lifetime aside from just your own hometown? Because I know that you traveled a bit, right? Ah, what an interesting comparison! Michael Jordan coaching middle school basketball—that would be quite something! Well, in my time, I was respected, especially among fellow musicians and within the courts where I worked. My skill as an organist was fairly well known, and I was often invited to examine organs or to perform in various cities like Dresden and Hamburg. So, I wasn’t completely obscure, but I wouldn’t say I had any sort of widespread fame outside of certain circles. I did travel a bit, yes, particularly early in my career when I sought out better positions or to learn from other musicians. But overall, my reputation was more local and regional. Nothing like the worldwide recognition you're speaking of today. Back then, I was really more of a craftsman than a celebrity. Ron Stauffer: Well, interestingly, you had an unusually wide range of musical endeavors, didn't you? I mean, you wrote cantatas, masses, oratorio, chamber music, and more in multiple languages, and lots of works for instruments that I don't think you even played. That was pretty ambitious for a lowly organ player, wasn't it? Ah, yes, I suppose it was a bit ambitious for a humble organist, wasn’t it? But you see, my life required versatility. In my various roles—whether in churches or courts—I was responsible for so many different kinds of music. For example, every Sunday required a new cantata for the church service, and that was just part of my job. I didn’t have the luxury of focusing on just one type of music. As for the instruments, you’re right—I didn’t play everything I wrote for. But as a composer, it was my duty to understand how they worked and what they were capable of. I studied them, learned from other musicians, and used my imagination. Sometimes you just have to trust your ear and your mind to go beyond what your hands can do. Writing in different forms and languages? Well, it came with the territory. When you work for the church, you write sacred masses; when you work for the courts, you compose chamber music for entertainment. My ambitions, I suppose, were just a reflection of the life I lived—meeting the needs of those I served. Ron Stauffer: That's interesting. Well, something that you may not know, because this didn't happen in your lifetime, but after you passed away, some of your works have taken on a whole new meaning and even a new essence. For example, I grew up listening to Andres Segovia, the Spanish guitar player, and he played your cello suites on the guitar, and that's a completely different instrument altogether. Did you ever see that coming, and would you have been okay with that, or were you insistent that your quote-unquote cello suites meant cello suites? Ah, now that is fascinating, Ron! Imagine my cello suites being played on the guitar—how extraordinary! In my time, the guitar wasn’t really an instrument I wrote for, so I certainly didn’t see that coming. But to answer your question, I think I would have been quite pleased by it. Music, you see, is a living art. It transforms, moves through time, and adapts to new contexts. I wasn’t so rigid that I would insist my cello suites remain only for the cello. In fact, many of my works were transcriptions themselves—my own and others'. I often rearranged pieces for different instruments depending on what was needed. The essence of the music, for me, was in the structure, the harmony, and the counterpoint. So, if someone found a new voice for my music, even on an instrument I didn’t write for, I think I would have smiled at the ingenuity. I would have been particularly curious to hear the guitar’s tone and expressiveness with those suites. If Segovia could bring out the soul of the music in a way that spoke to people, I would have embraced it. Ron Stauffer: Okay, here's an even crazier story. An English drug rock band called Procol Harum in the 1960s took one of your melodic lines and turned it into a song called A Whiter Shade of Pale, which became an unbelievable super smash hit, and I think it sold over 10 million records worldwide. What would you make of that? And did you ever imagine just how far your musical babies would stray from the nest?Ach du meine Güte, Ron! Now that is something I could never have imagined! A rock band, you say? And they took one of my melodies and turned it into a hit? I must say, that’s a kind of musical evolution I could never have foreseen. Ten million records? That’s more than I could have counted in my lifetime! I think I would have been quite intrigued by this. Music, as I said before, is alive, and it moves in directions we can’t predict. The idea that something I composed could inspire a completely different genre—that’s proof of music’s enduring power. I always believed that good melodies and harmonies could resonate deeply with people, but to see them resurface centuries later in rock music? That’s incredible. I can’t say I envisioned my musical children straying this far from the nest, but I think I would take it as a sign that they’ve grown wings and taken on a life of their own. If people are moved by it, whether in the quiet of a church or under the electric lights of a concert hall, it’s all part of music’s journey through time. A Whiter Shade of Pale, huh? I may not know what a “rock band” sounds like, but it seems my music found its way into something timeless after all! Ron Stauffer: Well, those musicians certainly got rich off of your music, so speaking of that, did you get rich in your lifetime? How wealthy were you, or were you poor? Well, let me

