The Successful Bookkeeper Podcast

Michael Palmer
  • 4.8 (85)
  • Management
  • Updated Weekly

The Successful Bookkeeper Podcast is a weekly show to help increase your confidence, work smarter and build a business you love. Each week you'll listen to inspiring guests who will share their success secrets, so you can take your bookkeeping enterprise and life to another level. Some of them include New York Times Best-Selling Author of E-Myth, Michael E. Gerber, Pure Bookkeeping Co-Founder, Debbie Roberts, the host of The Productive Woman podcast, Laura McClellan and the author of *I Know How She Does It*, Laura Vanderkam. If you're a bookkeeping business owner who is looking for an uplifting, entertaining and informative podcast exclusively for YOU then you have arrived at the right place! Get ready because your journey towards success begins — now. Your Host Michael Palmer is an acclaimed business coach who has helped hundreds of bookkeepers across the world push through their fears and exponentially grow their businesses and achieve the quality of life they've always wanted.

  1. 2d ago

    EP538: Dr. Sabrina Starling - Work From Your Strengths: Build A Profitable Firm Without Burnout

    See what the team at The Successful Bookkeeper has on right now → Dr. Sabrina Starling has spent over 20 years helping small business owners build profitable, sustainable companies without burning themselves out. In this episode, she brings her business psychology background directly to bookkeepers — walking through her $10,000-an-hour framework, the mindset shift that changed everything for her, and the practical steps you can take right now to stop trading hours for dollars and start building a business that works without you. Chapters [00:00] Opening and guest introduction [01:35] Burnout and starting a business [04:40] The E-Myth epiphany [08:10] The $10,000-an-hour framework [12:40] First hire and finding A-players [17:00] Time audits and glass ceilings [19:10] What has and hasn't changed in 20 years [22:40] AI and the human advantage [25:30] Serving your top clients and micro-innovation [28:50] The free download and closing thoughts From Burnout to 25 Hours a Week Sabrina started her business fresh out of a gruelling career as a psychologist in community mental health — working 40- to 50-hour weeks, taking on-call shifts, and running on empty. When she launched her coaching practice and started a family at the same time, she made what she calls a "very naive declaration": she would only work 25 hours a week. What felt like an impossible constraint turned out to be one of the best decisions she ever made. "Limits force innovation and creativity," she explains. That boundary forced her to be ruthlessly focused on only the work that moved the business forward. The $10,000-an-Hour Framework The turning point came when Sabrina started categorising every task in her business by its dollar-per-hour value — $10, $100, $1,000, or $10,000. She printed the chart and put it behind her monitor so she'd see it constantly. "Inevitably, I would be nose down working on something for a client, and then I would look up and say, oh my gosh, I've just spent 4 hours in $10 and $100 an hour activity." Blocking her highest-value work on the calendar first — before checking email, before firefighting — is what made the difference. She's made the chart available as a free download at tapthepotential.com/10k, along with two podcast episodes walking through how to use it for yourself and with your team. Hiring A-Players Into the Right Seats Sabrina's first hire was a virtual assistant — and the thinking she put into that hire became the seed of her How to Hire the Best book series. Rather than hiring fast out of desperation, she asked: what strengths does this role actually require to deliver results day in and day out? Her original VA, hired for her people skills and attention to detail, is still with the company 20 years later. "One A-player in the right seat working from their strengths will be 900% to 1,200% more productive than a warm body team member." For bookkeepers, payroll is already the biggest profit leak — and it's usually not optimised with A-players. AI, Adaptability, and the Human Advantage AI is reshaping bookkeeping, and Sabrina doesn't sidestep that. But her take is direct: when you offload $10-an-hour busywork to AI, you free yourself to do the work that actually can't be automated — deeply understanding your best clients, spotting problems they can't see in their own numbers, and delivering insight that goes far beyond the books. "When we convey to our team members that we want them doing $10,000 an hour work and we're going to show them how, they get so excited and they are relieved because they know they have job security at that point." The bookkeepers who will thrive are the ones having real conversations with their top clients and continuously innovating around their needs. Working From Your Sweet Spot Sabrina encourages bookkeepers to identify the 20% of clients driving 80% of revenue — and then narrow that further to the ones who are also a genuine joy to work with. Those are the relationships worth doubling down on. Use your natural detail orientation to tune in to what those clients are worried about, what's keeping them up at night, and where you can remove friction for them. She calls the result "micro-innovation" — small, consistent improvements that compound over time and make you genuinely irreplaceable. "Small steps forward taken in a consistent direction lead to big change over time." Links Mentioned Free $10,000-an-hour activity chart + bonus podcast episodes: tapthepotential.com/10k The E-Myth by Michael Gerber How to Hire the Best book series by Dr. Sabrina Starling Profit by Design Podcast (Tap the Potential) thesuccessfulbookkeeper.com About the Guest Dr. Sabrina Starling is a business psychologist, speaker, and author, and the founder of Tap the Potential LLC. She helps entrepreneurs build profitable, sustainably run companies by hiring A-players, building strong systems, and designing businesses that support their lives — not the other way around. Her entire team works 25 hours a week, and she has personally worked down to about 10. She is the author of the How to Hire the Best series and hosts the Profit by Design podcast. About the host Michael Palmer Michael Palmer is the host of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast and co-founder of Pure Bookkeeping and The Successful Bookkeeper. He started this work because of his father — a brilliant electrical contractor who worked twice as hard as he should have had to, because nobody on the financial side was in his corner. That gap is what The Successful Bookkeeper exists to close. His view: bookkeepers are the most undervalued force in small business — and every bookkeeper who builds a real business changes two families: theirs, and their clients'.

