Forged: Timeless Ways of Living

Humanitas Institute
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Forged: A timeless way of living. A podcast about forging lives of discipline, delight, craft, and calling that carry enduring wisdom into modern life.

  1. Oct 19

    Making Room for Beauty in Everyday Life with David and Phaedra Taylor

    What would change if we treated every part of our lives as worthy of prayer? And how might we learn to notice the beauty of the world when so much of modern life competes for our attention? On this episode of Forged, Brian Williams welcomes David and Phaedra Taylor for a conversation about prayer, art, family, and the habits that shape a meaningful life. They discuss their collaborative book Prayers for the Pilgrimage, the importance of making room for beauty in our homes, and the small decisions that help families resist the pull of digital distraction. Drawing on their experiences as artists, parents, and stewards of twenty-one acres of Texas prairie, the Taylors offer a thoughtful vision for living with greater attention, patience, and purpose. Along the way, David reflects on why artists are essential to human flourishing, while Phaedra shares what painting, motherhood, and restoring the land have taught her about creativity, limitation, and learning to let go of control. About the GuestsW. David O. Taylor is Associate Professor of Theology at Fuller Theological Seminary and the author of ten books, including To Set the World Aflame, Naming the Spirit, A Body of Praise, and Prayers for the Pilgrimage. An Anglican priest, he has written essays for a range of publications, including the Christian Scholars Review, Image Journal, The Washington Post, and the T&T Clark Companion to Theology and the Arts. In 2016 he produced a short film on the psalms with Bono and Eugene Peterson. He lives on twenty-one acres of land east of Austin, Texas, with his wife and children. Phaedra Taylor is an artist, illustrator, and high school art teacher, based in Austin, Texas, with her husband, theologian Rev. Dr. W. David O. Taylor, and their two children. She primarily works in encaustic (wax) and watercolor, exploring themes of place, memory, and story. She’s the illustrator of various collections and produced 22 paintings for the book Prayers for the Pilgrimage (2024, IVP). Phaedra loves walking in wild places, a strong pot of tea, and time to putter around in her garden. You can see more of her work at her website or on her instagram page. David Taylor’s Substack | https://wdavidotaylor.substack.comPhaedra Taylor Art | https://phaedrataylor.comBooks by W. David O. Taylor | https://wdavidotaylor.substack.com/p/my-books Episode References & ResourcesBooks The Mother Artist: Portraits of Ambition, Limitation, and Creativity by Catherine Ricketts Hannah’s Child: A Theologian’s Memoir by Stanley HauerwasOrthodoxy by G. K. Chesterton The Ethics of Beauty by Timothy Patitsas Poems “Late Fragment” by Raymond Carver “Wild Geese” by Mary Oliver “Manifesto: The Mad Farmer Liberation Front” by Wendell Berry Art and Film Tim Lowly’s paintings of his daughter, Temma Emily Young’s underwater marble sculptures off the coast of Tuscany "Big Night" (1996), directed by Campbell Scott and Stanley Tucci Connect with the Humanitas InstituteHumanitas Institute | https://humanitasinstitute.orgX | https://x.com/HIClassicalEdInstagram | https://www.instagram.com/humanitas_institute/TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@humanitas_instituteFacebook | https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61588606585070YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@TheHumanitasInstitute