    1h 14m
  5. 09/21/2024

    Napoleon Bonaparte: Emperor of the French

    In our first episode, I interview Napoleon Bonaparte (born Napoleone di Buonaparte), the short man from Europe who changed history forever by envisioning a precursor to the European Union and who nearly gained the whole world but lost it all in the end. One of the many historical figures I’ve been interested in throughout my life is Napoleon Bonaparte. You know, the short dude with the giant hat riding on the horse? Who was this crazy little man? Was he really so short in stature? Was he Italian, or French, or both? Why did he claim to be a friend of the people but then basically crown himself emperor of all of Europe? What was his main goal, if not total, utter, megalomaniacal conquest of the entire globe? These are questions I’ve always found amusing but they aren’t exactly burning in their level of urgency, so I’ve just quietly wondered about them. It’s far too much work to read through the many giant tomes that have been written about Napoleon over the years, and I’ve found most history books to be exceptionally dry. Usually, they’re so boring I can’t even get through the first few chapters, let alone the entire book. So, in this episode of Zombie History, join me as I prop up a Zombie Napoleon in the overstuffed chair across from me in my dimly lit den as the embers flicker in the fireplace and we have a “get to know you discussion.” Armed with an amazing grasp of the English language (which is, of course, completely historically inaccurate), as well as a complete and total understanding of the digital world and an omniscient, God-like view of all of human history up to now, this Cyborg version of Napoleon Bonaparte can speak with authority from Napoleon’s life and experience from his earliest days all the way to today, over 200 years after his death. Join me as I light up a cigar, take a warm swig of cognac, swish its brassy essence around on my tongue, and talk to my very first guest on this podcast, Napoleon Bonaparte.  As Napoleon himself might say, “Messieurs, commençons”. “Gentlemen, let us begin.” Ron Stauffer: Hi, Napoleon. Ah, Bonsoir, Ron. It is a pleasure to meet you. I like the setting you've created. Cigars, cognac, and a good conversation. What is it you wish to know from the Emperor himself? Ask away, and I shall answer with the precision of a battlefield command. Ron Stauffer: First things first, why do you have such a weird name, and are you actually Italian or French? Ah, I see you want it straight, Ron. My name—Napoleon Bonaparte—is French now, though it began as Napoleone di Buonaparte, reflecting my Italian roots. But as for who I am? By birth, Corsican. By ambition and choice, undeniably French. Ron Stauffer: Okay, well, that's interesting. What language did you speak? I grew up speaking Italian, or more precisely, Corsican—a dialect close to Italian. But once I set my sights on France, I quickly adopted French as my primary language. It became the tongue I used in battle, politics, and empire-building. Though, between us, my early French had a bit of an accent. Ron Stauffer: That’s funny. Okay, what about your size? I don't know if you know this, but sometimes people have suggested that perhaps you tried to conquer the entire world because you were overcompensating because you were such a short person. Tell me about your size in relation to whether that was normal for people of your era or not, and specifically whether that was an issue in your own life. Did people think of you as particularly short? Ah, yes, this "Napoleon complex" nonsense! In truth, I was around five foot six in modern terms, which was quite average for my time. The idea that I was particularly short comes from a misunderstanding—French inches were longer than English ones, so when my height was recorded, it seemed smaller than it actually was to some. Now, as for overcompensating—ha!—I did not need to be tall to command respect. My ambition, strategy, and charisma were more than enough to make up for a few inches. No one on the battlefield thought about my height when they saw the results! So, it wasn’t an issue for me. The world I conquered saw me as larger than life, and that’s what mattered. Ron Stauffer: You make a fair point. Okay. So talk about the conquering that you did. I mean, it kind of seems like sitting here from the history I've read, you wanted to essentially take over all of Europe. Did you think that was your right? Were you into the whole divine right of kings or, did you think God chose you to rule the earth or something like that? Ah, divine right? No, no, that was not my philosophy. I didn’t need the blessing of some monarch's god to justify my ambitions. I believed in merit—my own, above all. I rose not by birth, but by my ability, my vision. France was in chaos after the Revolution, and I seized the opportunity to bring order, stability, and, of course, glory. As for conquering Europe, it