    32 min

  2. Jun 23

    EP537: Teresa Gregory - Check Your Bias: How Mindset Shifts Help Bookkeepers Lead Better

    See what the team at The Successful Bookkeeper has on right now → Teresa Gregory has spent her career helping leaders find the hidden patterns that quietly shape every decision they make. In this conversation with host Michael Palmer, she turns that lens directly on bookkeeping professionals — the people who sit in a unique seat of trust with their clients every single day. Whether you manage a team, serve a full client roster, or are building your firm on your own, the mindset habits Teresa shares here apply immediately. Chapters [00:00] Introduction and Teresa's Background [03:13] Hidden Bias and First Impressions [07:00] Bias as a Biological Response [11:00] Working With Difficult Clients [14:30] The PAUSE Method Explained [19:00] Active Listening vs. Reloading [23:00] Strategic Client Check-Ins [27:00] Why Every Bookkeeper Needs a Coach [31:30] Positioning Yourself as an ROI Expert [35:30] Teresa's Resources and Wrap-Up Hidden Bias Is Running in the Background Every interaction you walk into carries invisible baggage. Teresa calls it the fight-or-flight response — a biological pattern your brain uses to assess safety and make quick judgments. The problem isn't that it exists; the problem is when you let a past experience cloud what's happening right now. "I'm reinforcing every time I have this engagement with them without identifying it and without saying, 'hey, this is what's going on,'" she explains. The first step is simply naming the bias before you walk into a meeting, a call, or a difficult conversation. The PAUSE Method for Breaking the Pattern Teresa teaches a five-step framework — Pause, Awareness, Unwind, Strategic, Effectiveness — that gives leaders a repeatable way to interrupt bias before it takes over. Pause and name what you're carrying. Build awareness of when it tends to show up. Unwind the reinforced pattern. Be strategic about what you'll do differently. Then evaluate honestly: did it work? "You have to identify it and say, 'this is what's causing me to do this,' and then look at how do I overcome it?" The method works whether you're prepping for a tense client review or walking into a room full of people you're slightly in awe of. Active Listening vs. Reloading Most people think they're listening. Teresa says they're reloading — nodding, making eye contact, and waiting for their turn to talk. Active listening looks different: you take in what the client actually said, reframe it back in your own words, and confirm you got it right. "What I heard you saying is…" followed by "Did I get that right?" This one shift builds more trust than almost anything else you can do. For bookkeepers — who already have deep, consistent access to business owners — it's a fast path to becoming a true strategic partner rather than a transactional vendor. Know What Your Client Actually Cares About Teresa is direct: you should have a running list of each client's core values and priorities. "If I cannot say to Michael, your number one important thing is ROI or bottom line or taxes, I need to be able to identify that. You should have a running list of what are the things that are important to that client so you can speak to those — and then any solution that you're proposing or any conversation you're having ties right back to it." Schedule intentional check-ins — monthly if possible, quarterly at minimum — to ask what has changed. Businesses change. Lives change. If you're not asking, you're missing it. Reposition Yourself as an ROI Expert One of the most practical moments in this episode is Teresa's challenge to bookkeepers to rethink how they introduce themselves. "If you were to tell me, 'I offer business owners a strategic advantage because I help them understand ROI' — now I'm like, whoa, I need that." Her own sister, a bookkeeper, spent six months practicing a new way of describing her work at local chamber events. The result: new clients in industries she'd never considered. You track every dollar that moves through a business. That is, by definition, the work of an ROI expert. Lead with that. Links mentioned Squared Success website: squaredsuccess.com Teresa Gregory on LinkedIn: search "Teresa L. Gregory" PureBookkeeping: purebookkeeping.com The Successful Bookkeeper: thesuccessfulbookkeeper.com About the guest Teresa Gregory is the founder of Squared Success, a leadership strategy and coaching firm. She began her career in training and development inside corporate organizations — including supporting the finance team at Microsoft — before transitioning into executive coaching for business owners. Her work focuses on helping leaders uncover hidden mindset barriers, break bias patterns, and build the intentional habits that drive real results. Teresa is also a speaker and, notably, coaches her own bookkeeper sister to help her grow her firm. About the host Michael Palmer Michael Palmer is the host of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast and co-founder of Pure Bookkeeping and The Successful Bookkeeper. He started this work because of his father — a brilliant electrical contractor who worked twice as hard as he should have had to, because nobody on the financial side was in his corner. That gap is what The Successful Bookkeeper exists to close. His view: bookkeepers are the most undervalued force in small business — and every bookkeeper who builds a real business changes two families: theirs, and their clients'.

