Trust & Influence in B2B

Joel Harrison

I’m Joel Harrison, founder of B2B Marketing.net (formerly B2B Marketing magazine) Propolis and the B2B Marketing Awards. It’s been my mission for the past 21 years to recognise, celebrate and evangelise for the amazing profession that is B2B marketing, which has evolved beyond that recognition in that time. In this podcast, I’ll be exploring what I believe is the biggest challenge facing B2B marketers today: Trust. Buyers have always been cynical, hard to reach and even harder to convince, and increasingly expect to be self-directed in their research. In other words, they only want to engage with you on their terms. As if that wasn't bad enough, media and content channels are fragmented whilst AI is opening the floodgates to a tidalwave of content of questionable quality and veracity. It all adds up to a crisis of trust in B2B. In this podcast, I'll be interviewing innovative and inspirational marketers in the front line of addressing this challenge, providing deep insights into the context of this challenge, exploring new insights about its implications and looking at real world solutions and success stories. I’ll be exploring this topic from every relevant angle and perspective, but I’m going to focus particularly on thought leadership, influencer marketing and advocacy as they have particular relevance to this challenge.

  1. 4d ago

    Why influencer skills are becoming essential for B2B CMOs | With Archana Dhankar of Proofpoint

    Most B2B marketing leaders aren't short on expertise — they're short on the confidence and the practised skill to be visible with it, whether that's in the room with their own board or out in public. Archana Dhankar, VP Marketing EMEA at Proofpoint, TEDx speaker and LinkedIn Top Voice, joins Joel Harrison to unpack what it actually takes to build that visibility, internally and externally, and turn it into real influence. ➡️ She breaks down the practical mechanics of building influence: a 2:1 ratio for balancing self-promotion against value-added content, a three-stage framework for knowing when visibility has become influence (likes, saves, and inbound interest), and why trust compounds differently on a public platform than it does inside your own organisation. She's also candid about the cost — the professional accountability, the late nights, the posts that flop despite your best instincts — and closes with practical advice for reluctant leaders and junior marketers on where to start. What you'll learnWhy visibility and influence are not the same thing, and how to tell them apartThe 2:1 ratio Archana uses to keep self-promotion from tipping into egoA three-stage framework for measuring whether your content is building real influenceWhy trust compounds differently on social platforms than it does in daily workThe personal cost of building a public profile – and why consistency, not confidence, is the hard partHow to start building influence if you're a reluctant leader, or a junior marketer just starting out Chapters00:01 – Introduction and episode setup02:08 – Archana's journey: two decades in B2B marketing, content roots back to 200804:20 – Visibility vs. influence: the core distinction06:17 – What prompted Archana to go public, and the “side hustle” advantage09:33 – Three phases of measuring when visibility becomes influence12:51 – Self-promotion vs. ego, and the 2:1 content ratio14:18 – Balancing personal brand with company brand16:47 – Why trust is the foundation of influence18:41 – Winning over skeptical stakeholders: SEMrush and Adobe as B2B influencer examples20:28 – How being an influential leader has shaped Archana's career23:29 – The personal cost: accountability and consistency26:08 – Where to start if you want influence, not just visibility30:19 – Advice for junior marketers31:14 – The one mindset shift that matters most LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/archanadhankar/ 🌐 Visit Joel Harrison's website to explore exclusive reports, upcoming events, and join the B2B marketing community: https://www.joelharrisonb2b.com/ 📲 Follow Joel Harrison and Trust & Influence in B2B across the web: LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/

    Why influencer skills are becoming essential for B2B CMOs  | With Archana Dhankar of Proofpoint
  2. Aug 5

    From the moshpit to the marketing plan | What a decade in the music business taught Jason Miller about attention in B2B

    In this episode of Trust and Influence in B2B Marketing, Joel Harrison sits down with Jason Miller, who leads content and marketing at V7 Labs and previously held senior content marketing roles at LinkedIn, Marketo and ActiveCampaign. Before B2B, Jason spent a decade in the music industry — touring with bands, working artist development, and photographing rock's biggest names — and he's never really left it behind. Together, they explore why the safe, by-the-numbers approach so many B2B marketers default to is quietly the riskiest choice of all, and what a career spent between the tour bus and the marketing plan has taught him about actually earning an audience's attention. ➡️ Jason holds nothing back. He explains why the music industry never called its fans “leads,” and how that community mindset shaped his approach at Marketo, where the entire strategy handed down from Marketo co-founder and CMO Jon Miller was simply “get people to like us.” He unpacks why viral, one-hit-wonder campaigns — from Old Spice to the Volvo truck ad — aren't repeatable playbooks for most brands, and why chasing them is a trap. He's candid about the tension between personality and brand safety inside a large corporate marketing team, drawing on his time working on Bing at Microsoft, and makes the case for consistency over virality — including a great story about Rick Rubin, the Red Hot Chili Peppers, and creating for yourself rather than for an audience. He closes with a warning about AI and taste: why outsourcing judgment to an algorithm is the worst thing a marketer can do right now, and what will actually matter in B2B marketing going forward. What You'll Learn What the music industry got right: why bands never called their fans “leads,” and what that means for B2B community-building.The Marketo playbook: how “get people to like us” became a strategy, not just a slogan.The one-hit-wonder trap: why viral campaigns like Old Spice and the Volvo truck ad aren't repeatable playbooks for most brands.Personality vs. brand safety: what happens to a big idea inside a large corporate marketing team, and why smaller, faster teams can take more risks.Consistency beats virality: “posting the draft,” building in public, and what Rick Rubin's work with Red Hot Chili Peppers can teach content marketers.AI and the death of taste: why outsourcing taste to an AI agent is a mistake, and the skills marketers now need to stay relevant. Chapters 00:00 - Introduction: From the Mosh Pit to the Marketing Plan 02:21 - Jason Miller: From Music Industry to B2B, and Life at V7 Labs 05:13 - Startup Speed vs. Corporate Red Tape 07:07 - Life on the Road: Artist Development Lessons 09:33 - B2C Personality Meets B2B: The Marketo Playbook 12:58 - The One-Hit-Wonder Trap: Old Spice, Volvo and Repeatable Playbooks 15:13 - HubSpot, “It Slaps,” and the Line Between Cool and Try-Hard 17:55 - Second Skin: Music as a Sense of Purpose 20:55 - Personality Inside a Corporate Machine: The Microsoft/Bing Story 24:49 - Consistency Over Virality: Posting the Draft and Rick Rubin's “Create for Yourself” 29:18 - Likable, Relevant, Consistent: What Actually Works on LinkedIn 31:43 - Why the Clay and Eleven Labs Playbooks Aren't Repeatable 34:14 - AI, Taste and the Last Human Trait 38:37 - Closing Thoughts Note: chapter times are taken from the unedited transcript and are approximate — confirm against the final published cut before adding to the platform. Follow the Guest Follow Jason Miller https://www.linkedin.com/in/jsnmiller/ https://www.v7labs.com/ Closing & Calls to Action If you care about making B2B marketing more meaningful, useful, and memorable, this conversation is for you. It's honest, funny in places, and packed with takeaways on how to build genuine personality into your content — whether you're a content creator, strategist, or brand leader. 🌐Visit Joel Harrison's website to explore exclusive reports, upcoming events, and join the B2B marketing community ➡ https://www.joelharrisonb2b.com/ 💬What do you think comes first—having something to say, or having the confidence to say it? Let us know in the comments below. 🔔Subscribe to the channel for weekly insights, interviews, and on-the-ground perspectives from the world of B2B marketing. https://youtube.com/@JoelHarrison-B2B?sub_confirmation=1 📲Follow Joel Harrison and Trust & Influence in B2B across the web: LinkedIn ▶ https://linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/ Podcast ▶ https://trust-influence-in-b2b.captivate.fm/ Instagram ▶ https://instagram.com/joelharrisonb2b/ Hashtags #JoelHarrisonB2B, #B2BMarketing, #ContentMarketing, #BrandPersonality, #B2BContent, #MarketingPodcast, #B2BInsights, #JoelHarrison, #B2BStrategy, #ContentStrategy, #Storytelling, #MusicIndustry, #B2BGrowth, #ThoughtLeadership, #MarketingTrends

    From the moshpit to the marketing plan | What a decade in the music business taught Jason Miller about attention in B2B
  3. Jul 25

    Stop trying to please everyone! | Karl Van den Bergh of Illumio on why consistency, not consensus, is what earns trust in B2B

    Most leadership advice pushes you toward a familiar template: decisive, diplomatic, endlessly composed. It's meant to build trust. Often it does the opposite – because trust depends on people actually knowing who you are, not the version of you assembled to fit expectations. In this episode of Trust & Influence in B2B, Joel Harrison is joined by Karl Van den Bergh, Chief Marketing and Strategy Officer at Illumio, the breach containment company. Karl has spent more than 25 years leading go-to-market teams at global technology companies, including CMO roles at Gigamon and DataStax, and now writes regularly on authenticity and what it means to be human at work. Together they unpack why being yourself is a trust strategy rather than a soft skill, how to tell real authenticity apart from the performative kind, and why Karl believes AI raises the value of human, relational marketing rather than eroding it. In this episode: Why most leadership advice pushes conformity rather than authenticity, and what gets lost in the processThe test that actually separates real authenticity from the performative kindWhy brands that try to please everyone end up forgettable – and the campaign that proves the oppositeHow fear of conflict quietly kills team performance, and what fixed it on Karl's own teamWhy Karl believes AI raises the value of human, relational marketing rather than replacing it Chapters 00:00 Cold open 01:26 Karl's background – from physics to CMO 03:13 Why he started writing about being yourself at work 06:10 Why a distinctive point of view is a differentiator 08:37 Personal brand vs. company brand 10:55 What authenticity actually means 11:50 Spotting performative authenticity 13:47 How authenticity cascades through a team 17:27 Where leaders fall short on consistency 19:46 Does this get harder as the stakes rise? 21:56 The counterargument: "Don't Be Yourself" 24:30 AI and the flattening of content 27:52 One thing to start doing differently next week Karl on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karlvandenbergh/ Joel on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/

    Stop trying to please everyone! | Karl Van den Bergh of Illumio on why consistency, not consensus, is what earns trust in B2B
  4. Jul 23

    Employee voices drown out brand voices in B2B – so how do you orchestrate them? Rida Oyebade of Workday on employee advocacy

    Why is employee advocacy so often mistaken for a content strategy? Rida Oyebade, Senior Social Media Manager at Workday, explains why handing employees “ready-made content” isn’t enough — advocacy only works when it still sounds like the person sharing it, not the brand behind them. In this episode of Trust & Influence in B2B, host Joel Harrison talks to Rida Oyebade about employee advocacy — the discipline of turning colleagues into credible, willing voices for the brand. Rida traces her own path into advocacy, breaks down the different tiers of an advocacy programme, and is candid about what she’s learned building one from scratch at Workday: why participation has to stay genuinely optional, why no programme survives without real buy-in from leadership, and why the whole discipline is really about borrowed trust rather than borrowed content. In this episode Why brand-originated content is losing ground to individual voices in B2BWhy handing employees ready-made content isn’t the same as earning their voiceThe three tiers of employee advocacy, and why each needs different handlingWhy employee advocacy means borrowing someone’s “personal real estate” — and why participation has to stay optionalWhat actually makes advocacy programmes work, and why persuasion alone isn’t enoughWhether employee advocacy is a specialism worth building a career around Guest Rida Oyebade is Senior Social Media Manager at Workday, where she leads employee advocacy — working with colleagues, or “influencers” as she prefers to call them, to carry the brand into places a corporate account can’t reach.

    Employee voices drown out brand voices in B2B – so how do you orchestrate them? Rida Oyebade of Workday on employee advocacy
  5. Jul 14

    Growth, creativity and trust: the B2B story of Cannes Lions 2026

    In this special edition of Trust & Influence in B2B, Joel Harrison is joined by Fiona McKenzie of Marketbridge to make sense of Cannes Lions 2026. Fresh from five days of multi-stream content, installations and fringe events, they let the dust settle and distil what actually matters for B2B marketers – viewed through a growth lens, not creativity for its own sake. They unpack why B2B is visibly on the rise at Cannes, the tension between creativity and commercial measurement, and the CFO buy-in conversation (brand as future cashflow). They dig into three important releases from the week: the FT's work on trust (including the finding that 82% trust a source more when it challenges than when it agrees), Bloomberg on reputation pulling weight across the full funnel, and Bain & Co.'s new model positioned as a rival to NPS, scoring a buyer's likelihood to choose you before any deal is on the table. The conversation moves through the B2B Lions winner – an obscure Swedish ball-bearing company using tidal energy in the Faroe Islands, and why a big idea told as a wider go-to-market story is a step in the right direction – the rise of creators and influence in B2B, Joel's framework of five "trust champions," and a notably optimistic read on AI: a technology that surfaces existing misalignment and removes grunt work rather than replacing human judgment. They close on what Cannes could do better for the B2B community. In this episode: What Cannes actually is, and why it's so hard to navigate. B2B moving up the agenda. The growth-versus-creativity lens. CFO buy-in and brand as future cashflow. Why CMOs are exhausted by the measurement debate. Three key releases: FT on trust, Bloomberg on reputation, Bain's NPS rival. The B2B Lions winner and what it signals. Creators, influence and Joel's five trust champions. A grounded, optimistic take on AI. What's missing, and what would take Cannes to the next level in 2027. Reports and resources mentioned (links below): FT – research on trust in B2B https://dimensionsofinfluence.ft.com/Bloomberg – reputation across the funnel, B2B Summit presentation https://www.bloombergmedia.com/blog/corporate-rep-study-2025/Bain & Co. – new buyer-choice model positioned against NPS https://www.bain.com/insights/raising-the-odds-on-a-deal-how-likelihood-to-buy-rewires-b2b-growth/ Chapters: (00:00) Welcome and why we waited for the dust to settle(01:13) What Cannes actually is, and how to navigate it(03:04) B2B on the rise at the festival(04:28) The growth lens: creativity anchored in commercial value(05:21) CFO buy-in and brand as future cashflow(07:54) Why CMOs are exhausted by measurement(10:23) Is B2B creativity judged by the wrong (B2C) playbook?(11:26) Three key releases: FT, Bloomberg and Bain(16:45) Talking the language of the boardroom(19:36) The B2B Lions winner: a Swedish ball-bearing story(24:29) Creators, influence and the five trust champions(30:11) AI: surfacing misalignment, not taking our jobs(35:17) What Cannes could do better(37:46) Wrap-up and how to share your own take Connect with Joel on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/ Connect with Fiona on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fiona-mckenzie-8a16921a/

    Growth, creativity and trust: the B2B story of Cannes Lions 2026
  6. Jul 8

    The deal is won before you're in the room | Why the recommended choice now beats the visible one, with Lottie O'Donoghue from Velo

    Most of the conversations that decide a B2B deal happen in a room you'll never be in. Buyers swap recommendations, compare notes and build their shortlists in spaces marketers can neither see nor measure – and by the time you're in contention, the decision is often half made. In this episode of Trust & Influence in B2B, Joel Harrison is joined by Lottie O'Donoghue, strategy director at Velo, a specialist B2B agency built on recommendation. Lottie has led marketing client-side in scale-up SaaS and run ABM at Accenture, and now shapes recommendation strategies for Velo's clients across technology, industrial and professional services. Together they unpack why becoming the recommended choice has shifted from a nice-to-have to a commercial imperative, the real difference between being known and being recommended, and the trust signals that quietly compound into advocacy. In this episode: Why the recommended choice now matters more than the visible oneThe trust signals that accumulate into recommendation, and the ones marketers most underestimateHow to make the case for investing in influence that conventional attribution can't captureWhere to start if you suspect you're not being talked about in the right roomsVelo's six Rs of Recommendation Marketing framework Download Velo's report here: https://www.velo-b2b.com/ebooks/?utm_source=Joel+Harrison&utm_campaign=Recommendation+Marketing This is a sponsored episode, produced in partnership with Velo.

