Station 4 Negotiation

Gene Killian

Station 4 Negotiation: where real stories unlock powerful negotiation strategies. Hosted by Gene Killian, a trial lawyer with 40 years of experience, we skip the gimmicks and distill practical lessons from real-world deals. Understand the art of negotiation through stories, not lists of rules. Here, you'll find practical insights that will help you communicate, collaborate, and close deals with confidence... and change the way you approach every conversation. Remember: negotiation is life.

  1. 2D AGO

    #58 – Lessons from NASA: How to Negotiate Like a Scientist

    This week on S4N, Gene leans into the recent public fascination with NASA – intensified by Artemis II's journey to the moon – to explore a different kind of mission: how to negotiate like a scientist. Drawing on ideas from organizational psychologist Adam Grant and his book Think Again: The Power of Knowing What You Don't Know, Gene breaks down why most of us default to defending our views instead of testing them – and how that instinct limits our effectiveness at the table. Learn how to treat your opinions like hypotheses, how to pressure-test the other side's assumptions without triggering resistance, and how to replace certainty with curiosity without losing credibility or control. Along the way, Gene connects NASA's post-Challenger disaster shift toward a learning culture – where questioning isn't weakness, it's responsibility – to the kind of environment great negotiators create: one where people feel safe enough to speak honestly, challenge ideas, and uncover what actually matters. Remember: negotiation is life. Mentioned in this episode: Think Again: The Power of Knowing What You Don't Know by Adam Grant The Fighting 69th, the 1940 film directed by William Keighley

    33 min

  2. APR 21

    #57 – Playing the Long Game: What the WNBA Got Right About Deals That Work When You Win

    Negotiation forces a tough question: are we fighting over slices – or building something bigger together? Most deals don't fail because of bad intentions. They fail because the structure only works for one side. This week on S4N, Gene uses the WNBA's new collective bargaining agreement to zero in on a core business challenge: how do you build a revenue-sharing deal that actually aligns incentives instead of creating friction? One side wants a bigger share of the upside. The other needs to manage risk and keep the business viable. If you've ever negotiated comp, a partnership, a client deal, or even an internal budget, you've felt this tension. This episode gets into what actually moves things forward – and how to stop dividing value, and instead think about how to structure it. When the structure is right, success scales for both sides. When it isn't, your deal doesn't hold up, and you find yourself right back at the negotiating table (or in court).  Because the goal isn't just to close the deal – it's to build one that works when things start going right. Remember: negotiation is life.

    39 min

  3. APR 7

    #56 – By the Numbers: Why "Strong" Data Makes a Weak Case

    You've heard it before: support your position with data. But what if the data doesn't hold up? This week on S4N, Gene unpacks the chilling case of Sally Clark – a British solicitor wrongfully convicted by numbers that looked airtight and were completely wrong – to expose how numbers can distort, not clarify, high-stakes decisions. We break down the prosecutor's fallacy, the critical difference between precision and accuracy, and why data that appears authoritative can be fundamentally wrong. More importantly, we translate this into practical negotiation insight, so you can interrogate data, challenge assumptions, and avoid blindly trusting expert analysis. When you trust data too much, and when your belief in your case outpaces what the data can actually support, decisions fall apart. This episode exposes a simple truth: the quality of your decisions is only as good as the quality of the information behind them. Whether you're negotiating a deal or evaluating risk, this episode will sharpen your skepticism – and your judgment. Remember: negotiation is life. Mentioned in this episode:  The Maths of Life and Death by Kit Yates

    32 min

  4. MAR 24

    #55 – I'm Not Lovin' It: Why Getting Attention Isn't Getting Buy-In – Or Getting Deals Done

    The recent viral McDonald's CEO video got what most brands and companies are chasing: attention. But attention isn't the same as buy-in – and it definitely isn't the same as getting a deal done. This week on S4N, Gene unpacks what most people are missing when they look at moments like this – and why attention alone can be misleading, especially in sales and negotiation. If you've ever had a conversation that didn't move forward, interest that didn't convert, or a deal that stalled for reasons you couldn't quite explain, this episode breaks down what's really going on – and what to do differently if you want your message to actually land. Getting attention might start the conversation. But only credibility gets the deal done. Remember: negotiation is life.  Mentioned in this episode:  Video posted by Chris Kempczinski on February 3, 2026 "McDonald's C.E.O. Takes a Big Bite Out of a Burger. Maybe Scratch 'Big'."  by Victor Mather for The New York Times, March 5, 2026 "An 'epic fail' by McDonald's turned into a marketing win" by Megan McArdle for The Washington Post, March 15, 2026

