Marketing Room 101

Ben Norman
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  • MARKETING
  • EVERY TWO WEEKS

For every solid theory in marketing, there's somebody saying Gen-Z don't use shops. For every effective ad, there's a Cannes winner. And for every flash of real genius, there's a LinkedIn post from a growth hacking guru. As host, and self-appointed guardian, of Marketing Room 101, Ben Norman welcomes marketers from across the industry into a safe space to vent their frustration and confront their demons, with the chance to eliminate them forever.

  1. The death of everything with Tom Roach: Jellyfish Brand Strategy VP and effectiveness expert on the debates and dichotomies that plague marketing

    13 APR

    The death of everything with Tom Roach: Jellyfish Brand Strategy VP and effectiveness expert on the debates and dichotomies that plague marketing

    In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by ⁠Tom Roach⁠, VP of Brand Strategy at ⁠Jellyfish⁠ and one of the biggest names in creative effectiveness. In his 25 years in the industry, Tom has held top positions in leading agencies like BBH, adam&eveDDB and Leo Burnett, leading strategy for brands including the BBC, McDonald’s, Sainsbury’s, Lloyds Bank, KFC and Weetabix, whilst picking up Gold and Silver IPA Effectiveness Awards along the way. In this time, Tom has become well known for his contributions to the field of creative effectiveness in advertising, and in this conversation he and Ben cover… How Tom got a job from a blog postThe danger of false dichotomies in advertising, including Long vs Short (and why Gusto gets it right), Brand vs Performance (and the case for ‘and’ over ‘or’), Creative vs Non-Creative (as if it’s a choice), and AI vs Human (and how humans have always needed to use tools)Twin-axis creative consistency (and why you need both)The snake oil salespeople saying everything is dead (like SEO and TV)Freud’s ‘narcissism of small differences’ (the one thing Tom managed to teach Les Binet)How most marketing best practice is sales collateral, not science (according to Paul Feldwick)How social media could be amplifying division in marketingBrighter futures for juniors in the creative industryHow AI is creating new roles for the next generationThe best brothers question yet⁠Connect with host Ben Norman⁠ or subscribe to avoid missing new episodes of Marketing Room 101

    45 min
  2. The big debate with Elena Jasper: Marketing Architects CMO and podcaster on the Brand vs Performance debate, and the power of TV

    22 MAR

    The big debate with Elena Jasper: Marketing Architects CMO and podcaster on the Brand vs Performance debate, and the power of TV

    In this episode, host ⁠Ben Norman⁠ is joined by ⁠Marketing Architects⁠ Chief Marketing Officer, host of ⁠The Marketing Architects Podcast⁠, Triathlete, former Junior Olympics competitor, and all-round marketing effectiveness fiend, ⁠Elena Jasper⁠. Elena is best known for championing TV’s role in the modern media mix, whilst challenging outdated and inaccurate thinking that overlooks the potential power of TV for brands today. Elena and Ben discuss advertising’s obsession with short term results, why TV can do both the long and the short, and why we need to stop putting channels in boxes. Elena then busts some common marketing myths before deciding to banish the Performance vs Brand debate, whilst explaining why B2B and B2C aren’t really that different after all, why Brand might have a brand problem, and why we shouldn’t be so afraid of AI. Before leaving, Elena makes the case to bring back the belief in reach and having a little more fun, then Ben remembers some bad boots on a Swiss mountain, and Elena recalls a big Olympic moment.

    40 min
  3. Steve Harrison’s punch up: Adland’s Progressive Gaze author on kicking politics out of advertising and why DE+I has its demons

    27 FEB

    Steve Harrison’s punch up: Adland’s Progressive Gaze author on kicking politics out of advertising and why DE+I has its demons

    In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by Steve Harrison, the 18x Cannes Lions-winning copywriter, creative director, and author, described by Campaign as ‘the greatest direct marketing creative of his generation’. In recent years, Steve has become known for more than just his award-winning creative work. He has also challenged the creative industry’s abandonment of its commercial responsibility to clients, arguing that “the industry has drifted from commercial selling to social activism, at the expense of economic relevance.” Ben and Steve discuss his latest book, ⁠Adland’s Progressive Gaze: How UK Advertising Lost Sight of the People and Things That Matter Most⁠, and how the demise of purpose has led to the rise of the Progressive Gaze. Steve then makes the case for banishing the politicisation of the advertising industry and explains why the obsession with diversity and inclusion might be making the industry less diverse and inclusive, as well as why so many people are afraid to challenge the Progressive Gaze. Ben and Steve also discuss the challenges facing the working class in marketing, why Steve still feels impostor syndrome after five decades in the industry, and what he wouldn't do with £3,000.

    42 min
  4. Ian Whittaker’s war is overquantification: Industry analyst & adviser on seeing the bigger picture

    2 FEB

    Ian Whittaker’s war is overquantification: Industry analyst & adviser on seeing the bigger picture

    In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by analyst and adviser to the media, technology and creative industries, Ian Whittaker, who, having gained over 20 years’ experience in the world of finance as an Equity Research analyst (including winning CityAM’s Analyst of the Year… twice), now brings a unique perspective to business in the marketing world through his consultancy Liberty Sky Advisors, and his subscription briefing for senior leaders, The Bigger Picture. Ben and Ian discuss the importance of marketers stepping back from spreadsheets and dashboards to see the wood for the trees, how to speak the language of the boardroom, and why we need to be more concrete in quantifying results. In a complicated landscape, Ben doesn’t ask Ian to predict what will change for marketers throughout 2025 and beyond, but instead asks what isn’t likely to change. Spoiler alert: He believes people, and agencies, still have a place in the world of AI. Ian explains why agencies need to refocus on their core competencies and fight on their own battlefield, instead of trying to fight the tech giants on their turf, and then chooses to banish ‘overquantification in marketing’ before returning ‘understanding a client’s business’ to the industry. Ian also explains what the Vietnam War can teach us about misguided metrics, what we can learn from Sun Tzu about the Tech vs Creative battle, and why future war historians might look back at the present day with interest.

