In the 1970s, Richard Ryan and Ed Deci ran experiments on what rewards do to motivation. They found that people did what they were asked, but were less motivated by rewards that felt like control. Behaviorists pushed back, but the evidence piled up over time, and today researchers apply self-determination theory in workplaces, classrooms, and sport. In this episode, Dart and Richard discuss what autonomy, competence, and relatedness actually mean, why rewards that feel like control can undermine motivation, and how to translate this into the design of work. Richard M. Ryan is President of the Center for Self-Determination Theory and a professor at Australian Catholic University’s Institute for Positive Psychology and Education. A clinical psychologist, he co-developed self-determination theory, which explains how autonomy, competence, and relatedness shape motivation and wellbeing. In this episode, Dart and Richard discuss: - What behaviorism left off the map - Why rewards can undermine motivation - From carrot and stick to real commitment - Is competence about winning or growing? - Are some people "coin operated"? - What a controlling boss never asks - Can pay support people, not push them? - The bonus that backfires - The three rules behind the theory - And other topics… Richard M. Ryan is Professor Emeritus of Psychology at the University of Rochester, where he earned his PhD in clinical psychology and served as director of clinical training. He is a professor at the Institute for Positive Psychology and Education at Australian Catholic University, a Distinguished Professor at Ewha Womans University in Seoul, and has led the Center for Self-Determination Theory since 2015. He began working with Edward Deci in 1977 and is co-author, with Deci, of Self-Determination Theory: Basic Psychological Needs in Motivation, Development, and Wellness. Resources Mentioned: Richard's Book, Self-Determination Theory: Basic Psychological Needs in Motivation, Development, and Wellness: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1462538967 Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us, by Daniel H. Pink: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1594484805 Designing Your Life: How to Build a Well-Lived, Joyful Life, by Bill Burnett and Dave Evans: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1101875321 Self-Determination Theory website: https://selfdeterminationtheory.org/ Connect with Richard: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/richardmryan/ Work with Dart: Dart is the CEO and co-founder of the work design firm 11fold. Build work that makes employees feel alive, connected to their work, and focused on what’s most important to the business. Book a call at 11fold.com.
