Marketing Without Rules

Lewis Vandervalk
  • 5.0 (3)
  • MARKETING
  • UPDATED WEEKLY

Marketing Without Rules is your go-to podcast for breaking free from the confines of traditional marketing. Hosted by Lewis Vandervalk, this show throws out the rulebook and embraces creativity, boldness, and unconventional thinking. Each episode dives into the uncharted territory of marketing strategies that don’t follow the norm – and that’s exactly the point. From disruptive tactics to real-world examples, interviews with industry rebels, and off-the-wall ideas, the podcast is for anyone tired of playing it safe. Whether you're a marketer, entrepreneur, or business owner, tune in!

  1. MWR #51 - How AI Phone Assistants Can Capture 60% More Leads for Service Businesses with John Cody

    12/23/2025

    MWR #51 - How AI Phone Assistants Can Capture 60% More Leads for Service Businesses with John Cody

    In this episode of Marketing Without Rules, Lewis Vandervalk sits down with John Cody, founder of Trailblaze AI and Social Spike, who has helped clients add over $20 million in new revenue by solving the critical problem of missed calls and slow response times.  John shares his entrepreneurial journey from creating nutrition apps in 2012 to launching his agency just weeks before COVID, and how he discovered that even successful marketing campaigns were leaving six figures on the table when businesses couldn't handle the influx of leads. He reveals how Trailblaze AI was born from this pain point, creating voice and text AI assistants that answer calls 24/7, qualify prospects, and book appointments directly into calendars.  During a live demonstration, John's AI assistant "Michelle" calls Lewis in real-time, showcasing how the system scrapes website information to provide personalized responses and guide prospects through the sales process. John explains that 60% of conversions happen after hours when traditional businesses are closed, and shares case studies showing 25-30% increases in booked appointments.  The conversation covers advanced SEO strategies using AI for competitor research, Reddit scraping for user-generated content insights, and how AI can research competitors' reviews to identify pain points. John emphasizes the transparency of telling callers they're speaking with an AI assistant, noting that customers are simply grateful someone picked up the phone after calling multiple competitors.  He discusses the future of AI-to-AI communication, where Google's AI will book appointments with business AI assistants, and how being available 24/7 can improve Google My Business rankings and local SEO performance. Try Trailblazeai.ca live - https://chat.trailblazeai.ca/  Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction to Marketing Without Rules 02:40 John's entrepreneurial journey: From nutrition apps to AI solutions 04:40 The problem: Successful marketing campaigns leaving money on the table 06:13 What Trailblaze AI does: Voice and text AI assistants for businesses 11:20 Live demo setup: Testing the AI assistant in real-time 18:28 AI for SEO: Using artificial intelligence for competitor research 22:52 Reddit scraping: Mining user questions for content strategy 25:23 Live AI demonstration: Michelle calls Lewis on air 27:15 Transparency in AI: Why telling customers it's AI works better 31:21 After-hours advantage: 60% of conversions happen outside business hours 34:45 Case studies: 25-30% increases in booked appointments 38:42 SEO benefits: 24/7 availability improving Google My Business rankings 40:15 The future: AI-to-AI communication and Google booking integration 42:42 Pricing and getting started with Trailblaze AI Visit BlueCrocus.ca if you have marketing questions you need help with!

    45 min
  2. MWR #50 - How to Be Unforgettable & What Most Salespeople Get Wrong About Cold Outreach with Dale Dupree

    12/19/2025

    MWR #50 - How to Be Unforgettable & What Most Salespeople Get Wrong About Cold Outreach with Dale Dupree

