Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health

Dr. Johnny Lieberman
  • 5.0 (10)
  • Self-Improvement
  • Updated Bimonthly

Welcome to Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health—a podcast for smart, curious listeners who are tired of being misled by clickbait headlines and not always sure which headlines to believe. Hosted by Dr. Johnny Lieberman—internist, infectious diseases physician, accidental dog dad, and now with an Animal Law Degree - this show pulls back the curtain on the interconnected and opaque systems that shape our food, medicine, environment, and public health. From factory farms to pharmaceutical labs, from the dog in your home to the label on your lunch meat—what’s marketed as “healthy” or “humane” is often anything but. Each episode investigates the real stories behind the headlines: the science, the policy, the ethics, and the consequences. Dr. Lieberman brings a sharp, witty, no-fluff perspective—armed with over 20 years of medical experience and a deep drive to uncover truth. Through solo episodes, expert interviews, and roundtable discussions, you’ll learn how to navigate misinformation, advocate for better systems, and make decisions that align with your values. If you’ve ever wondered what’s really in your food, how pandemics emerge, or whether you’re accidentally supporting abusive industries—this is the podcast for you.

  1. Behind the Label: How Industries Shape What We Believe About Animals | Ep21

    5d ago

    Behind the Label: How Industries Shape What We Believe About Animals | Ep21

    In this episode of Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, Dr. Johnny Lieberman talks with Ashley Frohnert, Director of Social Media at PETA, about humane-washing, consumer psychology, and the hidden realities behind products marketed as ethical, humane, or compassionate. From her childhood in 4-H to leading one of the world’s most influential animal advocacy social media teams, Ashley shares how questioning deeply held beliefs can lead to unexpected discoveries about animals, industry, and ourselves.

    40 min
  2. Humane Washing: The Labels Consumers Trust and the Truth Behind Them with Amber Canavan | Ep20

    May 27

    Humane Washing: The Labels Consumers Trust and the Truth Behind Them with Amber Canavan | Ep20

    Amber Canavan joins Dr. Johnny Lieberman to discuss humane washing, the marketing tactics used to make industrial animal agriculture appear ethical and compassionate. Together, they explore consumer psychology, public perception, animal advocacy, and the growing role of social media in exposing hidden realities behind food labeling and animal welfare claims.

    42 min

  3. May 13

    Why Animal Testing Is a Broken System and What's Replacing It with Mackensey Alexander | Ep19

    What if the biggest obstacle to curing Alzheimer's, ALS, and cancer isn't funding or effort, but the model we've been using for 2,000 years? Mackensey Alexander, bioethicist and law student at Lewis & Clark, makes the case that animal testing isn't just ethically wrong, it's scientifically broken. With a 90% failure rate in translating results to humans and $23 billion in taxpayer dollars spent annually on animal models, Mackensey and Dr. Lieberman break down the growing field of New Approach Methods (NAMs), from tumor organoids to organ-on-a-chip technology, and why the science of the future is already here. Plus: what's happening right now in Washington D.C. that could change everything.

    35 min

  4. Apr 29

    Animal Research: Bad Science, and A Broken System: A Former Lab Researcher Speaks Out | Ep18