    42 min

  3. Jun 16

    EP536: Melissa Broughton - Buy Before They Close: Acquiring Bookkeeping Firms The Smart Way

    See what the team at The Successful Bookkeeper has on right now → Melissa Broughton, founder of Busy Bee Advisors in Sacramento, has built a bookkeeping firm that grows not just through referrals and marketing, but through strategic acquisition of other bookkeeping practices. In this episode, she pulls back the curtain on her complete acquisition process — from finding firms before they shut their doors, to vetting the financials, to integrating clients without losing them. If you've ever wondered whether buying a book of business could be part of your growth plan, Melissa's experience — including the deals that went sideways — is exactly what you need to hear. Chapters [00:00] Cold open teaser [01:15] Melissa's growth journey since last episode [05:30] Launching an online bookkeeping course [09:00] How the acquisition strategy began [12:30] The 70% rule and the water test [17:00] Vetting financials and avoiding pitfalls [21:00] What makes a firm attractive to buyers [25:30] Client integration and transition lessons [30:00] Reading the seller's personality [33:30] Capacity, formulas, and skipping brokers How Melissa Got Into Acquisitions It started with a pattern Melissa kept hearing from tax professionals: a bookkeeper with a thriving practice would simply close up shop, send clients a farewell letter, and leave them scrambling. "There were bookkeepers who had successful, thriving practices and they just decided to retire — they just closed their doors." That gap between a bookkeeper ready to walk away and clients who still need service looked like an opportunity. The goal became getting in front of those owners before they pulled the plug. The 70% Rule and Other Benchmarks Melissa's core filter is straightforward: would the acquisition still be profitable if you only kept 70% of the clients? "We look at, is the business still profitable if you only retain 70% of their business? That's our benchmark." She calls it the "water test," and a surprising number of potential deals don't pass it. She also looks at minimum client roster size, client interaction levels, software alignment (her firm runs exclusively on QuickBooks Online), and whether all clients are under a signed contract. A book of business built on handshakes and mixed software platforms is a much riskier buy than it appears on paper. Vetting the Financials — Don't Take It as Gospel Because bookkeepers are numbers people, Melissa says they're actually well-positioned to do the kind of financial scrutiny most buyers skip. "Ask for proof of those deposits. Make sure that the income lines up." She requests bank statements alongside tax returns, digs into payroll breakdowns, and checks lease agreements — because taking on a seller's remaining lease obligations can quietly sink a deal. She also warns against letting a seller's likability cloud the numbers: "Nice has nothing to do with it." Integration: What Makes or Breaks the Transition The smoothest acquisition Melissa ever completed involved an owner who was fully ready to walk away and sent a clean, brief handover note to clients. The hardest ones involved sellers who couldn't really let go. "We generally will not have the owners stay on — I can only think of two situations where we've had the owners stay on, and I will say I regretted it both of those times." For every acquisition, she brings on extra team support and deploys what she calls a "client whisperer" — a trusted admin who calls each new client, makes the introduction, and asks the question most people avoid: what did your previous bookkeeper do that drove you crazy? What Sellers Should Know Melissa also flips the conversation for bookkeepers thinking about eventually selling their practice. The three biggest value drivers in her eyes are: signed contracts with every client, a reasonable level of ongoing client communication (not too hands-off, not so personal that clients will leave when you do), and consistent use of mainstream software. She also recommends having payment on file rather than invoicing after the fact — both as a business practice and because it signals a well-run, collectible revenue stream to any buyer. Starting negotiations, Melissa uses a 1.25x multiplier on receivables as a baseline and works from there. Links Mentioned Busy Bee Advisors: busybeeadvisors.com Contact Melissa directly for her acquisition formula and checklist — email will be in the show notes The Successful Bookkeeper: thesuccessfulbookkeeper.com Pure Bookkeeping: purebookkeeping.com About Melissa Broughton Melissa Broughton is the founder and owner of Busy Bee Advisors, a fully remote bookkeeping firm headquartered in Sacramento, California, with team members spread across the United States. She has built and sold businesses across multiple industries and has applied those lessons to growing her bookkeeping practice through strategic acquisitions. In 2024, she launched an online course to help aspiring bookkeepers start their own businesses; by August 2025, more than 3,500 people had completed it. Melissa is a returning guest on The Successful Bookkeeper podcast. About the host Michael Palmer Michael Palmer is the host of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast and co-founder of Pure Bookkeeping and The Successful Bookkeeper. He started this work because of his father — a brilliant electrical contractor who worked twice as hard as he should have had to, because nobody on the financial side was in his corner. That gap is what The Successful Bookkeeper exists to close. His view: bookkeepers are the most undervalued force in small business — and every bookkeeper who builds a real business changes two families: theirs, and their clients'.