wasn’t so much about taking everything for myself. It was about spreading the ideals of the Revolution—liberty, equality, fraternity—but on my terms. Europe was a collection of decaying monarchies, and I saw myself as the one to bring about a new order. I believed in destiny and that through conquest, I could reshape the world. But divine right? Non! I forged my own path. Ron Stauffer: Hmm, so were you a brutal oppressor and a tyrant, or were you more of a “man of the people?” Ah, the eternal question! Let’s just say, I was both, depending on who you asked. To my soldiers and many in France, I was a man of the people—a leader who rose from humble origins, a symbol of meritocracy, and someone who brought law and order through the Napoleonic Code. I gave many their first taste of social mobility and national pride. But to my enemies, especially the monarchs of Europe, I was a tyrant, a relentless force who disrupted the old order and bent nations to my will. Yes, I demanded loyalty, and yes, there was bloodshed—war is never gentle. But I always believed I was advancing civilization, not oppressing it Ron Stauffer: Okay, so what was your big beef with monarchy? I mean, Europe was built on the basis of monarchies of many different peoples, many different languages and races. What was your specific problem with monarchy and what were you trying to accomplish by destroying or demolishing monarchies? Ah, monarchy. My problem was simple: it represented stagnation, privilege by birth rather than by merit. Europe’s monarchs sat on their thrones, ruling by virtue of lineage, while people lived under systems that served only the elite. I, on the other hand, believed in the power of the individual—those who prove themselves worthy should lead, not those born to it. By challenging monarchies, I sought to spread the principles of the French Revolution—equality, meritocracy, the end of feudalism. Monarchies resisted these ideas because they threatened their very existence. My aim was not merely to destroy them, but to replace that old, rigid structure with something more dynamic and just. I wanted to create a Europe where talent, not blood, determined one’s place. Of course, I wasn’t opposed to ruling myself—just that I earned it through victory and vision, not birthright. Monarchs clung to the past; I sought to shape the future. Ron Stauffer: That seems a little bit ironic though, because didn't you at one point literally crown yourself emperor of all of Europe? Ah, yes, the irony isn’t lost on me, Ron. But consider this—when I crowned myself Emperor, I wasn’t submitting to the old ways. In fact, I was rejecting them. I didn’t let the Pope place that crown on my head; I took it for myself. That act symbolized my belief that power comes from achievement, not divine right. Now, why emperor? Europe was a place of empires, and I understood that to consolidate power and maintain stability, a strong, centralized figure was necessary. The title wasn’t about returning to monarchy; it was about ensuring that the revolutionary ideals had the strength behind them to survive.  That act was meant to show that power, in my view, comes from personal achievement, not from divine right or inherited privilege. Now, as to why I took the title of emperor, Europe was filled with empires. And I knew that to secure France's position and to maintain stability, a strong centralized leader was necessary. So while I did take the crown, it wasn't to become just another monarch—it was to symbolize that I had earned my place through victory and vision, not through some ancient bloodline. Ron Stauffer: Okay, so if I can be a little bit sarcastic with you right now, you said victory in vision, and yet one of the things you're most famous for is the unbelievable mistake of invading Russia. That ended poorly, didn't it? Ah, yes, Ron—that campaign. I won’t deny it, invading Russia was a grave miscalculation. My vision of bringing Tsar Alexander back in line with my Continental System clouded my judgment. The truth is, Russia's vastness, the brutal winter, and their scorched-earth tactics bled my Grande Armée dry. The cold, starvation—those were enemies even I could not conquer. It was a harsh lesson: ambition without limits can lead to disaster. That march into Russia—well, it’s the one campaign I’d rather not relive over this fine cognac. You could say my overconfidence was my downfall. A bitter defeat, but one that even an Emperor must own up to. Ron Stauffer: Okay. Well, so what was your grand vision though? Obviously, expansion of some sort was one of your goals, and crowning yourself emperor was one of your goals. What was “Napoleon’s theory of Europe,” if I were to give it a term? What was the outcome that you had desired for the continent in general? My grand vision—let’s call it the "Napoleonic Europe." I envisioned a unified continent, not fragmented by squabbling monarchies and petty alliances, but one where the principles