    What if the system we rely on to develop life-saving medicines is fundamentally flawed, causing immense animal suffering while failing to produce reliable results for humans? In this powerful episode of Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, Dr. Johnny Lieberman speaks with Dr. Emily Trunnell, Director of Science Advancement and Outreach at PETA. A former neuroscience researcher who conducted experiments on rats and mice during her PhD, Dr. Trunnell reveals the shocking realities of lab animal research  from dehydrated rats dying due to basic care failures and rats being forcibly intoxicated while lab workers joke about it, to Institutional Animal Care and Use Committees (IACUCs) acting as little more than rubber stamps. You’ll hear why more than 90% of drugs that pass animal tests still fail in human trials, the massive reproducibility crisis in animal research, species differences that make translation unreliable, and exciting non-animal methods (like organs-on-chips and AI modeling) that are already proving more human-relevant. This episode exposes a broken, self-regulated system and highlights the momentum toward modern, animal-free science that could accelerate medical progress while reducing harm. Top 3 Takeaways: The Animal Research Oversight System Is Broken and Self-Regulatory IACUCs are dominated by animal researchers who “police themselves.” They check minimal boxes under the Animal Welfare Act (which excludes 95–99% of animals like mice and rats), rarely question justifications for pain or multiple surgeries, and provide almost no real protection. Animal Experiments Are Poorly Reproducible and Rarely Translate to Humans Up to 89% of preclinical studies cannot be reproduced. 95% of drugs that succeed in animals fail in human clinical trials due to vast species differences, unnatural lab conditions, and publication bias that hides negative results. Modern Non-Animal Methods Are Superior and Already Available Technologies like organs-on-chips, organoids, and AI-driven in silico modeling use human cells and biology, deliver faster and more accurate results, and can replace animal tests  with agencies like the FDA now actively working to make animal testing the exception rather than the rule. About the Guest: Dr. Emily Trunnell Dr. Emily Trunnell graduated Magna Cum Laude from the University of Georgia with a degree in Nutrition Science and earned her doctorate in Neuroscience from the University of Georgia in 2016. She is currently the Director of Science Advancement and Outreach at PETA, where she works to modernize science policy, scientific publishing practices, and university education to support the transition to animal-free research methods. A former animal researcher who conducted experiments on rats and mice during her PhD, Dr. Rinne lives with a passion for advancing human-relevant science that benefits both people and animals. 🔗 Learn more: scienceadvancement.org. About the Show: Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health explores the intersection of animal welfare, public policy, and human health. Hosted by Dr. Johnny Lieberman, each episode invites changemakers, legal experts, and health advocates to shed light on what really impacts our communities and what we can do about it. About the Host: Dr. Johnny Lieberman is a physician, public health advocate, and lifelong animal lover with a passion for connecting the dots between animal welfare, human behavior, and the systems that shape our lives. With a background in both medicine and public health policy, Johnny brings a unique lens to conversations about how our treatment of animals impacts human health, the environment, and social justice. In Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, Johnny brings warmth, curiosity, and a dash of wit to tough conversations that matter. From exposing the realities of factory farming to uncovering the links between zoonotic diseases and our food systems, his goal is to empower listeners to be informed, compassionate, and engaged citizens while still keeping it real (and sometimes bringing in puppies). Whether he's discussing legislative loopholes or snuggling his rescue dog between recordings, Dr. Lieberman believes that creating a healthier world starts with how we treat its most vulnerable beings. Email: John@johnliebermanmd.com

    51 min
  5. Foie Gras: Force-Feeding, Cruelty, and the Grassroots Fight to Ban a Diseased Delicacy | Ep17

    Apr 15

    Foie Gras: Force-Feeding, Cruelty, and the Grassroots Fight to Ban a Diseased Delicacy | Ep17

