Education Futures

Svenia Busson & Laurent Jolie

A podcast about the future of education in the age of AI. We bring together interdisciplinary voices to explore how we can shape more desirable futures for learning.

  1. 1d ago

    No grades, no homework: inside a self-directed school

    Dr. Tyler S. Thigpen is the co-founder and Head of School at The Forest School: An Acton Academy, a self-directed K3–12 microschool in Trilith, near Atlanta, Georgia, and co-founder of the Institute for Self-Directed Learning. He holds a doctorate in Education Leadership (Ed.L.D.) from the Harvard Graduate School of Education, a Master's in Public Administration from the Harvard Kennedy School, and a Master's in Theological Studies from Regent College. Before founding The Forest School in 2018, Tyler wore many hats — church minister, Spanish teacher, and public-school principal — and co-founded Chattahoochee Hills Charter School and MENTOR Georgia, later working as a partner at the school-redesign nonprofit Transcend. Today The Forest School serves roughly 160 learners on campus, plus Forest School Online, which reaches students across the US, Kenya, Uganda, Costa Rica, China, Mexico, and Thailand. Tyler is also an instructor and Academic Director at the University of Pennsylvania Graduate School of Education, where he teaches "Introduction to Teaching With AI"; the author of The Playbook for Self-Directed Learning (Routledge, 2025); and the creator of the Story Arts curriculum, which was adopted statewide by Georgia's Department of Education. In this episode, Tyler talks with Svenia Busson about: The thread connecting a church minister, a Spanish teacher, and a self-directed microschool founderInside The Forest School — no homework, no grades, guides instead of teachers, badges instead of tests"Practicals": oral defenses and performance tasks that make learning AI-proof — you can use AI along the road, but you have to prove mastery at the endWhy discernment and judgment are "the new literacy" — and where he agrees with MIT's Justin Reich that AI literacy can't really be taughtCognitive debt — keeping learners in the "challenge zone" so the thinking never gets outsourced to AIThe four phases of self-directed learning: desire, resourcefulness, initiative, and persistenceScaling without cloning — the Institute for Self-Directed Learning and redesigning models with 20 Georgia superintendentsSliding-scale tuition and "diverse by design" — why being self-directed makes the school leaner and more affordable

    No grades, no homework: inside a self-directed school
  2. 5d ago

    Why AI should (and can) make schools more human

    Robin Lake is Director of the Center on Reinventing Public Education (CRPE), based at Arizona State University's Mary Lou Fulton Teachers College. For more than two decades she has been one of the most respected systems thinkers in American education — researching charter schools, district–charter collaboration, portfolio strategy, and urban school reform, and testifying before the U.S. House Education and Labor Committee and state legislatures. She holds a BA in International Studies and an MPA in Education and Urban Policy from the University of Washington, and was named to the 2016 class of Pahara-Aspen Education Fellows. Over the past three years, Robin has pivoted CRPE's work toward AI in education. She writes the newsletter Think Forward: Learning with AI, leads the inaugural Think Forward Fellowship (bringing together policymakers, system leaders, educators, researchers, funders, and technologists), and convenes the annual Think Forward: Learning with AI Forum. Her recent work includes Getting Beyond the Lightbulb Stage: Why AI Is Not Yet Transforming Education (CRPE, 2026), based on 50+ stakeholder interviews. In this episode, Robin talks with Svenia Busson about: The "lightbulb moment" vs. the transformation moment — why AI is saving teachers time but hasn't yet changed how schools actually work"Precision learning" picking up where personalized learning failed — inspired by a Fred Hutch cancer-center billboard, "We treat your cancer like it's YOUR cancer"Why the real prize is making schools more human — using AI to deepen relationships, not replace themFixing measurement and accountability first — why old assessment systems block the durable skills (adaptability, resilience, judgment) the future demandsAI governance as an R&D endeavour — balancing guardrails against innovation, and the case for state-backed "innovation districts"The charter school model as a "license to dream" — what Agua Fria's AI-powered career academies and Summit Public Schools revealWhy schools of education are failing to prepare new teachers for AI — and the certification signals that could change it fastest A clear-eyed case that AI's greatest gift to education could be making school human. Links mentioned Robin's newsletter — Think Forward: Learning with AI: https://crpe.substack.comCRPE — AI in Education: https://crpe.org/projects/ai-in-education/Getting Beyond the Lightbulb Stage (CRPE, 2026): https://crpe.org/getting-beyond-the-lightbulb-stage-why-ai-is-not-yet-transforming-education/2026: A Year for Leadership (CRPE): https://crpe.org/2026-a-year-for-leadership/Wicked Opportunities: Leveraging AI to Transform Education (CRPE): https://crpe.org/wicked-opportunities-leveraging-ai-to-transform-education/Summit Public Schools: https://summitps.org

