Lessons I Learned in Law

Heriot Brown
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Scott Brown is a 'recovering lawyer'. Following years working in international law firms, Scott now runs Heriot Brown, a Legal Recruitment business. His extensive discussions with people across the legal profession have given him insight into what makes lawyers tick. Now, Scott shares those insights with you - to help you in your career. On each episode Scott invites guests to leave their egos at their door, share their professional successes and challenges, as well as the lessons they've learned in law. Presented by Scott Brown of Heriot Brown Legal Recruitment. Follow Heriot Brown:Twitter | LinkedIn | Facebook | Instagram

  1. Over-Communicate and Find a Way: Doug McClure on Legal Leadership in Defence at Northrop Grumman

    JUL 17

    Over-Communicate and Find a Way: Doug McClure on Legal Leadership in Defence at Northrop Grumman

    Doug McClure, Senior Counsel at Northrop Grumman, shares lessons learned from more than two decades of in-house practice across heavy industry, infrastructure, and now one of the world’s largest aerospace and defence contractors. Doug reflects on his eight years supporting Northrop Grumman’s European operations—navigating a highly regulated, high-stakes sector that demands clarity, trust, and creativity. He begins with the cornerstone of his approach: communication. Doug explains why over-communicating, building personal credibility, and managing expectations are non-negotiable for in-house lawyers, particularly when working across global teams and cultural contexts. His second lesson is all about solutions. Saying “no” is sometimes necessary, but more often than not, Doug argues, the real skill is finding a way forward—even if it means finding a “third way” that balances business ambition with risk. Finally, Doug talks about the importance of managing expectations: balancing competing priorities, under-promising and over-delivering, and ensuring stakeholders feel heard—especially in the high-pressure, fast-changing world of defence procurement. Guest Recommendations: • Podcast: The Rest is History – Doug particularly enjoyed the episode on Hannibal and the Battle of Cannae • Book: Sapiens by Yuval Noah Harari – An engrossing exploration of how humans have adapted and shaped the world About Heriot Brown: Heriot Brown is a leading global recruitment business specialising in the in-house legal market. We help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers by matching them with exceptional in-house opportunities, while fostering a thriving community of legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone curious about building an in-house career in a complex, regulated industry.

    31 min
  2. 🎙️ Make Your Boss Look Good: Nick Havers on Leadership, Curiosity and Visibility at Lockton

    JUL 10

    🎙️ Make Your Boss Look Good: Nick Havers on Leadership, Curiosity and Visibility at Lockton

    Nick Havers, General Counsel for Europe and now also Managing Principal at Lockton, the world’s largest privately owned insurance brokers, shares three sharp, experience-driven lessons shaped across more than a decade in the insurance broking sector.  Nick’s recent promotion to Managing Principal, an honour usually reserved for client-facing, revenue-generating leaders, is a milestone not just for him, but for how lawyers are recognised as true business partners at Lockton. His elevation sends a powerful message: in-house legal leaders can and should have a seat at the table, valued alongside commercial leadership.  Now sitting on the European Executive Committee of Lockton, Nick reflects on what it means to be a lawyer trusted by the business. He shares how his first in-house GC taught him the power of “making your boss look good”, a mindset rooted in empathy, clarity, and teamwork that has stayed with him ever since.  Nick also unpacks the value of curiosity: why asking more questions than you answer leads to better outcomes, how to build relationships across a complex organisation, and how his team uses internal branding and training to market legal’s value across the business.  In a standout final lesson, Nick reminds us that not everything valuable is visible. Some of legal’s best work is in the crises that never materialise. His advice on combining hard work with strategic messaging, and showing how your team contributes to long-term growth, is a masterclass in modern in-house leadership. Guest Recommendation: • Book: Authentic Happiness by Martin Seligman – A toolkit for optimism, self-awareness, and signature strengths About Heriot Brown: Heriot Brown is a leading global recruitment business specialising in the in-house legal market. We help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers by matching them with exceptional in-house opportunities, while fostering a thriving community of legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone growing their legal career in a complex, fast-moving business.