    What if the fancy appetizer on upscale menus is actually a diseased organ produced through daily torture? In this powerful episode of Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, host Dr. Johnny Lieberman sits down with Sam Schillinger, Oregon Campaign Director for Pro Animal Future. Sam shares his journey from growing up in Iowa’s factory farm heartland to becoming a full-time organizer fighting to end animal agriculture through policy change. The conversation dives deep into the hidden cruelty of foie gras production where birds are force fed via tubes multiple times a day, leading to organ perforation, extreme trauma, and mortality rates far higher than normal. Sam explains why Pro Animal Future is prioritizing bans on the sale and production of force fed foie gras through ballot initiatives and direct lobbying in Portland, Denver, and Washington DC. You’ll hear why political organizing and empowering people as voters (rather than just consumers) offers huge untapped potential for helping farmed animals, how public support often exceeds what legislators prioritize, and practical ways anyone can get involved from signing petitions and attending socials to joining signature gathering efforts like Goosapalooza in DC. Whether you’re concerned about animal suffering, food system ethics, or using democracy to create change, this episode is a compelling call to move beyond awareness into organized action. Top 3 Takeaways: Policy Change Through Political Organizing Has Massive Potential  While many animal advocacy efforts focus on individual consumer choices, turning broad public support for animals into laws via ballot initiatives and lobbying is an underutilized but powerful lever that can create lasting systemic change. Foie Gras Is a Diseased Organ Produced Through Extreme Cruelty  Ducks and geese are force fed massive amounts of food through tubes jammed down their throats up to three times daily until their livers become pathologically enlarged (up to 10x normal size), with high rates of organ perforation and mortality. This is not a natural or healthy product, it's a diseased liver marketed as a delicacy. Grassroots Power Works Even Against Industry Resistance   Despite a recent committee setback in Portland, persistent advocacy is bringing the foie gras sales ban back to full city council. Meanwhile, Denver has already qualified a ban for the 2026 ballot, and DC is launching a major signature collection. Victories come from volunteers, community building, and sustained pressure on elected officials. About the Show: Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health explores the intersection of animal welfare, public policy, and human health. Hosted by Dr. Johnny Lieberman, each episode invites changemakers, legal experts, and health advocates to shed light on what really impacts our communities and what we can do about it.   About the Guest Sam Schillinger: Sam Schillinger is the Oregon Campaign Director for Pro Animal Future and a dedicated community organizer and animal advocate. Originally from Iowa, one of the nation’s top factory farming states, Sam studied philosophy in college, which prompted him to critically examine the ethics of our food system. After beginning as a petition circulator and briefly attending law school, he dropped out to pursue full-time advocacy for farmed animals. In his role with Pro Animal Future, Sam works with volunteers, voters, and elected officials to pass pro-animal policies, including efforts to ban the sale of force-fed foie gras in Portland. He is passionate about building political power for animals and turning public concern into enforceable laws. Outside of advocacy, Sam enjoys ultra-distance running, traveling, and theater. 🔗 Learn more: Pro Animal Oregon  Pro-Animal Oregon Website: https://proanimaloregon.org/ Stampede: stampede.proanimal.org Meetup: https://www.meetup.com/pro-animal-oregon/ Link to join Signal Chat: https://signal.group/#CjQKIMcRPytTHn3iNlON_IlLUjUYBdTjdgP_l-8-lyY2vpIaEhCp7zIsQG99xu0j_9Kvlad7 Goosapalooza Registration: https://proanimal.org/goosa About the Host:  Dr. Johnny Lieberman is a physician, public health advocate, and lifelong animal lover with a passion for connecting the dots between animal welfare, human behavior, and the systems that shape our lives. With a background in both medicine and public health policy, Johnny brings a unique lens to conversations about how our treatment of animals impacts human health, the environment, and social justice. In Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, Johnny brings warmth, curiosity, and a dash of wit to tough conversations that matter. From exposing the realities of factory farming to uncovering the links between zoonotic diseases and our food systems, his goal is to empower listeners to be informed, compassionate, and engaged citizens while still keeping it real (and sometimes bringing in puppies). Whether he's discussing legislative loopholes or snuggling his rescue dog between recordings, Dr. Lieberman believes that creating a healthier world starts with how we treat its most vulnerable beings. Email: John@johnliebermanmd.com

    42 min
  6. Dogs in Research: Taxpayer Funded Suffering and the Push for Human Relevant Science | Ep16

    Mar 30

    Dogs in Research: Taxpayer Funded Suffering and the Push for Human Relevant Science | Ep16