    37 min

  4. Jun 9

    EP535: Benjamin Tasker - Skills Over Tools: How Bookkeepers Can Thrive In The AI Revolution

    See what the team at The Successful Bookkeeper has on right now → AI is moving fast, and the bookkeeping profession is squarely in its path — but not in the way most people fear. In this episode, Michael Palmer sits down with AI strategist and educator Benjamin Tasker to talk about what the shift actually looks like on the ground, which skills will separate bookkeepers who thrive from those who stall, and how to start building your own AI system without a data science degree. Chapters [00:00] Welcome and Ben's Background [03:15] From Data Science to AI Education [08:00] AI's Real Impact on Bookkeeping [12:00] Human Judgment as the Key Check [15:30] Skills That Separate Thriving Bookkeepers [21:00] Data, Systems, and AI Strategy [25:00] Opportunities to Move Up the Value Chain [29:00] First Steps for Integrating AI [32:00] Client Expectations and Transparency [35:00] Fear, Mindset, and Where to Find Ben AI Will Elevate Bookkeeping, Not Replace It Ben is direct about the headline fear: bookkeepers are not going away. "AI will help elevate what a bookkeeper does," he says. The repetitive work — transaction coding, receipt capture, anomaly detection, drafting reports — gets absorbed by AI, which frees up the bookkeeper to move from data entry to data judgment. Think less time in the books and more time coaching clients on their financial pain points. AICPA and Intuit both point in the same direction: the future of the role looks a lot more like analytics and advisory than data input. The Two Skill Lanes Every Bookkeeper Should Know Ben references the World Economic Forum's skills taxonomy, which divides skills into two tracks. AI skills — analytical thinking, systems thinking, coding — pay a premium today, but AI will eventually encroach on those. Human skills — communication, empathy, leadership — are undervalued right now but will command a premium as AI can only mimic, never genuinely replace, them. "AI can put on a facade of empathy and compassion, but it really can't have it because it's robotic." For bookkeepers, the practical focus areas are AI supervision (checking outputs rigorously), advisory thinking, digital and data fluency, and transparent client communication. The Human in the Loop Is Not Optional Ben's background in healthcare data — building algorithms to predict sepsis risk from bedside monitors — gives him a sharp view on why human validation matters. A small data error that goes unchecked can cascade into a much larger problem. "A mistake, especially for a small business owner, could cost tens of thousands of dollars." Bookkeepers already understand this: the work is either right or it isn't. That precision mindset is exactly what responsible AI use demands, and it is a genuine competitive advantage for practitioners who carry it into their AI workflows. Data Is the Oil — Build a System, Not Just a Stack of Tools One of Ben's clearest points: buying an AI tool is not an AI strategy. The framework he outlines is straightforward — start with your data (client records, call transcripts, templates, Google Sheets), run it through a system you build and control, apply AI to it, then validate and iterate. "Just because you buy an AI tool doesn't mean you have an AI strategy or even an AI business." He encourages bookkeepers to build their own processing systems rather than relying entirely on third-party integrations that can change without warning. Start small — something as simple as having AI draft follow-up emails from call transcripts is a low-risk, high-value first step. Practical First Steps and Client Communication For bookkeepers ready to start, Ben's advice is to pick a low-stakes problem, solve it, and let that build confidence. Use AI to profile prospective clients from call transcripts, automate follow-up reminders, or create a client-facing dashboard from existing data. On the client side, transparency is non-negotiable: communicate that you are using AI, explain how it benefits them, and teach them how to give better inputs so they get better outputs. "By providing inputs and encouraging your customers to use AI to show them the benefits of it, they're going to become less resistant over time." That kind of teaching deepens the client relationship well beyond what traditional bookkeeping alone can offer. Links Mentioned Ben Tasker AI: bentaskerai.com Ben Tasker on LinkedIn World Economic Forum Skills Taxonomy (AI skills and human skills tracks) The Successful Bookkeeper Pure Bookkeeping About the Guest Benjamin Tasker is an AI strategist, educator, and speaker with over 10 years of experience in data science and artificial intelligence. His background spans healthcare predictive analytics, higher education, and enterprise AI strategy. Today he helps entrepreneurs and large organizations build the skills and systems they need to navigate the AI revolution. You can find his prompting frameworks, podcast appearances, and upcoming events at bentaskerai.com. About the host Michael Palmer Michael Palmer is the host of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast and co-founder of Pure Bookkeeping and The Successful Bookkeeper. He started this work because of his father — a brilliant electrical contractor who worked twice as hard as he should have had to, because nobody on the financial side was in his corner. That gap is what The Successful Bookkeeper exists to close. His view: bookkeepers are the most undervalued force in small business — and every bookkeeper who builds a real business changes two families: theirs, and their clients'.