    In this episode of Marketing Without Rules, host Lewis Vandervalk interviews Dale Dupree, the renegade behind the Sales Rebellion who proves that authenticity outperforms tactics every time.  Dale shares his unconventional journey from heavy metal band frontman to copier salesman to sales coach, revealing how he developed his signature "crumpled letter" strategy after being told to "F off" by a prospect. He discusses his most audacious tactics including exploding toner bottles, empty donut boxes with lipstick-written notes, and foam bricks for "copier repair," explaining how these experiential approaches get prospects calling him back from parking lots. Dale emphasizes that creativity isn't about being weird—it's about being genuinely human in a robotic sales world. He challenges listeners to find their own version of the crumpled letter by identifying what they fix, understanding their prospects' daily frustrations, and creating memorable moments that break through the monotony.  This episode is packed with actionable strategies for anyone ready to abandon traditional cold calling and embrace bold, relationship-building outreach. Connect with Dale Dupree: Website: https://www.salesrebellion.com/ Crumpled Letter Templates: https://icrumpledletter.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/copierwarrior/  Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction to Marketing Without Rules 01:20 Meet Dale Dupree: From Heavy Metal to Sales Rebellion 02:29 The Non-Traditional Journey: Band to Copiers 03:56 Birth of the Copier Warrior Brand 06:12 Exploding Toner Bottles and Unhinged Marketing 08:14 The Crumpled Letter Origin Story 11:45 Why Nobody Likes Cold Calls (Even Cold Callers) 14:58 The Empty Donut Box That Changed Everything 19:37 Getting Called Back from the Parking Lot 21:49 Resources and Templates at Sales Rebellion 23:40 Success Stories Across Industries 24:36 Finding Your Creative Voice in Sales 25:57 The Analytical Approach to Creative Outreach 28:09 The Baseball Bat and Foam Brick Strategies 31:54 Why This Approach Takes Commitment and Risk 35:12 The Three Sections of Your Motivation Day 37:22 Final Challenge: Be a Hunter, Not a Gatherer Visit BlueCrocus.ca if you have marketing questions you need help with!

    38 min
  3. MWR #49 - What Most Contractors Get Wrong About Scaling (& How to Rebuild) with Greg Wilkes

    12/12/2025

    MWR #49 - What Most Contractors Get Wrong About Scaling (& How to Rebuild) with Greg Wilkes

    In this episode of Marketing Without Rules, host Lewis Vandervalk interviews Greg Wilkes, multi-award-winning construction business coach and author of "Building Your Future."  Greg shares the raw story of how his successful 7-figure construction business collapsed overnight due to scaling without proper systems, including hiring disasters like an alcoholic employee and a project manager who coached clients to break contracts. After losing everything, Greg rebuilt from zero to 1.5 million in under 12 months using a refined 5-step framework covering planning, marketing, sales conversion, delivery, and scaling.  He reveals why most contractors target the wrong clients (homeowners instead of architects), the critical difference between margin and markup that cost him tens of thousands, and his AI-powered hiring system that prevents costly people mistakes.  Greg emphasizes the power of outbound marketing, human connections over automation, and the importance of leveling up project values rather than just adding volume when scaling. Connect with Greg Wilkes: Get his free book "Building Your Future": https://www.developcoaching.co.uk/building-your-future.pdf Website: https://www.developcoaching.co.uk/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/greg-wilkes/ Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction to Marketing Without Rules 01:01 Greg Wilkes' Background and Business Journey 02:52 When Everything Burnt to the Ground - The Perfect Storm 06:45 Hiring Disasters: The Alcoholic Employee Story 09:12 The Unscrupulous Project Manager Who Stole Contracts 11:54 Pricing Mistakes: Margin vs Markup Explained 14:56 The Decision to Rebuild and Start Again 17:23 Zero to 1.5 Million in 12 Months - Doing It Right 19:27 The Five-Step Framework for Construction Success 20:51 Attracting the Right Talent to Your Business 22:01 Using AI to Revolutionize Your Hiring Process 23:33 The 30-60-90 Day Onboarding System 25:04 Setting KPIs and Calibration Sessions 28:13 Marketing Strategy: Why Architects Are Your Real Clients 31:13 The Donut and Gin Strategy for Warming Up Prospects 33:39 Scaling Smart: Bigger Projects vs More Volume 36:12 Essential Books for Construction Entrepreneurs 38:45 Podcasts and Staying Current with AI 40:21 The One Thing That Makes the Biggest Difference Visit BlueCrocus.ca if you have marketing questions you need help with!

