The Messy Middle Matters

People, Process, Things | Indra Klavins
  • 5.0 (14)
  • CAREERS
  • UPDATED WEEKLY

The Messy Middle Matters® podcast shines a much-needed spotlight on what it really takes to work in, survive in, and even thrive in the messy middle of work.

  1. 4D AGO

    Ep 47: Why I Use AI, Unapologetically

    In this episode, Indra explores the multifaceted role of AI in our lives, emphasizing its potential as a tool for accessibility, communication, and personal growth. She discusses how AI can enhance our work, serve as a thinking partner, and help us engage with broader audiences. Indra also highlights the importance of human agency in shaping the tools we use, advocating for a thoughtful approach to technology that prioritizes clarity and dignity. Takeaways AI is not about cheating; it's a reflection of our input. Using AI can enhance accessibility in communication. AI can serve as a partner in amplifying our thoughts. Engaging with AI is crucial for shaping the future. AI helps distill complex ideas into digestible formats. The world was not built for everyone; AI can help navigate that. AI can provide perspectives that enhance our understanding. It's important to communicate in ways that resonate with diverse audiences. Tools like AI are essential for scaling our efforts effectively. Human agency must shape the tools we use, not the other way around. More from Indra and The Messy Middle Matters Indra on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/indrak/ Indra’s Blog: https://peopleprocessthings.substack.com   The Messy Middle Matters on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/themessymiddlematters/ Feedback for The Messy Middle Matters: https://messymiddlematters.com/feedback  The Messy Middle Matters Merch https://messymiddlemerch.com  Keywords AI, accessibility, communication, human agency, technology, innovation, thinking partner, future of work, systems thinking, digital tools

    17 min

  2. FEB 4

    Ep 46: Navigating the Goo Stage: Embracing Transformation w/ Stephanie Simpson

    In this episode, Indra and Stephanie Simpson explore the concept of the 'Goo Stage,' a transformative phase in life where individuals experience discomfort and uncertainty. They discuss the importance of navigating transitions, the role of leaders in supporting their teams during these times, and the significance of creating supportive environments. Stephanie shares insights on how to acknowledge and validate feelings during the Goo Stage, emphasizing the need for community and resources to aid in personal growth. The conversation concludes with invitations for listeners to reflect on their support systems and the importance of being present in the moment. Takeaways The Goo Stage represents a transformative phase in life. Transitions are crucial and should be navigated intentionally. Leaders play a vital role in supporting their teams during change. Creating a supportive environment is essential for growth. Acknowledging and validating feelings is the first step in navigating the Goo Stage. Community support is crucial during times of transition. One-size-fits-all solutions are often ineffective. Personal growth requires discomfort and vulnerability. Resources and tools should be tailored to individual needs. Reflection on support systems can enhance personal development. Follow Stephanie: Stephanie on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stephaniesimpsoncoaching/ Stephanie’s Website: https://www.stephanie-simpson.com/ Stephanie on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/stephaniesimpsoncoaching/  More from Indra and The Messy Middle Matters Indra on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/indrak/ Indra’s Blog: https://peopleprocessthings.substack.com   The Messy Middle Matters on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/themessymiddlematters/ Feedback for The Messy Middle Matters: https://messymiddlematters.com/feedback  The Messy Middle Matters Merch https://messymiddlemerch.com  Keywords Goo Stage, Transition, Change Management, Leadership, Support, Personal Growth, Stress Management, Transformation, Community, Resources

    39 min

  3. JAN 28

    Ep 45: Navigating Purpose, Identity and Career in the Messy Middle w/ Rachel Saslaw