    36 min

  5. Jun 2

    EP534: Sammy Mattingly & Fred Ott - Systems Before Scale: How Two Partners Built A Firm That Lasts - Part 2 of 2

    See what the team at The Successful Bookkeeper has on right now → Sammy Mattingly and Fred Ott are back for the finale of their two-part conversation with host Michael Palmer. Where Part 1 covered the leap into bookkeeping entrepreneurship, Part 2 gets into the gritty, practical work of making a young firm sustainable — documenting processes, surviving the first real growth wave, hiring employee number one, and deciding what kind of business they actually want to build. Chapters [00:00] Introduction and Episode Recap [01:18] What Makes This Partnership Work [04:30] Growth Wave Exposes System Gaps [07:00] Hiring the First Employee [09:00] Fixing Onboarding the Right Way [12:00] Joining Pure Bookkeeping and Freedom Gateway [15:30] Walls Hit and Lessons Learned [18:30] Long-Term Vision and the Journey [21:30] The 'How to Make a Few Thousand Dollars' Podcast The Partnership Advantage One of the quieter themes running through this episode is just how much the partnership itself has been a growth tool. Sammy puts it plainly: "Fred is the only one of my friends that I could do this with — and it's mostly down to that accountability piece and the amount of work that each of us is going to put into this." For bookkeepers considering a partner arrangement, this episode is a useful reality check on what makes it work — shared drive, mutual trust, and complementary skill sets — and what makes it hard. When Clients Arrive Faster Than Your Systems The real test of any process is live clients. Sammy and Fred thought their systems were solid after months of heavy networking. Then the referrals started rolling in, and the cracks showed fast. "We quickly realized our systems and our processes are not what we need to be able to support the growth that we have now and that we want in the future," Fred says. Their response was to pull back from networking temporarily, sit down together, and map out standard operating procedures from scratch — building workflows, identifying automation opportunities, and stress-testing everything against real client volume. Onboarding: Break It, Fix It, Repeat Onboarding was the first thing to crack under pressure. Rather than patching it on the fly, Sammy and Fred blocked a Saturday, mapped every pain point, and rebuilt it. When the next wave of clients came through a month later, the process was smooth — but it surfaced a new set of smaller issues. "There's always something rolling onto the pocket of like, okay, here's an issue with our process," Sammy says. "Now we need to set aside time to work together to map out how to fix that and how to implement it." That cycle of deliberate improvement is now a permanent feature of how they run the business. Pure Bookkeeping and the Freedom Gateway Sammy credits early podcast listening for pointing him toward Pure Bookkeeping, and describes the decision to join as straightforward once the need for a real system became obvious. What stood out most was the access to experienced guidance: "Having an hour with Lisa Campbell a week, someone who's done it, who's built a very successful firm — she was great in just helping us learn and develop and how to work on the business." They also appreciated that the system is customizable — their Pure and Pixie setup reflects their firm, not a template. Building Toward Something (Without Telling Everyone What It Is) When Michael asks about the long-term vision, neither Sammy nor Fred throws out a revenue number — and Michael approves. Fred frames it well: "Like we want to grow and do all these things, but ultimately the day-to-day — we want the day-to-day to be enjoyable. We like challenging ourselves, we're curious people, and we like learning." They're also currently working through Traction by Gino Wickman and have launched their own podcast, How to Make a Few Thousand Dollars, which earned an early shoutout from the entrepreneur who inspired the name. Links Mentioned Mattingly & Ott Financial Accounting How to Make a Few Thousand Dollars — Sammy and Fred's podcast (search on your podcast app) Pure Bookkeeping — the system referenced throughout the episode Traction by Gino Wickman — EOS framework book Sammy and Fred are currently implementing How to Make a Few Billion Dollars by Brad Jacobs — inspiration for their podcast name The Successful Bookkeeper Episode featuring Theresa Slack — referenced by Michael as a model partnership story About the Guests Fred Ott and Sammy Mattingly are co-founders of Mattingly & Ott Financial Accounting, LLC, a growing bookkeeping firm built on referral-driven networking, deliberate systems work, and a commitment to serving small business owners in their community. Friends since high school, they made the jump from W-2 employment to entrepreneurship together and are now navigating their first year of real scale — with their first employee, a growing client roster, and a podcast of their own. About the host Michael Palmer Michael Palmer is the host of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast and co-founder of Pure Bookkeeping and The Successful Bookkeeper. He started this work because of his father — a brilliant electrical contractor who worked twice as hard as he should have had to, because nobody on the financial side was in his corner. That gap is what The Successful Bookkeeper exists to close. His view: bookkeepers are the most undervalued force in small business — and every bookkeeper who builds a real business changes two families: theirs, and their clients'.

