Betwixt Podcast | Special Release

InterVarsity Press
InterVarsity Press
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This is a special, one-season release of the Betwixt Podcast from IVP author, Deb Gregory. To continue listening to the podcast after Episode 13, subscribe to the Betwixt Podcast here: Apple PodcastsSpotifyYouTubeSubstack Betwixt is a waypoint for spiritual wayfinders exploring the liminal passages that shape our lives. In each episode, Deb Gregory invites you into a grounded conversation and an embodied practice to help you navigate the spiritual life with intention and wisdom. If you’re seeking a steadier, more spacious way to walk with God, Betwixt is a companion for the journey.

  1. Sep 8

    Episode 13, Part 2 – Scaffold of Hope: Practices for Dark Seasons with Becky Eldredge

    This has been a special, one-season release of the Betwixt Podcast from IVP author, Deb Gregory. To continue listening to more episodes, subscribe to the Betwixt Podcast here: Apple PodcastsSpotifyYouTubeSubstack SPECIAL OFFER | As a listener of the show, you can get 25% off Deb Gregory's new book, Spiritual Wayfinding, by using the code IVPOD25 at checkout at ivpress.com. We hope you enjoy this season! What holds us when life becomes heavy? In this second conversation, Deb Gregory and spiritual director Becky Eldredge explore how hope is sustained in the seasons when our interior movements go quiet. Ignatian spirituality teaches that discernment is never a solo practice — it is communal, embodied, and grounded in the ways God meets us through others. Becky reflects on the reality of dark seasons: times when prayer feels thin, energy disappears, and the nervous system contracts under the weight of grief, fear, or exhaustion. In these moments, hope isn’t something we generate. It’s something we lean on. Something that is held for us. Something that comes through the people, practices, and postures that keep us tethered to God when we cannot feel that tether ourselves. This is the heart of the scaffold of hope — the steadying structures that support us until interior movements return. Becky names the simple, whole‑person practices that help rebuild hope: breath prayer when words are unavailable, stepping outside to engage the senses, tracing even the smallest graces through the examen, and allowing trusted companions to accompany us without rushing us toward resolution. Hope becomes a shared practice, not an individual achievement. It shows up in the body as steadiness, breath, presence, and the quiet assurance that we are not alone. And in Ignatian discernment, hope is one of the most reliable markers of God’s movement — even, and especially, in the dark. Themes Communal Hope — how others hold hope when we cannotScaffolding Practices — embodied rituals that steady us in dark seasonsIgnatian Accompaniment — discernment as a shared, relational practiceDesolation & Consolation — navigating spiritual darkness with honestyHope as Gift — a theological virtue, not optimismWhole‑Person Spirituality — tending the nervous system, emotions, and body in prayer Practices Breath prayer in seasons without wordsSensory grounding outdoorsNaming small graces in difficult daysThe examen as a way of tracing God’s presence in darknessAllowing community to hold hope on our behalfHand‑over‑heart prayer for God’s nearness Favorite Lines “Sometimes hope is held for us until we can hold it again.” “We need a scaffold of hope in the seasons when our interior movements go quiet.” Resources Becky’s Books: Encounter Grace: Moments of Hope, Joy, and Peace The Inner Chapel: Embracing the Promises of God  Busy Lives & Restless Souls: How Prayer Can Help You Find the Missing Peace in Your Life Deb’s Book: Spiritual Wayfinding: 33 Walking Meditations for Navigating Life with Embodied Wisdom Use Code IVPOD25 for 25% off Follow Becky Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/beldredge98 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/beldredge98/ My website: http://beckyeldredge.com  Ignatian Ministries- the non-profit Becky founded: https://ignatianministries.org/ Where to Find Deb Flourish Spiritual Direction Substack IG or Facebook Media Used in this Episode: Palms Down by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue) Faded Promises licensed through Soundstripe. Code: LUJWGE5LY2FBKNAT “In Peaceful Defiance” — licensed via Soundstripe Closing Music: ⁠Roots by Ryvoli⁠

  2. Sep 1

    Episode 13, Part 1 – Embodied Discernment: Noticing What Moves with Becky Eldredge

    SPECIAL OFFER | As a listener of the show, you can get 25% off Deb Gregory's new book, Spiritual Wayfinding, by using the code IVPOD25 at checkout at ivpress.com. We hope you enjoy this season! What does discernment have to do with the body? In this conversation, Deb Gregory and spiritual director Becky Eldredge explore the affective and holistic wisdom of Ignatian spirituality — a tradition where the whole person prays, listens, and discerns. Becky describes how interior movements show up not just in our thoughts but in our emotions, our breath, our posture, and the subtle shifts in energy that surface when we face a decision. Ignatian discernment invites us to pay attention to these movements as real spiritual data: signs of what draws us toward God and what pulls us away. Favorite lines: We throw hope around like confetti. Hope has a name, and his name is Jesus. Following this thread, Deb and Becky take a deep look at hope as a theological virtue — a God‑given orientation of the heart and a trusted fruit of the Spirit in discernment. Hope isn’t optimism or positivity; it’s the interior movement that buoys us, widens our perspective, and helps us recognize where God is drawing us forward. Themes Embodied Discernment — how the body participates in prayer and decision‑making Interior Movements — noticing emotional, cognitive, and somatic shifts Ignatian Spirituality — whole‑person wisdom for everyday life Cura Personalis — care for the whole person in spiritual direction Consolation & Desolation — affective markers that guide discernment Hope as a Theological Virtue — more than optimism; a God‑given orientation of the heart Affective Discernment — reading the signals of breath, posture, and energy Spiritual Accompaniment — the ministry of noticing what moves within Resources Becky’s Books: Encounter Grace: Moments of Hope, Joy, and Peace The Inner Chapel: Embracing the Promises of God  Busy Lives & Restless Souls: How Prayer Can Help You Find the Missing Peace in Your Life Deb’s Book: Spiritual Wayfinding: 33 Walking Meditations for Navigating Life with Embodied Wisdom Use Code IVPOD25 for 25% off Follow Becky Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/beldredge98 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/beldredge98/ My website: http://beckyeldredge.com  Ignatian Ministries- the non-profit Becky founded: https://ignatianministries.org/ Where to Find Deb Flourish Spiritual Direction Substack IG or Facebook Media Used in this Episode: Palms Down by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue) Faded Promises licensed through Soundstripe. Code: LUJWGE5LY2FBKNAT Music by Viacheslav Starostin from Pixabay Closing Music: ⁠Roots by Ryvoli⁠

  3. Aug 25

    Episode 12 – The Interior Wilderness: Encountering God in the Desert with Noel Forlini Burt

    SPECIAL OFFER | As a listener of the show, you can get 25% off Deb Gregory's new book, Spiritual Wayfinding, by using the code IVPOD25 at checkout at ivpress.com. We hope you enjoy this season! Why I wanted to talk with Noel Noel is both an Old Testament scholar and a spiritual director — two threads that run through my own story. My early academic path was aimed toward becoming an Old Testament scholar, but my vocation ultimately led me into spiritual direction. Even so, my love for the Hebrew Bible has never faded. Talking with Noel gave me the chance to explore both the scholarly depth and the spiritual formation that emerge in the wilderness stories of Scripture. Key Themes we Discussed (and Wrestled With) naming our interior landscape encountering God in desolation and disorientation biblical wilderness as a formative space varied terrains of wilderness in the Old Testament the Suscipe: An Ignatian prayer of trust What stuck with me Wilderness is not a single metaphor. It’s a range of terrains — and each one can become a place of encounter. A question for reflection Where do you notice wilderness in your own interior landscape, and what stands out as you name it? The Suscipe Prayer of St Ignatius Take, Lord, and receive all of my independence, Memory, understanding, and my entire will —all of my resources and possessions. Everything is yours. I entrust all of it to your care. Only inflame my soul with your love and grace. That is enough for me. (Translated by Deborah Gregory, Spiritual Wayfinding, pg 75) About Noel’s book God in the Desert: A Spiritual Theology of Wilderness in the Old Testament traces how God meets people in barren, exposed, or disorienting places — and how those ancient encounters can help us understand the landscapes within our own lives. Where to find Dr. Noel Forlini Burt Book: God in the Desert: A Spiritual Theology of Wilderness in the Old Testament Substack: noelforliniburt.substack.com Instagram: @noelforliniburt Where to Find Deb Flourish Spiritual Direction Substack IG or Facebook Music: Palms Down by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue) Faded Promises licensed through Soundstripe. Code: LUJWGE5LY2FBKNAT Closing Music: ⁠Roots by Ryvoli⁠

  4. Aug 18

    Episode 11 – Pilgrimage, Transformation, and Coming to See the Unseen Realm with Brian Zahnd