    In this episode of The Messy Middle Matters, Indra Klavins sits down with Rachel Saslaw, product marketing director and founder of NYC’s storytelling community StoryTell, to explore the messy middle of career, purpose, and identity. Rachel shares her journey of balancing a corporate career with a passion project, protecting her creative space from the pressures of monetization, and navigating societal expectations around hustle culture and “following your passion.” They discuss how work can serve as a fuel for life rather than a constant source of striving, and how intentionality, radical permission to change your mind, and embracing a multifaceted identity can bring clarity, freedom, and fulfillment. Key Takeaways: The messy middle often means balancing meaningful work with personal passions and financial stability. Work does not have to be your life’s calling; it can provide fuel for a life you love outside of the office. Saying “not for me (right now)” is a valid, intentional approach to career and passion projects. Preserving your passion requires setting boundaries and resisting the commodification of personal interests. Community and storytelling are powerful tools for empathy, belonging, and nuanced human connection. Identity is multi-faceted; your job title does not define your worth or your whole self. Experimentation and radical permission to change your mind allow flexibility and clarity in career decisions. Follow Rachel and StoryTell: Rachel Saslaw on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rachelsaslaw/  Rachel’s Website: https://rachelsaslaw.com/  StoryTell on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/storytellnyc More on Indra and The Messy Middle Matters Feedback for The Messy Middle Matters: http://messymiddlematters.com/feedback  Indra’s Blog: http://peopleprocessthings.substack.com   Indra on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/indrak/ The Messy Middle Matters Merch http://messymiddlemerch.com

    29 min

  4. JAN 21

    Ep 44: From Corporate Scripts to Owning the Room w/ Megumi Calver

    Summary In this engaging conversation, Indra K and Megumi explore the complexities of navigating the messy middle of careers, personal growth, and entrepreneurship. Megumi shares her journey from Tokyo to Kansas City, her career pivots from marketing to acting, and ultimately to creating a community-focused wine events company. The discussion highlights the importance of creating supportive spaces for women, the art of gathering, and the lessons learned through trial and error in both personal and professional realms. Takeaways Megumi's journey reflects the importance of embracing change. Creating spaces for women fosters community and support. Wine events can be a platform for empowerment and connection. Understanding what you don't want is as crucial as knowing what you want. Entrepreneurship often comes with unexpected challenges and surprises. The importance of intentionality in event planning and execution. Curiosity and playfulness enhance the experience of learning about wine. Networking in a supportive environment can lead to personal growth. Self-discovery is a continuous journey, especially in entrepreneurship. Building a community can provide validation and encouragement. Useful Links Megumi on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/megumicalver/ Megumi's Newsletter: https://merobebe.beehiiv.com/ Indra Klavins on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/indrak/ The Messy Middle Matters Merch http://messymiddlemerch.com  Feedback for The Messy Middle Matters: http://messymiddlematters.com/feedback  Keywords career pivots, entrepreneurship, women empowerment, wine events, personal growth, community building, marketing, acting, self-discovery, networking

    37 min

  5. JAN 14

    Ep 43: Navigating the First 90 Days w/ Amanda Jane Lee

    Starting a new role can feel overwhelming, even when you know the basics—logging in, getting paid, finding the coffee. In this episode, Indra Klavins and Amanda Jane Lee go beyond standard onboarding advice to explore how to truly set yourself up for success in your first 90 days. They discuss the importance of asking foundational questions, building your own organizational maps, decoding internal vocabulary, and taking a listening-first approach to understand culture and team dynamics. From strategic one-on-ones to creating your own “maps” of reporting structures and workflows, this episode is full of practical tips for making meaningful first impressions, establishing your brand, and navigating both in-person and remote environments. Whether you’re joining a hyper-growth startup, a large enterprise, or a cross-functional team, this conversation equips you with tools to orient yourself, gather context, and thrive in the messy middle of a new role. Useful Links The Messy Middle Matters Merch: messymiddlemerch.com  The Messy Middle Matters Glossary: messymiddlematters.com/glossary   Feedback for The Messy Middle Matters: messymiddlematters.com/feedback  Amanda Jane Lee on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amandajanelee/ Indra Klavins on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/indrak/