    30 min

  5. MAR 10

    #54 – No Hardball for Harbaugh: How to Show Interest Without Losing Leverage

    When you really want a deal, how do you show it – without tipping the balance against you? This week on S4N, Gene breaks down a high-profile NFL coaching negotiation to explore a common challenge in negotiation: how much interest should you actually show when you want a deal? Using the story of John Harbaugh's recent talks with the New York Giants, Gene walks through how both sides navigated a delicate balance – signaling interest without appearing too eager and giving away leverage. Along the way, we look at the small moments that shape negotiations, from subtle signals to personal touches (including a plate of chocolate chip cookies). In this episode, Gene covers: How to show real interest without weakening your negotiating position Why appearing too eager can shift leverage in a deal The role of rapport and patience in high-stakes negotiations Practical lessons you can apply to contracts, clients, and career decisions If you've ever wondered how experienced negotiators balance enthusiasm with restraint – or worried about revealing too much too soon – this episode offers a few insights from the field. Remember: negotiation is life.   Mentioned in this episode: "The Inside Story of the Giants' John Harbaugh Deal and the Talks That Saved It" by Ian O'Connor for The Athletic, January 19, 2026

    31 min

  6. FEB 24

    #53 – Great Lessons from the Great Depression: Negotiating In Uncertain Times

    This week on S4N, we step into the turmoil surrounding the 1929 stock market crash and the international debt crisis it exposed — a moment when information was unreliable, risk was rising, and decisions at the table carried consequences far beyond the room. Using this period as a lens, we give you the tools seasoned negotiators rely on when certainty disappears. By contrasting Wall Street's speculative frenzy with the high-stakes reparations talks between David Sarnoff and German finance minister Hjalmar Schacht, Gene explores how perspective can shift a stalled negotiation, why endurance matters, and how to know whether the right people are in the room. This episode reframes negotiation as judgment, not just technique — and asks what it really takes to stay steady when everything around you isn't. Remember: negotiation is life. Mentioned in this episode: 1929: Inside the Greatest Crash in Wall Street History – and How It Shattered a Nation by Andrew Ross Sorkin

    40 min

  7. FEB 10

    #52 – Is The Russia-Ukraine Conflict Even Negotiable?: When Talks Don't Mean Progress

    Is every conflict actually negotiable — or are some negotiations designed to fail from the start? This week on S4N, Gene examines the latest Russia-Ukraine negotiation efforts in Abu Dhabi through a negotiator's lens, not a political one. Instead of replaying headlines, he breaks down what seasoned dealmakers watch for beneath the surface: incentive misalignment, signaling vs. substance, internal power pressures, mediator choice, and the difference between visible activity and real movement. Looking at the newest diplomatic round and the unusual mix of players involved, Gene explores why who's in the room — and what they truly want — can matter more than any proposal on the table. He also challenges the common assumption that continued talks automatically signal progress. For business leaders and founders, the takeaway is practical: some deals stall not because of tactics, but because the structure is wrong from the beginning. This episode helps you recognize when the other side isn't positioned to agree, when a process is mostly optics, and when your leverage is being misunderstood — so you can adjust your strategy before time and credibility are wasted. Not every negotiation is winnable — and knowing that early is a competitive advantage. Remember: negotiation is life.  Mentioned in this episode:  "Trump's Ukraine Charade" by Julia Ioffe, February 5, 2026 for Puck News The June 18, 2024 episode of S4N: "#11 – Saving The Trouble(s): How To Handle Belligerent Negotiations, As Told By The Northern Ireland Conflict"

    33 min

  8. JAN 27

    #51 – Sell Like A Spy: How To Get What You Want Without Asking

    What if the best sales skills weren't built in boardrooms, but in backchannels, briefings, and quiet conversations where every word counts? This week on S4N, Gene pulls lessons from the world of espionage and shows why spy tradecraft maps surprisingly well to business negotiation. Drawing from Sell Like a Spy and Netflix's The Spy, he breaks down what intelligence professionals do differently when the stakes are high and the margin for error is low. Few people can get what they actually need to know without making the conversation feel like an interrogation, a pitch, or a trap. That's where elicitation comes in — a skill most business leaders think they have until they try to do it on purpose. Not by being slick, but by learning how to guide a conversation in a way that keeps trust intact and surfaces the truth faster. Along the way, Gene shares a deceptively simple internal question you can use to recalibrate in real time, especially in moments where you feel the urge to explain, persuade, or fill the silence. Tune in for spy stories, practical takeaways, and a challenge to rethink what "good communication" really looks like when outcomes matter. If you ever find yourself doing most of the talking, this episode will show you why that might be costing you more than you realize — and what to do instead. Remember: negotiation is life. Mentioned in this episode: Sell Like A Spy: The Art of Persuasion from the World of Espionage by Jeremy Hurewitz The Spy, the 2019 Netflix series directed by Gideon Raff

    28 min
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About

Station 4 Negotiation: where real stories unlock powerful negotiation strategies. Hosted by Gene Killian, a trial lawyer with 40 years of experience, we skip the gimmicks and distill practical lessons from real-world deals. Understand the art of negotiation through stories, not lists of rules. Here, you'll find practical insights that will help you communicate, collaborate, and close deals with confidence... and change the way you approach every conversation. Remember: negotiation is life.

Information

  • Creator
    Gene Killian
  • Years Active
    2024 - 2026
  • Episodes
    59
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © 2023
  • Show Website
    Station 4 Negotiation