The Lost Art Of the Skilled Trades

Andrew Brown
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Welcome to The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades, the ultimate podcast dedicated to celebrating and exploring the world of skilled trades. Hosted by Andrew Brown, a passionate advocate for the trades industry, this podcast is your go-to source for knowledge, inspiration, and practical advice. Andrew brings a unique perspective shaped by years of hands-on experience, entrepreneurial success, and a deep commitment to elevating the trades. Dive into the fascinating and ever-evolving world of skilled trades, where creativity, problem-solving, and dedication come together to build the world around us. From carpentry and HVAC systems to electricians, plumbers, millwrights, and beyond, every episode uncovers the grit, determination, and artistry that define the people behind these essential professions. Andrew’s journey began with a life-changing moment on September 11, 2001, when he worked alongside tradespeople, first responders, and community helpers at Ground Zero. This experience inspired him to dedicate his life to advocating for the unsung heroes of the trades. Through his company, Andrew has helped provide tools, equipment, and resources to industry professionals worldwide. Now, through this podcast, he continues his mission to spotlight the craftsmanship, hard work, and dedication of tradespeople everywhere. Each episode features in-depth interviews with industry experts, seasoned professionals, and rising stars in the trades. From contractors and electricians to HVAC specialists, plumbers, carpenters, and more, listeners will gain insider knowledge about the skills, tools, and strategies needed to thrive in these essential fields. Andrew also speaks with educators, advocates, and business leaders who are working to inspire the next generation of tradespeople, offering a fresh perspective on the value and opportunities within the trades. At its core, The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades is more than just a podcast — it’s a celebration of a culture built on pride in craftsmanship and an unwavering commitment to excellence. In a time when traditional career paths are overemphasized, this podcast shines a light on an alternative: rewarding careers in skilled trades that offer creativity, financial stability, and the satisfaction of building something tangible. Whether you’re a seasoned trades professional, an aspiring craftsman, or simply curious about the industry, this podcast is your ultimate guide to the untold stories and secrets of success in trades like refrigeration, building, plumbing, and construction. Join Andrew Brown as he celebrates the artistry, resilience, and innovation of the skilled trades — and inspires a new generation to pick up the tools that keep our world running. About Andrew Brown Andrew Brown is a fervent advocate for the skilled trades and is dedicated to addressing and then fixing the trades shortage gap. Through platforms such as social media, podcasts, and live events, he tirelessly promotes the benefits of the trades to students, parents, and educators. Follow Andrew Brown YouTube: https://youtube.com/@andrewbrowntrades LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrew-brown-b1736a5/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@andrew.l.brown

  1. 3d ago

    Why This Skilled Trades Business Has a Waiting List of Job Applicants

    8⁸HVAC and plumbing apprenticeship that works: Abe Zarou of AllTech Services explains how an in-house academy gave his company a waiting list of people who want to work there. Several years ago AllTech had the same problem as everyone else. Technicians came and went, the company recruited from competitors, and hiring decisions were made out of desperation. So Abe and his team built AllTech Academy to develop their own technicians. The first version had a lot of attrition. They rebuilt the recruiting process to feel like a boot camp, and Abe says attrition is now close to zero. The academy went from 50 or 60 applications a class to more than 1,100 for the last one. Abe Zarou is the owner and president of AllTech Services. He started as a technician with no degree and learned the business side, from finance and marketing to inventory and vehicles, through a lot of trial and error. You'll hear what AllTech changed in recruiting, what day one looks like for a new apprentice, how a career path and daily field support keep people from leaving for a couple of dollars more somewhere else, and how Abe keeps a whole company aligned on its CARE values. He also talks honestly about what it costs to own a trades business, what he thinks about private equity buying up contractors, and what a high school student with a mechanical spark should do first. IN THIS EPISODE (00:00) – How do you have a waiting list: Andrew asks the question every contractor wants answered, and Abe explains why AllTech decided to develop its own technicians. (02:51) – Hiring out of desperation: Why "hire almost anybody" failed, and what changed when AllTech stopped labeling the younger generation. (04:25) – Recruiting like a boot camp: Tough questions, multiple interviews, and a day one that lays out the next 8 to 16 weeks and a career path. (06:56) – Keeping them after you train them: The career path that covers skills, tools, income and continuing education, field support every day, and the CARE values that keep the whole company aligned. (10:27) – From technician to owner: Everything Abe had to learn beyond the technical work, and what changed when he joined Nexstar in 2023. (14:07) – Starting your own business: Abe's honest warning about the sacrifices, and why he'd join a best practice group and find a mentor early. (18:17) – Private equity and the data center boom: Why Abe isn't scared of deep pockets and why he says the trades are recession proof. (22:35) – Advice for high school students: Talk to tradespeople, go to trade shows, ask questions, and why parents are changing their minds about the trades. KEY TAKEAWAYS 1. Desperation hiring costs more than it saves. AllTech's early hires were made to fill capacity, and the company paid for it in attrition. 2. A harder recruiting process can keep people longer. Tough questions and several conversations before day one helped bring AllTech's attrition close to zero. 3. People stay when they can see what's next. A career path covering skills, tools, income and continuing education, plus daily field support, answers "where do I go from here?" 4. Owning the business is a different trade. Finance, marketing, leadership and operations have to be learned, and a best practice group or mentor shortens that learning curve. ABOUT THE GUEST Abe Zarou is the owner and president of AllTech Services, an HVAC and plumbing company in Northern Virginia, and the founder of AllTech Academy, the company's paid apprenticeship program for new technicians. He came up in the trades as a technician and learned to run the business through years of trial and error. He credits his father as his mentor and joined Nexstar in 2023. KEYWORDS HVAC apprenticeship, plumbing apprenticeship, paid apprenticeship, in-house training academy, technician recruiting, technician retention, employee attrition, hiring in the trades, career path for technicians, HVAC business owner, home services business, starting a trades business, private equity in the trades, Nexstar Network, skilled trades careers, AllTech Academy, AllTech Services, Abe Zarou, The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades, Andrew Brown RESOURCE LINKS Abe Zarou on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/abe-zarou-8bb18b21b AllTech Services: https://www.alltechservicesinc.com AllTech Academy: https://www.alltechservicesinc.com/about/alltech-academy/ Andrew Brown keynotes and working sessions: https://andrewbrownspeaker.com More from the show: https://andrewbrown.net SUPPORT THE SHOW If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

