Liminal Living Dr. Thomas J Rundel
-
- Religion & Spirituality
Welcome to the Liminal Living Podcast, where we dive deep into the realm of liminal spaces—those transitional phases where uncertainty is our companion. I'm your host and curator of conversations, Dr. Tom Rundel, and it's my pleasure to serve as your guide through these uncharted territories. With a doctoral background in spirituality and leadership from Portland Seminary, my research has centered on the spirituality found in the narratives of liminality in the Bible, but I have expanded my research to include other faith traditions and cognitive science. Since our launch in 2023, we've been dedicated to exploring the nuances of dark nights and deconstructions, but our journey expanded to include insights from a diverse array of modern-day thinkers and artists. Through a blend of stories, practices, and perspectives, we provide valuable guidance for fellow travelers navigating their own liminal spaces. So, join us as we embark on this journey and embrace the uncertainty in order to uncover the hidden wisdom that lies within the liminal spaces of life.
-
S3 E17: Tom Rundel: Arriving at 95% Certainty is Good Enough
"Have you ever wondered how much of what you believe to be true is actually influenced by the quirks of your own mind? In this solo episode of the Liminal Living podcast, we delve into the fascinating realm of cognitive biases and their impact on our perception of reality. We use Brian McLaren’s list of 13 cognitive biases that cloud our judgment, revealing how they shape our understanding of truth and certainty. Through a philosophical lens, we examine the notion of absolute certainty, suggesting that acknowledging the presence of biases allows us to embrace uncertainty with an open hand.
-
S3 E16: Chad Bahl: To Hell with Eternal Conscious Torment
Have you ever always hated the doctrine of eternal conscious torment but felt like it was too central to the faith to discard? Chad is the guy to talk to. Today we deconstruct the theology of ECT, discuss its origins, its evolution, and its future home in the proverbial lake of fire. We also discuss open and relational theology, evangelicalism, liminality, contemplation, and more views of the afterlife.
-
S3 E15: Ally Henny: I Won't Shut Up
Have you ever wondered how one finds their voice in a world that often seeks to silence them? Today, we're diving deep into that question with author and advocate-minister Ally Henny, as we explore her journey of resilience, faith, and empowerment.
-
S3 E14: Justin Lee: Coming out as Gay in the Southern Baptist Church
Have you ever been made the “prayer request” of a community because your story didn’t match the triumphal testimony narrative? Justin grew up in the Southern Baptist Church as a conservative labeled by his high school peers as “God boy.” He was handing out tracts, evangelizing, and really good at obeying purity culture rules when it came to women. Then he realized that he was gay. He went on a long journey of wrestling with faith and identity, and we talk about his story today.
For over 25 years, Justin Lee has been a leading voice in navigating contentious issues with depth and empathy. As the author of "Talking Across the Divide: How to Communicate with People You Disagree With—and Maybe Even Change the World," his work has been adopted as a college textbook, guiding students through areas of disagreement. Beginning his journey in the 90s as a spokesperson for Bridges Across the Divide, Justin later founded a nonprofit dedicated to fostering dialogue within Christian communities on LGBTQ issues, gaining international recognition for his efforts. His bestselling book, "Torn: Rescuing the Gospel from the Gays-vs.-Christians Debate," has solidified his reputation as a bridge-builder between progressives and conservatives. Justin's influence extends beyond his writing, as a co-host of three podcasts and a sought-after speaker featured in global media outlets. Now, he focuses on empowering individuals to apply strategic dialogue principles to diverse causes, maintaining a vibrant online presence through his YouTube channel and website at GeekyJustin.com.
You can preorder Justin’s book here: https://geekyjustin.com/books/torn-v2/
You can connect to Justin’s YouTube here: https://www.youtube.com/geekyjustin
Time Stamps for the episode:
02:48 Boardgame Geekdom
08:04 Board games are like cosplay
11:54 Growing up Baptist
17:13 Coming out into a culture war
23:49 Slow realization, “I am gay.”