    40 min
  5. Arjen Klinkenberg has a wobble: Tony's Chocolonely Creative Director & Brand Guru on creative disruption for start-ups

    09/12/2025

    Arjen Klinkenberg has a wobble: Tony's Chocolonely Creative Director & Brand Guru on creative disruption for start-ups

    In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by ‘that guy thatbuilt that Tony’s brand’ - Arjen Klinkenberg (or ‘Klink’ as he is known) - who created the first Tony’s Chocolonely wrapper design in just 10 minutes and gave up his day job to join the ‘impact-first’ chocolate business as Creative Director and Brand Guru for almost 20 years, before setting up his creative brand consultancy ‘Klink’ earlier this year. Klink and Ben discuss creativity in unexpected places, why small disruptive start-up teams need a shared idea of where they want to go, if they want to be the ‘mosquito in the room’, and why having no idea what you’re doing, can be the biggest advantage of all. Ben asks Klink about the balance between personality and purpose, before Klink makes the case for the execution of shelf wobblers in an unexpectedly impassioned rant, and the return of novelty and nonsense in your product and communications. Finally, Ben’s brother admits to some undeclared corporate benefits, Klink swears a lot and Ben talks about penguins.

    35 min
  6. An advent surprise: Tony's Chocolonely and the empty door drama

    08/12/2025 ·  BONUS

    An advent surprise: Tony's Chocolonely and the empty door drama

    A special episode of Marketing Room 101, to celebrate the Tony's Chocolonely 8th December advent drama. ⁠Click here⁠ to find out more about the issues of unfairness and exploitation in the chocolate industry.

    1 min
  7. Nick Eagle in real life: Advertising photographer on quality over convenience and the power of people

    17/11/2025

    Nick Eagle in real life: Advertising photographer on quality over convenience and the power of people

    In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by perhaps the friendliest man in advertising - Nick Eagle - the photographer from Sheffield, Yorkshire, whose relaxed and down-to-earth approach has led him to shoot huge campaigns for iconic brands like The BBC, Paddy Power, and Manchester United across the globe. Nick and Ben recall the worst shoot ever and discuss the challenges and joys of the unexpected situations commercial photography creates. Nick also explains why, after years of working with heroes and national treasures like Erling Haaland, Clare Balding, and Anthony Joshua, he believes the real skill in photography is not in pressing the button, especially when shooting portraits. Nick shares why shooting his local football club, Sheffield United, stands alongside working on Sky Sports’ biggest ever out-of-home campaign as one of his proudest moments. He also makes the case for prioritising quality over efficiency in image making, discusses why he thinks AI is similar to VAR in football, and explains why meeting in person is always worth the effort. Finally, Ben’s brother recalls a chicken being thrown through a window, Nick talks about a man in a skip, and Ben declares his love for rubbish working men’s clubs in nondescript places.

    34 min
  8. Lindsey Clay’s meta analysis: Thinkbox CEO on modern media, the power of TV and her love of jingles

    20/10/2025

    Lindsey Clay’s meta analysis: Thinkbox CEO on modern media, the power of TV and her love of jingles

    In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by Lindsey Clay, CEO of Thinkbox, the UK’s marketing body for commercial TV, and perhaps the industry’s most passionate voice for the power of television advertising. Before joining Thinkbox, Lindsey worked at some of the UK’s leading agencies including McCann Erickson and JWT, and today she continues to shape the industry as a Fellow of the Marketing Society, an Honorary Fellow of the IPA, and a proud member (and former President) of WACL. Lindsey and Ben discuss the industry’s obsession with technology, why that’s coming at the expense of creativity, and what’s changed in TV in the 20 years since Thinkbox was created, before discussing the problem of gender equality in senior leadership, and what needs to change to get a 50/50 gender split amongst CEOs. Ben presents Lindsey with some common myths from self-proclaimed tech gurus and TV critics, before Lindsey makes the case to temporarily banish advertising on Meta, why brands need to think before they invest and what would really needs to change to create a level playing field. Finally, Lindsey has a good old sing-song, Ben reminisces over Chicken Tonight and Linsey regrets pregnant paintballing. Links discussed in the episode: Channel 4 – Mirror on Masculinities Thinkbox – Context Effects Thinkbox - Nickable Charts Thinkbox – TV Masters Training

    37 min
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About

For every solid theory in marketing, there's somebody saying Gen-Z don't use shops. For every effective ad, there's a Cannes winner. And for every flash of real genius, there's a LinkedIn post from a growth hacking guru. As host, and self-appointed guardian, of Marketing Room 101, Ben Norman welcomes marketers from across the industry into a safe space to vent their frustration and confront their demons, with the chance to eliminate them forever.

Information

  • Creator
    Ben Norman
  • Years Active
    2024 - 2026
  • Episodes
    30
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © Ben Norman 2024
  • Show Website
    Marketing Room 101

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