As authoritarianism and far-right politics gain ground in the United States and across Europe and beyond, what’s clear is that this is not a uniquely American crisis. In this episode of The Blue Ridge Breakdown, I’m joined by journalist and author Cole Stangler, whose reporting spans both U.S. and French politics, to talk about: the global rise of the far right, the left’s loss of working-class support, and what lessons can be drawn across borders. From West Virginia’s labor history to France’s Yellow Vest movement, from FDR and Thomas Paine to today’s failures of neoliberal politics, this conversation asks a simple but urgent question: what do we want—and what will it take to win? Troy Miller:So as I was thinking about this intro and first, fascism being on, you know, now here in America, I was about to say, like, oh, you know, when Trump was elected, all these Americans were like, oh, I’m going to move to France and get away from the authoritarianism and the fascism. And then I thought, no, that was going on in 2015 and 16 too. So. And then I thought, actually, this has been going on since at least George W. Bush in the Iraq war. I remember Americans being like, “I’m going to flee to Europe. That’s so much better over there. They have universal healthcare, just like, it’s a better situation. And there I’ll live happily eating baguettes and drinking wine or whatever, or if you’re in Germany, eating wurst and drinking beer in the beer garden.” And it’s painfully clear to me that authoritarianism and fascism is on the rise everywhere. And Europe is no exception. It has a slightly different form across different countries in Europe. And because it’s a parliamentary system, it’s been a different kind of road to power. But let’s not kind of delude ourselves into thinking, oh, the grass is so much greener over there. So to really highlight this and talk about this, my friend Cole Stangler is joining us now. He is the author of several books, including—I’ll call it The American Mirror, because I don’t speak French and I will end up butchering the French pronunciation otherwise. His previous book is Paris Is Not Dead. You can find that one in English. The American Mirror will create enough demand here with this program that we’ll get it published in English. He is also the host of the new program, What Do We Want? Conversations with the International Left. Cole, thanks for taking the time and joining us today. Cole Stangler:Yes, my pleasure. Thanks so much for having me, Troy. Troy Miller:Yeah, it’s an important conversation. I should say off the bat that one of the reasons we’re having this conversation is because you covered my campaign two years ago as part of your book The American Mirror. And so with that full disclosure. Okay. You were writing that book during the election, and so it’s kind of tough to see the outcome at that point, but I think there were hints of it. The first two questions, and I’m not supposed to ask compound questions, but I’m going to, are, what did you learn from the process of writing the book and how has the information changed? How has your view changed in the year and a half since, or the year and three months or so since the election and take that any way you’d like? Cole Stangler:Sure, yeah. I mean, I think maybe if I could, if I could quickly, I’ll answer the question. But I think just to respond to your intro, which I think you’re spot on, we’ve been dealing with this threat of the far right for quite some time in Europe. I’ll speak more about France, which is what I know. I’ve been living in France for almost 10 years now. It’s gone by very quickly. So we do have this, I think generally speaking, you know, the European way of life, I think is something worth defending. Maybe we can get a chance to talk about that later. I think, like it is actually, you know, advantage that we have, you know, universal and at least extremely low cost health care that’s largely provided by the state, you know, paid sick leave, et cetera, down the list. I think all that is worth defending. But I think you’re about the 2024 campaign. You’re right. We talked and I’ve known you since before that as well, Troy. I don’t know how much full disclosure you want to give, but I know Troy very, very well. But I think in 2024, when we met, as you pointed out, this was not a—you kind of see the writing on the wall. I met with people in Washington, D.C. at the time, a congresswoman, and you could already sense that Trump, or at least the Democrats, were not looking in a super good position for November of that year. But what sort of surprised me the most, I would say part of the book, The American Mirror, is that I was looking at the ways in which America can help us understand French politics and some of the transformations in Europe. And one of the trends that I think is essential, and I think, I think you talk about this as well, Troy, is that the left has lost a big chunk, not all of it, but a big chunk of the kind of working class voters that used to vote for it in the past. That’s true in the United States, that’s true in Europe. We’ve seen that with the Democratic Party. So that, to me is, I think, the ultimate question. In some ways, it’s really the only question I care about. I think it’s the one question that I’m obsessed with that I think matters, is what can the left do to win back these kind of working class voters that used to vote for it. In cities, the left does decently well, but you leave large urban areas and it’s catastrophic. And that’s true in the United States, as you know. It’s also unfortunately, increasingly true in France. And so all this to say when I was in, that was part of why I wanted to come to a state like West Virginia, someone who’s interested in the labor movement. Not without romanticizing things too much, but a little bit of romanticization is good, I think, and healthy. Right. West Virginia plays this such an important part in the history of the labor movement with the miners, the UMWA also. Right. I was in the northern part of the state where, you know, you had the, the steelworkers, you know, used to be, used to be present quite—they’re still there, but used to be more prominent, the USW. And so all this to say what I learned is that I think I’ve always thought that unions were so important for kind of providing this connection between Democrats and, let’s say the left more generally, progressives and working class people, especially outside of urban areas. The decline of unionism explains this problem so well. And so what I kind of was surprised to find on the ground is that even in some of these places, I was in the southern part of the state after we met in Mingo County and—right—the UMWA is, is, is, is right. The decline of the UMWA explains in large part the, the biggest boost in Republican vote shares there. But I think what I learned is that, you know, the, the, the, it’s not like everyone was voting for the Democrats in the first place. You know, when the UMWA was there, like it always was more divided. And so this is, you know, maybe a more kind of nuanced answer, but understanding that even when the union was there, it wasn’t as if everyone was bought into sort of, you know, supporting the union and supporting Democrats. It was still seen as sort of a kind of polarizing topic. But I’ll take the polarization over the, over the, you know, not having any left or no unions or no Democrats at all. So what does that mean? I think for us moving forward, it’s that like being realistic about, like, what does it mean if we have a more robust, stronger labor movement on the ground? Maybe it means that we don’t convince everyone, but, but it’s important to be there. And, you know, it’s better, like I said, better to have a polarized kind of situation than to not exist at all. So in some ways it shattered some of my kind of romantic illusions about kind of the golden era of the UMWA. But. But they were there, right? And the Democrats were being elected because of them in large part. So I think I’ve gone on for too long about the first. Troy Miller:No, no, no, that’s great. And what I’ll, I’ll start off by saying by adding to your full disclosure of how long we’ve known each other, because I, you know, when we were freshmen in college, I think you were the first person I met who was talking about Thomas Frank’s What’s the Matter with Kansas? And I think that is, you know, so you’ve been wrestling with this problem for a long time, so to speak. Or, you know, not so to speak. No, for a long time. You know, we’re looking at 15 years now at least, and longer. But in any case, the question of how did Democrats lose unions? How did Democrats, you know, also is the other thing in America, I think, and I’ll add to West Virginia’s labor history, that next year marks the 150th anniversary of the nation’s first or real one of the only general strike, starting here in Martinsburg with the railroad unions. And one of those amazing things where, yeah, they tried to put down the strike, but it spread so fast that when they tried to deploy federal soldiers, the rails are all done. You know, worker solidarity gets the goods. It’s really hard to stop workers who make everything move in the country from getting what they want at that point. And I think that’s one of the things that is a difference between the left in America right now and the left in Europe. You know, there’s always these calls for general strikes. Oh, let’s just grind the American economy to a halt. But the fractured nature of labor in America and the fractured nature of society in America make that, I feel like a much harder hill to climb than in France. And one of the people kind of miss about the Gilet Jaune movement, the yellow vest movement, that those were