    Why AI should (and can) make schools more human
  3. Jul 20

    Funding evidence-based applications of AI in education

    Kumar Garg is President of Renaissance Philanthropy, the science-and-technology philanthropy he co-founded with Tom Kalil in 2024 to help donors invest in high-impact research across AI, climate, and education. He holds a BA from Dartmouth and a JD from Yale Law School, and cut his teeth over eight years in the Obama White House Office of Science and Technology Policy, where he led the administration's STEM-education agenda — including the "Educate to Innovate" campaign that mobilized more than $1 billion in philanthropic and in-kind investment, and the White House Science Fair. Before Renaissance, he spent nearly six years (2018–2024) as Vice President and Managing Director at Schmidt Futures, the philanthropic initiative of Eric and Wendy Schmidt, where he built much of its science, talent, and education portfolio and launched the Learning Engineering Virtual Institute (LEVI). He is one of the principal architects and evangelists of "learning engineering" — the idea that instruction should be treated as a systems-level engineering and data challenge — and delivered Carnegie Mellon's 2022 Simon Initiative Distinguished Lecture, "Shaping the Field of Learning Engineering." Today, Renaissance runs a DARPA-inspired "fund model" that raises capital against well-scoped three-to-five-year technical bets, from doubling middle-school math outcomes for low-income students to catching early-reading difficulties before third grade. In this episode, Kumar talks with Svenia Busson about: The Renaissance "fund model" — how naming a bottleneck, recruiting a technical lead, and raising from donors like an investor raises from LPs unlocks three-to-five-year breakthroughsWhy environmental factors like lead poisoning and classroom air quality may drive learning outcomes as much as pedagogy — and can move a child 10+ IQ pointsLearning engineering explained in plain language — the four always-running loops of learning science, design, instruction, and the individual learnerLEVI Math's north star — doubling the rate of middle-school math gains for low-income kids at under $1,000 per student, down from the $4,000 high-dosage tutoring benchmarkThe LEVI Literacy Initiative — using AI as a diagnostic screener, not a teacher, to flag dyslexia and speech errors in the K–2 window"Dynamic dosing" and the human + AI tutoring triangle — why teachers and tutors enhance, rather than compete with, AI toolsBuilding rigor into edtech — the Tools Competition's research-partner requirement and ending moonshots with published RCTsWhy the advanced AI-and-education world is "shockingly small," and how DARPA-style active program management grows it mentioned in the episode:Renaissance Philanthropy — https://www.renaissancephilanthropy.org/Learning Engineering Virtual Institute (LEVI) — https://learning-engineering-virtual-institute.org/LEVI Literacy Initiative — https://learning-engineering-virtual-institute.org/literacy/The Tools Competition — https://tools-competition.org/Big If True Science accelerator — https://www.renaissancephilanthropy.org/big-if-true-science-acceleratorSchmidt Futures / Schmidt Sciences — https://www.schmidtsciences.org/Lead Exposure Elimination Project (LEEP) — https://leadelimination.org/Center for Global Development (lead pollution & learning research) — https://www.cgdev.org/J-PAL (2012 high-dosage tutoring research) — https://www.povertyactionlab.org/Carnegie Mellon "dynamic dosing" human + AI tutoring study (2025) — https://www.heinz.cmu.edu/media/2025/September/in-study-of-human-ai-tutoring-with-us-seventh-graders-human-tutors-enhanced-the-benefits-of-ai-tutorsDARPA — https://www.darpa.mil/