    SPECIAL OFFER | As a listener of the show, you can get 25% off Deb Gregory's new book, Spiritual Wayfinding, by using the code IVPOD25 at checkout at ivpress.com. We hope you enjoy this season! I’ll admit it—I was a bit nervous to talk about heaven with Brian Zahnd. Perhaps like you, I carry baggage from childhood images of gold streets and clouds, and I wasn’t sure where this conversation would go. But his stories of walking long long-distance pilgrimages like the Camino de Santiago opened such a grounded way of talking about heaven, embodiment, and the unseen world we move through every day. I really loved this conversation! What we get into Brian has walked multiple pilgrimages—40 miles, 160 miles, and the full 500-mile Camino de Santiago twice. Those long walks have shaped his sense of identity and the stripping-away that happens when life is reduced to walking, eating, sleeping, and repeat. Brain shares the adventures of crossing the Pyrenees, staying in the monastery at Roncesvalles, and watching people who don’t consider themselves religious still feel drawn into the shared rituals of the Camino. He noted that at some point, his perspective shifted from finally getting a vacation to an overhaul of vocation. “Eventually it doesn’t feel like a holiday. It feels like, I am a pilgrim now. My life has been reduced to blessed simplicity.” We also explore his new book Unseen Existences: Of Heaven, Earth, and the Divine Mystery in All Things and why so many of us inherited narrow or sentimental ideas of heaven. Brian talks about heaven in a way that isn’t wispy and frail, but grounded and gritty. Why this conversation matters If you’ve ever felt allergic to heaven-talk, this episode might be a relief. Brian challenges the modern assumption that only what we can measure is real, without dismissing science or reason. Instead, he invites us to recover an older Christian intuition: that the visible and invisible co-exist, and that our own lived experience—our senses, our movement, our curiosity—can help us glimpse the mysterious existence of heaven all around us. What made me laugh Two pastors walked together for days before admitting they were pastors—only on the Camino! Tune in if you enjoy conversations about: the Camino de Santiagoembodied spiritualityheaven without sentimentalitythe unseen world in Christian (mystic) imaginationpilgrimage and spiritual transformationBuen Camino! Where to Find Brian Website: https://brianzahnd.comSubstack: https://brianzahnd.substack.comTwitter / X: https://twitter.com/BrianZahndInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/brianzahndFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/BrianZahndAuthor (facebook.com in Bing)YouTube (Word of Life Church): https://www.youtube.com/c/WordofLifeChurch  Where to Find Deb Flourish Spiritual DirectionSubstackIG or Facebook Thanks to InterVarsity Press for generously offering 25% off Spiritual Wayfinding: 33 Walking Meditations for Navigating Life with Embodied Wisdom. Use Code IVPOD25 at https://www.ivpress.com/spiritual-wayfinding Music: Palms Down by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue) Faded Promises licensed through Soundstripe. Code: LUJWGE5LY2FBKNAT Closing Music: ⁠Roots by Ryvoli⁠

  5. Aug 11

    Episode 10 – Forest Bathing: Cultivating Connection with Nature and God with Kim Van Natta

    SPECIAL OFFER | As a listener of the show, you can get 25% off Deb Gregory's new book, Spiritual Wayfinding, by using the code IVPOD25 at checkout at ivpress.com. We hope you enjoy this season! Overview Discover how forest bathing—an intentional immersion in nature—can deepen your spiritual life and boost your physical health. In this episode, Kim Van Natta, a spiritual director and certified forest therapy guide, shares insights on engaging all your senses outdoors to experience divine connection. Use code IVPOD25 for 25% off Spiritual Wayfinding: 33 Walking Meditations for Navigating Life with Embodied Wisdom Main topics: The essence of forest bathing and its physical health benefits, including immune boosting through phytocidesThe spiritual significance of engaging with creation as a means of connecting with GodPractical guidance on how to participate in a forest bathing walk and incorporate it into your spiritual practiceThe biblical basis for nature as a pathway to divine encounter, supported by scripture referencesThe emergence of Wild Church as a community of outdoor believers rediscovering sacred space in creation In this episode: How trees release healing chemicals that support immune function and reduce stressThe history and development of shinrin yoku in Japan and its global adoptionThe relationship between embodiment, senses, and spiritual awarenessHow to create your own forest bathing experience, regardless of location or seasonThe role of silence, shared presence, and sensory invitations in deepening spiritual mindfulness Timestamps: 00:00 - Introduction to forest bathing and its health benefits 02:00 - The physical and spiritual 'rest' offered by engaging with nature 03:30 - Exploring the biblical and scientific foundations of nature as divine gift 05:00 - The historical origins of forest bathing in Japan and its global spread 07:00 - Practical steps for doing a forest bathing walk and sensory engagement 10:00 - How biblical scriptures illuminate our connection to creation and God 13:30 - The role of Wild Church and outdoor communities in spiritual renewal 16:00 - The scientific evidence of phytocides' effects on immune health 18:00 - Embodiment and sensory awareness as pathways to divine presence 20:00 - How to start your own practice of forest bathing today 42:00 - Guided natural mindfulness practice: Experience the Pleasure of Presence Resources & Links: Spiritual Wayfinding: 33 Walking Meditations for Navigating Life with Embodied Wisdom Wild Church Network Church of the Wild by Victoria Louris Rewilding with Mary DeYoung Association of Nature and Forest Therapy Connect with Kim Van Natta: Website Connect with Deb Gregory: Flourish Contemplative CenterSubstackInstagram / Facebook May this episode inspire you to slow down, open your senses, and experience God's presence in the sacred space of creation.

  6. Aug 4

    Episode 9 – Contemplation That Fuels Action, Howard Thurman, and Communal Discernment with Rich Johnson

    SPECIAL OFFER | As a listener of the show, you can get 25% off Deb Gregory's new book, Spiritual Wayfinding, by using the code IVPOD25 at checkout at ivpress.com. We hope you enjoy this season! Overview Pastor and spiritual director Rich Johnson joins Deb Gregory for a conversation at the intersection of contemplation and action — a place often misunderstood, oversimplified, or treated as two separate paths. Drawing on Howard Thurman, African American approaches to spiritual formation, pietistic roots, and his experience leading a multiracial, justice‑oriented congregation, Rich explores how slowing down, listening deeply, and grounding ourselves in the divine voice becomes the wellspring for courageous, sustained action. Rich shares stories from his journey — from Morehouse College to planting Sanctuary Church — and invites us into a rhythm of discernment that harmonizes active love and deep reflection. Rich Johnson is the founding pastor of Sanctuary Columbus Church, a multiracial, justice‑oriented, contemplative Christian community. He is a spiritual director and the Director of the Weborg Center for Spiritual Direction at North Park Seminary. He is a lover of coffee, long walks, and a student of Howard Thurman’s wisdom on the inner life and social action. Use code IVPOD25 for 25% off Spiritual Wayfinding: 33 Walking Meditations for Navigating Life with Embodied Wisdom KEY THEMES: Contemplation as Paying Attention Rich defines contemplation as noticing where God is at work — in memory, in the body, in habits, in resistance, and in desire. It’s not passive. It’s an active inward movement that naturally leads outward into relationship and action. Action Emerging from the Inner Voice Rich shares how he began to burn out when he was “listening to every voice around me instead of the voice within.” Returning to the inner voice of God reshaped his leadership, his discernment, and his community’s justice work.  Belovedness as Identity and Communion Drawing on Henri Nouwen’s Life of the Beloved, Rich reflects on belovedness as the core of human identity — not just for the self, but for the community. Belovedness becomes the ground for how we show up, act, and extend ourselves to others. Pietism: Head and Heart Together Rich describes his Swedish‑Lutheran pietistic roots, where faith is not performative or rigid but relational and lived. Two guiding questions shape this tradition: Where is it written? How goes your walk with what you read? Communal Discernment Rich shares how Sanctuary Church practices discernment together — beginning with silence, naming interior movements, listening for the Spirit, and asking: What does the Lord require of us? This practice guides their justice work, including recent engagement with prison reform. The Missing Practice of Lament Rich names what many feel but rarely articulate: lament is missing from most spiritual‑discipline handbooks. In his community, lament is encouraged — shouting, grieving, protesting, naming what hurts. Lament becomes a way of gathering in grief and attuning to God’s heart. Coffee as Contemplative Practice Rich shares his morning ritual: a sensory grounding practice using the 5‑4‑3‑2‑1 method while holding a warm cup of coffee. It’s a way of awakening the senses to God before the day begins to pull them apart. Timestamps: 00:00 - Welcome and introduction to Rich Johnson’s journey of justice and contemplation 02:08 - The relationship between slowing down, attention, and God's activity in community 03:28 - How body synchronization and extended mind theory support communal discernment 05:23 - Grounding embodied discernment through sensory awareness and simple practices 09:41 - Defining contemplation and action: paying attention to where God is at work 11:47 - The necessity of integrating contemplation with active love, rooted in belovedness 14:10 - Exploring pietistic spirituality: connecting head, heart, and action 18:05 - Practical discernment: slowing down to navigate life’s decisions 20:40 - The power of silence and communal listening in strategic planning 24:37 - Engaging contemplative practices in social justice movements 27:23 - The spiritual discipline of lament and collective grief 29:04 - Discernment on justice issues: proximity, listening, and integrity 33:30 - The importance of patience, clarity, and listening in communal action 36:13 - Howard Thurman’s legacy, sacred spaces, and cultural expression in spirituality 40:48 - Transition from burnout to renewal: embodied listening as a form of healing 43:37 - What's next: integrating contemplative spirituality into training and community life 45:02 - Practicing silence and sensory awareness in monastery and everyday settings 50:55 - Recognizing divine life amid challenges: noticing the evergreen in grayness 52:44 - The call to follow the life within and around us—embodying hope and justice Resources & Links: Howard Thurman: Essential Writings Henry Nouwen: Life of the Beloved Howard Thurman House — Visiting the sacred space Gethsemane Monastery in Kentucky, exploring silence, community, and contemplative practice Where to Find Rich Johnson: Rich Johnson on Instagram Sanctuary Church Columbus Northern Seminary - Weborg Center

