The Hurdle Rate Podcast

thehurdleratepod
  • 4.6 (26)
  • Investing
  • Weekly

Join Matt, Ben, Jeff, and Tim for an entertaining and informative weekly podcast cutting through conventional wisdom on Bitcoin, investing, and macroeconomics. Every Wednesday, this forward-thinking team delivers unique perspectives and innovative insights that challenge mainstream financial narratives, empowering listeners to make more independent decisions for their corporate or personal financial lives. Is Bitcoin your hurdle rate? New episodes every Wednesday!

  1. 1d ago

    Debt Crisis Is Accelerating | The Hurdle Rate Podcast | Ep. 80

    In this week’s Hurdle Rate, the crew breaks down the $6 billion Binance hack, Triple C spreads blowing out, and why digital credit spreads may compress against junk debt. They also discuss what Fannie Mae preferreds teach about underwriting dividends, why both the gross and claims-adjusted mNAV metrics break down, and how to value a Bitcoin balance sheet as a stream of future cash flows. The episode closes on the ATM narrative and why ASST trades like perpetual leverage on Bitcoin. Here’s the latest with Matt Cole, Jeff Walton, Ben Werkman, and Tim Kotzman. Follow us on X: https://x.com/HurdleRatePod All episodes now live: https://tnorth.com/shows/hurdle-rate/ Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 00:52 - The Binance Hack 02:57 - Triple C Spreads Blow Out 11:02 - Bitcoin Still Seen As Risk 14:30 - Digital Credit Spreads Will Compress 18:41 - The Fannie Mae Preferred Lesson 23:22 - Rethinking mNAV 33:00 - Premium Or Discount? 35:36 - Breaking Both Valuation Models 42:17 - The ATM Narrative Is Wrong 46:39 - Perpetual Leverage On Bitcoin True North does not intend for anything herein to be considered an offer or sale of any securities, including those of Strive. True North encourages listeners to consult with their tax and investment advisors. Additional information on any securities or issuers referenced herein can be found in such issuers’ filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), including any registration statements, prospectuses and prospectus supplements for each issuers’ securities. Listeners should read such documents and other documents incorporated by reference therein or that such issuer has filed with the SEC for more complete information. You may get these documents for free by visiting EDGAR on the SEC website at www.sec.gov.* Any securities referred to herein, including those of True North’s parent Strive, are not collateralized by underlying bitcoin holdings and may be subordinated to senior claims. There are no guarantee of returns liquidity or future performance. The securities referred to herein are neither bank deposits, nor FDIC insured, nor regulated in the same way, and do not have the same regulatory and other protections as bank accounts, money market funds, treasuries, or similar investments and as a result may not be comparable investments. Current trading prices and effective yields may vary, current rates are not indicative of future rates, and in some cases rates are subject to frequent adjustments and may be significantly lower than discussed herein. Cash dividends are not guaranteed. In some cases, dividends have not been paid and may not be paid in the future. Ownership of securities referred to in herein does not confer ownership in the underlying assets, including bitcoin.