    Why This Skilled Trades Business Has a Waiting List of Job Applicants

  2. Oct 20

    The $240,000 Electrician: Who's Training the Next One?

    Data center electricians are making big money. Andrew Brown asks who's training the next generation of electricians while the same experienced people get recruited from job to job. Mike Rowe shared a story about visiting a data center in Texas, where he met three electricians, all under 30. According to Mike, all three were making more than $240,000 a year, and all three had been recruited away from other projects three times in the previous 18 months. Andrew posted about it on LinkedIn, the post passed 100,000 impressions, and the comments from people who work in the field turned into this episode. This is a solo episode from Andrew Brown, host of The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades. He works through the strongest comments on both sides, including the ones that disagreed with him. You'll hear what might sit behind a $240K paycheck, why an electrical project supervisor said experienced workers should be rewarded for teaching, the case for moving workers between projects, an apprentice's account of being used as cheap labor, and whether data center work builds skills that carry into the rest of a career. Andrew ends with a question for contractors and apprentices, and he wants to hear your answer. IN THIS EPISODE (00:00) – The $240,000 Electrician: Mike Rowe's story about three young electricians at a Texas data center who'd each been recruited away three times in 18 months. (02:00) – What's Behind the $240K: Commenters asked about hours, travel and per diem, and why that changes the conversation for someone just entering an apprenticeship. (03:26) – Rewarding the People Who Teach: An electrical project supervisor's point that experienced workers need to be rewarded for teaching, not just for getting the job done quickly. (05:17) – Moving Workers vs. Training Apprentices: Why good companies move people between jobs, and one young apprentice's experience of being used as cheap labor. (08:21) – The Data Center Question: Whether years on data center projects prepare an electrician for industrial maintenance, commercial work, service work or running a business. (09:40) – Who's Ready to Take Their Place?: Employers who invest in developing people, and who's ready when today's experienced workers retire. KEY TAKEAWAYS 1. Big pay stories need context. Hours, travel and per diem change what $240,000 means, and that pay isn't necessarily what someone coming out of high school into an apprenticeship will see. 2. Teaching takes time on the job. If the only thing being measured is how quickly the work gets done, apprentices don't get the chance to learn. 3. Keeping experienced people working and preparing new people to become experienced are two different jobs, and the industry needs both. 4. Recruiting isn't the finish line. Once new people arrive, somebody has to teach them and show them what the next step in their career looks like. ABOUT THE HOST Andrew Brown hosts The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades, where he talks with people in shipbuilding, aviation, manufacturing, construction and other trades about how careers get built and how employers develop their people. Through keynotes and working sessions, Andrew works with companies that are bringing people into the trades and want to keep them. KEYWORDS electrician salary, data center electrician, $240,000 electrician, electrician apprenticeship, apprentice electrician, mentoring apprentices, training the next generation, skilled trades careers, skilled labor shortage, retiring workforce, construction workforce, workforce development, journeyman electrician, trades mentorship, Mike Rowe, The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades, Andrew Brown RESOURCE LINKS Andrew Brown keynotes and working sessions: https://andrewbrownspeaker.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrew-brown-b1736a5 SUPPORT THE SHOW If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

    The $240,000 Electrician: Who's Training the Next One?