  7. Jul 28

    Episode 8 – The Easter Labyrinth: From Medieval Joy to Trauma Healing Through Embodied Prayer with Jill Geoffrion

    SPECIAL OFFER | As a listener of the show, you can get 25% off Deb Gregory's new book, Spiritual Wayfinding, by using the code IVPOD25 at checkout at ivpress.com. We hope you enjoy this season! In this episode, Deb Gregory speaks with theologian, photographer, and global labyrinth facilitator Dr. Jill Geoffrion, whose scholarship and ministry at Chartres Cathedral have shaped contemporary understanding of the labyrinth as a path of prayer. Jill’s work through Faith, Hope, and Love Global Ministries extends far beyond France, bringing labyrinth installations and healing practices to communities experiencing violence, displacement, and collective trauma. The conversation explores the sensory wisdom of embodied practice, the medieval Easter traditions of Chartres, the historical development of labyrinths in Christian contexts, and the surprising ways labyrinths create safe spaces for healing in places of suffering. Historical Background Labyrinths appear in Christian tradition as early as the fourth century, beginning with a repurposed Roman mosaic placed at the doorway of a North African cathedral in 324. Jill notes, “Anything that shows up in a cathedral has been around because it doesn’t get to the cathedral first.” By the ninth century, labyrinths appear in manuscripts; by the twelfth and thirteenth centuries, they are installed on cathedral floors in Italy and France, culminating in the large walkable labyrinth at Chartres Cathedral around 1220. Jill clarifies a common misconception: medieval pilgrims did not use labyrinths as substitutes for traveling to Jerusalem. “The first time we even hear of such an idea was in the eighteenth or nineteenth century,” she explains. Instead, labyrinths served primarily as liturgical tools for the cathedral community. Use code IVPOD25 for 25% off Spiritual Wayfinding: 33 Walking Meditations for Navigating Life with Embodied Wisdom In this episode: Jill's journey from scholarship to global healing initiatives with labyrinth installationsThe distinction between labyrinths and mazes, and why turning back on the path matters physically and psychologicallyHow labyrinths serve as containers for community and individual pilgrimage, especially in regions of traumaThe significance of the Chartres Cathedral labyrinth as a centuries-old testament to prayer, pilgrimage, and liturgical joyPractical tips for approaching a labyrinth intentionally, whether walking physically, tracing patterns, or imagining the pathThe profound connection between physical movement, sensory engagement, and spiritual/emotional healingThe surprising ways labyrinths have facilitated physical recovery—like Deb’s experience walking the labyrinth with a broken ankleHow the rhythms of play, spontaneity, and openness transform our experience of sacred practiceEmbracing the mystery: why the spiritual and physical impact of labyrinths remains partly beyond our understanding Resources & Links: Faith Hope and Love Global Ministries — Jill’s nonprofit for healing through labyrinthsLabyrinth Locator — Discover labyrinths worldwide and resources for practiceLauren Artress and Veriditas — Pioneers of labyrinth revitalization and trainingLabyrinth Patterns and Resources — Free downloadable labyrinth designsBook: "Spiritual Wayfinding" by Deb Gregory — Guide to embodied spiritual practices and labyrinthsResearch on Restorative Play with Matt Bloom Connect with Jill Jeffrion: LinkedInPersonal Website Final Reflection: Whether walking, tracing, or imagining, the labyrinth invites us into a sacred dance of opening, surrender, and discovery. Embrace the mystery, linger in stillness, and carry the peace of the journey into your daily life. Remember, each turn reflects a step closer to ourselves and to the divine shadows and light within. Music: Palms Down by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue) Faded Promises licensed through Soundstripe. Code: LUJWGE5LY2FBKNAT Closing Music: ⁠Roots by Ryvoli⁠