    46 min
  3. Focus on the stuff that matter: Law is Only Interesting to Lawyers: Pola Karolczyk on Communication, Courage and Career Shifts

    JUL 3

    Focus on the stuff that matter: Law is Only Interesting to Lawyers: Pola Karolczyk on Communication, Courage and Career Shifts

    Pola Karolczyk, General Counsel and Chief People Officer at Cowboy, joins Scott to share her dynamic legal journey: from competition law in Poland and US law firms, to regulatory work at Apple, and now building the legal and people functions at a fast-moving e-bike scaleup.  Pola reflects on three powerful lessons, beginning with the need to ditch legal jargon and speak human. She learned early on that most people, especially in business, aren’t interested in the mechanics of the law, just the outcome. This mindset has shaped her ability to communicate clearly, deliver pragmatic advice, and influence senior stakeholders across borders.  She also highlights the importance of developing leadership and commercial skills outside the comfort zone of technical legal work, drawing on her experiences in Big Law, Apple, and now Cowboy. Pola’s final lesson is one for ambitious lawyers: if you want to lead, don’t wait for calm conditions. Join a scaleup, stretch yourself, and learn on the edge.  Now wearing dual hats in legal and HR, Pola offers rare insight into what it means to shape culture and governance in parallel, and why reporting directly to the CEO matters.  Guest Recommendation:  • Podcast: Impact Theory with Tom Bilyeu - Practical strategies for personal and professional growth  About Heriot Brown:  At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.  Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone navigating the leap into leadership. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone navigating the leap into leadership.

    40 min
  4. 🎙️ Everything is Figureoutable: Tara Haig on Saying Yes, Showing Up, and Scaling as GC at Multiverse

    JUN 26

    🎙️ Everything is Figureoutable: Tara Haig on Saying Yes, Showing Up, and Scaling as GC at Multiverse

    Tara Haig, General Counsel at Multiverse, joins Scott to reflect on a legal career driven by curiosity, courage, and instinct. From saying yes to opening a New York office two years post-qualification to leading legal, privacy, and governance for one of the UK’s most prominent edtech scale-ups, Tara’s story is all about leaning into discomfort, and figuring it out along the way.  Now part of the exec team at Multiverse, a $1.7B AI-powered apprenticeship platform, Tara shares her take on three big lessons: embracing stretch opportunities (even when terrifying), understanding the commercial engine behind your business, and showing up with authenticity. Whether it’s tackling GDPR in lockdown, raising a SPAC, or managing legal complexity across Series A to D growth, she’s built a legal career that’s anything but linear.  This episode is a must-listen for anyone navigating scale-up chaos, growing their team, or trying to stay grounded while building something big. Tara also shares candid reflections on working from Kenya, raising twins, and why perspective, and permission to say no, is as important as saying yes.  Guest Recommendations: • Book: Invisible Women by Caroline Criado Perez • Podcast: Pivot with Kara Swisher & Scott Galloway • Podcast: The Rest is Politics  About Heriot Brown:  At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.  🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave us a review, or share it with a lawyer navigating the scale-up world.

    39 min
  5. 🎙️ Eat Your Own Dog Food: Shelley McKinley on AI, Ambiguity, and Owning the Grey Areas

    JUN 19

    🎙️ Eat Your Own Dog Food: Shelley McKinley on AI, Ambiguity, and Owning the Grey Areas

    Shelley McKinley, Chief Legal Officer at GitHub and Vice President at Microsoft, joins Scott to share career-defining lessons from two decades at the sharp edge of tech, innovation, and regulation.  Now leading GitHub’s global legal, policy, and trust teams, Shelley offers a behind-the-scenes look at the early days of GitHub Copilot, launched before ChatGPT put generative AI on the map, and shares what it really means to advise on emerging technology when the law hasn’t caught up yet. She talks candidly about navigating ambiguity, making smart bets in fast-moving industries, and how the best legal advice can’t be given in a vacuum.  Shelley’s lessons cover how to lead in-house teams with the right mix of legal and non-legal expertise, how to focus on high-impact work in a sea of meetings, and why building strong internal networks is a non-negotiable skill for modern legal leaders. Her reflections are sharp, grounded, and refreshingly honest, touching on everything from grunge music to paralegal strategy, Microsoft’s legal transformation, and the FUD-to-FOMO evolution of AI.  Guest Recommendations: • Podcast: Acquired — Particularly the Spotify and Microsoft episodes • Book: The Meditating Mother by Laura Kopchick — A quirky short story collection written by Shelley’s college friend (https://www.amazon.com/Meditating-Mother-Laura-Kopchick/dp/1962148157)  About Heriot Brown:  At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.  🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone curious about leading in tech, AI, or global legal teams.