  2. Oct 27

    Biggest Bitcoin Buy | The Hurdle Rate Podcast | Ep. 79

    In this week’s Hurdle Rate, the crew breaks down Strive’s largest Bitcoin purchase ever, 6,182 BTC that brings total holdings to 43,000, plus the new $1 billion SATS ATM and hitting the 61% amplification target. They also discuss SpaceX’s $40 billion off balance sheet GPU deal, why perpetual digital credit backed by Bitcoin beats time-bound chip financing, and whether capital is the last moat in an AI world. The episode closes on the future of income and why risk may be mispriced across Bitcoin balance sheets. Here’s the latest with Jeff Walton, Ben Werkman, Joe Burnett, Adam Livingston, and Tim Kotzman. Follow us on X: https://x.com/HurdleRatePod All episodes now live: https://tnorth.com/shows/hurdle-rate/ Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 01:39 - 43,000 BTC And The SATS ATM 04:41 - Our Largest Bitcoin Buy Ever 10:35 - Engineering Amplified Bitcoin 14:25 - Is The Bear Market Over? 21:49 - Inside SpaceX’s $40B GPU Deal 26:57 - GPUs Vs. Bitcoin As Collateral 31:29 - Why Perpetual Beats Time Bound 39:08 - Is Capital The Last Moat? 51:25 - Will AI Labs Hold Bitcoin? 56:05 - The Future Of Income 01:00:27 - Risk Is Mispriced True North does not intend for anything herein to be considered an offer or sale of any securities, including those of Strive. True North encourages listeners to consult with their tax and investment advisors. Additional information on any securities or issuers referenced herein can be found in such issuers’ filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), including any registration statements, prospectuses and prospectus supplements for each issuers’ securities. Listeners should read such documents and other documents incorporated by reference therein or that such issuer has filed with the SEC for more complete information. You may get these documents for free by visiting EDGAR on the SEC website at www.sec.gov.* Any securities referred to herein, including those of True North’s parent Strive, are not collateralized by underlying bitcoin holdings and may be subordinated to senior claims. There are no guarantee of returns liquidity or future performance. The securities referred to herein are neither bank deposits, nor FDIC insured, nor regulated in the same way, and do not have the same regulatory and other protections as bank accounts, money market funds, treasuries, or similar investments and as a result may not be comparable investments. Current trading prices and effective yields may vary, current rates are not indicative of future rates, and in some cases rates are subject to frequent adjustments and may be significantly lower than discussed herein. Cash dividends are not guaranteed. In some cases, dividends have not been paid and may not be paid in the future. Ownership of securities referred to in herein does not confer ownership in the underlying assets, including bitcoin.

  3. Oct 20

    Bitcoin Fell, We Grew 6x | The Hurdle Rate Podcast | Ep. 78

    In this week’s Hurdle Rate, the crew breaks down the $700 million SATS IPO, Strive’s first year as a public company, and growing from 5,886 to 36,818 Bitcoin through a bear market. They also discuss why SATS is a 15% fixed rate preferred junior to SATA, how the amplification engine was built, and what TradFi investors asked during a high yield selloff. The episode closes on the digital credit bubble and why Strive’s 18-month dividend reserve is stronger than it looks. Here’s the latest with Matt Cole, Jeff Walton, Ben Werkman, Joe Burnett, and Adam Livingston. Follow us on X: https://x.com/HurdleRatePod All episodes now live: https://tnorth.com/shows/hurdle-rate/ Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 00:54 - Strive’s First Year 06:58 - 6x the Bitcoin in a Bear Market 14:40 - The Amplification Engine 22:18 - The Dream Bear Market 25:22 - Why SATS Is 15% Fixed 34:32 - Designing SATS 42:27 - Treasury Breakeven ARR 46:40 - The Digital Credit Bubble 55:54 - Pricing Through a High Yield Selloff 01:01:13 - What’s Your LTV? 01:06:30 - The 18-Month Dividend Reserve True North does not intend for anything herein to be considered an offer or sale of any securities, including those of Strive. True North encourages listeners to consult with their tax and investment advisors. Additional information on any securities or issuers referenced herein can be found in such issuers’ filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), including any registration statements, prospectuses and prospectus supplements for each issuers’ securities. Listeners should read such documents and other documents incorporated by reference therein or that such issuer has filed with the SEC for more complete information. You may get these documents for free by visiting EDGAR on the SEC website at [www.sec.gov](http://www.sec.gov).* Any securities referred to herein, including those of True North’s parent Strive, are not collateralized by underlying bitcoin holdings and may be subordinated to senior claims. There are no guarantee of returns liquidity or future performance. The securities referred to herein are neither bank deposits, nor FDIC insured, nor regulated in the same way, and do not have the same regulatory and other protections as bank accounts, money market funds, treasuries, or similar investments and as a result may not be comparable investments. Current trading prices and effective yields may vary, current rates are not indicative of future rates, and in some cases rates are subject to frequent adjustments and may be significantly lower than discussed herein. Cash dividends are not guaranteed. In some cases, dividends have not been paid and may not be paid in the future. Ownership of securities referred to in herein does not confer ownership in the underlying assets, including bitcoin.