    41 min
  4. MWR #48 - How to Build Million-Dollar Relationships in Demolition with Kevin Wiley

    12/05/2025

    MWR #48 - How to Build Million-Dollar Relationships in Demolition with Kevin Wiley

    In this episode of Marketing Without Rules, Lewis Vandervalk sits down with Kevin Wiley, a relationship broker and founder of Demolition Group of America, who has built a multi-million dollar consulting business by mastering the art of face-to-face networking in the construction industry.  Kevin shares the legendary "donut strategy" passed down from his father, known as "the donut man," who never made appointments but simply showed up at client offices with donuts, leading to deals worth millions of dollars. Kevin reveals how he scaled this approach to build relationships across the country, from walking into Arco Murray's Chicago office with premium donuts to flying to Baltimore just for dinner meetings that resulted in major contracts. He explains his systematic approach to relationship building, including sending 2,000 monthly emails globally, using custom sports jerseys as memorable gifts, and leveraging sticky notes with company logos to stay top-of-mind with decision makers.  The conversation covers Kevin's transition from ironworker to relationship broker during COVID, how he formed Demolition Group of America by connecting his 35 years of industry relationships with top demolition companies nationwide, and his philosophy of collaboration over competition. Kevin emphasizes the power of consistency, transparency, and old-school values in an increasingly digital world, sharing specific tactics like lunch-and-learns, sporting events, and personalized swag that have generated millions in revenue.  He also discusses the importance of safety in demolition work, emerging opportunities in data centers and renewable energy infrastructure, and his company's expansion into global markets including Europe and disaster relief areas. Connect with Kevin here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevin-wiley-9b84b6134/ Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction to Marketing Without Rules 02:04 The donut strategy: How Kevin's father built relationships without appointments 04:05 Building Demolition Group of America during COVID with 35 years of relationships 06:09 Walking into Arco Murray: Turning donuts into million-dollar deals 07:32 The systematic approach: 2,000 monthly emails and consistent follow-up 11:35 Face-to-face connections: Why personal meetings beat digital outreach 13:47 Collaboration over competition: How to profit from jobs outside your scope 17:51 Public vs. private sector: Why relationships matter more in private work 20:45 The power of swag: Custom jerseys, sticky notes, and memorable gifts 21:28 Turning consistency into a systematic process 22:35 Rapid fire insights: Communication, bidding mistakes, and starting over 25:43 Global expansion: From Chicago to Europe and disaster relief 27:48 Tunnel to Towers fundraiser: Giving back to veterans and community 30:21 Old school values vs. digital generation in construction 33:32 Safety first: Why demolition requires constant vigilance 35:52 Coolest projects and final advice: Love what you do Visit BlueCrocus.ca if you have marketing questions you need help with!

    39 min
  5. MWR #47 - How Service Businesses Can Use High-Value Incentives to Stop Competing on Price with John Dwyer

    11/25/2025

    MWR #47 - How Service Businesses Can Use High-Value Incentives to Stop Competing on Price with John Dwyer

    In this episode of Marketing Without Rules, Lewis Vandervalk sits down with John Dwyer, a direct response marketing expert from Australia who has spent decades helping businesses break free from price-based competition through creative incentive strategies.  John shares the legendary story of how he convinced Jerry Seinfeld to become the spokesperson for an Australian bank's "get a home loan, get a free vacation" campaign, which resulted in the bank tripling their home loans within the first year while never advertising interest rates. He reveals his "Happy Meal Toy" philosophy; the same principle McDonald's uses with low-cost, high-perceived-value incentives that take customers' eyes off price.  John demonstrates how service businesses can implement this strategy, sharing case studies including a turf farm that sold out of grass in six days by offering premium beer with purchases, and a hardware store that doubled revenue competing directly against a massive chain store using vacation incentives.  The conversation covers his Facebook contest formula that generates hundreds of qualified leads for as little as $30 per day, including the "Ugliest Back Fence Contest" that produced six months of hot leads in three days for an aluminum fence company. John explains how his vacation incentive program works, offering $1,000+ value vacations for $50 cost, and how businesses can use these as both lead generation tools and conversion closers.  Throughout the episode, he emphasizes that successful marketing isn't about having the best product or lowest price… it's about creating irresistible offers that make price irrelevant. Resources Discussed on the Episode: https://theinstituteofwow.com/ https://vacationsincentive.com/ https://fbcontestblueprint.com/ https://bookofwow.com/ Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction to Marketing Without Rules 01:07 Direct response vs. traditional advertising: The calamari principle 05:31 The Jerry Seinfeld bank campaign: Chasing a celebrity for six months 12:15 The Happy Meal Toy philosophy: Low cost, high perceived value 18:26 How persistence and a bad Crocodile Dundee accent landed Seinfeld 22:27 Case study: The turf farm that ran out of grass in six days 25:38 Why the most expensive bank in Australia never advertised rates 28:45 The vacation incentive program: $50 cost, $1,000+ value 32:20 Facebook contest formula: 900+ leads for $200 spend 38:15 The hardware store vs. Bunnings: David beats Goliath 41:10 Real estate revolution: Personalized home valuations 43:11 Final advice: Never compete on price, always add value Visit BlueCrocus.ca if you have marketing questions you need help with!

