Inorganic Podcast

Christian Hassold & Ayelet Shipley
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Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold host the Inorganic Podcast. Ayelet and Christian have combined 20 years of experience helping venture and private equity sponsors execute mergers and acquisitions in SaaS and digital agencies in the U.S. and Europe. On this podcast, Ayelet and Christian discuss M&A strategy, sourcing tactics, and other dynamics around mergers and acquisitions. They also report on market activity, emphasizing larger companies buying smaller SaaS or agencies and discussing the rationale behind the deals and economics. We sometimes invite guests to join our discussion, building on our mission to make the art and science of M&A more transparent for buyers, sellers, and financial sponsors. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

  1. E51: The Origination Edge: How Herringbone is Buying Agencies at Velocity

    MAR 12

    E51: The Origination Edge: How Herringbone is Buying Agencies at Velocity

    Summary In this episode, Azim Nagree, head of M&A at Herringbone Digital, shares insights on building a successful origination engine, the importance of early and honest communication in M&A, and how agencies can prepare for sale by focusing on retention, growth, and profitability. Takeaways Open and honest conversations early in the process streamline deals.Retention rate of 80% is a key indicator of business health.Growth of 15-20% and EBITDA of 20-25% are desirable benchmarks.AI should improve core business metrics to add value.Founders should focus on building a strong foundation before sale. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Milestone Celebration 01:10 Azim Nagree’s Background and Herringbone's Focus 05:42 Herringbone's Acquisition Strategy and Ideal Targets 07:49 Relationship with Private Equity and Deal Support 09:21 Lessons from Deal Experience and Early Communication 13:43 Deal Origination Process and Tech Stack 15:00 Defining the Prospect Universe and Narrowing the Buy Box 16:33 Balancing Organic and Broker Deal Sourcing 18:43 Assessing Seller Readiness and Valuation Expectations 20:01 Using the 'Magic Number' to Evaluate Sellers 23:57 The Triangle of Value: Retention, Growth, Profitability 25:21 Evaluating EBITDA and Adjusted EBITDA 28:57 Retention and Growth Benchmarks for Agencies 29:59 The Leaky Bucket Problem in Agencies 30:05 Identifying Signs of Retention Issues 30:36 Impact of AI on Agency Valuation and Performance 34:09 Common Mistakes Before Selling an Agency 35:36 Advice for Founders Considering Exit 36:47 Managing Communications with Potential Buyers 39:51 Closing Remarks and Key Takeaways Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured Connect with Azim Nagree on LinkedIn Herringbone Digital - https://herringbonedigital.com  Azim Nagree on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/azimnagree/  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

    41 min
  2. E50: From Acquired Founder to Serial Acquirer at Veza Digital

    FEB 25

    E50: From Acquired Founder to Serial Acquirer at Veza Digital

    In this episode, Yannick Lorenz uncovers his remarkable transition from building Shadow Digital to leading Vesa Digital’s aggressive M&A and growth strategy. He talks openly about the ups and downs of agency life, the importance of building a sellable business, and stepping into a strategic role in acquisitions—all fueled by lessons learned the hard way. Key Topics: How Yannick built Shadow Digital from a freelance side hustle into a successful agencyThe pivotal moment when he realized the value of making his business sellableThe lessons learned from hitting rock bottom during a major agency crisis in 2020The unique approach Vesa Digital takes to agency roll-ups and the concept of the VAN (Vesa Agency Network) strategyCreative deal structures and the importance of leaving chips on the table during acquisitionsHow Yannick is leveraging his CEO experience to now lead Vesa’s inorganic & M&A effortsThe impact of self-sourcing deals and avoiding traditional private equity pathwaysNavigating culture fit, valuation, and deal negotiations with foundersPractical advice for founders about financial literacy, recurring revenue focus, and deal-making mindset Timestamps: (0:13) The rapid evolution of Claude AI and setting up local coding interfaces (1:27) The magic of task stacking versus answer approximation in Claude (3:05) Introducing Yannick Lorenz and his entry into agency growth and exit (4:26) Yannick’s background: from Germany to founder in California (6:10) Building Shadow Digital: from side hustle to agency (8:38) The turning point: landing a $20,000 deal and scaling (11:26) Navigating the 2020 crisis and the push toward specialization (12:24) Scaling rapidly with Webflow before the crash (13:47) A major realization: building a business to sell and the importance of cash flow (15:15) How Yannick connected with Vesa during a cold outreach mistake (17:19) The evaluation process: fit, culture, and professionalism (20:05) From lifestyle agency to a growth-focused exit plan (22:14) Strategies for leaving cash in the business before an exit (23:23) Reflecting on the emotional rollercoaster of entrepreneurship (25:21) Learning the inorganic & M&A game from top experts (27:48) Vesa’s current inorganic growth strategy and future plans (29:55) Creative deal structures in agency acquisitions ($500K–$1M range) (34:15) Lessons on being an empathetic versus aggressive acquirer (36:25) Why financial literacy and recurring revenue are vital for deals (38:35) How interested founders can connect with Yannick for opportunities Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured Connect with Yannick Lorenz on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/shadowyaya/ Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

    39 min
  3. E49: Silicon Valley's Next Target: Agencies, plus Details on the New Engen+Grapevine.ai Deal

    FEB 9

    E49: Silicon Valley's Next Target: Agencies, plus Details on the New Engen+Grapevine.ai Deal

    In this episode, we explore the rising influence of AI in marketing agencies, the implications of tech-forward agency models, and recent high-profile acquisitions like Grapevine AI. Discover how private equity and Silicon Valley are reshaping agency valuations, deal structures, and the future of the industry. Key TopicsThe emergence of AI-native agencies as highlighted by Y Combinator's 2026 request listHow agencies are evolving to resemble software companies with higher margins and scalabilityThe challenges traditional agencies face integrating innovative, tech-led modelsTrends in agency valuations, deal structures, and the influence of private equityAn in-depth analysis of the recent Grapevine AI acquisition and its significanceThe shifting landscape of deal valuation, cash on close, and deal structure for tech-forward agenciesThe barriers to adopting AI and modern practices within conservative client organizationsThe strategic rationale behind merging creator economies with AI-enabled marketing solutions Timestamps00:00 - Building custom Claude bots and the evolution of OpenClaw 02:12 - Silicon Valley’s focus on AI-native agencies 03:00 - How agencies will become more like software companies 03:50 - The landscape of traditional vs. modern, tech-forward agencies 07:02 - Private equity's view on services versus software investments 09:40 - Recent acquisitions: New Engine’s Grapevine AI and other strategic moves 11:32 - What makes Grapevine AI unique in creator-led content 14:10 - The impact of deal structure and valuation rigor in AI agency acquisitions 17:23 - How founders are pushing for tech-led valuations and lower risk models 18:16 - The challenges of adapting legacy agency models to AI-driven futures 20:11 - Industry response and what’s next for agency deal activity Resources & LinksGrapevine AINew EngineY Combinator - 2026 Startups List (scroll to #3)LinkedIn - Caroline LaVere Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

    21 min
  4. E48: Scaling a Global Marketplace Agency ft. Travis Johnson, co-founder, Podean

    JAN 31

    E48: Scaling a Global Marketplace Agency ft. Travis Johnson, co-founder, Podean

    In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, hosts Christian Hassold and Ayelet Shipley are joined by Travis Johnson, co-founder and Global CEO of Podean, to talk about the incredible story behind the one of the rising star Amazon and marketplace retail media agencies, which is now backed by Mountiangate. The conversation explores the origin of Podean, their successful search for private equity backers, their acquisition of Commerce Canal and their broader point of view on  the opportunities in the retail media and marketplaces business. Travis shares insights on how Podean differentiates itself by offering integrated solutions that address not just media performance but also the broader operational needs of brands in the marketplace. He emphasizes the importance of understanding consumer behavior and the necessity for brands to adapt to the changing dynamics of e-commerce. Takeaways Podean was founded to bridge gaps in the retail media landscape.Retail media is becoming increasingly important for brands.Global consistency is a priority for large brands.Podean's growth strategy includes a focus on social commerce.The partnership with Mountain Gate Capital aims to enhance Podean's capabilities.Navigating the M&A process requires careful preparation and cultural alignment.AI is seen as a transformative tool, but its implementation must be thoughtful.Future growth for Podean includes strategic acquisitions to enhance service offerings. Chapters 02:28 Travis Johnson’s Background & Podean 04:55 Retail Media Today & Holdco Limits 08:00 Building a Global Marketplace Business 10:41 Social Commerce & Live Shopping 11:19 Winning Clients from Holdcos 12:47 Early M&A Talks & Learning Private Equity 16:00 Choosing the Platform Model & Mountaingate 19:08 Control, Governance & Valuation Realities 23:57 Strategic Buyers vs. Private Equity 28:26 Commerce Canal: The Right Acquisition 31:13 Closing Two Deals & Integration 39:24 Using AI Without the Hype 45:37 Growth Strategy & What’s Next Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured Connect with Travis Johnson https://www.linkedin.com/in/travis-johnson77/  Follow Podean on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/company/podean/  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

    49 min
  5. E47: Solving Problems Through Acquisition ft. Tom Shipley

    JAN 15

    E47: Solving Problems Through Acquisition ft. Tom Shipley

    In this engaging episode, co-hosts Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold welcome Tom Shipley to share his journey of building and scaling businesses through acquisitions. He discusses the challenges and opportunities in mergers and acquisitions (M&A) present, emphasizing the importance of strategic thinking and relationship building. The conversation also explores partnership dynamics and the role of external partners in resolving conflicts. Tom highlights the power of acquisitions in overcoming business challenges and achieving growth, offering insights into the process of identifying and acquiring businesses. Takeaways Acquisitions can solve almost every business challenge.Partnership dynamics often require external mediation.Strategic thinking is crucial in M&A.Building relationships is key to successful acquisitions.Acquisitions offer a faster path to business growth.Understanding seller motivation is essential in deals.Partnership conflicts can hinder business progress.Acquisitions can provide liquidity and strategic opportunities. Chapters 00:46 Tom Shipley’s Path Into M&A 01:38 The First Acquisition That Changed Everything 05:34 Using Acquisitions to Solve Cash and Capability Gaps 08:28 Buy vs. Build: Rethinking Entrepreneurship 09:37 Seller Motivation and Why Deals Exist Everywhere 11:50 Organic Growth vs. Acquisition Math 13:41 Partnership Misalignment as a Growth Blocker 14:21 How M&A Can Resolve Partner Deadlock 19:26 Mergers as a Reset for Growth and Liquidity 28:40 The Valley of Despair for Mid-Market Founders 29:45 Buying the Next Chapter vs. Starting Over 31:50 Where to Find Acquisition Opportunities 37:49 Adding a Zero: Expanding the Mental Model 39:44 DealCon, Reources, and Community Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured Connect with Tom Shipley https://www.linkedin.com/in/t-shipley/ Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

    41 min
  6. E46: The UK Independent Agency Scene w/Robin Skidmore, CEO Journey Further

    JAN 8

    E46: The UK Independent Agency Scene w/Robin Skidmore, CEO Journey Further

    In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, co-host Christian Hassled interviews Robin Skidmore, a seasoned entrepreneur and the founder and CEO of Journey Further. They discuss Robin's journey from humble beginnings to founding successful agencies, including Epiphany Search and Journey Further. The conversation explores the evolution of Journey Further, its recent acquisition of Salderson Media, and the challenges of expanding into the U.S. market. Robin shares insights on agency culture, the current state of the UK agency market, and the importance of adapting to changes in consumer behavior and technology, particularly AI. The episode concludes with a discussion on Robin's investments in startups and the significance of maintaining a strong company culture as the agency grows. Takeaways Robin Skidmore's entrepreneurial journey began with a car wash at age 12.Journey Further was launched in 2017 with a clear roadmap for growth.The agency focuses on performance media and aims to be creatively driven.Acquisition of Salderson Media was strategic for expanding capabilities.Expanding to the U.S. market presented unique challenges and cultural differences.Maintaining a strong company culture is crucial for agency success.The UK agency market is experiencing consolidation and increased competition.AI is transforming the marketing landscape, requiring agencies to adapt.Investing in startups allows for a deeper understanding of client challenges.Cultural dynamics influence agency operations and client relationships. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Robin Skidmore and Journey Further 02:14 Robin's Entrepreneurial Journey and Epiphany Search 04:52 The Evolution of Journey Further 08:13 Acquisition of Salderson Media and Market Relevance 10:32 Expanding to the U.S. Market: Challenges and Insights 17:31 Cultural Differences in Agency Operations 20:16 Lessons from Epiphany to Journey Further 23:29 The State of the UK Agency Market 26:21 Future Growth Strategies and Inorganic Expansion 30:28 Cultural Dynamics in Agency Growth 34:21 Investments Beyond Agencies: The Pub and Startups 41:22 Maintaining Culture and Addressing AI Challenges Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

    51 min
  7. E45: M&A Frenzy in the AI Era

    JAN 4

    E45: M&A Frenzy in the AI Era

    In this episode, co-hosts Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold delve into AI related acquisitions, particularly focusing on outsized valuation multiples and whether they are sustainable or extensible to the digital agency sector. They discuss the valuation multiples seen in recent AI focused acquisitions led by Meta, Nvidia, Cvent, and OpenAI, and opine on the race for talent in the AI era. The conversation highlights the evolving landscape of agency capabilities in the face of AI advancements and the potential for consolidation in the market. The hosts also explore the future of digital agencies and the opportunities that lie ahead for strategic acquirers in the AI domain. Takeaways AI is driving significant M&A activity in the tech sector.Recent acquisitions show high valuation multiples for AI companies.The trend of acquiring talent over products is prevalent in AI M&A.Digital agencies must adapt to the changing landscape influenced by AI.There is a potential consolidation in the agency market due to AI advancements.Strategic acquirers are looking for speed to market through AI capabilities.The valuation of AI startups is often based on capital raised rather than revenue.The market for AI capabilities in agencies is still developing.Founders may need to be realistic about their exit multiples in the current environment.The future of digital agencies will be shaped by AI innovations. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to AI Trends 01:03 M&A Activity in AI 05:16 Valuation Multiples in AI Acquisitions 11:00 The Talent Acquisition Race 15:18 AI's Impact on Agencies 19:07 Future of Digital Agencies 25:01 Opportunities in AI Acquisitions Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

    31 min
  8. E44: Inside a Social Media Agency Pioneers Exit: Earnouts, Post Close, Lessons Learned

    12/19/2025

    E44: Inside a Social Media Agency Pioneers Exit: Earnouts, Post Close, Lessons Learned

    In this episode of the Inorganic Podcast, co-host Ayelet Shipley interviews Carrie Kerpen, a pioneer in social media and co-founder of Likeable Media. They discuss Carrie's journey from starting a social media agency to successfully exiting the business. Carrie shares insights on the importance of profitability, setting exit goals, choosing the right M&A advisor, and negotiating earn-outs. She reflects on her experiences and the lessons learned, particularly for women entrepreneurs, and emphasizes the need for community and support in the business world. Takeaways Carrie started Likeable Media in 2007, one of the first social media agencies.The initial focus was not on exiting but on building a profitable business.Setting a target exit value can help guide business decisions.Timing and personal readiness are crucial when deciding to sell a business.Choosing the right M&A advisor can significantly impact the sale process.Negotiating earn-outs requires careful consideration of control and reporting.Reflecting on the exit process can reveal areas for improvement.Building a community for women founders can provide essential support.Women entrepreneurs often face unique challenges in the exit process.M&A can be a powerful tool for business growth and problem-solving. Chapters 0:00 Introducing Carrie Kerpen 1:05 Founding Likeable Media  3:33 Early Growth & Cash Flow Challenges 5:22 Becoming CEO and Focusing on Profitability 6:37 Market Shifts & Productizing the Agency 7:21 Building a Brand through All the Social Ladies 9:07 Financial Stability & the $20M Exit Goal  10:43 Knowing When It's Time to Sell 12:55 Choosing an M&A Advisor vs. a Banker 15:36 Price vs. Timing After the Exit 18:22 Negotiating & Protecting an Earnout 22:02 Life After the Sale 23:12 What Carrie Would Do Differently 24:51 Acting Like a Platform and Rethinking Capital 25:58 The Exit Gap and The Whisper Group 27:45 Closing Thoughts Connect with Christian and Ayelet Ayelet’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ayelet-shipley-b16330149/ Christian's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hassold/ Web: https://www.inorganicpodcast.co In/organic on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InorganicPodcast/featured Connect with guest, Carrie Kerpen https://www.linkedin.com/in/carriekerpen/ Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

    29 min
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Ratings & Reviews

5
out of 5
4 Ratings

About

Ayelet Shipley and Christian Hassold host the Inorganic Podcast. Ayelet and Christian have combined 20 years of experience helping venture and private equity sponsors execute mergers and acquisitions in SaaS and digital agencies in the U.S. and Europe. On this podcast, Ayelet and Christian discuss M&A strategy, sourcing tactics, and other dynamics around mergers and acquisitions. They also report on market activity, emphasizing larger companies buying smaller SaaS or agencies and discussing the rationale behind the deals and economics. We sometimes invite guests to join our discussion, building on our mission to make the art and science of M&A more transparent for buyers, sellers, and financial sponsors. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Information

  • Creator
    Christian Hassold & Ayelet Shipley
  • Years Active
    2023 - 2026
  • Episodes
    53
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © Inorganic Podcast
  • Show Website
    Inorganic Podcast

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