  4. Oct 6

    Bitcoin Is Cheap. Amplify Now. | The Hurdle Rate Podcast | Ep. 77

    In this week's Hurdle Rate, the crew breaks down Strive's latest 2,000 Bitcoin purchase, a Q3 that delivered a 99% total return, and the new $500 million SATA repurchase facility. They also discuss the goal of pushing amplification above 60% while Bitcoin is under $100K, why the market is too focused on the downside, and why US capital markets are the major leagues. The episode closes with a recap of the Bitcoin Treasuries Conference and why Luke Gromen's "paper gold" comparison doesn't fit digital credit. Here's the latest with Matt Cole, Jeff Walton, Adam Livingston, and Tim Kotzman. Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 01:42 - Strive's Q3: 99% Total Return 07:56 - The $500M SATA Repurchase Facility 09:47 - Targeting 60% Amplification 11:23 - Managing Downside Risk 19:02 - Stop Fearing the Downside 25:43 - Think Bigger 32:58 - Why US Capital Markets Win 40:26 - Bitcoin Treasuries Conference Recap 47:11 - Bitcoiners vs. TradFi 53:47 - Luke Gromen's Digital Credit Confusion True North does not intend for anything herein to be considered an offer or sale of any securities, including those of Strive. True North encourages listeners to consult with their tax and investment advisors. Additional information on any securities or issuers referenced herein can be found in such issuers’ filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), including any registration statements, prospectuses and prospectus supplements for each issuers’ securities. Listeners should read such documents and other documents incorporated by reference therein or that such issuer has filed with the SEC for more complete information. You may get these documents for free by visiting EDGAR on the SEC website at [www.sec.gov](http://www.sec.gov).* Any securities referred to herein, including those of True North’s parent Strive, are not collateralized by underlying bitcoin holdings and may be subordinated to senior claims. There are no guarantee of returns liquidity or future performance. The securities referred to herein are neither bank deposits, nor FDIC insured, nor regulated in the same way, and do not have the same regulatory and other protections as bank accounts, money market funds, treasuries, or similar investments and as a result may not be comparable investments. Current trading prices and effective yields may vary, current rates are not indicative of future rates, and in some cases rates are subject to frequent adjustments and may be significantly lower than discussed herein. Cash dividends are not guaranteed. In some cases, dividends have not been paid and may not be paid in the future. Ownership of securities referred to in herein does not confer ownership in the underlying assets, including bitcoin.

  5. Sep 29

    All In On Bitcoin | The Hurdle Rate Podcast LIVE | Ep. 76

    The Hurdle Rate goes LIVE at the Bitcoin Treasuries Conference in New York, back where the Strive and Semler deal started a year ago. The panel looks back on that deal, which brought the two companies' roughly 6,000 and 5,000 Bitcoin together, and explains why getting bigger was what made SATA possible. Matt explains the game theory behind SATA's daily dividend now that Strategy is following suit, and why the two companies are playing different games. The panel also covers why Strive is aiming for total returns rather than Sharpe ratio, Matt's call for $500K Bitcoin by 2030, and what comes next for Bitcoin balance sheet companies. Here's the latest with Matt Cole, Jeff Walton, Ben Werkman, and Joe Burnett. Follow us on X: https://x.com/HurdleRatePod All episodes now live: https://tnorth.com/shows/hurdle-rate/ Timestamps: 00:00 - One Year Since Semler 05:25 - The Game Theory of Daily Dividends 12:18 - Strategy Follows Suit 16:28 - Why Amplification Matters 23:43 - The Future of Bitcoin Balance Sheets True North does not intend for anything herein to be considered an offer or sale of any securities, including those of Strive. True North encourages listeners to consult with their tax and investment advisors. Additional information on any securities or issuers referenced herein can be found in such issuers’ filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), including any registration statements, prospectuses and prospectus supplements for each issuers’ securities. Listeners should read such documents and other documents incorporated by reference therein or that such issuer has filed with the SEC for more complete information. You may get these documents for free by visiting EDGAR on the SEC website at [www.sec.gov](http://www.sec.gov).* Any securities referred to herein, including those of True North’s parent Strive, are not collateralized by underlying bitcoin holdings and may be subordinated to senior claims. There are no guarantee of returns liquidity or future performance. The securities referred to herein are neither bank deposits, nor FDIC insured, nor regulated in the same way, and do not have the same regulatory and other protections as bank accounts, money market funds, treasuries, or similar investments and as a result may not be comparable investments. Current trading prices and effective yields may vary, current rates are not indicative of future rates, and in some cases rates are subject to frequent adjustments and may be significantly lower than discussed herein. Cash dividends are not guaranteed. In some cases, dividends have not been paid and may not be paid in the future. Ownership of securities referred to in herein does not confer ownership in the underlying assets, including bitcoin.

  6. Sep 22

    Growing Trust Grows Liquidity | The Hurdle Rate Podcast | Ep. 75

    In this week's Hurdle Rate, the crew breaks down Strive's latest 1,355 Bitcoin purchase, Bitcoin's breakout, and why short-term traders may miss the move. They also discuss how digital credit could reshape the next bull market, why liquidity is the clearest measure of trust, and what Michael Saylor and Warren Buffett teach about building balance-sheet companies. The episode closes on the affordability crisis and why Bitcoin may be the new American dream. Here's the latest with Matt Cole, Jeff Walton, Ben Werkman, and Tim Kotzman. Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 02:40 - Strive's Balance Sheet Growth 06:13 - Bitcoin's Breakout 08:23 - Warrants and Short-Term Trading 13:38 - Zoom Out and Stay in the Game 21:31 - Digital Credit Changes the Bull Run 23:09 - SATA Volume and 75 Dividends 26:00 - Liquidity Is Trust 32:03 - Why Digital Credit Isn't for Everyone 37:20 - Building Strategy's Liquidity Engine 41:49 - Lessons From Saylor and Buffett 50:04 - The Return of Balance Sheet Companies 51:45 - Affordability and Bitcoin True North does not intend for anything herein to be considered an offer or sale of any securities, including those of Strive. True North encourages listeners to consult with their tax and investment advisors. Additional information on any securities or issuers referenced herein can be found in such issuers’ filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), including any registration statements, prospectuses and prospectus supplements for each issuers’ securities. Listeners should read such documents and other documents incorporated by reference therein or that such issuer has filed with the SEC for more complete information. You may get these documents for free by visiting EDGAR on the SEC website at [www.sec.gov](http://www.sec.gov).* Any securities referred to herein, including those of True North’s parent Strive, are not collateralized by underlying bitcoin holdings and may be subordinated to senior claims. There are no guarantee of returns liquidity or future performance. The securities referred to herein are neither bank deposits, nor FDIC insured, nor regulated in the same way, and do not have the same regulatory and other protections as bank accounts, money market funds, treasuries, or similar investments and as a result may not be comparable investments. Current trading prices and effective yields may vary, current rates are not indicative of future rates, and in some cases rates are subject to frequent adjustments and may be significantly lower than discussed herein. Cash dividends are not guaranteed. In some cases, dividends have not been paid and may not be paid in the future. Ownership of securities referred to in herein does not confer ownership in the underlying assets, including bitcoin.

  7. Sep 15

    Podcasters Per Share | The Hurdle Rate Podcast | Ep. 74

    This week on The Hurdle Rate: Adam Livingston joins Strive as VP of Investments, Strategy buys back $139 million of STRC with stretch back near 99, and Strive adds 469 Bitcoin at an average cost of $77,954 while hitting an all-time high market cap of $2.75 billion. Jeff makes the case that trust is the real infrastructure of capital markets, and why Bitcoin makes that trust legible. We get into the Clarity Act, AI doomerism, and why the crew thinks the frontier labs are using fear to build a moat ahead of their IPOs. Matt takes macro with the 10-year touching 5%, what a short-term Bitcoin flush would actually look like, and why it would be the dream setup. We close with a capital markets recap and Strive's one-year anniversary. Here's the latest with Matt Cole, Jeff Walton, Ben Werkman, Adam Livingston, and Tim Kotzman. Follow us on X: https://x.com/HurdleRatePod All episodes now live: https://tnorth.com/shows/hurdle-rate/ Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 01:17 - Adam Livingston Joins Strive 08:52 - Trust as Capital Markets Infrastructure 19:48 - The Amplified Bitcoin Story and SATA 22:44 - Building Through the Bear Market 24:54 - An Outsider's View of Strive 28:35 - The Clarity Act and Regulatory Trust 36:23 - AI Doomerism and the Messy Middle 45:03 - Don't Let the Ladder Get Pulled Up 51:28 - Macro: The 10-Year Touches 5% 55:27 - What a Bitcoin Flush Would Look Like 1:01:46 - Capital Markets Recap True North does not intend for anything herein to be considered an offer or sale of any securities, including those of Strive. True North encourages listeners to consult with their tax and investment advisors. Additional information on any securities or issuers referenced herein can be found in such issuers’ filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), including any registration statements, prospectuses and prospectus supplements for each issuers’ securities. Listeners should read such documents and other documents incorporated by reference therein or that such issuer has filed with the SEC for more complete information. You may get these documents for free by visiting EDGAR on the SEC website at [www.sec.gov](http://www.sec.gov).* Any securities referred to herein, including those of True North’s parent Strive, are not collateralized by underlying bitcoin holdings and may be subordinated to senior claims. There are no guarantee of returns liquidity or future performance. The securities referred to herein are neither bank deposits, nor FDIC insured, nor regulated in the same way, and do not have the same regulatory and other protections as bank accounts, money market funds, treasuries, or similar investments and as a result may not be comparable investments. Current trading prices and effective yields may vary, current rates are not indicative of future rates, and in some cases rates are subject to frequent adjustments and may be significantly lower than discussed herein. Cash dividends are not guaranteed. In some cases, dividends have not been paid and may not be paid in the future. Ownership of securities referred to in herein does not confer ownership in the underlying assets, including bitcoin.