    What if the animal research you thought was saving lives was actually driven more by money and outdated methods than real scientific progress? In this powerful  episode of Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, host Dr. Johnny Lieberman sits down with Jeremy Beckham, animal rights activist and third year law student at Lewis & Clark Law School. With over 20 years of advocacy experience including work with PETA, the Beagle Freedom Project, and the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine Jeremy reveals how the multi-billion-dollar animal research industry is disconnected from actual patient outcomes. From the shocking use of beagles in painful toxicity tests to the story of chimpanzees that led to a major policy shift, Jeremy explains why 92% of drugs that pass animal tests still fail in humans, how institutions prioritize grants and publications over results, and why non animal methods are often superior. He also shares hard-won victories, including campaigns that closed dog labs and shifted universities toward better science. Whether you’re a dog lover, a physician, a scientist, or simply someone who wants medical research that actually works, this episode is a must listen wake up call about where your tax dollars are going and how we can demand better for both animals and human health. Top 3 Takeaways: Animal Research Is Driven by Money, Not Results Research universities and breeding companies profit from massive federal grants and animal sales, but the system is untethered from delivering new therapies or cures for patients. Careers are built on publications, not real world outcomes. Most Drugs That Work in Animals Fail in Humans A shocking 92% of drugs deemed safe and effective in animal tests fail in human clinical trials. Meta analyses and real world examples like tobacco industry studies on beagles and monkeys show that animal data often misleads and delays progress. Public Pressure and Sunlight Work Campaigns exposing labs (including undercover footage from facilities like Ridglan Farms) and policy wins like ending chimpanzee research and the FDA Modernization Act show that scrutiny, advocacy, and shifting funding toward human relevant methods can create real change. About the Guest:  Jeremy Beckham Jeremy Beckham is a third year law student at Lewis & Clark Law School in Portland, Oregon, and a dedicated animal rights activist with more than 20 years of experience. He has worked in various capacities for PETA’s laboratory investigations department, the Beagle Freedom Project (as Research Specialist), and the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine. Jeremy has managed major campaigns against dog labs (including at Texas A&M and the University of Utah), helped pass state legislation requiring labs to offer dogs for adoption instead of euthanasia, and participated in numerous Freedom of Information Act efforts to expose lab practices. He is passionate about using the law to advocate for better science and stronger protections for animals. After graduating, Jeremy plans to continue litigating on behalf of animal protection organizations and activists. LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jsbeckham About the Show: Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health explores the intersection of animal welfare, public policy, and human health. Hosted by Dr. Johnny Lieberman, each episode invites changemakers, legal experts, and health advocates to shed light on what really impacts our communities and what we can do about it. About the Host: Dr. Johnny Lieberman is a physician, public health advocate, and lifelong animal lover with a passion for connecting the dots between animal welfare, human behavior, and the systems that shape our lives. With a background in both medicine and public health policy, Johnny brings a unique lens to conversations about how our treatment of animals impacts human health, the environment, and social justice. In Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, Johnny brings warmth, curiosity, and a dash of wit to tough conversations that matter. From exposing the realities of factory farming to uncovering the links between zoonotic diseases and our food systems, his goal is to empower listeners to be informed, compassionate, and engaged citizens while still keeping it real (and sometimes bringing in puppies). Whether he's discussing legislative loopholes or snuggling his rescue dog between recordings, Dr. Lieberman believes that creating a healthier world starts with how we treat its most vulnerable beings. Email: John@johnliebermanmd.com

    54 min
  7. Making Your Voice Heard: Public Comments, Rulemaking, and Animal Welfare with Nicole Wood | Ep 15

    Mar 18

    Making Your Voice Heard: Public Comments, Rulemaking, and Animal Welfare with Nicole Wood | Ep 15

