Humans in the Loop

Seb Agertoft

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TECHNOLOGY

A podcast for thoughtful technologists. Seb Agertoft - Coach to tech company founders and leadership teams - interviews founders, technologists, artists, investors, thought leaders and policymakers wrestling with the tough questions at the forefront of emergent tech like AI, quantum computing, renewable energy, web3, blockchain, robotics and autonomous vehicles. Not just can we build it, but how to build tech with human interests at heart.

5 DAYS AGO

Alex Komoroske on the hacker ethic and pro-social tech

Alex Komoroske is one of the smartest voices out there talking about better forms of technology right now. He spent a long chapter of his career at the likes of Google and Stripe and is now the Founder and CEO of Common Tools, working on enabling decentralised technology. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Alex Komoroske's Perspective on Tech03:39 The Hacker Ethic and Disillusionment in Tech06:31 The Slide into Cynicism: A Cultural Shift in Tech09:12 Emergence and Coordination Complexity in Organizations11:40 Slime Molds: A Metaphor for Organizational Dynamics14:24 The Future of Incumbent Organizations17:24 The Same Origin Policy and Its Consequences20:06 Resonance vs. Hollowness in Technology22:50 The Resonant Computing Manifesto25:09 The Role of LLMs in Shaping the Future32:07 Unlocking the Power of LLMs35:40 The Role of Privacy in Resonant Computing37:09 Organizational Structures for Resonance42:24 The Importance of a Resonant Privacy Model46:38 Emergence and Resonance in Technology53:55 A Vision for the Future of Technology Links: Resonant computing manifesto Alex’s website Slime molds deck Alex’s ‘bits and bobs’ document The Same Origin Paradigm Get in touchInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/humansinthelooppodEmail: seb@theuncommonfounder.comPersonal website: https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

1 hr
13 JAN

Kevin Kelly on Flounder Mode and Optimism

How to describe Kevin Kelly? Founder of Wired Magazine. Writer of industry defining essays like '1000 true fans' - https://kk.org/thetechnium/1000-true-fans/Co-chair of The Long Now Foundation encouraging people to think on civilisational timescalesPassionate traveller and photographer whose travelled remote parts of Asia for the last 50 years - https://kevin2kelly.myshopify.com/products/colors-of-asia-a-visual-journeyThe subject of the brilliant term, coined by Brie Wolfson - Flounder Mode https://joincolossus.com/article/flounder-mode/And a dream podcast guest Kevin is known for many things, not least his optimism, but Kevin's flavour of optimism is what we calls 'protopian not utopian' - an acknowledgement that new technology creates major new problems but that over time we find ways to solve them Chapters 00:00 The Hollywood Approach to Career Paths 05:20 Pursuing Interesting Projects 07:46 Influence and Unique Contributions 10:38 Radical Optimism Explained 13:38 The Choice of Optimism 16:28 The Reality of Progress 19:05 Wrestling with Counter Narratives 21:54 Building Better Technology 28:18 Navigating Technology's Strengths and Weaknesses 30:54 The Ethics of Technology Creation 33:14 The Role of Corporations in Technology 36:04 The Necessity of Innovation in Addressing Problems 42:14 Long-Term Thinking and the Long Now Foundation 47:55 Envisioning a Desirable Future 53:11 Celebrating Cultural Heritage Through Photography Get in touch Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/humansinthelooppod Email: seb@theuncommonfounder.com Personal website: https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

55 min
16/12/2025

The Soft Technologies of Democracy with Ed Gillespie

Ed has spent his career thinking systemically about the future and consulting with governments and corporations on topics as varied as the environment, politics, healthcare and education. He's also the co-host of hit podcast 'Jon Richardson and the Futurenauts' alongside comedian Jon Richardson and fellow Futurenaut Mark Stevenson. Given Ed's varied expertise I wasn't quite sure where this conversation would go, but I needn't have worried. What unfolded was a great chat about climate, politics, and the soft technologies of technology that we need to make better use of to solve our toughest problems. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Ed's Work 04:22 The Role of a Futurist 07:17 Asking the Right Questions 10:23 The Politicization of Climate Change 13:12 The Transition to Renewable Energy 16:01 Motivations Behind Climate Action 18:57 The Economic Case for Renewables 22:01 The Challenge of Unburnable Carbon 25:17 Exploring Economic Models: Degrowth vs. Abundance 29:59 Grassroots Perspectives on Climate Action 34:43 Bystander Leadership: The Call for Courage 40:20 Finding Hope Amidst Challenges 46:41 Envisioning a Future of Bio-Regionalism