30:10 Making peace with new identity
35:03 Accepting that I can’t become straight
41:34 the danger of failed testimony to group narrative
48:43 Wrestling with the clobber passages
55:26 Asking the gay community to help with our theology
1:00:43 weaponizing truth claims
1:05:46 teaching the beginners
1:09:17 dialogue with those ideologically opposed to you
All Music for this episode is provided by Axeltree -
S2 E13: Amy Fritz: Untangling Faith from the Evangelical Industrial Complex
Has your faith community become a breeding ground for spiritual abuse? Today I talk to Amy Fritz, host of the podcast "Untangled Faith," and we delve into the complexities of spiritual abuse within faith communities, drawing from her personal experiences and her husband's encounters while working for Dave Ramasey. Through occasional articles, Amy shares insights on faith, parenting, and simplifying life while fostering meaningful connections. In this insightful interview, she discusses pivotal moments in her faith journey, theological perspectives that reshaped her thinking, and sustaining practices that offer hope. Touching on topics like reorganized religion, abusive tactics, and the impact of the Evangelical industrial complex, Amy explores where the church could head in the next decade with honesty, humility, and openness. We also talk about failing religious leadership, and the transformation needed to address systemic issues within the church.
You can find Amy’s blog here: http://amyfritzwrites.com/
You can connect to Amy’s podcast here: https://untangledfaithpodcast.com/
Time Stamps for the episode:
02:39 Network and Connections
06:56 Reorganized religion
11:25 The abuse of “convert and convince” tactics
16:38 Failing religious leaders
22:59 Allergic of pastoral “leadership” culture
29:19 Leadership corruption
33:22 The Evangelical industrial complex
38:03 untangling faith from Evangelical industrial complex
42:50 The apocalypse we find ourselves in
49:02 Asking: what can we own, and help make right?
54:30 Trying church again
59:13 Walmart-ization of western church
1:04:23 Cannibalizing mega church campuses
All Music for this episode is provided by Axeltree -
S3 E12: Matthew Paul Turner: Finding Belonging after deconstruction
Have you struggled with finding community and belonging after deconstruction? Many do, because you are in a liminal space of development, unsure of who you are, what you believe, and therefore, who your people are. Matthew Paul Turner, no relation to Tina, has been on a journey of belonging that he illustrates with a new Children’s book, You Will Always Belong. Matthew takes deep spiritual truths around the concept of identity and makes them accessible to children, and therefore, that inner child in you that desires to belong. The starting place: learn to belong to yourself so that you know what people it is safe to belong to.
Matthew Paul Turner has traveled the globe as a photographer, journalist and humanitarian documentarian. But he has truly made his mark in the world of children's literature. The #1 New York Times bestselling author brings an unmatched gift for rhyme and powerful storytelling to his inspiring books for young readers. Whether documenting the struggles of impoverished communities through his non-profit work or capturing the stunning visuals of National Geographic's "The Story of God" series with Morgan Freeman, Turner has a keen eye for narratives that reveal the full depth of the human experience. With deliberate messages of hope, empowerment and unlocking the resilience of the spirit, his children's books blend lyrical prose with lessons that will captivate young minds. From the realities he's witnessed globally to the imaginations he aims to spark, Turner is a versatile storyteller using his talents to craft transformative tales for all ages.
You can find Mattthew’s book here: https://rb.gy/95yd5a
You can connect to Matthew’s many other works here: https://matthewpaulturner.com/
Time Stamps for the episode:
Time Stamps for the episode:
02:46 Beard Talk
06:43 Teenage Drivers
11:43 Matthew the Author
17:19 Writing children’s books for adults
23:29 Hurricane Katrina and shifting politics
29:45 The primacy of compassion
33:56 Changing political camps
38:57 Church as priest of capitalism
44:12 The violence of converting and convicting
49:26 The American Church needs humbling
55:56 Finding belonging
1:01:03 You belong, you do.
All Music for this episode is provided by Axeltree
All Music for this episode is provided by Axeltree