57 episodes

Ramblings about W. Edwards Deming in the digital transformation era. The general idea of the podcast is derived from Dr. Demming's seminal work described in his New Economics book - System of Profound Knowledge ( SoPK ). We'll try and get a mix of interviews from IT, Healthcare, and Manufacturing with the goal of aligning these ideas with Digital Transformation possibilities. Everything related to Dr. Deming's ideas is on the table (e.g., Goldratt, C.I. Lewis, Ohno, Shingo, Lean, Agile, and DevOps).

Profound John Willis

    • Business
    • 5.0 • 3 Ratings

Ramblings about W. Edwards Deming in the digital transformation era. The general idea of the podcast is derived from Dr. Demming's seminal work described in his New Economics book - System of Profound Knowledge ( SoPK ). We'll try and get a mix of interviews from IT, Healthcare, and Manufacturing with the goal of aligning these ideas with Digital Transformation possibilities. Everything related to Dr. Deming's ideas is on the table (e.g., Goldratt, C.I. Lewis, Ohno, Shingo, Lean, Agile, and DevOps).

    S4 E8 - Bill Bellows - Unveiling the Spectrum of System Thinking Part 1

    S4 E8 - Bill Bellows - Unveiling the Spectrum of System Thinking Part 1

    In the first part of a two-part series with Bill Bellows, we delve deep into the essence of system thinking and its pivotal role in shaping organizations. Bellows leads us on a journey exploring the nuanced differences between 'Red Pen' and 'Blue Pen' organizations, and beyond, into the realms of 'Me' versus 'We' and the collective impact of every straw on the camel's back.
    Bellows opens the discussion with his famous 'Red Pen Blue Pen' exercise, a metaphorical exploration that distinguishes two types of organizations based on quality and system thinking. He illustrates how small details, like the ease of cap removal on pens, can symbolize the deeper operational philosophies and outcomes of organizations. This exercise not only serves as a tool for introspection but also highlights the broader implications of systemic thinking in operational excellence.


    Expanding further, Bellows introduces the concepts of 'Me' versus 'We' and the allegory of the last straw, pushing us to contemplate the collective responsibility versus individual blame within organizational contexts. Through these discussions, he underscores the importance of a systemic perspective that fosters collaboration, continuous improvement, and a shared understanding of goals and challenges.

    You can find Bill Bellows on LinkedIn here:
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/bill-bellows-218435/

    • 55 min
    S4 E7 - Dave Nave - Engineering Quality and Transformation with Deming's Legacy

    S4 E7 - Dave Nave - Engineering Quality and Transformation with Deming's Legacy

    In this episode of the Profound Podcast, I had the pleasure of engaging with Dave Nave, a multifaceted expert with a rich background in engineering, quality improvement, and business management consulting. Through his work and studies, Nave has delved deep into W. Edwards Deming's philosophies, applying these principles across various sectors with notable emphasis on manufacturing.
    Our conversation explored Nave's initial skepticism towards quality improvement methodologies and his transformative encounter with Deming's teachings. Nave vividly described his early career experiences, where he challenged the concepts of process variability and predictability, only to find empirical evidence that humbled his perspective. This journey led him to embrace Deming's methodologies, seeking further education and eventually contributing to quality improvement initiatives in the defense industry and beyond.


    Nave's experiences with the Deming Scholars MBA program at Fordham University stood out as a pivotal moment in his career. Immersed in Deming's teachings, he gained insights from esteemed professors and applied these lessons to real-world challenges. His anecdotes about the practical applications of Deming's principles, especially in the context of manufacturing assembly lines and quality control, were particularly enlightening.


    The conversation also touched upon the challenges and nuances of implementing quality improvement methodologies within organizations. Nave shared stories from his consulting work, highlighting the importance of systemic thinking and the pitfalls of siloed approaches to process improvement.

    Dave Nave's LinkedIn can be found below:
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/davenave/

    • 1 hr 5 min
    S4 E6 - Dr. Khai Minh Pham - Redefining Our Understanding of AI

    S4 E6 - Dr. Khai Minh Pham - Redefining Our Understanding of AI

    In this episode of Profound,  I talk with Dr. Khai Minh Pham, whose unique approach to artificial intelligence challenges conventional paradigms and opens new frontiers in AI research and application. Dr. Pham, with his extensive background in both medicine and artificial intelligence, shares his journey towards creating a distinctive AI framework that prioritizes knowledge over data, steering clear of the traditional data-centric methodologies that dominate the field.
    Dr. Pham recounts his early realization of the limitations inherent in human cognitive processes and how this propelled him to explore AI as a means to augment human memory and decision-making capabilities. 


    Central to this episode is Dr. Pham's critique of the prevailing AI models that rely heavily on data processing and pattern recognition. He introduces his concept of "macro connectionist AI," a system that mimics human reasoning more closely by forming high-level knowledge representations rather than merely processing data inputs. This approach, according to Dr. Pham, not only enhances AI's problem-solving capabilities but also significantly reduces the computational resources required, challenging the current industry trend towards increasingly complex and energy-intensive AI systems.

    you can find Dr. Pham's LinkedIn below:
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/khai-minh-pham/

    • 53 min
    S4 E5 - Richard Steele - Navigating Cultural Shifts with Deming's Philosophy

    S4 E5 - Richard Steele - Navigating Cultural Shifts with Deming's Philosophy

    In this episode of the Profound Podcast, I engage in an insightful conversation with Richard Steele, founder and president of Peeker Services. We explore his journey from rebuilding locomotives to embracing W. Edwards Deming's principles, leading to a radical change in his company's management practices, particularly around performance appraisals and bonus systems. Steele shares transformative moments, like presenting his new pay program to the Detroit Deming study group, including Dr. Deming himself, and the eventual transition of his company into an employee-owned structure. The dialogue delves into the practical applications of Deming's theories in the workplace, the power of collective problem-solving, and the importance of fostering a culture of learning and adaptation. Finally, we take a look at some of Dick's critiques of Deming's Journey to Profound Knowledge.
    Steele's narrative demonstrates a successful integration of system thinking and the profound impact of shifting from traditional merit pay to a more inclusive and equitable model, redefining quality and performance metrics within his organization.

