Industry Relations

Rob Hahn and Greg Robertson
  • 4.7 (36)
  • TECHNOLOGY
  • UPDATED WEEKLY

This is Industry Relations, a podcast that is at the intersection of real estate and technology from an insider's perspective. Hosted weekly by Rob Hahn (The Notorious ROB) and Greg Robertson.

  1. JAN 28

    Jack Miller on Lists, Trends, Marketplaces and CoStar.

    The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player! Overview Rob and Greg are joined by Jack Miller (President & CEO of T3 Sixty) for a wide-ranging discussion on the SP 200, changes to T3's ranking methodology, brokerage business models, agent economics, consolidation, and the future of the MLS as a comprehensive marketplace. Key Takeaways SP 200 methodology update: Rankings now factor in future impact, not just past performance, leading to notable shifts in the Top 10. Agent economics by model: Traditional brokerages show higher average agent income, while fee-based and capped models emphasize unit economics. Brokerage costs: The critical metric is cost per transaction and cost per agent—not just GAAP net income. Teams vs. platforms: High-producing agents increasingly partner with platforms (Compass, Place, Side) instead of building large internal teams. MLS under pressure: Preserving a comprehensive marketplace is the key challenge as private and delayed listings increase. Consolidation continues: Industry consolidation is ongoing, but not near an end-state oligopoly. Portals vs. brokerages: Compass and Zillow are shaping industry direction in different ways, with contrasting strengths and strategies. Links Consulting Trends Industry Rankings Sp200 Rankings Industry News Connect with Rob and Greg Rob's Website  Greg's Website    Watch us on YouTube   Our Sponsors: Cotality  Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board    Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    1h 16m

  2. JAN 21

    Can You Regulate "Public Marketing"?

    The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player! Overview Rob and Greg open the episode by honoring Glenn Kelman's retirement from Redfin, reflecting on his leadership style, industry impact, and memorable moments. The conversation then pivots to new state-level legislation in Wisconsin and Washington targeting listing transparency, and whether laws attempting to regulate "public marketing" will actually change broker behavior—or simply create loopholes. Key Takeaways Glenn Kelman's legacy: Widely regarded as a first-ballot industry Hall of Famer for his longevity, candor, and mission-driven leadership at Redfin. Marketing vs. data: "Marketing" a listing is not the same as disclosing full MLS data—an important distinction lawmakers may be overlooking. Legislation limits: New laws requiring public marketing are difficult to define and enforce, and may fail to prevent private or limited-exposure listings. Free market tension: Over-regulation can lead to workarounds and unintended consequences rather than the transparency it aims to create. MLS role evolving: MLS participation is increasingly seen as a trade-off rather than a necessity, though inertia and seller expectations remain powerful forces. Links Satirical Realtor Video   Connect with Rob and Greg Rob's Website  Greg's Website    Watch us on YouTube   Our Sponsors: Cotality  Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board    Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    56 min

  3. JAN 14

    Compass Closes, CoStar Cuts, TAN Stirs the Pot.

    The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player! Overview Rob and Greg dive into a packed week in real estate: the Compass–Anywhere deal officially closes, CoStar announces major spending cuts for Homes.com, and the recently settled Top Agent Network lawsuit raises big questions about the future of Clear Cooperation. They debate what these moves mean for MLSs, brokers, and portals—and preview the industry shake-ups still to come. Key Takeaways MLS Reset is sold out, with Rob returning as a featured speaker. Compass–Anywhere deal closes, surprising some who expected DOJ interference. CoStar cuts Homes.com spending by 35%, signaling a shift in strategy but not an exit from residential. Debate over Homes.com's future: Will CoStar pivot, partner with brokerages, or rethink its model? Top Agent Network settlement surfaces new guidance from NAR, suggesting TAN may not violate Clear Cooperation—potentially reshaping private-listing practices. Rob and Greg strongly disagree on the long-term impact of the TAN news and the strength of private networks. Upcoming injunction ruling (Zillow vs. NAR/DOJ context) may matter less than expected depending on how Compass positions itself. Links Compass Article Greg Hague Guest Post Connect with Rob and Greg Rob's Website  Greg's Website    Watch us on YouTube   Our Sponsors: Cotality  Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board    Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    38 min

  4. JAN 7

    What if the MLS Becomes Optional?

    The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player! Overview In this episode, Rob and Greg dive into the implications of a future where exclusive listings become the industry norm. They explore how this shift could reshape brokerages, MLS operations, agent recruitment, consumer transparency, and portal business models. With a slow news week in real estate, the discussion becomes a deep speculative analysis of what happens if the market fully embraces private listing networks, how big brokers consolidate power, and whether the MLS becomes a "nice to have" rather than a necessity. They also touch on political factors, Zillow vs. Homes.com strategy, and how agents might adapt in a less transparent ecosystem. Key Takeaways Exclusive listings could dramatically shift power to large brokerages, enabling stronger recruitment flywheels and disadvantaging boutique firms. Big brokers may form alliances to consolidate private listing access, leaving smaller shops struggling to compete. MLSs risk becoming secondary tools—useful but no longer essential—if private networks supply the bulk of market inventory. Consumer transparency may decline if days-on-market and price-change history disappear, increasing agent value as data interpreters. Portal strategies (Zillow, Homes.com) may need to adapt, especially if sellers aren't willing to pay for exposure under an exclusive model. The industry still misunderstands exclusive listings, which are less about double-ending and more about recruiting, retention, and leverage. Market cycles and seller psychology remain central, as many sellers still prefer full exposure while others choose convenience and certainty. Political housing policy may shift unexpectedly, though current geopolitical chaos makes predictions uncertain.   Connect with Rob and Greg Rob's Website  Greg's Website    Watch us on YouTube   Our Sponsors: Cotality  Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board    Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    56 min

  5. 12/31/2025

    Forecast 2026: Mortgage Rates, MLS Wars, and Industry Consolidations

    The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player! Overview Rob Hahn and Greg Robertson close out the year with their annual predictions episode. They debate where housing transactions, interest rates, and home prices are headed, then turn to broader market forecasts. The conversation shifts to industry-specific predictions around lawsuits, private listings, MLS policy, portal strategy, and where consolidation may reshape brokerages and real estate technology next. Key Takeaways Existing home sales, interest rates, and median home price predictions — with very different rationales. Why mortgage rates may be driven more by the bond market than the Fed. Bold calls on NASDAQ, gold, and Bitcoin. Compass vs. Zillow and the future of private listings. A potential overturning of the NAR settlement and what that would mean for the industry. Why forms litigation could be the next major legal battleground. What portals like Zillow, Realtor.com, and Homes.com may need to change. Predictions around major brokerage, franchise, and proptech consolidation. MLSs redefining participants, IDX access, and control of listing data.   Connect with Rob and Greg Rob's Website  Greg's Website    Watch us on YouTube   Our Sponsors: Cotality  Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board    Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    1h 2m

  6. 12/24/2025

    2025 in the Rearview: Who Got It Right?

    The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player! Overview Rob Hahn and Greg Robertson close out the year by revisiting their 2024 predictions and grading how they actually turned out. From transaction volume and mortgage rates to MLS power shifts, NAR's role, Zillow's influence, and major industry moments, the episode becomes a candid year-in-review on what really changed—and what didn't—in real estate. Key Takeaways Greg outperformed Rob on most economic predictions, including transaction volume, mortgage rates, and median home prices.  The stock market's strong performance validated Rob's bullish call.  MLSs and NAR dominated debate: MLS autonomy increased, while NAR's influence continued to erode.  Realtor.com's acquisition activity missed Greg's specific predictions, while Rob's calls on Phoenix-style breakaways and MLS mergers did not materialize. Zillow's growing power, ongoing lawsuits, and IDX tensions were identified as major forces shaping the future. Housing affordability emerged as a defining political issue, highlighted by discussions around commissions, younger voter sentiment, and proposals like 50-year mortgages.  Both hosts frame 2025 as a "transition year," where the consequences of earlier lawsuits and policy shifts fully surfaced. Next week, 2026 Predictions!   Links: Bingo Board Vendor Alley    Connect with Rob and Greg Rob's Website  Greg's Website    Watch us on YouTube   Our Sponsors: Cotality  Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board    Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    57 min

  7. 12/17/2025

    Who Runs Bartertown?

    The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player! Overview Rob Hahn and Greg Robertson dig into the escalating conflict between Zillow and MRED over private listing networks (PLNs), IDX rules, and Zillow's Listing Access Standards (ZLAS). What starts as a dispute over listing visibility quickly becomes a deeper conversation about power: who ultimately controls listing data—the MLS or the portal? The episode explores MRED's emails to brokers, Zillow's outreach for direct feeds, potential January disruptions, and why this fight could set a precedent for MLS–portal relationships nationwide.  Key Takeaways Zillow and MRED are on a collision course over whether Zillow can selectively exclude PLN listings while still receiving IDX feeds.  MRED argues selective exclusion violates its IDX rules; Zillow argues it owes transparency to sellers and consistency to its standards.  Emails suggest Zillow may pursue direct broker feeds, potentially bypassing the MLS if access is cut off.  The dispute is less about private listings themselves and more about control—"who runs Barter Town."  Outcomes range from MLS dominance, to Zillow dominance, to a hard-to-define compromise—with major implications for brokers, sellers, and other MLSs. Links Zillow stalemate with Chicago's MLS looks like it's coming to a head Mad Max Clip   Connect with Rob and Greg Rob's Website  Greg's Website    Watch us on YouTube   Our Sponsors: Cotality  Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board    Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    1 hr

  8. 12/10/2025

    How Much Transparency Is Too Much?

    The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player! Overview In this episode, Rob and Greg dive into the recurring issue of embezzlement and financial mismanagement within small Realtor associations. Using recent cases as a jumping-off point, they debate what "transparency" should actually look like in a member-driven nonprofit, whether associations should provide full access to financial records, and what safeguards could reasonably prevent future financial failures. The discussion gets spirited as they explore audits, member oversight, governance culture, and how much transparency is too much—or not enough. Key Takeaways Embezzlement in small associations: Recent cases highlight how financially fragile many smaller associations are and how one incident can destabilize them.  Audit funding proposals: Rob suggests that state or national associations should fund audits for smaller associations that can't afford them. Transparency debate: Rob advocates for allowing any member to inspect line-item financials; Greg argues that professional audits—not member investigations—are the correct mechanism for oversight. Concerns about disruption: Greg emphasizes how untrained members digging through records could create confusion, waste staff time, or misinterpret legitimate expenses. Proper purpose & confidentiality: Rob proposes a compromise where members may inspect records but must keep information within the association; Greg notes NDAs may be required due to vendor contract confidentiality. Governance culture: Both agree that trust has eroded in parts of organized real estate, though they disagree on the extent and cause. Association survival risk: When embezzlement happens in small associations, they may face insolvency or be forced to merge. Checks & balances: Discussion includes dual-signature thresholds, expense-tracking systems like Ramp, and the importance of third-party annual audits. Connect with Rob and Greg Rob's Website  Greg's Website    Watch us on YouTube   Our Sponsors: Cotality  Notorious VIP The Giant Steps Job Board    Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

    1h 1m
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4.7
out of 5
36 Ratings

About

This is Industry Relations, a podcast that is at the intersection of real estate and technology from an insider's perspective. Hosted weekly by Rob Hahn (The Notorious ROB) and Greg Robertson.

Information

  • Creator
    Rob Hahn and Greg Robertson
  • Years Active
    2017 - 2026
  • Episodes
    100
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © Rob Hahn & Greg Robertson
  • Show Website
    Industry Relations

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