    What if you could directly shape the rules that govern factory farming, environmental protections, and more without ever running for office? In this eye-opening episode of Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, host Dr. Johnny Lieberman talks with Nicole Wood, a second-year law student at Lewis & Clark Law School focused on animal law and industrial agriculture reform. Nicole explains the rulemaking process, where agencies turn broad laws into enforceable details, and how anyone can submit public comments during open periods to make their perspective count. Drawing from their own journey from growing up around family farms to becoming a vegan advocate and active commenter on issues like feedlot pollution Nicole demystifies terms like "humane washing" and "greenwashing," exposes misleading industry labels, and offers practical steps: using regulations.gov and federalregister.gov, crafting persuasive comments with personal testimony and facts, and even building records for future legal challenges. Whether you're passionate about animal rights, the environment, public health, or any regulated issue, this episode empowers you to move beyond frustration and into action balancing industry influence with your voice as a consumer, parent, or concerned citizen. Top 3 Takeaways: Public Comment Periods Are Open to Everyone When agencies propose or update rules (under laws they've been tasked to implement), they must open a notice-and-comment period anyone can submit input via regulations.gov. No expertise or direct impact required; your perspective adds visibility and can influence outcomes. Persuasive Comments Combine Personal Testimony and Facts Start with who you are and why the issue matters to you (e.g., as a consumer or parent), then back it up with evidence, studies, or corrections to agency claims. Agencies review and often respond to comments in groups when finalizing rules; strong, fact-based input carries real weight. "Humane Washing" and "Greenwashing" Exploit Consumer Values Labels like "cage-free" or "climate-friendly" often mislead chickens may still be overcrowded and stressed, or companies claim net-zero goals without plans or tech to achieve them (as in Tyson's settled case). Research beyond marketing; public comments help challenge these gaps in regulation. About the Guest:   Nicole Wood is a second year JD student at Lewis & Clark Law School, specializing in animal law with a focus on challenging industrial animal agriculture through regulatory advocacy, consumer protection, and environmental law. A longtime vegan advocate, Nicole serves as Symposium Editor for the Animal Law Review, External Projects Chair for the Animal Legal Defense Fund student chapter, and has contributed to public comments on issues like feedlot pollution permits. Their pre-law experience in financial compliance sharpened their eye for regulatory gaps, driving their commitment to corporate transparency and animal protection. Nicole is a 2025-26 Law Scholars for Change recipient for their dedication to farmed animal advocacy. Websites: ALDF: Animal Rights and Welfare : https://aldf.org/article/take-action/ Food and Water Watch: Clean Water, Climate Change, Wildlife Protection, Fighting Factory Farms: https://www.foodandwaterwatch.org/get-involved/ Center for Food Safety: Pesticides, Clean Water, Fighting Factory Farms, Wildlife Protection: https://www.centerforfoodsafety.org/policy-comments New comment opportunities in press releases: https://www.centerforfoodsafety.org/news Brooks Institute: Animal Rights and Welfare : https://thebrooksinstitute.org/subscribe About the Show: Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health explores the intersection of animal welfare, public policy, and human health. Hosted by Dr. Johnny Lieberman, each episode invites changemakers, legal experts, and health advocates to shed light on what really impacts our communities—and what we can do about it. About the Host: Dr. Johnny Lieberman is a physician, public health advocate, and lifelong animal lover with a passion for connecting the dots between animal welfare, human behavior, and the systems that shape our lives. With a background in both medicine and public health policy, Johnny brings a unique lens to conversations about how our treatment of animals impacts human health, the environment, and social justice. In Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, Johnny brings warmth, curiosity, and a dash of wit to tough conversations that matter. From exposing the realities of factory farming to uncovering the links between zoonotic diseases and our food systems, his goal is to empower listeners to be informed, compassionate, and engaged citizens while still keeping it real (and sometimes bringing in puppies). Whether he's discussing legislative loopholes or snuggling his rescue dog between recordings, Dr. Lieberman believes that creating a healthier world starts with how we treat its most vulnerable beings. Connect with Dr. Johnny Lieberman Email: John@johnliebermanmd.com