    Making Room for Beauty in Everyday Life with David and Phaedra Taylor

  2. Oct 5

    What Do We Lose When Work Becomes Only a Paycheck? with Jeffrey Dill

    What happens when work becomes little more than a paycheck, food becomes something we expect to appear in a grocery store, and home becomes mostly a place of consumption? In this episode, Brian Williams speaks with sociologist, professor, and farmer Jeffrey Dill about the dignity of work, the discipline of living within limits, and what farming can teach us about family, freedom, and responsibility. Drawing on his experience with a regenerative beef and pork farm in Pennsylvania, Jeff considers what industrial efficiency gives us and what it can quietly take away: connection to land, craft, neighbor, and the formative power of labor itself. Their conversation ranges from Adam Smith and Wendell Berry to care work, fatherhood, household life, and raising young men who understand that a good life is larger than a career. Listen for a thoughtful invitation to recover work as something that forms us, not merely something that pays us. Jeff also reflects on folding laundry as a discipline, time outdoors with family as a delight, woodworking as a craft, and the love of God and neighbor as the calling that gathers the rest of life together. The conversation closes with W. H. Auden and a reminder that meaningful lives are built through ordinary acts of work, love, service, and fidelity. About the GuestJeffrey Dill is an Affiliate Professor of Sociology and Liberal Studies in the Templeton Honors College at Eastern University. He received his B.A. in English from Wheaton College and his Ph.D. in Sociology at the University of Virginia, where he was a Bradley Fellow at the Institute for Advanced Studies in Culture. His research focuses on questions of pluralism and difference in educational systems, moral and citizenship education, and socialization processes in schools. He is author of The Longing and Limits of Global Citizenship Education: the moral pedagogy of schooling in a cosmopolitan age. His work has been published in Social Forces, the Journal of Moral Education, Society, and The Huffington Post. When not teaching, he is busy helping to run Wyebrook Farm, a sustainable beef and pork farm in Honey Brook, PA. Guest LinksDr. Jeffrey Dill | Templeton Honors College at Eastern University | https://templeton.eastern.edu/jeffrey-dill Wyebrook Farm | https://www.wyebrookfarm.com/ Episode References & Resources BooksAn Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations — Adam SmithEspecially Book I and Smith’s discussion of the division of labor through the example of pin-making. Standing by Words — Wendell BerryIncludes the essay “Poetry and Marriage: The Use of Old Forms,” discussed in the episode in connection with limits, commitment, freedom, and form. Ox-Cart Man — Donald Hall, illustrated by Barbara CooneyA portrait of the seasons and rhythms of agricultural and household life in New England. Essays, Encyclicals & Poems Laborem Exercens (On Human Work) — Pope John Paul IIDiscussed in connection with the dignity of work, the distinction between the subjective and objective dimensions of work, and the priority of human persons over capital. “Poetry and Marriage: The Use of Old Forms” — Wendell BerryA reflection on how limits and forms, rather than simply restricting human freedom, can make certain goods possible. “As I Walked Out One Evening” — W. H. AudenThe poem Jeff reads and reflects upon at the conclusion of the conversation. Connect with the Humanitas InstituteHumanitas Institute | https://humanitasinstitute.orgX | https://x.com/HIClassicalEdInstagram | https://www.instagram.com/humanitas_institute/TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@humanitas_instituteFacebook | https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61588606585070YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@TheHumanitasInstitute

    What Do We Lose When Work Becomes Only a Paycheck? with Jeffrey Dill

  3. Sep 21

    The Cost of Ambition and a Life Worth Living with Miroslav Volf

    What happens when your sense of worth depends on being better than the people around you? And what changes when you stop asking how you rank and start asking what kind of life is actually worth living? Brian Williams talks with theologian Miroslav Volf about the difference between excellence and superiority, the fragility of a self built on achievement, and the possibility of receiving our lives as gifts rather than projects of endless comparison. Drawing on Life Worth Living and The Cost of Ambition, they consider education, vocation, place, gratitude, contentment, and the communities that help us discern what we are for. Listen for a hopeful account of how we can pursue meaningful work and genuine excellence without making success the measure of our worth. Along the way, Volf reflects on growing up in Yugoslavia as the son of a Pentecostal minister, discerning his calling as a theologian, the disciplines and delights that sustain his ordinary life, and the writers who have helped him think about contentment, vocation, and hope. About the GuestMiroslav Volf is the Henry B. Wright Professor of Theology at Yale Divinity School and the Founder and Director of the Yale Center for Faith and Culture.  His many books include Life Worth Living: A Guide to What Matters Most, The Cost of Ambition: How Striving to Be Better than Others Makes Us Worse, and Glimmerings: Letters on Faith between a Poet and a Theologian. Guest Links Yale Center for Faith & Culture | https://faith.yale.edu/ Life Worth Living | https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/691260/life-worth-living-by-miroslav-volf-matthew-croasmun-and-ryan-mcannally-linz/ The Cost of Ambition | https://bakerbookhouse.com/products/9781587437311_the-cost-of-ambition?srsltid=AfmBOopzP8KPhrxDR6EZM-VjIwfoeo4nhB36_Y-br3sffcYsk2BOWmQX Episode References / Resources Life Worth Living: A Guide to What Matters Most by Miroslav Volf, Matthew Croasmun, and Ryan McAnnally-Linz The Cost of Ambition: How Striving to Be Better Than Others Makes Us Worse by Miroslav Volf Education’s End by Anthony T. Kronman The Sickness Unto Death by Søren Kierkegaard Works of Love by Søren Kierkegaard Hannah Coulter by Wendell Berry Exclusion and Embrace by Miroslav Volf Dante Alighieri, Paradiso,  Connect with the Humanitas InstituteHumanitas Institute | https://humanitasinstitute.orgX | https://x.com/HIClassicalEdInstagram | https://www.instagram.com/humanitas_institute/TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@humanitas_instituteFacebook | https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61588606585070YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@TheHumanitasInstitute