  8. Jul 14

    Episode 7 – Inside the Sensory Rich, Embodied Wisdom of Neurodivergent Spirituality with Josh Davis

    SPECIAL OFFER | As a listener of the show, you can get 25% off Deb Gregory's new book, Spiritual Wayfinding, by using the code IVPOD25 at checkout at ivpress.com. We hope you enjoy this season! Autistic pastor and spiritual director Josh Davis takes us inside the sensory‑rich, embodied wisdom of neurodivergent spirituality. He shares how his body processes emotional and sensory spikes, how stimming helps him settle, and why music has become his “heart language”—a place to regulate and commune with God without words. We explore the surge of surprise, the role of embodied prayer, and the spiritual depth that emerges when we honor the body’s way of knowing. Featuring selections from Josh’s own music throughout the episode.   In this episode: How surprise impacts emotional regulation and spiritual transformation, guided by research from “surpriseologists” Tania Luna and Leanne RenningerThe significance of the surprise regulation protocol: freeze, find, shift, and shareJosh’s embodied practices for connecting with God through sunlight, blessing, and sensory groundingThe nuances of masking versus unmasking, and the spiritual journey of owning neurodivergent traitsThe sacred role of music as a heart language that fosters divine communionChallenges and creative solutions for neurodivergent believers in church environmentsThe importance of cultivating spaces of authentic belonging and vulnerabilityHow imagination works differently in neurodivergence, including insights on aphantasia and alternative pathways to divine encounterPractical ways leaders and spiritual directors can validate diverse pathways to God and nurture neurodivergent giftsA guided reflection inspired by Psalm 34 to taste, see, hear, smell, and touch the goodness of GodTimestamps: (00:00) The power of surprise and its role in emotional and spiritual awakening (02:37) The surprise regulation protocol: freeze, find, shift, share (07:12) Embodied spiritual practices for regulation and connection (10:16) Understanding neurodivergence as creative diversity (17:12) How surprise amplifies emotions and how to cultivate grace (22:14) Neurodivergent experiences of church, worship, and belonging (28:04) The gifts of neurodivergent believers: diversity as divine design (30:42) The spiritual richness of the body and movement in Scripture and practice (35:24) The unmasking process: vulnerability, shame, and spiritual freedom (46:46) Imagining with and without visualization: a guide for spiritual growth (58:11) A simple embodied meditation to taste and see God’s goodness Resources & Links: Neurodivergent Faith PodcastSpiritual Wayfinding: 33 Walking Meditations for Navigating Life with Embodied Wisdom by Deborah GregoryPsalm 34 ScriptureSurprise by Tanya Luna & Leanne RennigerConnect with Josh Davis: Podcast: Neurodivergent Faith PodcastYouTube: Just Josh Davis (Autistic Pastor)  Facebook - Josh DavisInstagram -@autisticpastorMusic – Just Josh Davis on BandcampExtended Closing Meditation: Join Josh in this embodied reflection: pause, notice one sensory experience that signals God's goodness, and breathe in divine blessing. Feel free to adapt practices for your own body, soul, and context—trusting that transformation often begins in the surprise of simply showing up as ourselves. Music: Opening Music: Palms Down by Blue Dot Sessions Closing Song: "Roots" by Ryvoli Featured Songs by Josh Davis: What If, Desire

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This is a special, one-season release of the Betwixt Podcast from IVP author, Deb Gregory. To continue listening to the podcast after Episode 13, subscribe to the Betwixt Podcast here: Apple PodcastsSpotifyYouTubeSubstack Betwixt is a waypoint for spiritual wayfinders exploring the liminal passages that shape our lives. In each episode, Deb Gregory invites you into a grounded conversation and an embodied practice to help you navigate the spiritual life with intention and wisdom. If you’re seeking a steadier, more spacious way to walk with God, Betwixt is a companion for the journey.

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