    25 min

  6. May 26

    EP533: Sammy Mattingly & Fred Ott - From Porta Potties To Bookkeeping: How Networking Built Their Firm Fast - Part 1

    See what the team at The Successful Bookkeeper has on right now → Sammy Mattingly and Fred Ott co-founded Mattingly & Ott Financial Accounting in their mid-twenties, with backgrounds in Big Four auditing and investment management — and a brief, memorable detour into portable sanitation. In Part 1 of this two-part conversation, they walk through the early decisions that shaped their firm: getting certified, landing first clients, and discovering that digital ads were no substitute for showing up in person. Chapters [00:00] Cold open and intro [01:18] Sammy's listener origin story [03:15] Backgrounds before bookkeeping [06:30] The porta potty adventure [11:00] Finding bookkeeping on YouTube [13:00] Five-week plan and first clients [16:00] Why paid ads flopped [18:30] Discovering networking as a strategy [21:00] Building one-to-one meeting habits [24:30] Shifting to strategic partnerships From Porta Potties to ProAdvisor Before bookkeeping, Sammy and Fred tried their hand at entrepreneurship the hard way — buying 20 used porta potties off a site called Crapper King, shipping them across the country on a semi-truck, and eventually moving them on Facebook Marketplace after a good pressure wash. The experience wasn't profitable, but it was formative. As Michael notes on the show, it gave them a layer of genuine empathy for clients: "They don't have all the answers, they're making mistakes, they're trying to figure it out." After a few more ideas, a YouTube video on starting a bookkeeping firm was all the spark Sammy needed. "I watched it, and I was like, well, if this guy can do it, Fred and I can do this." The Five-Week Launch Plan Once they committed to bookkeeping, Sammy and Fred moved fast. They built a five-week plan: get QuickBooks certified, become ProAdvisors, and land one client. Two large cleanup projects came through the QuickBooks ProAdvisor directory almost immediately — enough to justify going full-time. Fred describes those first weeks as equal parts doing the work and learning on the fly: "We were certified in QuickBooks, but it's like — we've got to figure out how this works. We've never done a QuickBooks cleanup for this type of company before." Why Paid Ads Weren't the Answer With their first projects underway, they turned to paid social media ads hoping to fill the pipeline. Six weeks and 15 or 16 leads later, the results were discouraging — contacts who were hard to reach and nowhere near ready to hire a bookkeeper. "We were finding they were all super unqualified," Fred says. That dead end turned out to be the pivot point. A conversation with a local small business attorney introduced a word they'd barely considered: networking. Networking as a Growth Engine Neither Sammy nor Fred would describe themselves as natural networkers — both lean introverted. But they committed fully, spending two to three months filling their days with open networking events and one-to-one coffee meetings. The accountability of working as a team made the difference: knowing the other person was putting in the effort kept each of them showing up. Fred's father, a career salesman, gave them the frame they needed: "Unseen, unheard, unsold." They tracked weekly one-to-one meeting goals, walked up to strangers, shook hands, and asked people to coffee — regardless of whether an obvious business connection was visible. Strategic Relationships Over Volume Over time, the approach evolved from broad networking to targeted relationship-building. Sammy describes the shift as following the data: "We took a step back and we were like, okay, what percentage of our referrals is coming from CPAs or whoever? And it's like, okay, well, if 80, 90% of our referrals are coming from these types of people, we need to go to rooms where there are these types of people." Tax preparers, business brokers, and other professionals who rarely attend networking events became the focus — making Mattingly & Ott's presence at those events even more valuable. Links mentioned Pure Bookkeeping — the system Sammy and Fred found through the podcast Pixie — practice management tool they discovered through The Successful Bookkeeper thesuccessfulbookkeeper.com — resources, episode search, and Ask the Show feature About the guests Sammy Mattingly and Fred Ott are co-founders of Mattingly & Ott Financial Accounting, LLC. High school friends turned business partners, they launched their bookkeeping firm roughly a year and a half ago and went full-time within the first few months. Sammy brings a background in Big Four audit; Fred comes from investment management. Together they serve small, service-based businesses and have built their client base almost entirely through in-person networking and strategic referral relationships. Part 2 of their conversation covers how those relationships translate into referral systems and scalable growth. About the host Michael Palmer Michael Palmer is the host of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast and co-founder of Pure Bookkeeping and The Successful Bookkeeper. He started this work because of his father — a brilliant electrical contractor who worked twice as hard as he should have had to, because nobody on the financial side was in his corner. That gap is what The Successful Bookkeeper exists to close. His view: bookkeepers are the most undervalued force in small business — and every bookkeeper who builds a real business changes two families: theirs, and their clients'.