    Richard's LinkedIn can be found here:
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-steele-6586477/

    • 43 min
    S4 E4 - Bill Bellows - Unraveling Complexity in Safety and Quality Part 2

    S4 E4 - Bill Bellows - Unraveling Complexity in Safety and Quality Part 2

     In part two of their discussion, John Willis engages in a deep dive with Bill Bellows on the multifaceted world of safety, quality, and systems thinking. Inspired by the pioneering work of Sydney Decker, Dr. Woods, and Erik Hollnagel, they explore the nuanced perspectives on safety and quality that transcend conventional understanding.
    John and Bill navigate the intricate connections between thoroughness, efficiency, and effectiveness, drawing parallels to the foundational principles of Deming and Ackoff. They dissect the Efficiency-Thoroughness Trade-Off (ETTO) principle introduced by Hollnagel, pondering its implications in the context of operational safety and quality management.
    The conversation further delves into Russ Ackoff’s insights on systems thinking, the DIKW (Data, Information, Knowledge, Wisdom) model, and the profound impact of understanding complex systems on improving organizational outcomes. Bill shares anecdotes from his experiences, illustrating the practical application of these concepts in real-world settings, including his work at Rocketdyne and with the Deming community.

    Bill's LinkedIn can be found here:
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/bill-bellows-218435/

    Show Notes:
    1) Ackoff videos on Deming Cooperative, https://demingcooperative.org/ackoffvideos/
    2) Ackoff on DIKUW - article, https://faculty.ung.edu/kmelton/Documents/DataWisdom.pdf
    3) Ackoff on DIKUW - video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzS5V5-0VsA&t=21s 
    3) Deming and Ackoff - excerpts of Volume 21 of the Deming Library, ("A Theory of a System for Educators and Managers”),https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MJ3lGJ4OFo 
    4) Deming and Ackoff - transcript of full recorded of Volume 21 of the Deming Library ,https://ackoffcenter.blogs.com/ackoff_center_weblog/2011/04/a-converstaion-between-russell-ackoff-and-edward-deming.html
    5) Ackoff - Memories, https://www.amazon.com/Memories-Hardcover-Collectors-Russell-Ackoff/dp/0956537995
    6) Ackoff - Differences That Make a Difference, https://www.amazon.com/Differences-that-Make-Difference-Distinctions/dp/1908009012/ 

    • 40 min
    S4 E3 - Bill Bellows - Navigating Organizations Through a Systems Lens Part 1

    S4 E3 - Bill Bellows - Navigating Organizations Through a Systems Lens Part 1

    In this episode, I sit down once again with Bill Bellows to explore the interconnected nature of quality thinking. Our conversation ventures beyond traditional boundaries, drawing on Bill's unique insights into systemic thinking and its implications for organizational excellence.
    We delve into the philosophy of interconnectedness, illustrating how quality extends far beyond the superficial, embedding itself into every facet of production and service. Bill shares enlightening perspectives on the importance of viewing organizations as whole systems, where every element is interrelated and changes in one part can ripple through others.

    Bill's LinkedIn can be found here:
    https://www.linkedin.com/in/bill-bellows-218435/


    Show Notes:
    1) Ackoff videos on Deming Cooperative, https://demingcooperative.org/ackoffvideos/
    2) Ackoff on DIKUW - article, https://faculty.ung.edu/kmelton/Documents/DataWisdom.pdf
    3) Ackoff on DIKUW - video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzS5V5-0VsA&t=21s 
    3) Deming and Ackoff - excerpts of Volume 21 of the Deming Library, ("A Theory of a System for Educators and Managers”),https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MJ3lGJ4OFo 
    4) Deming and Ackoff - transcript of full recorded of Volume 21 of the Deming Library ,https://ackoffcenter.blogs.com/ackoff_center_weblog/2011/04/a-converstaion-between-russell-ackoff-and-edward-deming.html
    5) Ackoff - Memories, https://www.amazon.com/Memories-Hardcover-Collectors-Russell-Ackoff/dp/0956537995
    6) Ackoff - Differences That Make a Difference, https://www.amazon.com/Differences-that-Make-Difference-Distinctions/dp/1908009012/ 

    • 34 min

Customer Reviews

5.0 out of 5
3 Ratings

3 Ratings

Top Podcasts In Business

Money Stuff: The Podcast
Bloomberg
In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen
Norges Bank Investment Management
REAL AF with Andy Frisella
Andy Frisella #100to0
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
Money News Network
The Ramsey Show
Ramsey Network
Habits and Hustle
Jen Cohen and Habit Nest

You Might Also Like

In Their Own Words
The Deming Institute
Troubleshooting Agile
A weekly problem-solving session for all things agile
Akimbo: A Podcast from Seth Godin
Seth Godin
Cautionary Tales with Tim Harford
Pushkin Industries
Pivot
New York Magazine
Freakonomics Radio
Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher