The Third Layer

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The Third Layer is crafted for family-owned business leaders who understand the intricacies of navigating a business where family and leadership intersect. Host, Marshall Lockton zeroes in on the greatest leadership lessons.

  1. 6 hr ago

    Wild Caught, Personally Shipped: Sena Wheeler on Redefining the Family Fishing Business

    In this episode of The Third Layer, host Marshall speaks with Sena Wheeler, co-founder of Sena Sea, about navigating a profound family legacy that traces back hundreds of generations to commercial fishermen in Norway. Sena shares the journey of evolving her family's historic Alaskan commercial fishing operations into a modern, direct-to-consumer enterprise. The conversation highlights the strategic decision to prioritize sustainability and value-add processing over mass volume, allowing the family to "do more with less" while delivering premium quality. Sena discusses the unique dynamics of running a business with her husband, Rich, detailing how they leverage their distinct strengths by dividing responsibilities between "out at sea" harvesting and "on land" marketing and logistics. She also emphasizes the importance of intentional family integration, bringing their teenage children onto the boats to instill a strong work ethic and build shared memories. For family business leaders, Sena's story is a compelling testament to the power of leaning into authentic heritage, adopting scalable models before crises hit, and utilizing deeply rooted family values to adapt an ancient trade for the modern marketplace. Key Themes: Evolving a Legacy Business Division of Strengths in Partnership Authentic Brand Storytelling Intentional Succession and Family Integration Sustainable Scaling Timestamps: 00:05 - Introduction of Sena Wheeler and Sena Sea 01:25 - Five generations of fishing, Norwegian roots 02:35 - Visiting Norway and the family's origins 03:17 - Norwegian immigrant community in Ballard, Seattle 04:37 - How Sena's father married into the fishing family 06:09 - Life aboard a fishing vessel and the seasonal lifestyle 07:32 - Evolution of trip lengths across generations 10:25 - Long lining explained: halibut and black cod fishing 15:19 - How fishing passed through the female side of the family 19:59 - Pivot to direct-to-consumer and Sena's food science background 22:49 - Why they chose DTC over traditional distribution 24:26 - Building a small processing facility and the 2020 sales surge 29:33 - Email marketing strategy and authentic family storytelling 31:54 - How Sena and Rich divide responsibilities 37:34 - Sustainability and regulation of Alaskan fishing 43:18 - Family legacy and reconfiguring generations of fishing for today Additional Resources: Shop with Sena: www.senasea.com Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn Follow PeopleForward Network on LinkedIn Learn more about PeopleForward Network

    45 min

  2. 18 Jun

    The OG Chicago Slice: Nick Perrino on Fighting Giants and Staying Family Owned

    In this episode of The Third Layer, host Marshall connects with Nick Perrino, Chief Revenue Officer at Home Run Inn, to explore the evolution of his family's century-old, Chicago-based pizza business. Now in its fourth generation, Home Run Inn has scaled from a Prohibition-era tavern into a massive restaurant and frozen food enterprise, but its success remains deeply anchored in its foundational values. Perrino highlights the complexities of multigenerational leadership, detailing how the family balances professional roles with family dynamics through intentional communication and robust conflict-management frameworks. He emphasizes the critical importance of a "learner mindset" and the courage to lean into discomfort, lessons powerfully reinforced during their massive operational pivot to double production during the COVID-19 pandemic. By hiring, firing, and operating strictly by their core values (Family, Pride, Grit, and Courage), Home Run Inn has created an environment of deep trust and high performance. For family business leaders, Perrino's reflections offer a powerful blueprint for aligning stakeholders, nurturing internal talent, and preserving legacy while adapting to immense market demands. Key Themes: Operationalizing Core Values Navigating Multigenerational Leadership Embracing the Learner Mindset Courage Over Comfort Scaling Through Crisis   Timestamps: 00:17 - Origin story of Home Run Inn, founded during Prohibition in 1923 02:03 - Launch of pizza in 1947 and the birth of tavern style pizza 06:38 - Current business scope: six restaurants, airport locations, and frozen pizza in all 50 states 08:00 - Market positioning as a family-owned brand competing against Nestle and Schwan's 09:30 - Nick's father Joe Perrino scaling the business from restaurants into frozen pizza 18:16 - Nick's career path outside the business at Sears Holdings and Power Play Distributors 25:23 - COO role during COVID and scaling production from 60,000 to 120,000 pizzas per day 33:33 - Core values: family, pride, grit, and courage 39:22 - Navigating family dynamics and professional roles within the C-suite 54:08 - Legacy: standing for what you believe in even when no one is following   Additional Resources: Connect with Nick on LinkedIn Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn Follow PeopleForward Network on LinkedIn Learn more about PeopleForward Network

    58 min

  3. 4 Jun

    Seven Generations Deep: Ben Etherington on Legacy, Trust, and Tin with Ben Etherington

    In this episode of The Third Layer, host Marshall speaks with Ben Etherington, a seventh-generation leader of Nathan Trotter & Co., North America's largest manufacturer of tin and solder and one of the longest-running continuously operating businesses in the United States. Ben shares the profound responsibility and unique dynamics of leading a historic enterprise deeply rooted in foundational Quaker values of honesty, modesty, and family. The conversation explores the evolution of the company, from its 1789 founding to modernizing operations through value-add manufacturing and the strategic construction of North America's only primary tin smelter. Ben delves into the complexities of a "five-headed monster" leadership model, shared equally between five partners across two different families. He emphasizes the absolute necessity of trust, consensus, and shared vision to make this structure work. He also candidly discusses the intrinsic pressures of inheriting a legacy. Namely, the drive to "not screw it up", and the delicate balance of preserving a strong family culture while driving necessary growth and evolution. For family business leaders, Ben's insights provide a compelling look into leveraging foundational values, strategic adaptability, and deep-rooted trust to fuel long-term performance. Key Themes: Multigenerational Leadership & Shared Authority Cultural Preservation vs. Business Evolution Building Trust as a Core Asset Acquisition Dynamics in Family Businesses Strategic Adaptability Leading by Example Timestamps: 00:02 - Introduction of Ben and Nathan Trotter & Co. 00:56 - Company overview: non-ferrous metals, plants, and products 02:30 - Founding story: Nathan Trotter established in 1789 in Philadelphia 03:04 - Quaker roots and their influence on business values 08:38 - Adaptability as a key to longevity: factoring, tariff response, world wars 11:44 - Seventh generation ownership and the Morris family partnership 12:42 - Grandfather's role and how Ben's father took over the business 16:03 - Ben's father's prerequisites for joining: exit plan, manufacturing, new energy 21:44 - Ben's background: Conestoga High School, University of Vermont, MBA at Denver, Accenture 23:19 - Decision to leave Accenture and join Nathan Trotter with brother Luke 28:10 - Five-partner leadership structure and how decisions get made 39:02 - Post-COVID tin shortage and the Department of Defense smelter grant 44:05 - Transformational impact of the Virginia smelter on the business 46:12 - Ben's leadership style: leading by example over rah-rah energy 51:19 - Legacy: making the right decisions daily and letting it shape itself Additional Resources: Visit the Nathan Trotter Website Reach out to Ben here: ben@nathantrotter.com Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn Follow PeopleForward Network on LinkedIn Learn more about PeopleForward Network