    The Cost of Ambition and a Life Worth Living with Miroslav Volf

  4. Sep 7

    Encountering the Real: Mathematics, Education, and AI with Jake Tawney

    What if mathematics is not merely a tool for solving problems, but a way of encountering reality? In this episode of Forged, Brian Williams talks with mathematician and educator Jake Tawney about the beauty of number and shape, why wonder belongs at the heart of education, and what we risk losing when technology begins doing our thinking for us. From Euclid and fractals to calculators and artificial intelligence, Jake makes the case that education should begin with real things worth knowing and loving. Their conversation ultimately turns toward a larger question: What habits, practices, and encounters help us become more fully human? Jake and Brian explore why mathematics has so often been reduced to computation, how teachers can invite students into genuine wonder, and why AI raises deeper questions than efficiency alone. Jake also reflects on the practices that have shaped his own life as a husband and father, including prayer, cooking, wine, reading aloud, and the conviction that our first calling is to give ourselves for the good of others. Books & Resources MentionedAnother Sort of Mathematics: Selected Proofs Necessary to Acquire a True Education in Mathematics by Jake TawneyEuclid’s ElementsA Mathematician’s Lament by Paul LockhartThe Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe by C. S. LewisGaudium et Spes (Pastoral Constitution on the Church in the Modern World), especially paragraphs 22 and 24 About the GuestJacob Tawney (Jake) has been enamored by mathematics for as long as he can remember, from kindergarten to calculus. But he truly fell in love with it during his sophomore year at Denison University during a course on mathematical proofs. After completing an undergraduate degree in mathematics and computer science from Denison, he continued his studies at The Ohio State University. There he earned a master’s degree in mathematics, submitting a thesis on the mathematics of juggling. During his time in Ohio, Tawney taught at Upper Arlington High School and the Pontifical College Josephinum, including courses in Euclid and the philosophy of mathematics. In 2014 he relocated his family to Phoenix, Arizona, to join Great Hearts Academies, where he most recently served as the chief academic officer. In 2026, Jake joined the Institute for Catholic Liberal Education where he currently serves as the Director of Curriculum and Academic Resources. Jake is the author of Another Sort of Mathematics, available through Encounter Books, as well as a primer on teaching Euclid available through Cana Academy. Jake is the proud husband of Christina and the proud father of eight children, all of whom have something unique in their souls that can only be satisfied by wondering about mathematics. Another Sort of Mathematics - Encounter Books | https://www.encounterbooks.com/books/another-sort-mathematics/ Connect with the Humanitas InstituteHumanitas Institute | https://humanitasinstitute.orgX | https://x.com/HIClassicalEdInstagram | https://www.instagram.com/humanitas_institute/TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@humanitas_instituteFacebook | https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61588606585070YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@TheHumanitasInstitute

    Encountering the Real: Mathematics, Education, and AI with Jake Tawney

  5. Aug 24

    Junius Johnson on Learning to See the World as Wild and Wonderful

    How do fairy stories prepare children for a world of suffering, courage, beauty, and surprise? And what happens when adults lose the imagination to see rain, trees, music, and ordinary acts of making as anything more than useful resources? Dr. Junius Johnson joins Brian Williams to explore how fantasy gives us categories for facing real danger, recognizing evil, practicing courage, and remaining open to wonder. Drawing from Tolkien, C. S. Lewis, George MacDonald, The Neverending Story, and his own life as a musician and father, Junius argues that good stories do more than entertain us. They train our affections and help us become the kind of people who can enter the world with wisdom, desire, and hope. Their conversation moves from dragons and unicorns to grief, beauty, friendship, music, and the work of making. Along the way, Junius offers a practical invitation: read stories that enlarge your moral imagination, make something beautiful even when no one is watching, and resist the habit of calling the world “merely” ordinary. About the GuestJunius Johnson is a writer, teacher, speaker, independent scholar, and musician. His work focuses on beauty, imagination, and wonder in the Christian and Classical intellectual traditions. He is the executive director of Junius Johnson Academics and holds a BA from Oral Roberts University (English Lit), an MAR from Yale Divinity School (Historical Theology), and an MA, two MPhils, and a PhD (Philosophical Theology) from Yale University. He is the author of 5 books and is a contributing writer for the Humanitas textbooks with Classical Academic Press. He is co-host of The Classical Mind, a podcast discussing the great books of the Western tradition. Guest LinksJunius Johnson Academics | https://academics.juniusjohnson.com/Junius Johnson Publications | https://www.juniusjohnson.com/The Classical Mind Podcast | https://www.theclassicalmind.com/ On Teaching Fairy Stories | https://www.amazon.com/dp/1600514928/ Father of Lights | https://www.amazon.com/Father-Lights-Theology-Life-World/dp/1540964892/Junius Johnson on Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/junius_johnson/Junius Johnson on X | https://x.com/DrJuniusJohnsonJunius Johnson Academics on Facebook | https://www.facebook.com/JuniusJohnsonAcademicsJunius Johnson Academics on YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@juniusjohnsonacademics Connect with the Humanitas InstituteHumanitas Institute | https://humanitasinstitute.orgX | https://x.com/HIClassicalEdInstagram | https://www.instagram.com/humanitas_institute/TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@humanitas_instituteFacebook | https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61588606585070YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@TheHumanitasInstitute

