Welcome to the Leading Edge in Emotionally Focused Therapy, hosted by Drs. James Hawkins, Ph.D., LPC, and Ryan Rana, Ph.D., LMFT, LPC—Renowned ICEEFT Therapists, Supervisors, and Trainers. We're thrilled to have you with us. We believe this podcast, a valuable resource, will empower you to push the boundaries in your work, helping individuals and couples connect more deeply with themselves and each other. In this episode of The Leading Edge in EFT, James Hawkins and Ryan Reyna tackle one of the trickiest tensions in therapy: how to work with distortion and meaning-making without gaslighting your client—especially tender pursuers and highly protected withdrawers. Using a vivid “watermelon vs. hot sauce” metaphor, they unpack what happens when one partner intends care, but the other receives danger. They explore why the brain distorts on purpose in the name of survival, how to keep honoring the client’s emotional reality, and how to redirect blame away from partners and back to the negative cycle as the true enemy. You’ll hear a powerful reframe that replaces the potentially invalidating, “What’s the story you’re telling yourself?” with a cleaner, safer question: “When you see Trigger X, what message does the cycle send to you about how your partner sees you?” James and Ryan apply this lens not just to couples, but also to race, marginalization, and societal conversations, illustrating how attempts to “correct the facts” can land as gaslighting when bodies are carrying generations of threat. They share moving examples of Stage 2 and Stage 3 work where partners begin catching and correcting the cycle on their own—creating “cycle killer” moments that change everything. If you’re an EFT therapist, trauma-informed clinician, or a partner trying to understand your own reactions, this episode will help you honor emotion, respect meaning-making, and still gently face distortion—without shaming or silencing anyone. Top Takeaways “Distortion” in EFT ≠ Fake or Irrational Emotion Emotions are never irrational; they always make sense in context. What may be “distorted” is the meaning-making or thinking, not the feeling. Watermelon vs. Hot Sauce Metaphor One partner offers something meant to be sweet and refreshing (watermelon). The other experiences it as danger or attack (hot sauce). This gap often comes from old injuries, expectations of being hurt, and the cycle, not badness in either partner. Why “What’s the Story You Tell Yourself?” Can Feel Like Gaslighting Although poetic, it can land as, “This is just in your head; you’re making it up.” For pursuers especially, this repeats a long history of being told they’re “too much” or “misreading reality.” A Safer, Cleaner Clinical Question Instead of: “What’s the story you’re telling yourself?” Use: “When you see Trigger X, what message does the cycle send to you about how your partner sees you?” This question: Honors the client’s internal world and logic. Externalizes the problem to the cycle, not the partner. Protects both partners from blame and shame. The Cycle as the Real Distorter The negative cycle becomes the “third entity” that scrambles messages. Seeing the cycle as the enemy helps the therapist stay out of the triangle and helps partners fight the cycle, not each other. Expected Pain Is Real Pain (Jim Coan’s Research) The brain responds to anticipated threat almost as if it already happened. So even if words are technically “distorted,” the body’s reaction is real and valid. The limbic system amplifies signals to protect, not to be dramatic. Clinical Target: Lean Into Pain, Not Cognitive Correction If you pivot too fast to “self-reflection” or cognitive reframe, you may move away from the raw pain where the best enactments live. Staying with the pain supports deeper Stage 2 work and more powerful enactments. Personal vs. Clinical Use of Self-Reflection Personally, it’s healthy to ask, “Is this really what they meant, or is this my story?” Clinically, putting that question on the client too soon can feel invalidating and gaslighting. Application to Race, Marginalization, and Power When someone names patterns of racism or marginalization, responding only with “facts” and statistics often lands as, “You’re crazy; that’s not real.” Bodies encode generational and societal cycles, so their threat response has good reasons. Saying, “I can see good reasons your brain codes it this way,” is deeply regulating and dignifying. Stage 2 & Stage 3: “Cycle Killer” Moments In de-escalated couples, partners begin to say things like: “This might be my stuff coming up, but here’s what happens for me…” “You don’t have to put that part of you away—let’s make space for your fear and my optimism.” These are Stage 3 moments where partners catch and correct the cycle themselves—sometimes without therapist intervention. Therapist Posture: Genuine Blame on the Cycle Effective EFT therapists truly believe that “this is the cycle, not their character.” Repeated exposure to Stage 2/3 couples reshapes the therapist’s internal frame, making it easier to hold the externalized cycle under pressure. Therapist Self-Care and Embodiment Therapy is hard on bodies, not just minds. Ryan and James emphasize physical health practices (walking, gym, etc.) as non-optional for therapists. Our bodies are the instrument we bring into the room. From the Couch to the Culture The same principles that de-escalate couples can transform societal conversations—about race, oppression, and power. As Bruce Perry urges, therapists are invited to take what they witness in session and amplify it into the world We aim to equip therapists with practical tools and encouragement for addressing relational distress. We're also excited to be part of the team behind Success in Vulnerability (SV)—your premier online education platform. SV offers innovative instruction to enhance your therapeutic effectiveness through exclusive modules and in-depth clinical examples. Stay connected with us: Facebook: Follow our page @pushtheleadingedge Ryan: Follow @ryanranaprofessionaltraining on Facebook and visit his website James: Follow @dochawklpc on Facebook and Instagram, or visit his website at dochawklpc.com George Faller: Visit georgefaller.com If you like the concepts discussed on this podcast you can explore our online training program, Success in Vulnerability (SV). Thank you for being part of our community. Let's push the leading edge together!