    The deal is won before you're in the room | Why the recommended choice now beats the visible one, with Lottie O'Donoghue from Velo
  7. Jul 2

    Why lead gen is still B2B's trust free zone | How blind faith and 'tolerable mischief' underpins a global industry, with Robin Caller of Leadscale

    Lead generation is the discipline B2B marketing relies on most and trusts least. In this episode of Trust & Influence in B2B, Robin Caller, founder and CEO of Leadscale, explains why, and what it would take to fix it. Most people in B2B know that a good share of the leads changing hands every day are of questionable quality. Few will say so on the record. Robin is an exception. He calls it "a tolerable level of mischief", a grey zone the whole industry has quietly learned to live with, and in conversation with host Joel Harrison he explains why it persists, why he refuses to call it fraud, and how transparency could begin to put it right. A note before you listen: Robin speaks freely, and not everyone in the industry will agree with all of it. That's rather the point. In this episode: – Why lead generation has been B2B's least-trusted discipline for 20 years – What "a tolerable level of mischief" really means, and why it isn't fraud – The "blind faith" model and the hierarchy of transparency – Why marketers tolerate poor-quality leads: the quota trap – How advertisers are part of the problem, not just the victims – The provenance questions every buyer should be asking their suppliers – Why "more leads will not be the answer" in the AI era Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Lead Generation Challenges 05:42 Transparency and Its Role in Trust 08:20 The Ambivalence of Stakeholders 11:26 Blind Faith in Lead Generation Practices 14:23 The Importance of Transparency in Data Collection 17:19 Navigating the Gray Areas of Lead Generation 18:22 Finding Fair Solutions for All Parties 21:37 Advertisers: Victims and Perpetrators 21:54 The Importance of Data Sharing 24:30 Data Decay and Its Impact on Performance 25:16 Trust and Transparency in Data Transactions 25:25 Generational Perspectives in Marketing 27:03 The MQL Mindset and Its Limitations 29:20 Dynamic Qualification of Leads 31:12 Managing Tolerances in Imperfect Systems 32:48 The Future of Lead Generation 36:23 Questions for Better Data Practices 39:56 The Ethical Implications of Data Sourcing 42:42 A Positive Outlook on Future Trends About the guest Robin Caller is the founder and CEO of Leadscale, a London-based lead generation and data quality business. He has spent more than two decades in lead and demand generation and is one of the industry's more outspoken voices on data quality, transparency and trust. Robin on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/robincaller/ About the podcast Trust & Influence in B2B is hosted by Joel Harrison, founder of Joel Harrison B2B. Each episode explores marketing strategy and practice with senior B2B practitioners, researchers and academics. Joel on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/ Enjoyed this episode? Follow the show in your podcast app and leave a rating or review – it helps other B2B marketers find it.

    Why lead gen is still B2B's trust free zone | How blind faith and 'tolerable mischief' underpins a global industry, with Robin Caller of Leadscale
  8. Jun 23

    Stop claiming you're the best! AI will mark you down for it | Tom Rudnai on winning influence in the age of Dark AI