  3. Oct 13

    We Don't Need Data Center Electricians. We Need Electricians. | Concetta Defa

    Concetta Defa, executive director of the Utah Building Trades Council, on why data center training has to build real electricians, not one-job installers. Tech companies are pouring money into training workers to build data centers, and electricians on those jobs can make over $200,000 a year with overtime. Concetta has seen this before. When she was an apprentice, crews were putting up cell towers, and people who only ever learned cell towers struggled to pass journeyman exams and many left the trade once that build-out ended. Her question for every workforce program today: when the data center boom is over, what happens to the people you trained to do one thing? Concetta started as an IBEW Local 354 apprentice in 1996, after her father died and she needed to help support her family. She worked as a journey-level electrician, foreperson, estimator, project manager and assistant business manager before leading the Utah Building Trades Council. In this conversation she covers how to get into the IBEW when there's a waitlist, how apprentice pay climbs to journeyman scale, what job site conditions are really like, and why the money war over experienced workers is hurting the contractors building everything else. This episode is for anyone thinking about an electrical apprenticeship, career changers trying to get into a union, and the apprenticeship programs, contractors and workforce leaders deciding how the next generation gets trained. IN THIS EPISODE (00:00) – We Don't Need Data Center Electricians: Concetta's warning about training people for one build instead of a whole trade. (01:15) – Building Careers or Filling Demand?: Where the money in skilled trades training is going, and why both good and narrow training are happening at once. (05:26) – A Career Changer at 36: Andrew's family member trying to get into the union, and what happens to narrowly trained workers when the boom ends. (08:02) – The Cell Tower Boom: Why people who only learned one kind of work struggled to journey out and left the trade. (11:48) – Job Site Conditions Change Everything: Materials, methods, safety and procedures shift between data centers, industrial, commercial and energy work. (13:20) – Into the Trade by Accident: From a grocery store job to an IBEW apprenticeship, four contractors and the mentors who shaped her. (20:14) – How to Get Into the IBEW: Waitlists, ranking lists, construction wireman roles and why you should understand the value of what you're joining. (24:45) – Becoming a Stronger Applicant: Track your hours, get on a union contractor's crew, and what to do if you're bad at interviews. (30:28) – Apprenticeship Length and Pay: Three to five years, starting around 50 to 60 percent of journeyman scale, with raises as you progress. (33:33) – What Job Site Conditions Are Really Like: Mud, snow, break tents, porta-johns, and going from two years outdoors to a room with four walls. (41:26) – Solving the Shortage or Moving Workers Around?: How data center money pulls experienced workers away from housing, retail and infrastructure. (45:45) – How Contractors Can Keep Their People: Feeling valued, local work, work-life balance, and fitting the people to the work. (51:51) – What Apprenticeship Leaders Should Start Doing: Put an experienced journeyman beside every apprentice in the field. (54:14) – Hire PowHER and Utah Building Trades: Where to find Concetta's work with women in energy careers and the Utah building trades. Key Takeaways Training someone to build one kind of facility isn't the same as training an electrician. When that build-out ends, people without broad skills struggle to pass journeyman exams and move to other kinds of work. If you can't get into the IBEW right away, keep working in the industry, track your hours, and try to get on with a union contractor. A year of real job site experience tells an apprenticeship committee more than an interview can. Apprentices typically start at 50 to 60 percent of journeyman pay and get regular step raises over three to five years. Union retirement and benefits only pay off if you stay long enough to build them. The fix isn't more money. Apprentices need an experienced journeyman beside them in the field, because the tips and tricks of the trade aren't in any book. As Andrew puts it, apprenticeship teaches a trade, mentorship builds the tradesperson. About the Guest Concetta Defa is executive director of the Utah Building and Construction Trades Council. She began as an apprentice electrician with IBEW Local 354 in 1996 and has worked as a journey-level electrician, foreperson, estimator, project manager and union steward. She also served as assistant business manager for IBEW Local 354, a trustee for the Utah Electrical Training Alliance, and president of Utah Women in Trades. Concetta hosts a podcast with the Center for Energy Workforce Development's Hire PowHER initiative, which helps women find careers in energy and the skilled trades. She's passionate about mentoring apprentices and making sure the next generation is trained for a whole career, not just the current boom. Keywords electrician apprenticeship, data center electrician, IBEW apprenticeship, how to become an electrician, skilled trades careers, union electrician, journeyman electrician pay, construction workforce, trades mentorship, workforce retention, women in the trades, Concetta Defa, Utah Building Trades Council RESOURCE LINKS Concetta Defa on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/concetta-defa Utah Building and Construction Trades Council Website: https://www.utahbuildingtrades.org Hire PowHER (Center for Energy Workforce Development): https://getintoenergy.org/hire-powher/powher-hours/ Get Into Energy: https://getintoenergy.org SUPPORT THE SHOW If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