    32 min

  6. JAN 7

    Ep 42: Spot the Green Flags: Leveraging AI for Role Fit & Career Clarity

    In this conversation, Amanda Jane Lee discusses the innovative use of AI in self-discovery and career guidance. She emphasizes how AI can assist individuals in identifying their strengths and preferences through targeted questioning, making the process of career exploration more efficient and personalized. Takeaways AI can help identify personal strengths and preferences. Mind mapping software is a useful tool in self-discovery. Asking the right questions is crucial for self-exploration. AI can generate questions to guide personal discovery. Understanding green flags is important in career choices. Self-discovery can be enhanced through technology. AI can streamline the process of finding suitable roles. Personalized guidance can lead to better career decisions. The role of AI in career exploration is growing. Embracing technology can aid in personal development. Useful Links The Messy Middle Matters Merch: messymiddlemerch.com  The Messy Middle Matters Glossary: messymiddlematters.com/glossary   Feedback for The Messy Middle Matters: messymiddlematters.com/feedback  Amanda Jane Lee on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amandajanelee/ Indra Klavins on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/indrak/

    24 min

  7. 12/17/2025

    Ep 41: From Expert to Leader: The Emotional Journey to People Management w/ Laura Lillie Goodridge

    This conversation delves into the complexities of transitioning into leadership roles, emphasizing the emotional and practical challenges faced by new managers. Indra K and Laura Lillie Goodridge explore the jarring shift from individual contributor to manager, the importance of self-awareness, and the need for effective communication and feedback. They discuss the lack of support many organizations provide for new leaders and the significance of finding the right coaching and resources to navigate this transition successfully. The dialogue highlights the evolving nature of leadership in today's workplace, advocating for a more empathetic and self-aware approach to management. Takeaways Transitioning to leadership is a significant emotional and practical shift. New managers often feel isolated from their previous peer relationships. Organizations frequently lack adequate support for new leaders. Effective communication is crucial for setting expectations and managing teams. Feedback should be a two-way street, involving both giving and receiving. Self-discovery is essential for understanding one's leadership style. Coaching can provide valuable external perspectives for new leaders. Understanding company leadership styles is vital for alignment. New managers should focus on fundamental skills before reshaping their identity. The landscape of leadership is evolving towards a more empathetic approach. Useful Links Laura on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/the-manager-coach/ Laura on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/the_manager_coach/ Laura’s website: https://www.lauralilliecoaching.com/ Laura’s resources for new managers: https://www.lauralilliecoaching.com/managers-resources The Messy Middle Matters Merch: messymiddlemerch.com  The Messy Middle Matters Glossary: messymiddlematters.com/glossary   Feedback for The Messy Middle Matters: messymiddlematters.com/feedback  Indra Klavins on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/indrak/

    38 min

  8. 12/10/2025

    Ep 40: Starting Over Again: The Humility of Career Change w/ Mikki Hoffman

    In this conversation, Mikki and Indra explore the complexities of navigating career changes and the profound shifts in identity that accompany them. They discuss the importance of humility, community support, and vulnerability during transitions, emphasizing the need to redefine one's identity and align actions with personal values. The dialogue highlights the significance of small impacts and the ripples they create within communities, encouraging listeners to embrace change and seek connection. Takeaways The job market is unpredictable, leading to frequent career changes. Identity can shift significantly when changing roles or companies. Experiential design and community engagement can be fulfilling career paths. Humility is essential when starting anew in a different field. Community support plays a crucial role during transitions. Vulnerability can lead to deeper connections and support. Redefining one's identity is a journey that requires self-reflection. Embracing change can lead to personal growth and new opportunities. It's important to align actions with personal values. Every small impact can create ripples in the community. Useful Links The Messy Middle Matters Merch: messymiddlemerch.com  The Messy Middle Matters Glossary: messymiddlematters.com/glossary   Feedback for The Messy Middle Matters: messymiddlematters.com/feedback  Mikki on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/micaelahoffman/  Indra Klavins on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/indrak/

    38 min
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Ratings & Reviews

5
out of 5
14 Ratings

About

The Messy Middle Matters® podcast shines a much-needed spotlight on what it really takes to work in, survive in, and even thrive in the messy middle of work.

Information

  • Creator
    People, Process, Things | Indra Klavins
  • Years Active
    2025 - 2026
  • Episodes
    48
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © Copyright 2025 All rights reserved.
  • Show Website
    The Messy Middle Matters