    30 min

  7. May 19

    EP532: Natalia Zacharin - Price It And Zip It: How Confident Pricing Funds Real Growth - Part 2

    See what the team at The Successful Bookkeeper has on right now → If you've ever quoted a price, panicked at the silence, and then talked yourself into a discount before the prospect even responded — this episode is for you. In the finale of this two-part series, Natalia Zacharin, Founder and Principal of Zacharin Consulting, picks up where she left off: taking a firm from underpriced and overworked to a multi-million-dollar operation built on confident pricing, high-caliber hires, and fractional CFO services that change businesses from the inside out. Chapters [00:00] Cold open and episode intro [01:37] Non-negotiables and self-care [04:48] The hiring formula and pricing shift [08:00] Price it and zip it [11:00] Joining a mastermind, betting on herself [13:30] Building referrals and CFO services [17:30] What fractional CFO work really looks like [23:00] AI, pricing pressure, and quality [26:30] Hiring up and scaling out of production [29:00] Final advice and where to find Natalia The Moment She Stopped Underselling For a long time, Natalia was closing deals she immediately regretted. She'd set a minimum of $500 a month, get on the sales call, hit silence — and before the prospect could say a word, she'd already dropped the number. "I would get off the call and then be mad at myself because I did it again," she says. The fix was deceptively simple: state the price and stop talking. That uncomfortable pause exists for the client to process, ask questions, or push back — and it's not your job to fill it. Learning to sit in that silence was the turning point that finally gave her room to hire. The Hiring Formula Behind the Growth Natalia uses a straightforward formula: between $200,000 and $300,000 in gross revenue per employee. She was at $300,000 and wanted to hire — but the numbers said she needed to be closer to $500,000 first. So she raised her prices, created the margin, and then hired. Her early lesson: the first hire was underqualified, which meant she spent more time training than delegating. "Looking back, I should have hired someone with a lot more experience that was more expensive, maybe even a manager level." Hiring up — paying well, offering full benefits, building a team that can run without you — is the model she's stayed with ever since. Fractional CFO Services: Already Doing It for Free The expansion into fractional CFO work didn't start with a strategy — it started with Natalia noticing she was already answering CFO-level questions at the end of every bookkeeping sales call. Clients kept asking: how do I get more profitable? How much cash do I actually need? When should I hire? "If you're already giving advice, you're already doing that for free unless you're charging for it." She formalized those conversations into a monthly engagement built around projections, accountability, and the kind of honest focus that keeps business owners from avoiding the hard work that actually moves the needle. AI, Pricing Pressure, and Leaning the Right Direction With AI tools multiplying and overseas competitors undercutting on price, Natalia's response is deliberate: go the other direction. "Don't feel the pressure of constantly lowering your pricing. That's going in the wrong direction. You need to actually be even better." Her firm uses AI to work faster and more accurately, but every file is reviewed by an in-house controller regardless of client size. The value isn't in the tool — it's in the trained eye that knows where to look and what the numbers mean for that specific business. Scaling Yourself Out of the Business Getting out of day-to-day production takes longer than most people expect. Natalia spent four years trying to hand off payroll before she finally found a payroll-only specialist with decades of experience — not a generalist bookkeeper. The message for anyone building a firm: don't give up when a hire doesn't stick. Keep looking for the right person. "It took me four years to get out of payroll… I'd be on vacation, walking the beach, running someone's payroll on my phone because it kept coming back to me." The same patience applies to every role you want to transition out of. Links Mentioned Zacharin Consulting website: zacharynconsulting.com LinkedIn: Grow Your Bottom Line Instagram: Grow Your Bottom Line Pure Bookkeeping: purebookkeeping.com The Successful Bookkeeper resources: thesuccessfulbookkeeper.com About the Guest Natalia Zacharin is the Founder and Principal of Zacharin Consulting, a full-service bookkeeping and fractional CFO firm she built from the ground up as a single mother. Starting with cold LinkedIn outreach and clients at $75 a month, she scaled the firm to multi-million-dollar revenue by combining confident pricing, strategic hiring, and advisory services that help business owners understand and act on their numbers. She is based in the United States and serves clients across industries including logistics, IT, and professional services. About the host Michael Palmer Michael Palmer is the host of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast and co-founder of Pure Bookkeeping and The Successful Bookkeeper. He started this work because of his father — a brilliant electrical contractor who worked twice as hard as he should have had to, because nobody on the financial side was in his corner. That gap is what The Successful Bookkeeper exists to close. His view: bookkeepers are the most undervalued force in small business — and every bookkeeper who builds a real business changes two families: theirs, and their clients'.