    Junius Johnson on Learning to See the World as Wild and Wonderful

  6. Aug 10

    Hope Is a Practice: Lydia Dugdale on The Lost Art of Dying Well

    How can we prepare for death without becoming consumed by it? And what might the lost art of dying teach us about living with greater wisdom, agency, and hope? Dr. Lydia Dugdale joins Brian Williams to recover an older vision of mortality, one in which preparing for death meant tending to our relationships, forming our character, asking ultimate questions, and learning when medical technology helps or harms. Their conversation offers a practical invitation: rather than leaving our final decisions to fear, haste, or unfamiliar institutions, we can begin now to live the kind of life that makes dying well possible. Lydia and Brian discuss hope as a virtue that can be practiced rather than a feeling we must wait to receive. Lydia identifies five practices that help us resist despair: lament, endurance, imagination, confidence formed through gratitude, and the sustaining love of community. About the GuestLydia Dugdale, MD, MAR (ethics), is the Dorothy L. and Daniel H. Silberberg Professor of Medicine at the Columbia University Medical Center and Director of the Center for Clinical Medical Ethics. She also serves as Co-Director of Clinical Ethics at NewYork-Presbyterian Hospital/Columbia University Irving Medical Center.A practicing internist, Dr Dugdale moved to Columbia in 2019 from Yale University, where she previously served as Associate Director of the Program for Biomedical Ethics and founding Co-Director of the Yale Program for Medicine, Spirituality, and Religion. Her scholarship focuses on end-of-life issues, the role of aesthetics in ethics, moral injury, and the doctor-patient relationship. She edited Dying in the Twenty-First Century (MIT Press, 2015) and is author of The Lost Art of Dying (HarperOne, 2020), a popular press book on the preparation for death. Dr Dugdale attended medical school at the University of Chicago, completed residency training at Yale-New Haven Hospital, and holds a MAR in ethics from Yale Divinity School. Guest LinksThe Lost Art of Dying | https://www.amazon.com/Lost-Art-Dying-Reviving-Forgotten/dp/0062932640/ref=pd_ci_mcx_mh_mcx_views_0?pd_rd_w=dJyQ3&content-id=amzn1.sym.352fa4e9-2aa8-47c3-b5ac-8a90ddbece20%3Aamzn1.symc.40e6a10e-cbc4-4fa5-81e3-4435ff64d03b&pf_rd_p=352fa4e9-2aa8-47c3-b5ac-8a90ddbece20&pf_rd_r=ZS5VF87D3067V5WKN4X0&pd_rd_wg=CgWsb&pd_rd_r=48553bce-b241-40ab-8dd5-93fc63e7fdb3&pd_rd_i=0062932640 Dying in the Twenty-First Century | https://mitpress.mit.edu/9780262534598/dying-in-the-twenty-first-century/ Columbia Center for Clinical Medical Ethics on X | https://x.com/columbia_ccme Columbia Center for Clinical Medical Ethics on Facebook | https://www.facebook.com/ColumbiaCenterforClinicalMedicalEthics Connect with the Humanitas InstituteHumanitas Institute | https://humanitasinstitute.orgX | https://x.com/HIClassicalEdInstagram | https://www.instagram.com/humanitas_institute/TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@humanitas_instituteFacebook | https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61588606585070YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@TheHumanitasInstitute