    In this episode of Trust and Influence in B2B Marketing, Joel Harrison sits down with Tom Rudnai, Founder of Demand Genius and author of the Dark AI study — a research project that analyzed hundreds of AI prompt clusters across major B2B categories to map where brands are truly winning and losing influence. Tom's central finding is as counterintuitive as it is urgent: the more boldly a brand claims to be the best, the more likely AI is to quietly sideline it during the buyer conversations that shape outcomes. So where is influence actually earned in an AI-led world — and what should B2B marketers be doing differently? ➡️ Tom cuts through the noise with sharp, data-grounded thinking on why AI is not a search channel — and why treating it like one is one of the most costly mistakes in B2B marketing today. He introduces the "Dark AI" concept: the 84% of buyer conversations where no brand gets cited, yet where the problem framing, requirements, and shortlist criteria are already being quietly formed. He unpacks how AI enters exploratory mode at the top of the funnel — and why confident, directive brand language fails at the exact moment influence is most available. He also lays out the concept of information gain, arguing that original research, clear perspectives, and genuinely new knowledge are now the highest-value signals a brand can produce. From convergence patterns to what to actually measure, this conversation will challenge how you think about authority, content, and trust in modern B2B. Chapters: 00:00 - Introduction: Why Bold Positioning Can Backfire in AI Search 02:08 - Tom's Background and the Story Behind Demand Genius 03:59 - How Buyers Use AI Differently from Traditional Search 06:16 - The Dark AI Study: What It Measured and What It Found 10:30 - AI Visibility vs. AI Influence: The Iceberg Explained 13:18 - Convergence: How AI Narrows Down to a Recommendation 18:38 - Information Gain: The New North Star for B2B Content 22:11 - Why Confident Category Claims Fail in AI-Led Journeys 25:28 - What B2B Marketers Should Actually Be Measuring 30:49 - Patterns Across Categories and AI Models 33:22 - The One Takeaway Every Marketer Should Remember Follow Tom Rudnai, linkedin.com/in/tomrudnai demandgenius.ai If you care about making B2B marketing more meaningful, useful, and memorable, this conversation is for you. It's honest, reflective, and packed with takeaways that can help elevate your approach to thought leadership—whether you're a content creator, strategist, or brand leader. 🌐Visit Joel Harrison's website to explore exclusive reports, upcoming events, and join the B2B marketing community ➡️ https://www.joelharrisonb2b.com/ 💬What do you think comes first—insightful data or a compelling story? Let us know in the comments below. 🔔Subscribe to the channel for weekly insights, interviews, and on-the-ground perspectives from the world of B2B marketing. https://youtube.com/@JoelHarrison-B2B?sub_confirmation=1 📲Follow Joel Harrison and Trust & Influence in B2B across the web: LinkedIn ▶ https://linkedin.com/in/joelharrison/ Podcast ▶ https://trust-influence-in-b2b.captivate.fm/ Instagram ▶ https://instagram.com/joelharrisonb2b/ #JoelHarrisonB2B, #B2BMarketing, #ThoughtLeadership, #ContentStrategy, #MarketingTrends, #B2BContent, #BrandVsDemand, #Storytelling, #MarketingPodcast, #B2BInsights, #JoelHarrison, #B2BVideos, #B2BStrategy, #AISearch, #DarkAI, #AEO, #BuyerJourney, #InformationGain, #B2BGrowth, #AIMarketing, #DemandGeneration

    Stop claiming you're the best! AI will mark you down for it | Tom Rudnai on winning influence in the age of Dark AI

Ratings & Reviews

4.1
out of 5
7 Ratings

About

I’m Joel Harrison, founder of B2B Marketing.net (formerly B2B Marketing magazine) Propolis and the B2B Marketing Awards. It’s been my mission for the past 21 years to recognise, celebrate and evangelise for the amazing profession that is B2B marketing, which has evolved beyond that recognition in that time. In this podcast, I’ll be exploring what I believe is the biggest challenge facing B2B marketers today: Trust. Buyers have always been cynical, hard to reach and even harder to convince, and increasingly expect to be self-directed in their research. In other words, they only want to engage with you on their terms. As if that wasn't bad enough, media and content channels are fragmented whilst AI is opening the floodgates to a tidalwave of content of questionable quality and veracity. It all adds up to a crisis of trust in B2B. In this podcast, I'll be interviewing innovative and inspirational marketers in the front line of addressing this challenge, providing deep insights into the context of this challenge, exploring new insights about its implications and looking at real world solutions and success stories. I’ll be exploring this topic from every relevant angle and perspective, but I’m going to focus particularly on thought leadership, influencer marketing and advocacy as they have particular relevance to this challenge.