    We Don't Need Data Center Electricians. We Need Electricians. | Concetta Defa

  4. Oct 6

    Are We Building Careers in the Skilled Trades or Just Filling Jobs? | Julian Scadden

    Julian Scadden, CEO of Nexstar Network, on why the trades need a clear path from technician to business owner, not just a pitch about six figures. Everyone says the trades pay well, carry no student debt and don't need a degree. Julian wants to know why kids still aren't lining up. His answer starts with his own story: early in his plumbing apprenticeship, a service manager pulled him aside and said everyone loved how clean he kept the truck and how well he did the paperwork, but he wasn't a good plumber. Julian never planned to be one anyway. He's a high school dropout who learned business through what he calls business apprenticeship, and he asks every employer listening a hard question: if a technician told you they wanted to start their own company, would you help them or fire them? Julian is president and CEO of Nexstar Network, a member-owned organization that coaches independent plumbing, HVAC and electrical companies, and he was a Nexstar member himself before he led it. Recorded at Nexstar's conference, this conversation covers his Substack post on what comes after "become a plumber," what makes a good mentor, his open letter to the CEO of Lowe's, and why he doesn't think private equity will consolidate the trades. This episode is for trades business owners who employ technicians, technicians wondering what comes next, and anyone funding or building workforce programs who wants careers to last past the first 90 days. IN THIS EPISODE (00:00) – Become a Plumber, and Then What? The Missing Path to Ownership: Julian explains why six figures and no debt aren't pulling kids in, and why the story of ownership gets left out. (02:40) – From Technician to Owner: The Skills It Takes and Who Is Teaching Them: The service manager who told Julian he wasn't a good plumber, a contractor who built a $4 million business and lost it, and why employers have to start developing owners. (06:00) – What Makes a Good Mentor: Mentor versus sponsor, balanced accountability, and how his first mentor Ed Coleman let him make a costly mistake without letting it sink the company. (12:00) – The Letter to Lowe's: Data Center Dollars or Real Trades Careers? Julian and Andrew ask whether the money going into workforce programs is building careers or just filling seats, and why honest expectations about the work matter. (17:50) – Private Equity and the Trades: Will Consolidation Win? Why Julian reads the trend lines differently than most, why airlines can consolidate and trades can't, and what happens when buyers don't know how to operate the business. (23:00) – Who Should Join Nexstar Network and Where to Find Julian: Who is a good fit, why Nexstar is more of an accelerator than an incubator, and how to reach him. Key Takeaways Pay alone doesn't recruit people into the trades. If the pitch stops at six figures and no debt, it leaves out the career path, including the path to owning a business, that makes someone stay. A mentor walks you through your own development, while a sponsor is in rooms you aren't and says your name. The best mentors hold balanced accountability and can tell the difference between you building muscle and you sinking. Be honest about the job. Showing up at 6 a.m. when it's 20 degrees, or crawling into an attic with asbestos, is the reality, and ride-and-decide days let a new hire find out before they commit. Andrew ties this back to the first 90 days, which is where most new hires are won or lost. Private equity can't take over an industry where anyone with technical skill and a license can start a competing business tomorrow. Julian expects it to stay a challenge but not to consolidate the trades. About the Guest Julian Scadden is president and CEO of Nexstar Network, a member-owned organization for independent plumbing, HVAC and electrical contractors. He was named CEO on November 1, 2020, after joining Nexstar as its first implementation coach, then leading training and events and serving as vice president of operations. He started in the trades as a plumbing apprentice and has more than two decades in home services. Julian writes on Substack about the future of the trades, including an open letter to the CEO of Lowe's about workforce funding and the path to ownership. Nexstar's mission is to help the world's best tradespeople become the world's best business people, and it only works with independently owned companies, not investment-backed ones. Keywords skilled trades, path to business ownership, trades business owner, plumbing careers, become a plumber, technician to owner, mentorship in the trades, mentor vs sponsor, balanced accountability, private equity in the trades, data center workforce, Lowe's Foundation, trades careers for Gen Z, first 90 days, retention, HVAC business, electrician business, home services, Julian Scadden, Nexstar Network RESOURCE LINKS Julian Scadden on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/julianscadden Nexstar Network Website: https://www.nexstarnetwork.com An Open Letter to the CEO of Lowe's (Julian's Substack): https://julianscadden.substack.com/p/an-open-letter-to-the-ceo-of-lowes SUPPORT THE SHOW If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

    Are We Building Careers in the Skilled Trades or Just Filling Jobs? | Julian Scadden

  5. Sep 29

    Are Employers Ready for the Next Generation of Skilled Workers?