    Funding evidence-based applications of AI in education
  4. Jul 16

    Why teachers should not reject AI without trying it

    Maureen Russo Rodriguez is coming up on her 20th year as an educator and teaches language and literature — primarily Spanish, with occasional turns in English — at St. Mark's School, a small boarding school outside Boston. With a background in comparative literature and a stint in higher ed, she co-founded AI Co-Lab, a teacher-led, peer-to-peer network for building AI literacy. What began with a single faculty email she sent the week ChatGPT launched (a tool she shares a birthday with) has grown from nine teachers into a movement of 900+ educators across 300+ schools, with materials released under a Creative Commons license so any school can remix and reuse them. Ron Spalletta teaches in the English department at the same school, with a background rooted in poetry (and a little molecular biology). Through a Patterson Innovation Grant, he has been probing what AI means for writing, learning, and assessment — and has designed several of Co-Lab's monthly "explorations," including a widely used one on alternative assessment built to help teachers profile themselves as assessors and rethink AI-resistant assignments. In this episode, Maureen and Ron talk with Svenia Busson about: Defining AI literacy for teachers — awareness of what these tools are and aren't, in order to preserve the human core of teachingWhy AI literacy is "a lot more driver's ed than automotive repair" — hands-on practice, not looking under the hoodHow Co-Lab works as a peer-to-peer network — structured monthly explorations, breakout rooms, and PD that pushes back on "one-and-done" webinars and consultant hypeThe four types of "naysayers" — and why refusing AI can be a legitimate, informed act of teacher agencyGenerative AI as an "arrival technology" — it's already in students' lives whether or not it enters your classroomSarah Schneider Kavanagh's dilemma-and-decision cycle — how professional judgment breaks down if teachers never touch the toolsReinventing assessment in the age of AI — from oral exams to AI-resistant tasks, and pairing an LLM's scope with a teacher's discernmentThe students who worry them most — the ones doing everything right and watching peers coast on A-pluses through dishonest AI use A conversation about why AI literacy isn't optional — it's how teachers keep their agency. Links mentioned in the episode: AI Co-Lab: https://www.educolab.org/Justin Reich & Jesse Dukes, The Homework Machine podcast: https://www.teachlabpodcast.com/On "arrival technologies" (Reich & Dukes): https://www.researchgate.net/publication/385821042_Toward_a_New_Theory_of_Arrival_Technologies

    Why teachers should not reject AI without trying it
  5. Jul 13

    Why kids & teens get attached to AI, and the risks

    Dr. Mathilde Cerioli is a cognitive neuroscientist working at the intersection of child development, AI, and public policy. She holds a Master's in child psychology from Paris and a Ph.D. in Cognitive Neuroscience from the Université de Montréal, where her research focused on using board games and video games to improve cognitive functioning in children and adolescents, including those with learning disabilities. After her doctorate she worked with EdTech and video-game companies, translating child-development science into product design. She went on to co-found everyone.ai, a California-based nonprofit that anticipates, educates on, and evaluates the risks and opportunities of AI for children and youth (ages 0–25), alongside co-founders Grégory Renard, Anne-Sophie Seret, and Céline Malvoisin. As Chief Scientist, she leads its research, authored the founding report The Future of Child Development in the AI Era (2024), and recently launched the AïA Safety Builder — an assessment system that scores AI products on 15 human-like behaviors driving anthropomorphism in children. She is also Chief Scientist of the iRAISE Alliance, the global coalition launched with the Paris Peace Forum, and advises OpenAI's Expert Council on Well-Being and AI. In this episode, Mathilde talks with Svenia Busson about: Why children don't have "mini adult brains" — and what developmental science says AI design keeps getting wrongThe 15 human-like behaviors that make AI feel human — flattery, mimicry, validation, proactivity — and when they tip from helpful to harmfulAnthropomorphism and attachment — why kids bond with machines faster than adults doSensitive periods, pruning, and plasticity — how AI introduced too early risks cognitive "stunting" (echoing Rebecca Winthrop's work at Brookings)The adolescent brain, reward systems, and a rat-and-alcohol study that explains why teens crave AI approvalWhy friction and "expectation violation" in messy teen friendships aren't a bug — but how the brain actually learnsCognitive offloading in adults — metacognition, burnout, and the risk for young people entering the workforceDoing rigorous research when a new model ships every week — the iRAISE expert-consensus approach If you are building AI tools in the space this is a must-listen. Links mentioned: everyone.ai — https://everyone.aiiRAISE Alliance — https://i-raise.orgParis Peace Forum — https://parispeaceforum.orgRebecca Winthrop, Brookings Institution — https://www.brookings.edu/people/rebecca-winthrop/ and her article on cognitive stunting: https://www.brookings.edu/articles/is-it-time-to-measure-cognitive-stunting/

    Why kids & teens get attached to AI, and the risks
  6. Jul 9

    Two students on AI, cheating, and the future of work

    Henry Scott studies at the London Interdisciplinary School (lis.ac.uk), pursuing a Bachelor of Arts and Science in Interdisciplinary Problems and Methods, and will be part of the school's third graduating class. Dyslexic since childhood, he turned early to AI dictation tools to help articulate his thinking — a habit he credits with sharpening his own unassisted writing over time. At LIS he took an AI and Ethics module taught by legal scholar Emma Rengers, wrote a four-page AI declaration for a capstone project he partly "vibe-coded," and built a custom AI assistant — nicknamed Clover — to manage his calendar and track his mood and habits. Felix Audebert is a first-year student at Forward College (forward-college.eu), the European university where students spend one year each in Lisbon, Paris, and Berlin. He is pursuing a double bachelor's in Politics & International Relations and Business & Leadership. Felix uses AI almost daily and has access to Forward College's AI hub, which includes a tool that flags how much of a student's work risks tipping into cognitive offloading. He recently used AI to help a Portuguese impact-measurement startup narrow down interview targets for a client project. In this episode, Henry and Felix talk with Svenia Busson about: Using AI as an assistant rather than letting it think for youThe line between cognitive offloading and freeing up mental bandwidthWhy both still write by hand — and the NTNU brain-connectivity research (Frontiers in Psychology) behind itHow Forward College and LIS each handle AI in the classroom, from AI hubs to mandatory declarationsThe honesty gap — why students under-report AI use, and tools like Consensus that can confirm your own bias back to youRethinking assessment in the AI era, from written declarations to oral exams ("vivas")The EU AI Act (high-level summary), algorithmic bias in immigration and parole systems, and what it means for the workforce they're enteringEmotional offloading — AI companionship, naming your assistant, and where human connection still wins