    55 min

  4. 21 May

    Built To Endure: Cameron Young On Resilience In Life And Leadership

    Cameron Young, a fourth-generation leader at Behler Young, shares lessons on resilience, leadership, and culture behind his family's nearly 100-year-old HVAC distribution business. He reflects on how strong family dynamics, adaptability, and a commitment to integrity have sustained long-term success. Cameron also opens up about overcoming a life-changing spinal cord injury in college, drawing parallels to his father's leadership during the 2008 financial crisis. His story highlights the importance of vulnerability, intentional succession planning, and shifting from individual dependency to building empowered teams. He emphasizes keeping founding stories relevant for today's workforce and investing in internal culture through leadership development, community involvement, and shared values, creating an environment where people perform at their best and drive lasting business growth. Key Themes Generational Resilience and Adaptability Vulnerable Leadership Modernizing the Legacy Intentional Succession Development Culture as a Performance Driver   Timestamps: 02:32 - Company growth and branch network expansion across Michigan 05:00 - Third generation, Doug Young, joins and leads the business 08:10 - Culture, honesty, and integrity as keys to 100-year longevity 12:27 - Spinal cord injury while studying abroad in Spain 15:21 - Mindset and recovery after the injury 21:50 - Great Recession impact on the business and parallel family hardships 25:32 - Resilience lessons from navigating both crises simultaneously 29:51 - Career at Steelcase and transition into the workforce post-injury 33:21 - Management training program and roles within Behler Young 36:04 - Behler Young MBA leadership development program for the fourth generation 42:33 - Community giving through the BY Cares program 52:52 - Cameron's personal legacy and what he hopes to model for others Additional Resources: Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cameron-young-94ba6612/ Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marshall-lockton-26369a1/ Follow PeopleForward Network on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/peopleforward-network/posts/?feedView=all Learn more about PeopleForward Network: https://peopleforwardnetwork.com/

    59 min

  5. 7 May

    Replay: The Ripple Effect: How Jeff Oddo's search for significance led to business transformation and growth

    In this episode, Jeff Oddo shares the journey of transforming his family's janitorial business into a nationwide franchise powerhouse. From early leadership failures and emotional burnout to rediscovering purpose through significance and servant leadership, Jeff reveals how vision, values, and vulnerability fueled massive growth. Learn how City Wide grew from one company to over 100 franchises, all rooted in culture, clarity, and the ripple effect.   Additional Resources: Jeff Oddo, President/CEO at City Wide Facility Solutions: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffoddo/ Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn Follow PeopleForward Network on LinkedIn Learn more about PeopleForward Network   Key Takeaways: True fulfillment in leadership comes from making a meaningful impact, not just financial gain. Jeff's early management mistakes taught him the value of humility, mentorship, and people-first leadership. Shifting from doing to teaching allowed Jeff to scale his business and serve more people through a replicable model. Clear processes and training manuals not only enabled growth, but also freed Jeff from micromanagement. Every franchisee is vetted on mission, vision, and values, because shared beliefs are the foundation of sustainable success.

    57 min

  6. 23 Apr

    Building Life Into Others: Ben Hutton on Teams, Clients, and Community

    In this insightful episode, Ben Hutton, President of Hutton, shares his transformative journey from a twelve-year-old shop sweeper to the leader of a thriving 400-person construction and facility services company. The conversation explores the unique challenges of second-generation leadership, specifically the pressure to emulate a founder's style. Ben candidly discusses his "3 a.m. moment"—a point of burnout caused by trying to lead with his father's forceful, operational approach rather than leaning into his own strengths. For family business leaders, this episode serves as a case study in self-awareness and organizational evolution. Ben details how he shifted from being a bottleneck to a visionary leader by identifying his "unique ability" and empowering a separate President to handle operations. The discussion dives deep into the rigorous work of discovering authentic core values, the power of storytelling to connect a dispersed workforce, and the necessity of defining success through the lens of purpose rather than just profit margins.   Key Themes Transitioning Leadership Styles The Power of Unique Ability Authentic Value Discovery Storytelling as Strategy Community as a Stakeholder Redefining Success Timestamps 03:26 - Early memories of the company and longtime employees who are still with Hutton today 08:05 - Returning to Wichita and building credibility through roles in operations, project management, and business development 12:22 - Growth from 80 to 400 employees and the realization that empowering others was the key to scaling 15:08 - Ben's burnout moment at 3 a.m. and the start of a leadership transformation 23:05 - Why leading through culture takes constant communication, story-sharing, and clarity of purpose 30:08 - Distilling the company's values into four words: Lead, Inspire, Respect, Construct 34:52 - Creating the company purpose statement and defining success around team members' dreams, clients' vision, and communities' future 44:05 - Tornado response story that showed both client care and deep care for a superintendent who lost his home 54:34 - Why community is a core stakeholder and how Hutton gives back through volunteer time and donated expertise 58:51 - Ben's professional and personal legacy: building an enduring company and loving his family well Additional Resources Connect with Ben on Linkedin Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn Follow PeopleForward Network on LinkedIn Learn more about PeopleForward Network