    Jon Ward, CEO of Ward Vessel and Exchanger, on why welders quit in the first 90 days, how a "people first" culture actually gets built, and why your best welder is rarely your best mentor. Jon asks a question most shop owners avoid: if a million young people raised their hands tomorrow and said they wanted to work in the skilled trades, would employers actually be ready for them? His answer is blunt. A lot of companies say they'd hire 20 or 40 people tomorrow if they could find them, but most have no system to actually bring that many people on without losing them in the first three months. Ward Vessel and Exchanger builds pressure vessels and heat exchangers that end up in everything from Gorilla Glue to GLP-1 drug manufacturing, and Jon's spent years rebuilding how his company onboards, mentors, and retains welders in two very different labor markets, Charlotte and Houston. Jon Ward has run Ward Vessel and Exchanger, a family manufacturing business founded in 1982, since taking over leadership of the company. He's built a formal apprenticeship program with NC Works, runs the business on EOS (the Entrepreneurial Operating System), and was named to the UNC Charlotte Board of Trustees in 2026. He also hosts his own podcast, Forged in Focus. This episode is for anyone building or fixing an onboarding process, any shop owner losing skilled people to bigger paychecks at data center jobs, and anyone who's ever wondered whether their most talented person should actually be the one training the new hires. Jon walks through his three core values, what a real apprenticeship partnership with a workforce agency looks like, and the mastery chart his team is rolling out to make skill progression visible to every welder on the floor. IN THIS EPISODE (00:00) – Why the First 90 Days Make or Break a New Hire: Jon explains why the old "pair them with a lead guy and let them figure it out" model fails, and what changes when leadership actually gets involved early. (03:00) – The Three Core Values Behind a People-First Culture: Passionate, consistent, and selfless, Jon breaks down how Ward hires to these values, fires to them, and built a "people first" ethos around a line he heard on a stage years ago: culture over customers. (05:00) – Building an Apprenticeship Program With NC Works: How a one-year, state-funded apprenticeship partnership in Mecklenburg County works in practice, and what Jon learned running it with his first apprentice. (10:00) – What Ward Vessel and Exchanger Actually Builds (and Why Welders Matter): From hair care products to GLP-1 drug manufacturing equipment, Jon explains the products welders touch every day without anyone realizing it, and why 320,000 more welders are needed by 2029. (19:00) – Why Your Best Welder Isn't Always Your Best Mentor: Jon tells the story of his most productive fabricator ever, a guy who could do a 1,000-hour project in 500 hours and still turned down every promotion to shop foreman. (42:00) – Competing With the Data Center Boom for Tomorrow's Welders: Why data center construction is pulling skilled workers away with big money, and what a shop can offer that a relocation-required job can't. Key Takeaways New hires aren't going to be productive in the first 90 days, and treating that as a reality to plan around instead of a problem to rush through is what separates companies that retain people from ones that don't. The best technical performer on a team is often the worst fit for mentoring someone new, patience and a genuine desire to take on someone else's problems matter more than raw skill. A state-funded apprenticeship program can shift a meaningful chunk of a new hire's salary during training, but it only works with a real system behind it, not just goodwill and good intentions. Shops competing for welders against data center construction jobs can win on stability (no travel, no relocation, steady hours) even when they can't win on raw pay. About the Guest Jon Ward is President and CEO of Ward Vessel and Exchanger, a Charlotte, North Carolina-based manufacturer of ASME Code pressure vessels and heat exchangers with a second facility in Houston, Texas. Founded in 1982 as a family business, the company builds equipment used across consumer products, industrial manufacturing, and pharmaceutical production. Jon is a 1994 UNC Charlotte engineering graduate, was appointed to the UNC Charlotte Board of Trustees in 2026, and was named among the Charlotte Business Journal's Most Admired CEOs the same year. Jon has spent the last several years rebuilding Ward's onboarding, mentorship, and apprenticeship systems around a "people first" ethos built on three values: passionate, consistent, and selfless. He runs the company on EOS (the Entrepreneurial Operating System) and hosts his own podcast, Forged in Focus, where he talks with manufacturing leaders about the future of the industry. Keywords skilled trades, first 90 days onboarding, welder shortage, apprenticeship program, mentorship in the trades, employee retention, welding careers, manufacturing careers, NC Works apprenticeship, EOS Entrepreneurial Operating System, trade school vs college, data center construction jobs, Jon Ward, Ward Vessel and Exchanger, pressure vessels, heat exchangers, American Welding Society, Fabtech RESOURCE LINKS Jon Ward on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jongward Ward Vessel and Exchanger Website: https://wardvesselandexchanger.com Forged in Focus (Jon's podcast): available on Spotify and YouTube SUPPORT THE SHOW If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

    Are Employers Ready for the Next Generation of Skilled Workers?