    44 min
  6. MWR #46 - How to Get More Customers Through Referrals for Service Businesses with Kendall Hines

    11/07/2025

    MWR #46 - How to Get More Customers Through Referrals for Service Businesses with Kendall Hines

    In this episode of Marketing Without Rules, Lewis Vandervalk sits down with Kendall Hines, co-founder and CEO of Clicki, who transformed his family's struggling lawn care business from 90 customers to over 2,000 customers and nearly $1 million in revenue within six years and then went on to start a software company changing the game for business referrals.   Kendall shares his journey from building his first software solution out of necessity (Lawn Bot, which was acquired by Real Green and later WorkWave) to creating Clicki, a referral platform that automates the entire referral process for service businesses. He reveals how rising digital advertising costs on Google, Facebook, and platforms like HomeAdvisor are forcing small businesses to pay $100-400 per customer acquisition, eating into profits and growth potential.  Kendall demonstrates Clicky's automated system that sends referral invitations immediately after job completion, tracks referrals through CRM integration, and handles payouts automatically via Venmo, Cash App, Amazon gift cards, or Visa cards.  The conversation covers building B2B partner programs with real estate agents and other complementary businesses, the new mobile-optimized promoter app with magic links that eliminate login friction, and strategies for creating omnipresent marketing campaigns. Kendall emphasizes the importance of systematic approaches to growth, sharing how one client reached $650K in revenue in their first year spending $0 on traditional digital advertising by focusing entirely on referrals and community marketing. Interested in seeing if Clicki is the right fit for your business? Click here to book a demo (& snag a $50 gift card) Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction to Marketing Without Rules 02:31 Kendall's journey: From lawn care technician to software entrepreneur 05:27 Building and selling Lawn Bot to Real Green/WorkWave 07:03 The referral problem: Why most programs fail 09:13 How Clicki automates the entire referral process 13:18 Live demo: Setting up referrals for Joe's Junk Removal 17:28 Building B2B partner programs with real estate agents 19:37 The new promoter app: Mobile-first referral experience 22:37 Tracking, leaderboards, and gamifying referrals 24:57 Magic links: Eliminating friction in the referral process 28:45 Overcoming objections: Why referrals matter for growth 31:07 Building omnipresent marketing across multiple channels 32:22 Year-end planning: Reverse engineering your growth goals 34:18 Final thoughts and getting started with Clicki Visit BlueCrocus.ca if you have marketing questions you need help with!

    35 min
  7. MWR #45: How to Build Customer Loyalty Through Consistent Email Marketing for Service Businesses with Marc Mawhinney

    10/29/2025

    MWR #45: How to Build Customer Loyalty Through Consistent Email Marketing for Service Businesses with Marc Mawhinney