  8. Sep 8

    The Billion Dollar Wall | The Hurdle Rate Podcast | Ep. 73

    In this week's Hurdle Rate, the crew discusses SATA hitting $999 million outstanding, Strategy doubling its STRC repurchase facility to $2 billion, and Strive adding another 1,000+ Bitcoin. Ben breaks down the art and science of running the desk and why amplification stays on. Matt makes the case that we've never seen a bull market with a perpetual preferred model in place. We also get into executive comp and shareholder alignment, and close on macro: what happens if the 10-year breaks 7%. Here's the latest with Matt Cole, Jeff Walton, Ben Werkman, and Tim Kotzman. Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 01:20 - SATA Nears $1 Billion 07:10 - Strive's Flywheel and Amplification 09:34 - Strategy's Push to Get STRC Back to 100 12:12 - The Art and Science of Capital Markets 15:33 - The First Bull Market With Perpetual Preferreds 17:44 - ASST Volume Up 9.7x in Three Weeks 20:00 - Competition and the Digital Gold Rush 26:55 - What Saylor Is Really Like 30:01 - Executive Comp and Shareholder Alignment 48:21 - Macro: What If the 10-Year Hits 7%? 59:22 - Private Credit Risk in Insurance True North does not intend for anything herein to be considered an offer or sale of any securities, including those of Strive. True North encourages listeners to consult with their tax and investment advisors. Additional information on any securities or issuers referenced herein can be found in such issuers’ filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), including any registration statements, prospectuses and prospectus supplements for each issuers’ securities. Listeners should read such documents and other documents incorporated by reference therein or that such issuer has filed with the SEC for more complete information. You may get these documents for free by visiting EDGAR on the SEC website at [www.sec.gov](http://www.sec.gov).* Any securities referred to herein, including those of True North’s parent Strive, are not collateralized by underlying bitcoin holdings and may be subordinated to senior claims. There are no guarantee of returns liquidity or future performance. The securities referred to herein are neither bank deposits, nor FDIC insured, nor regulated in the same way, and do not have the same regulatory and other protections as bank accounts, money market funds, treasuries, or similar investments and as a result may not be comparable investments. Current trading prices and effective yields may vary, current rates are not indicative of future rates, and in some cases rates are subject to frequent adjustments and may be significantly lower than discussed herein. Cash dividends are not guaranteed. In some cases, dividends have not been paid and may not be paid in the future. Ownership of securities referred to in herein does not confer ownership in the underlying assets, including bitcoin.

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4.6
out of 5
26 Ratings

About

Join Matt, Ben, Jeff, and Tim for an entertaining and informative weekly podcast cutting through conventional wisdom on Bitcoin, investing, and macroeconomics. Every Wednesday, this forward-thinking team delivers unique perspectives and innovative insights that challenge mainstream financial narratives, empowering listeners to make more independent decisions for their corporate or personal financial lives. Is Bitcoin your hurdle rate? New episodes every Wednesday!

Information

  • Creator
    thehurdleratepod
  • Years Active
    2025 - 2026
  • Episodes
    80
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © Copyright 2025 All rights reserved.
  • Show Website
    The Hurdle Rate Podcast

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