  6. Sep 15

    The AI Data Center Boom Is Hiring Tradespeople, Is It Building Careers?

    The AI and data center boom is creating a wave of new trade jobs for electricians, HVAC techs, and welders. Host Andrew Brown asks the real question: are we filling projects, or building tradespeople? Every headline right now says the same thing: massive money pouring into new data centers, new energy infrastructure, new construction. That means a hiring wave for electricians, HVAC techs, pipefitters, and welders. But Andrew argues there's a difference between teaching someone the three tasks a specific project needs and actually training them in the trade, and most companies aren't paying attention to which one they're doing. This episode connects directly to Andrew's First 90 Days framework: the reason a 22-year-old lasts 45 days on a data center job and then leaves isn't usually pay. It's that nobody owned Day 27, nobody checked in once the newness wore off, and nobody showed them where the job actually leads. If you're hiring into this boom right now, whether you're staffing a data center project or just trying to bring new people into your trade, this episode is a direct, practical challenge: look at the last person you hired and ask what you're actually preparing them for, the project or their career. IN THIS EPISODE (00:00) – Intro: The AI and Data Center Boom: Why money, projects, and demand are flooding into the trades right now, and why that's genuinely good news. (01:09) – Filling Projects vs. Building Tradespeople: The core question of the episode, are new hires becoming electricians, or becoming really good at two or three tasks one project needs. (03:20) – Who Owns Day 27? The First 90 Days Connection: Day one is easy, HR and safety own it. Nobody owns the day the newness wears off, and that's when people actually decide to stay or leave. (05:58) – Being Honest About Pay, Hours, and What the Work Really Looks Like: Six-figure trade jobs are real, but overselling the number without the overtime, nights, and travel behind it creates an expectations problem that turns into a retention problem. (07:49) – Showing New Hires the Career Path, Not Just the Task: What it looks like to show someone the route from apprentice to journeyman to foreman to owning their own business, instead of just this week's assignment. (10:16) – The Challenge to Employers: Project or Career?: A direct question for anyone hiring right now, would the person you just hired still have value if the work changed tomorrow? Key Takeaways Getting someone through the front door isn't the win, it's the start, the real return comes when they stay, get better, and eventually train the next person. Nobody owns Day 27. HR and safety own Day 1, but almost no company has a clear answer for who checks in once the newness wears off. Overselling six-figure trade pay without explaining the overtime, travel, or hours behind it creates an expectations problem that becomes a retention problem. Training someone for a data center project isn't the same as training them for the electrical trade, one ends when the project does, the other doesn't. About the Host Andrew Brown is a keynote speaker, workforce strategist, and host of The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades. Before this, he spent 23 years running , a national B2B industrial tool supply company, giving him a real operator's view of the trades, not an outside consultant's. His work centers on one idea: skilled-trades companies don't have a hiring problem, they have a First 90 Days problem. He helps organizations figure out not just how to get people into the trades, but how to keep them once they arrive and develop them into long-term skilled professionals. Keywords AI data centers, skilled trades careers, electrician training, HVAC technician, data center construction jobs, apprenticeship, first 90 days, day 27, workforce retention, career pathway, workforce shortage, Gen Z trades, Andrew Brown RESOURCE LINKS Andrew Brown, Speaking & Workforce Strategy: andrewbrownspeaker.com The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades: andrewbrown.net SUPPORT THE SHOW If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

    The AI Data Center Boom Is Hiring Tradespeople, Is It Building Careers?