    46 min

  6. JUN 12

    🎙️ Forget the Patriarchy and Other Lessons in Leadership – Sam Plant, CLO at Müller UK*

    Sam Plant, Chief Legal Officer at Müller UK & Ireland, brings a refreshing mix of humility, insight and honesty to this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law. From risk-taking in legal advice to speaking up about gender inequality, Sam shares three candid lessons that challenge the status quo. Leading the legal and compliance function across one of the UK’s best-known consumer brands—yoghurts, milk, desserts, and a vast B2B logistics network—Sam reflects on a career shaped as much by mistakes as by milestones. He explains why embracing the right kind of mistake can sharpen commercial judgement, and why lawyers who never get it wrong may be playing it too safe. Sam also offers a counterpoint to the classic “say yes to everything” career advice. In his view, learning to say no—to roles, responsibilities, and scope creep—is essential for long-term success and team wellbeing. In a standout third lesson, Sam shares how he became more aware of his own privilege and began advocating for gender equity in law and beyond. His honest reflections on male allyship, everyday bias, and building trust with women in the profession are as powerful as they are practical. Guest Recommendations: • Book: Doppelganger by Naomi Klein • Podcast: Origin Story by Ian Dunt and Dorian Lynskey About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with a colleague—especially those who want to lead with empathy, courage, and clarity.

    1h 4m

  7. JUN 5

    🎙️ Be Liquid, Fill Gaps: David Flavell on Global Experience and Strategic Influence at PepsiCo

    David Flavell, General Counsel and Corporate Secretary at PepsiCo, shares practical, hard-earned insights from a legal career that has spanned the globe—from Melbourne to Shanghai, Dubai to New York—culminating in one of the most senior legal roles in the Fortune 50. Now leading a global legal function of 500+ professionals, David speaks candidly about how in-house lawyers can step into a more strategic mindset. He explains why legal leaders must go beyond technical skill and embrace being seen as commercial operators—riding potato trucks (literally), working side-by-side with business teams, and asking the questions no one expects lawyers to ask: “How’s the business doing?” David unpacks what it really means to be a strategic partner, how to balance legal risk with business ambition, and why “being liquid and filling the gaps” is one of the most valuable habits a legal leader can develop. From navigating cultural differences to crisis management and AI readiness, this episode is packed with practical guidance for lawyers who want to lead, not just advise. About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave us a review, or share it with someone navigating global legal leadership.

    1h 6m

  8. MAY 28

    🎙️ Trust Your Gut: Jorrit de Haan on Building Legal from Scratch at Mollie

    Jorrit de Haan, General Counsel and Corporate Secretary at Mollie, joins Scott to share the honest highs and hidden challenges of building an in-house legal function from the ground up. Jorrit stepped into his first GC role at Mollie in 2021, tasked with transforming a handful of lawyers working reactively into a fully-fledged legal team. In this conversation, he shares the leadership lessons he’s learned along the way—starting with the golden rule that you can’t spend too much time on hiring. From trusting your gut when bringing people in, to protecting team culture and avoiding the “department of no” trap, Jorrit lays out what it really takes to build a trusted, high-performing legal function in a fast-paced fintech. He also opens up about his own career path—from private practice to interim roles—and why it took trying a few things before landing in the GC seat, the role that fits him best. Along the way, you’ll hear why Harlan’s Razor (“never attribute to malice what you can attribute to incompetence”) has become one of his guiding leadership principles. About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with a colleague navigating their own in-house leadership journey.

    44 min
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About

Scott Brown is a 'recovering lawyer'. Following years working in international law firms, Scott now runs Heriot Brown, a Legal Recruitment business. His extensive discussions with people across the legal profession have given him insight into what makes lawyers tick. Now, Scott shares those insights with you - to help you in your career. On each episode Scott invites guests to leave their egos at their door, share their professional successes and challenges, as well as the lessons they've learned in law. Presented by Scott Brown of Heriot Brown Legal Recruitment. Follow Heriot Brown:Twitter | LinkedIn | Facebook | Instagram

Information

  • Creator
    Heriot Brown
  • Years Active
    2021 - 2025
  • Episodes
    98
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © 2025 Heriot Brown
  • Show Website
    Lessons I Learned in Law