51 min
02/12/2025

Creative courage in big tech with Ben Lehnert, fmr design leader Microsoft and SAP

Benedikt Lehnert is former design leader at Microsoft and Chief Design Officer at SAP. He's had a seat at the top table in big tech and brings his own clear-eyed perspective based on that experience.I really enjoyed the conversation with Ben as we discussed the role of the designer in this current moment, the moral responsibilities of building business and technology, the hype cycles and weird incentives at play with the AI hyperscalers, and Ben's view that we should simply focus on adding more than we take. Chapters 00:00 The Evolution of a Designer 05:38 Navigating the Startup Journey 10:03 Transforming Microsoft: A Design Perspective 14:45 The Role of Chief Design Officer at SAP 20:14 Shifting Focus: From Big Tech to Teaching and Ethics 30:07 The Human Condition in Technology 38:35 AI and Humanistic Considerations 43:17 Learning from Poets and Thinkers 58:37 A Hopeful Vision for the Future Ben hosts the Poets and Thinkers podcast and you can find out more about him here: https://benediktlehnert.github.io/

1h 2m
18/11/2025

Talking to animals with Kate Armstrong

Summary In this conversation, I speak to Kate Armstrong, the Executive Director of InterSpecies Internet, about the latest advancements in how we communicate with animals through technology. Kate emphasizes the importance of planetary kinship and the responsibility humans have as advanced toolmakers to create beneficial tools for other species. The discussion also touches on real-world applications of interspecies communication, the complexities of wild animal communication, and the need for legal frameworks to protect animal rights. Throughout the conversation, Kate shares insights into the future of this field and the resources available for those interested in learning more. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Interspecies Internet 03:47 The Journey to Interspecies Communication 06:59 The Origin Story of Interspecies Internet 11:21 Understanding Interspecies Communication 14:19 The Importance of Interspecies Communication 17:17 Technological Applications in Interspecies Communication 19:52 Frontiers of Interspecies Communication 22:50 The Role of AI in Animal Communication 25:40 Exploring Communication Across Species 28:24 Anthropocentrism in Animal Communication 30:39 The Magic of Interspecies Communication 32:11 Domestic Animals as Communication Pioneers 36:18 Ethical Considerations in Animal Communication 38:45 Nature Rights and Legal Frameworks 44:53 The Future of Interspecies Communication Resources: https://www.interspecies.io/ TED talk

54 min
28/10/2025

Rewiring Democracy with Godfather of Cybersecurity and public interest technologist, Bruce Schneier

This episode features an OG in the world of internet security, the Godfather of Cybersecurity, Bruce Schneier. Bruce describes himself as a public interest technologist, and has done many things under that banner - run companies, lectured at Harvard, testified before Congress, authored over a dozen books, and written a blog for over 20 years that has more than 250k regular readers - to name just a few. Key topics: - The need for better technical minds in policy making - The implications of AI for democracy (not as bleak as you might expect - Bruce’s new book Rewiring Democracy goes deep on the emerging implications and he remains largely optimistic) - Why the internet was not designed with security in mind - Why prompt injection makes AI applications inherently insecure for high stakes tasks - Threat modelling for personal security in an age of geopolitics Chapters 00:00 What Bruce actually does 03:58 The Journey to Becoming a Public Interest Technologist 06:54 Understanding Cybersecurity and the Internet Today 09:36 Advice for Online Safety and Security 12:39 The Role of Governments in Data Privacy 15:41 Geopolitical Implications of Cybersecurity 18:35 Cyber-Physical Systems and Their Risks 21:49 The Impact of AI on Cybersecurity 24:27 Rewiring Democracy in the Age of Technology 30:08 The Evolving Landscape of Cybersecurity and AI 32:21 Understanding Prompt Injection Vulnerabilities 36:30 The Internet's Security Flaws and Historical Context 39:25 Capitalism's Role in Cybersecurity Failures 46:11 Skepticism Towards Web3 and Blockchain 48:37 Rewiring Democracy for the Information Age 55:27 Trust, Power, and the Future of AI in Governance You can find Bruce at www.schneier.com