  7. Sep 8

    Inside IUPAT: Glazing Careers, Mentorship, and the Trade Nobody Talks About

    Travis Nevins of the International Union of Painters and Allied Trades explains what a glazier actually does, and why this skilled trade career is everywhere you look and almost nobody can name it. Every skyscraper facade, every mall handrail, every office glass partition, that's glazing. Travis has spent 25 years in the trade, and he opens by pointing out something most people never notice: glazing surrounds us constantly, yet it's one of the least recognized paths into the skilled trades. Travis Nevins is the Deputy Director of Organizing at IUPAT. He spent five years as a glazier apprentice in New York, became a journey-level glazier, taught safety and upgrading courses for years, and now works to bring more people into the trade nationally. This episode is for anyone weighing a skilled trade career, a parent looking for real alternatives to the college-only path, or anyone curious what happens after you say yes to an apprenticeship. Travis walks through the actual apprenticeship timeline, what separates people who thrive from people who burn out, and the one trait he says matters more than technical skill. IN THIS EPISODE (00:00) – What Is a Glazier? The Trade Hiding in Plain Sight: Travis explains glazing, from residential windows to skyscraper curtain walls, and why so few people know the trade exists. (05:00) – Getting In: No Experience Needed, Just the Right Attitude: You don't need to know how to read a tape measure to start an apprenticeship, Travis explains what actually matters on day one. (10:00) – Mentorship: Why the Best Mechanic Isn't Always the Best Mentor: Travis breaks down what makes a good mentor, and it's rarely the most technically skilled person on the crew. (13:00) – Apprentice to Journey Worker: Pay, Progression, and the 8,000-Hour Mark: A typical apprenticeship runs three to four years with steady 5% raises every six months, and Travis ties it back to the 10,000-hour rule. (18:00) – What Makes People Stay (and What Burns Them Out): Inconsistent work and long commutes push people out, Travis explains how to set realistic expectations before someone signs up. (25:00) – The Ladder Story, How Glazing's Changed, and How to Get Started: Travis, who's afraid of heights, shares the story of forcing himself back up a 65-foot ladder, plus how safety culture and technology have transformed the trade. Key Takeaways Glazing is one of the most visible trades in the world and one of the least understood, most people who work with glass, aluminum, and facade systems never set out to become a glazier, they simply never heard of it as an option. Attitude predicts success in a glazing apprenticeship more reliably than prior experience or technical aptitude, employers and mentors consistently choose a positive, coachable person over a more skilled but difficult one. A typical IUPAT glazing apprenticeship runs three to four years and roughly 8,000 hours, with earn-while-you-learn pay that increases on a steady, predictable schedule. The biggest reasons apprentices leave the trade are inconsistent work and the reality of travel, not the physical demands of the job itself, setting honest expectations up front matters more than recruiting harder. About the Guest Travis Nevins is the Deputy Director of Organizing at the International Union of Painters and Allied Trades (IUPAT). He spent five years as a New York State registered glazier apprentice before becoming a journey-level glazier at IUPAT District Council 4, Local 677, where he later taught health, safety, and journey-person upgrading courses. He spent seven years on staff at District Council 4 before moving to IUPAT's International Union in 2021. Travis now works to bring more people into the glazing trade and IUPAT's other core trades, including commercial and industrial painting, drywall finishing, and floor covering, across a network of 105 training centers in the US and Canada. Keywords glazier, glazing trade, skilled trades career, glazier apprenticeship, apprenticeship program, journey worker, IUPAT apprenticeship, construction trades career, blue collar career, commercial glazing, curtain wall, facade installation, construction safety, trade school alternative, Travis Nevins, IUPAT, International Union of Painters and Allied Trades RESOURCE LINKS Travis Nevins on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/travis-nevins-43107b202/ IUPAT Website: https://www.iupat.org SUPPORT THE SHOW If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