    Hope Is a Practice: Lydia Dugdale on The Lost Art of Dying Well

  7. Jul 27

    Elliot Ackerman on Fatherhood, Friendship, and the Habits That Shape Men

    How does a father help his son become a good man? In this episode of Forged, Brian Williams speaks with Marine veteran, novelist, and journalist Elliot Ackerman about the small habits and embodied patterns that shape a man’s life and form the next generation: wearing a suit with intention, writing a thank-you note, keeping a friend, caring for meaningful objects, reading deeply, and learning to live with purpose. Drawing from Ackerman’s series “A Man Should Know,” the conversation explores why fathers, coaches, mentors, and male friendships matter in a culture where many young men are left to make it up as they go. For fathers seeking to lead their homes with wisdom, steadiness, and hope, this conversation offers a clear reminder: formation often begins in the little things. Ackerman also reflects on the Marine Corps, the influence of his own father, the meaning carried by inherited objects, the discipline of writing, and the quiet work of raising children with both acceptance and standards. Together, Brian and Elliot consider how fathers pass on more than advice. They pass on habits, stories, loves, friendships, and a way of seeing the world. About the GuestElliot Ackerman is the author of the novels Sheepdogs, Halcyon, 2034 (coauthor), Red Dress in Black and White, Waiting for Eden, Dark at the Crossing, and Green on Blue, as well as the memoirs The Fifth Act: America’s End in Afghanistan and Places and Names: On War, Revolution, and Returning. His books have been nominated for the National Book Award, the Andrew Carnegie Medal in both fiction and nonfiction, and the Dayton Literary Peace Prize. He is a contributing writer at The Atlantic and a Marine veteran who served five tours of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan, where he received the Silver Star, the Bronze Star for Valor, and the Purple Heart. He divides his time between New York City and Washington, DC. Elliot Ackerman at Penguin Random House | https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/authors/2133889/elliot-ackerman/ Connect with the Humanitas InstituteHumanitas Institute | https://humanitasinstitute.orgX | https://x.com/HIClassicalEdInstagram | https://www.instagram.com/humanitas_institute/TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@humanitas_instituteFacebook | https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61588606585070YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@TheHumanitasInstitute

    Elliot Ackerman on Fatherhood, Friendship, and the Habits That Shape Men

  8. Jul 13

    Why Making Things Matters: Andrew Peterson on Beauty, Discipline, and Hope

    What kind of person is formed by songs, stories, gardens, books, and the patient work of making? This episode is a living picture of classical education beyond the classroom. In this conversation, Brian Williams speaks with singer-songwriter, author, and Rabbit Room founder Andrew Peterson about how truth, goodness, and beauty are carried through embodied practices: reading aloud, making music, gathering around tables, learning from creation, and practicing a craft over time. Andrew invites parents, educators, and ordinary makers to recover the courage to begin badly, the discipline to keep going, and the joy of telling the truth as beautifully as we can. Together, Brian and Andrew explore the Rabbit Room as a “wayside inn” for artists and readers, the formative power of handmade work, the goodness of amateur creativity rooted in love, and the danger of bypassing craft. This conversation offers a hopeful vision for homes, schools, and communities where beauty is not an extra, but part of how children and adults become fully human. About the GuestAndrew Peterson is a singer-songwriter, author, and founder of the Rabbit Room. Andrew has released more than ten records over the past twenty years, earning him a reputation for songs that connect with his listeners in ways equally powerful, poetic, and intimate. As an author, Andrew’s books include the four volumes of the award-winning Wing feather Saga, which have sold more than a million copies, along with his creative memoirs, Adorning the Dark, and The God of the Garden. He’s also an executive producer of the Wing feather Saga Animated Series, which is currently in production on its third season with Angel Studios. In 2008 Andrew founded the Rabbit Room, a nonprofit organization based in Nashville, Tennessee that nourishes Christ-centered communities by cultivating and curating stories, art, and music. Guest LinksAndrew Peterson | https://www.andrew-peterson.com/The Rabbit Room | https://www.rabbitroom.com/The Wingfeather Saga | https://www.wingfeathersaga.com/Adorning the Dark | https://www.bhpublishinggroup.com/product/adorning-the-dark-2/adorning-the-dark-2/The God of the Garden | https://www.bhpublishinggroup.com/product/the-god-of-the-garden-2/ Connect with the Humanitas Institute Humanitas Institute | https://humanitasinstitute.org X | https://x.com/HIClassicalEd Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/humanitas_institute/ TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@humanitas_institute Facebook | https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61588606585070 YouTube | https://www.youtube.com/@TheHumanitasInstitute

    Why Making Things Matters: Andrew Peterson on Beauty, Discipline, and Hope
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Forged: A timeless way of living. A podcast about forging lives of discipline, delight, craft, and calling that carry enduring wisdom into modern life.

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