    1h 7m
  6. 09/19/2024

    Introducing “Zombie History”

    You’re listening to Zombie History. Conversations with significant people from the past… who are dead. I’m Ron Stauffer, and I’ll be your host on this conversational journey through history. Have you ever wondered what it would be like if you could find long-dead historical figures and talk to them about their lives and hear them explain, first-hand, why they did what they did? Or how the surrounding context of the particular era they lived in informed their decisions and actions? I sure have. What if you somehow had the ability to: * Ask Picasso where cubism came from and what his “blue period” was all about? * Learn why John the Baptist wore camel skins and ate locusts and honey in the desert? * Find out if Albert Einstein regretted encouraging the development of atomic weapons? * Get Napoleon’s own explanation for why he chose to invade Russia when it was clearly one of the biggest wartimes blunders in history? * …and discover who on earth John Hancock really was, and why a man with such a seemingly insignificant role in the American Revolution put such a ridiculously oversized signature on the Declaration of Independence? If that sounds interesting to you, join me in this podcast as I exhume the bodies of many significant historical figures, plop them down in a big, overstuffed chair in my living room, put a cigar in their mouths and a glass of brandy in their hands, and ask them the questions about their lives that have kept me up at night. Basically, I talk to dead people. When I meet new people in an unfamiliar environment, one of the most common icebreaker-type games starts with a question like: “If you could meet any historical figure, who would it be, and why?” I’ve never known exactly how to answer that. There are just SO many “historical figures” — how could I possibly choose just one? Do I have to choose just one? And even if I could decide who I wanted to meet, if I were somehow able to talk to that person face-to-face, what would I even say? What would I ask?  What would he or she say in return? Would it be an interesting conversation or an incredibly awkward waste of time? Also, how on earth could I meet a historical figure from the past anyway? They’re dead! As we all know, “dead men tell no tales.” UNTIL NOW! In this experimental podcast, I will attempt to satisfy my historical curiosity in a way that we never could before. Using the power of artificial intelligence, I will identify people from long ago, resurrect their spirits, and create a NEW dialogue with an OLD figure in a conversation that is as historically informed as possible. Fair warning: I have never tried this before, and I’m not exactly sure how it will turn out. I don’t know where these fireside chats will go or what topics I’ll cover with each dead person. If that sounds interesting to you, subscribe to this podcast, and let’s see, together, where this grand experiment takes me as I uncover the greatest, newest ghost stories. Thanks for listening to Zombie History, where we provide history lessons from beyond the grave. For more information about the show, visit zombiehistory.com. This is Zombie History. HISTORY LESSONS… FROM BEYOND THE GRAVE. For more information about the show, visit zombiehistory.com. Zombie History is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit zombiehistory.com

    5 min

About

Interviews with dead people from history, by Ron Stauffer. zombiehistory.com