    Inside IUPAT: Glazing Careers, Mentorship, and the Trade Nobody Talks About

  8. Sep 1

    What Actually Makes an Apprenticeship Program Work

    Andreas Brockmann of United Grinding built an apprenticeship program that now gets 400 applicants for 5 spots — and it starts apprentices with hand tools, not machines. Three years ago, United Grinding had 15 candidates for 4 apprenticeship positions. This year, they had over 400 applicants for 5 spots. Andreas Brockmann, the Apprenticeship Coordinator who built the program from scratch, says the shift didn't come from a hiring gimmick — it came from treating apprentices like real employees from day one: full benefits, a $19.50 starting wage, 15 days of vacation, and a four-year path to becoming a mechatronic technician. Andreas reached out to Andrew after disagreeing with a LinkedIn post, making a simple but pointed argument: an 18-year-old can't walk into industry already knowing how to be a professional — companies have a responsibility to develop them. That conversation became this episode. Andreas unpacks exactly how United Grinding recruits, trains, and mentors apprentices in Miamisburg, Ohio — from six months on hand tools before anyone touches a machine, to bringing parents into the very first interview, to why CEO buy-in makes or breaks the whole thing. This episode is for manufacturing leaders, HR and workforce development professionals, and trades employers who keep saying "young people don't want to work" — and are ready to hear a different explanation, and a real blueprint for fixing it. IN THIS EPISODE (00:00) – Meet Andreas Brockmann: Why a LinkedIn disagreement turned into this conversation about who's really responsible for developing young talent. (02:00) – The 10% rule: Why United Grinding dedicates roughly 10% of its workforce to apprentices, and what that investment actually returns. (09:00) – From 15 candidates to 400: How the program grew every year since it launched three years ago. (10:00) – Hand tools before machines: Why apprentices spend six months on a workbench with files and chisels before they ever touch a drill press or CNC machine. (15:00) – Getting the whole company bought in: Why apprenticeship programs die without the CEO "200% behind it," and how United Grinding builds and vets mentors. (29:00) – Bringing parents into the process — and why Andreas believes the skilled trades talent gap is "our fault, not theirs." Key Takeaways Companies, not young workers, are responsible for closing the skilled trades talent gap — and treating apprentices like full employees from day one changes who applies and who stays. Apprenticeship programs only survive difficult years if the CEO and leadership are fully bought in from the start; programs get cut first when budgets tighten, and that's the worst time to cut them. Starting apprentices on hand tools for six months before machines builds fundamentals, patience, and pride in the work before productivity even becomes the goal. Bringing parents and family into the recruiting process — not just the applicant — builds the home support system that determines whether an apprentice actually finishes the program. About the Guest Andreas Brockmann is the Apprenticeship Coordinator at United Grinding North America in Miamisburg, Ohio, where he built the company's four-year apprenticeship program from the ground up. An engineer by training with decades of manufacturing and workforce development experience, Andreas has grown the program from 15 applicants for 4 positions to over 400 applicants for 5 spots in just three years. He works directly with local high schools, career centers, and even middle schools to build a talent pipeline for precision manufacturing careers, and regularly collaborates with other Ohio manufacturers on workforce-sharing and apprenticeship best practices. Keywords apprenticeship program, skilled trades apprenticeship, manufacturing apprenticeship, mechatronics technician, CNC apprenticeship, workforce development, Gen Z in the trades, apprentice mentorship, career pathways in manufacturing, tuition reimbursement, Andreas Brockmann, United Grinding, United Grinding North America, Miamisburg Ohio, manufacturing careers, industry 4.0, workforce shortage RESOURCE LINKS Andreas Brockmann on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andreasbrockmann/ United Grinding Apprenticeship Program: https://www.grinding.com/en/about-us/our-team/apprenticeship-program/ WORK WITH ANDREW Keynotes, workshops, podcast activations, and workforce storytelling for the skilled trades. andrewbrownspeaker.com

    What Actually Makes an Apprenticeship Program Work
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About

Welcome to The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades, the ultimate podcast dedicated to celebrating and exploring the world of skilled trades. Hosted by Andrew Brown, a passionate advocate for the trades industry, this podcast is your go-to source for knowledge, inspiration, and practical advice. Andrew brings a unique perspective shaped by years of hands-on experience, entrepreneurial success, and a deep commitment to elevating the trades. Dive into the fascinating and ever-evolving world of skilled trades, where creativity, problem-solving, and dedication come together to build the world around us. From carpentry and HVAC systems to electricians, plumbers, millwrights, and beyond, every episode uncovers the grit, determination, and artistry that define the people behind these essential professions. Andrew’s journey began with a life-changing moment on September 11, 2001, when he worked alongside tradespeople, first responders, and community helpers at Ground Zero. This experience inspired him to dedicate his life to advocating for the unsung heroes of the trades. Through his company, Andrew has helped provide tools, equipment, and resources to industry professionals worldwide. Now, through this podcast, he continues his mission to spotlight the craftsmanship, hard work, and dedication of tradespeople everywhere. Each episode features in-depth interviews with industry experts, seasoned professionals, and rising stars in the trades. From contractors and electricians to HVAC specialists, plumbers, carpenters, and more, listeners will gain insider knowledge about the skills, tools, and strategies needed to thrive in these essential fields. Andrew also speaks with educators, advocates, and business leaders who are working to inspire the next generation of tradespeople, offering a fresh perspective on the value and opportunities within the trades. At its core, The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades is more than just a podcast — it’s a celebration of a culture built on pride in craftsmanship and an unwavering commitment to excellence. In a time when traditional career paths are overemphasized, this podcast shines a light on an alternative: rewarding careers in skilled trades that offer creativity, financial stability, and the satisfaction of building something tangible. Whether you’re a seasoned trades professional, an aspiring craftsman, or simply curious about the industry, this podcast is your ultimate guide to the untold stories and secrets of success in trades like refrigeration, building, plumbing, and construction. Join Andrew Brown as he celebrates the artistry, resilience, and innovation of the skilled trades — and inspires a new generation to pick up the tools that keep our world running. About Andrew Brown Andrew Brown is a fervent advocate for the skilled trades and is dedicated to addressing and then fixing the trades shortage gap. Through platforms such as social media, podcasts, and live events, he tirelessly promotes the benefits of the trades to students, parents, and educators. Follow Andrew Brown YouTube: https://youtube.com/@andrewbrowntrades LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrew-brown-b1736a5/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@andrew.l.brown

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