    In this episode of Marketing Without Rules, Lewis Vandervalk reconnects with Marc Mawhinney, a lifelong entrepreneur who has been helping coaches get more clients since 2014 and hosts the Natural Born Coaches Podcast with over 900 episodes.  Marc reveals his remarkable consistency strategy of sending daily emails for over 8 years without missing a single day, explaining why most entrepreneurs fail at email marketing by putting all their effort into one weekly email that gets lost in busy inboxes. He breaks down his systematic approach to content creation, including batching emails three weeks in advance and repurposing content across multiple platforms to cut through the noise of the online space.  The conversation covers Marc's evolution from real estate to coaching, his innovative flat-fee joint venture model that has generated consistent revenue streams, and his philosophy on handling criticism and building resilience in business. Marc shares his three critical questions every entrepreneur must answer for guaranteed success: who do you help, how do you help them, and where do you find them. He also discusses the retirement of his 92-month Secret Coach Club newsletter, creative business ideas from golf ball diving to pizza box innovations, and his approach to building authentic relationships rather than high-pressure sales tactics.  Throughout the episode, Marc emphasizes the compound effect of small daily actions over sporadic bursts of effort, providing practical frameworks for sustainable business growth that service business owners can apply to build lasting customer relationships. Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction to Marketing Without Rules 02:33 Marc's journey from real estate to coaching since 2014 06:47 The power of daily email consistency (8+ years without missing a day) 09:28 Why repetition works: The Guy Kawasaki Facebook experiment 11:11 Navigating social media algorithms and engagement challenges 12:05 The three questions for guaranteed business success 16:45 Secret Coach Club: 92 months of newsletter publishing 19:53 Flat-fee joint venture model and partnership strategies 22:58 Community building: The Coaching Jungle VIP program 24:40 Creative business ideas and thinking outside the box 30:15 Golf ball diving business and insurance strategies 34:16 The Alter Ego Effect and performance psychology 39:49 Final advice on authenticity and avoiding online BS Visit BlueCrocus.ca if you have marketing questions you need help with!

    46 min
  8. MWR #44: How to Hire Peak Performers by Putting Your Skunks on the Table with Kasim Aslam

    10/17/2025

    MWR #44: How to Hire Peak Performers by Putting Your Skunks on the Table with Kasim Aslam

    In this episode of Marketing Without Rules, Lewis Vandervalk sits down with Kasim Aslam, serial entrepreneur who built and sold Solutions Eight (the world's #1 ranked Google Ads agency) for eight figures to a SoftBanc-backed company.  Kasim reveals why most service business owners struggle with hiring and retention, sharing his counterintuitive approach that peak performers care more about growth than compensation once financially satisfied. He walks through his proven 7-step hiring system that has helped him build six multimillion-dollar businesses, including how to create job postings that attract top talent, implement "flytraps" to filter thousands of applicants down to the best candidates, and run trial projects that reveal true performance before making hiring decisions.  Kasim introduces his "Black Box Delegation" framework for managing high performers without micromanaging, explaining why the traditional approach of trying to "retain" top talent is backwards, instead focusing on creating a flywheel that benefits from peak performers while they're with you.  The conversation also covers the emerging field of Answer Engine Optimization (AEO) and how local service businesses can leverage authority-based content strategies. Throughout the episode, Kasim emphasizes treating employees as "miracles" rather than commodities, sharing real examples from his agency where individual employees managed 40% of revenue and became millionaires through equity partnerships. Get Kasim's Free Hiring Book: https://thehirebook.com/#section-IHYOSLuNCP Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction to Marketing Without Rules 02:24 Kasim's background: From $100M Google Ads agency to serial entrepreneur 04:17 The power of collecting books as "traps for future learning" 07:17 Why service business owners struggle with hiring and delegation 12:45 The Pareto Principle in hiring: Finding your 20% peak performers 18:30 Why peak performers choose growth over compensation 22:15 The flywheel approach to top talent retention 25:19 Step 1-2: Mindset shift and creating irresistible job postings 27:19 Step 3: Distribution strategy for maximum applicant flow 29:08 Step 4-5: Flytraps and trial projects to filter candidates 35:00 Step 6: Interview techniques that prevent future complaints 37:09 Step 7: Onboarding for peak performance from day one 40:45 The Black Box Delegation framework 44:49 Answer Engine Optimization (AEO) for local service businesses 48:33 Final thoughts and resources Visit BlueCrocus.ca if you have marketing questions you need help with!

    49 min
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Ratings & Reviews

5
out of 5
3 Ratings

About

Marketing Without Rules is your go-to podcast for breaking free from the confines of traditional marketing. Hosted by Lewis Vandervalk, this show throws out the rulebook and embraces creativity, boldness, and unconventional thinking. Each episode dives into the uncharted territory of marketing strategies that don’t follow the norm – and that’s exactly the point. From disruptive tactics to real-world examples, interviews with industry rebels, and off-the-wall ideas, the podcast is for anyone tired of playing it safe. Whether you're a marketer, entrepreneur, or business owner, tune in!

Information

  • Creator
    Lewis Vandervalk
  • Years Active
    2024 - 2025
  • Episodes
    51
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © Lewis Vandervalk
  • Show Website
    Marketing Without Rules