58 min
07/10/2025

Tara Fung, Founder CO:CREATE - Life on the Frontier. Booms, busts & pivots

This episode features Tara Fung, co-founder of CO:CREATE - a digital platform for tattooing. Tara raised $25m in seed funding from A16z at the height of the NFT hype with a technical vision for how to scale that ecosystem, but ultimately ran into hard times as the market for NFTs collapsed. What followed was a journey into the unknown, seeking ways to successfully pivot the company into something they could build and scale. Tattoos aren’t necessarily the first thing that spring to mind when you think of vc-backed businesses, but Tara’s own experience of getting tattooed served as a point of inspiration for CO:CREATE, coupled with a willingness to explore beyond the typical playbooks. Key topics: Facing uncertainty as a FounderSupportive investorsPivoting your companyBeing sober about the nature of the startup gameTrust online Chapters 00:00 The Evolution of CO:CREATE 12:57 Navigating the Fundraising Landscape 19:04 Navigating Investor Relationships and Pivots 23:48 Motivation and Purpose in Entrepreneurship 30:00 Finding Clarity in Direction and Focus 32:16 Breaking the Playbook: A New Approach to Entrepreneurship 34:23 The Future of Trust in a Distrustful World 38:17 Navigating Attention and Discovery in the Digital Age 42:12 Ethics and Technology: Balancing Business with Societal Impact 43:00 Exploring Trust, Ethics, and Technology 45:29 Empowering Artists in the Tattoo Industry

47 min
08/09/2025

Granola AI Co-founder Sam Stephenson on designing for AI and Human Agency

This episode features Sam Stephenson, co-founder of ⁠Granola⁠ - one of the standout UK success stories in AI product building. Sam and I discussed his background as a designer, his journey to becoming a founder, the trajectory of the company so far, and shares his thoughts on designing for human agency and the future of work. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Granola and Its Purpose 02:33 Sam's Background and Design Journey 05:19 Influences from Communal Living 09:36 The Origin of Granola and Co-founder Dynamics 12:01 The Messy Process of Finding the Right Project 16:12 Simplicity in Product Design 19:11 Growth Trajectory and User Experience 21:45 Balancing Short-term and Long-term Goals 24:12 Navigating AI Development Challenges 26:50 Balancing Innovation and Practicality in AI 29:16 The Pressure of Rapid Growth in AI Startups 32:43 The Future of Work with AI Assistance 36:51 Reducing Coordination Complexity in Organizations 38:28 The Human Element in AI Interactions 41:01 Agency and Control in the Age of AI 43:31 Envisioning a High-Leverage Future with AI

45 min
05/08/2025

Artist founders and figuring out what AI is really for

In this conversation, I speak to William Morgan and Sylvan Rackham, the Co-Founders of Restless Egg, an incubator for Artist Founders, about the intersection of art, technology, and innovation. They discuss the concept of the 'artist founder', the challenges faced by creative technologists, and the need for a supportive infrastructure to foster their ideas. The conversation explores the role of institutions, funding sources, and the future of technology, particularly in relation to AI. They emphasize the importance of agency in technology and the potential for artist founders to create meaningful experiences that go beyond mere productivity enhancements. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Restless Egg 01:21 Artist founders 04:18 Discovering the Community of Creators 10:10 Key Players in the Artist Founder Ecosystem 14:37 The Role of Philosophy and Technology 20:31 Bridging Art and Technology 25:32 Defining the Artist Founder 28:24 The Future of AI and Experience 29:20 The Role of Artist Founders in E-commerce 32:41 Funding the Creative Frontier 36:58 The Shift in Investment Perspectives 41:03 The Future of Technology and Agency 44:29 AI: Tool or Evolutionary Break? 51:45 The Playful Nature of Innovation 58:59 Empowering Agency Through Technology Where you can hear more from William and Sylvan www.restlessegg.com William's substack Some of the organisations mentioned: AntikytheraRestless EggStrelkaMedialab Some of the people mentioned: Benjamin BrattonRefik AnadolDaisy GinsbergIan Cheng Other resources referenced: Sam Altman blog post about ideas peopleMy post about Creative OutsidersA piece written by friend and collaborator, Danya ShultsAn artificial history of natural intelligence

1h 4m

9 Episodes

A podcast for thoughtful technologists. Seb Agertoft - Coach to tech company founders and leadership teams - interviews founders, technologists, artists, investors, thought leaders and policymakers wrestling with the tough questions at the forefront of emergent tech like AI, quantum computing, renewable energy, web3, blockchain, robotics and autonomous vehicles. Not just can we build it, but how to build tech with human interests at heart.

Creator

Seb Agertoft
Years Active

2025 - 2026
Episodes

9
Rating

Clean
Copyright

© Seb Agertoft
Show Website

Humans in the Loop