    1hr 2min

  7. 9 Apr

    Better Today, Better Together, Better Tomorrow: CoorsTek and the Power of Shared Leadership

    Jonathan Coors, Co-CEO of CoorsTek, details the evolution of a fifth-generation family enterprise that expanded from the iconic Coors brewery into a global industrial ceramics leader. Jonathan shares his personal journey from working in politics to navigating the family business, emphasizing the necessity of earning credibility through mentorship and humility. A central focus of the conversation is the family's innovative approach to succession: rather than selecting a single successor, they established an "Office of the CEO" comprising Jonathan, his brother, and his cousin. This structure leverages their complementary strengths, fosters robust strategic debate, and mitigates potential family conflict. Jonathan also discusses the critical role of values-based leadership. Viewing the company as a "marble masterpiece" to be shaped, and the importance of authenticity when leading a global workforce of 5,000. It provides actionable insights on stewardship, the strategic advantages of taking a company private, and the discipline required to ensure family assets grow for future generations.   Key Themes: Collaborative Governance (Office of the CEO) Strategic Patience & Privatization Stewardship vs. Ownership Feedback Loops in Family Firms Universal Values with Local Application   Timestamps: 07:46 - Why ceramics matter & how they enable modern technology 09:05 - Story of Adolf Coors & the founding of the brewery 12:33 - How Coors survived Prohibition & the role of entrepreneurship 13:03 - What drove the longevity of the Coors brand & family business 15:51 - Major growth milestones at CoorsTek, including acquisitions & global expansion 19:08 - Why CoorsTek went public briefly & then returned to private family ownership 36:09 - Creation of the three-person Office of the CEO & how the model works 48:25 - Leadership through culture, authenticity, & values in a 5,000-person global company   Additional Resources: Connect with Jonathan Coors on LinkedIn Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn Follow PeopleForward Network on LinkedIn Learn more about PeopleForward Network

    1hr 4min

  8. 26 Mar

    If You Dislike Change, You'll Dislike Irrelevance More: How Progress Luv2Pak Stayed Relevant for Over a Century

    Ben Hertzman, President of Progress Luv2Pak, shares the century-long evolution of the packaging company, from a family-run factory to a modern, diversified enterprise. After his father, David, acquired the business, it evolved from domestic manufacturing into a global sourcing operation, adapting to customer needs and changing markets. Hertzman emphasizes that lasting culture is built on trust and empowerment. After gaining experience at Procter & Gamble, Ben rejoined the company as a trainee and worked his way up, reinforcing a commitment to meritocracy and continuous learning. The company builds loyalty by investing in its people and creating growth opportunities. With the launch of Gather Packaging, Progress Luv2Pak has re-entered domestic manufacturing, strengthening supply chain resilience and positioning the business for its next chapter of growth.   Key Themes: Entrepreneurship Through Acquisition Strategic Transformation and Adaptability Leading Through Empowerment and Trust Internal Talent Development Full-Circle Strategy Intergenerational Transition   Timestamps: 03:20 - David acquires the box factory, beginning the family's ETA journey 04:30 - Growth through retail clients and the Trivial Pursuit boom 06:42 - Move from domestic manufacturing to global sourcing 09:04 - Innovation and adapting to industry change 12:32 - Early exposure to the business through factory visits and travel 17:08 - Leadership lessons from P&G on culture and accountability 19:02 - Returning as a trainee and rising to president 27:13 - Turning around a struggling division and earning trust 40:13 - Launching Gather Packaging and returning to U.S. manufacturing 45:29 - Defining legacy through caring for people and partners   Additional Resources: Connect with Ben on LinkedIn Connect with Marshall on LinkedIn Follow PeopleForward Network on LinkedIn Learn more about PeopleForward Network

    48 min
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The Third Layer is crafted for family-owned business leaders who understand the intricacies of navigating a business where family and leadership intersect. Host, Marshall Lockton zeroes in on the greatest leadership lessons.

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