    36 min
  8. My Origin Story: From Infectious Disease Doctor to Animal Advocate | Ep14

    Mar 4

    My Origin Story: From Infectious Disease Doctor to Animal Advocate | Ep14

    What happens when a life-changing bond with a dog reshapes your entire career? In this intimate origin story episode of Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, host Dr. Johnny Lieberman opens up about his transformation from a thriving infectious disease physician in Colorado to a law student in Oregon focused on animal welfare. Drawing from over two decades in medicine, Johnny recounts how adopting his first dog, Celeste, ignited a passion for animal rights, leading him to confront issues like puppy mills, factory farming, and systemic flaws in healthcare. From navigating personal loss and depression to volunteering against animal exploitation and rebooting his life during the COVID-19 surge, Johnny reveals the tipping points that shifted his focus to One Health, a framework connecting animal welfare, human health, and the environment. He also exposes healthcare industry pitfalls, like profit-driven decisions that deny care to high-risk patients. Whether you're a healthcare professional, animal lover, or someone contemplating a career pivot, this episode inspires reflection on identity, compassion, and making systemic change for a better world. Top 3 Takeaways: The Power of the Human-Animal Bond: A deep connection with dogs like Celeste and Sienna can profoundly change your perspective, teaching presence, empathy, and the joys of rescue, while exposing hidden cruelties like puppy mills. Healthcare's Hidden Conflicts: Profit motives in medicine, such as value-based purchasing systems, often prioritize hospital scores over patient needs, leading to denied surgeries for high-risk individuals and a broken system driving early retirements. Embracing One Health for Systemic Change: Animal welfare, human health, and environmental management are interconnected; shifting careers to advocate in this space can leverage skills like medical expertise to reduce suffering and create a broader positive impact. About the Show Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health explores the intersection of animal welfare, public policy, and human health. Hosted by Dr. Johnny Lieberman, each episode invites changemakers, legal experts, and health advocates to shed light on what really impacts our communities—and what we can do about it. About the Host Dr. Johnny Lieberman is a physician, public health advocate, and lifelong animal lover with a passion for connecting the dots between animal welfare, human behavior, and the systems that shape our lives. With a background in both medicine and public health policy, Johnny brings a unique lens to conversations about how our treatment of animals impacts human health, the environment, and social justice. In Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health, Johnny brings warmth, curiosity, and a dash of wit to tough conversations that matter. From exposing the realities of factory farming to uncovering the links between zoonotic diseases and our food systems, his goal is to empower listeners to be informed, compassionate, and engaged citizens—while still keeping it real (and sometimes bringing in puppies). Whether he's discussing legislative loopholes or snuggling his rescue dog between recordings, Dr. Lieberman believes that creating a healthier world starts with how we treat its most vulnerable beings. Connect with Dr. Johnny Lieberman : Email: John@johnliebermanmd.com

    22 min
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About

Welcome to Puppies, Pandemics, and Public Health—a podcast for smart, curious listeners who are tired of being misled by clickbait headlines and not always sure which headlines to believe. Hosted by Dr. Johnny Lieberman—internist, infectious diseases physician, accidental dog dad, and now with an Animal Law Degree - this show pulls back the curtain on the interconnected and opaque systems that shape our food, medicine, environment, and public health. From factory farms to pharmaceutical labs, from the dog in your home to the label on your lunch meat—what’s marketed as “healthy” or “humane” is often anything but. Each episode investigates the real stories behind the headlines: the science, the policy, the ethics, and the consequences. Dr. Lieberman brings a sharp, witty, no-fluff perspective—armed with over 20 years of medical experience and a deep drive to uncover truth. Through solo episodes, expert interviews, and roundtable discussions, you’ll learn how to navigate misinformation, advocate for better systems, and make decisions that align with your values. If you’ve ever wondered what’s really in your food, how pandemics emerge, or whether you’re accidentally supporting abusive industries—this is the podcast for you.

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