    Two students on AI, cheating, and the future of work
  7. Jul 6

    Wartime lessons: Ukraine's bet on AI in education

    Oksana Matiiash is the CEO of WINWIN EdTech Center of Excellence, Ukraine's national hub for technology and innovation in education. Launched in December 2025 under Ukraine's Global Innovation Strategy, the Center generates evidence through research and foresight and pilots education technologies, including AI, while Ukraine navigates a full-scale war. It also brings together government, educators, researchers, startups, and global partners to scale innovations that improve learning. The Center's partners include the Ministries of Digital Transformation and of Education and Science of Ukraine, UNICEF, Google for Education, OpenAI, Estonian Centre for International Development (ESTDEV). Oksana holds a Master of Public Policy from the University of Oxford, where she studied as a Weidenfeld-Hoffmann Scholar, and a law degree from Taras Shevchenko National University of Kyiv. In this episode, Oksana talks with Svenia Busson about: Why Ukraine launched a national EdTech Center to accelerate education innovation during the war and in the age of AILeading wartime emergency education — and what crisis taught her about what school systems actually needThe WINWIN EdTech Center's three pillars: research and foresight, innovation and pilots, ecosystem-buildingUkraine's new OpenAI-funded study on how AI is shaping learning for students living through years of disrupted schoolingWhy teachers, not students, come first in her AI rollout — even as kids learn to prompt on TikTokThe World Bank-backed RCT where six weeks of tech-assisted tutoring closed months of learning lossBuilding a "Responsible AI" framework with teachers as co-designers, not just recipientsThe critical-thinking and learning-agency skills she considers non-negotiable in an information war

    Wartime lessons: Ukraine's bet on AI in education
  8. Jul 2

    Alpha School: 2 hours of academics, the rest for life skills

    MacKenzie Price is the co-founder of Alpha School and the AI-driven 2 Hour Learning model that powers it, a Stanford-trained psychologist who left the traditional path the day her daughter came home from second grade and said, simply, "school is boring." In 2014, working alongside the colleague she still calls "the OG, the Original Guide," Price opened the first Alpha campus in Austin, Texas, betting that AI-personalized, mastery-based instruction could compress a full day of core academics into two hours. The bet paid off: Alpha students now grow two to five-and-a-half times faster than peers on NWEA MAP Growth assessments, and the model has expanded to more than 50 campuses, including Texas Sports Academy (low-to-no-cost, athletics-focused, partly funded through Texas education savings accounts) and Waypoint Academy, a wilderness-based program. This fall she's taking the model international, with new World School campuses opening in Ecuador and Kenya, building on an earlier pilot that brought the model to roughly 1,000 Ukrainian refugee students. Price built Alpha around three commitments: kids learn twice the material in a fraction of the time, kids build real-world life skills through afternoon workshops, and — first and foremost — kids love school. By Alpha's own surveys, 95% of students say they do, and as many as 60% say they'd rather be in class than on vacation. She hosts her own Future of Education podcast and shares Alpha's experiments with more than a million followers across social media. In this episode, MacKenzie talks with Svenia Busson about: Why AI-driven mastery learning can compress a school day into two hours — without losing depthThe "guide" model — trading lesson plans and lectures for one-on-one motivation and emotional coachingCognitive load theory in practice — keeping every student in their own zone of productive strugglePaying kids to learn — the financial-literacy logic behind Alpha's motivation systemTexas Sports Academy and the wilderness-based Waypoint Academy — turning "selection bias" into a design principleBringing the model into public schools, and new World School campuses launching in Ecuador and KenyaAlpha X projects — the teenagers behind a self-produced Broadway musical, a six-figure jewelry brand, and CPR-certified rescue trainingWhy MacKenzie believes philosophy, not computer science, is becoming education's most valuable subject

    Alpha School: 2 hours of academics, the rest for life skills

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A podcast about the future of education in the age of AI. We bring together interdisciplinary voices to explore how we can shape more desirable futures for learning.

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