    41 min

  8. May 12

    EP531: Natalia Zacharin - Zero Experience, Millions Earned: From Clerk To Inc. 5000 Firm Owner

    See what the team at The Successful Bookkeeper has on right now → Natalia Zacharin had no bookkeeping background, no clients, and no safety net when she started Zacharin Consulting in January 2019. She was 49, a single mom, and her invoicing clerk job was being phased out. In part one of this two-part conversation, Natalia lays out exactly how she went from that starting point to building a firm that now employs 16 people, targets $4 million in revenue, and landed at number 802 on the 2025 Inc. 5000 list. Chapters [00:00] Cold open: asking the right questions [00:52] Introducing Natalia Zacharin [03:00] From invoicing clerk to business owner [07:00] Where the firm stands today [10:00] First client via LinkedIn [13:00] Self-teaching bookkeeping on YouTube [16:30] Hiring a CPA manager — lessons learned [19:00] Building the pipeline: 4 clients to 12 [23:00] Doubling down and working 7 days a week [26:00] COVID, the PPP pivot, and early burnout Starting From Zero — And Meaning It Natalia's entry into bookkeeping wasn't a career pivot she planned. Her fiancé suggested it over coffee when she couldn't find another job. She enrolled in an online course, started messaging business owners on LinkedIn in January 2019, and landed her first client on January 29th of that year — a landscaping company owner in California who is still a client today. Her prior experience as an invoicing clerk in Microsoft Dynamics and NetSuite gave her attention to detail, but she had never opened QuickBooks. YouTube as a Training Program When Natalia got into her first client's books, she found the revenue hadn't been recorded — showing a negative $2 million on the P&L. Rather than walking away, she cleaned it up herself using YouTube, watching videos second by second and refreshing the balance sheet after every change to see what happened. "That was how I learned," she says. "I taught myself how to read financials, not how to do just data entry." It was slow, it was self-directed, and it worked. The Formula for Getting Clients Early On Natalia built her first pipeline through two channels: LinkedIn outreach and a local women's business group. Her LinkedIn approach was simple — start genuine conversations, never lead with a pitch, and ask questions. "No one likes it when you just come out with a full three paragraphs of what you do. No one cares." At in-person events, she set a clear intention before walking in: she was there to get a client, not just to have lunch. By August 2019 she had 4 clients and quit her day job. By November she had 12 — enough to cover her bills. Doubling Down on What Works After quitting her job, Natalia worked 12 to 14 hours a day, seven days a week, iterating constantly on what was generating new business. Her core principle: if something moves the needle, do more of it faster. She avoided prescriptive networking formats like BNI in favour of methods she could control and test. "Selling is psychological, it's not intuitive," she says. "I just didn't give up. I didn't feel like I had other options, so I just kept going." COVID, the PPP, and a Hard Lesson About Burnout In January 2020, Natalia called her mother — who had been helping her financially — to say she no longer needed the support. Three months later, COVID hit and her clients' revenues collapsed. She pivoted immediately to helping clients apply for PPP and EIDL loans, achieving near-perfect approval and forgiveness rates. But by August 2020, working alone under enormous pressure, she stopped exercising and started running out of energy. Part two of this series picks up there — with hard-won lessons on burnout, pricing, and scaling a team. Links Mentioned Zacharin Consulting: zacharinconsulting.com Pure Bookkeeping: purebookkeeping.com The Successful Bookkeeper: thesuccessfulbookkeeper.com About the Guest Natalia Zacharin is the Founder and Principal of Zacharin Consulting, a full-service accounting firm based in Maryland that offers bookkeeping, accounting, and fractional CFO services. She started the firm in 2019 with no formal bookkeeping training and grew it to a 16-person team tracking over $3 million in annual revenue. In 2025, Zacharin Consulting was named to the Inc. 5000 list of fastest-growing companies in the United States, ranking number 802. About the host Michael Palmer Michael Palmer is the host of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast and co-founder of Pure Bookkeeping and The Successful Bookkeeper. He started this work because of his father — a brilliant electrical contractor who worked twice as hard as he should have had to, because nobody on the financial side was in his corner. That gap is what The Successful Bookkeeper exists to close. His view: bookkeepers are the most undervalued force in small business — and every bookkeeper who builds a real business changes two families: theirs, and their clients'.

    26 min
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About

The Successful Bookkeeper Podcast is a weekly show to help increase your confidence, work smarter and build a business you love. Each week you'll listen to inspiring guests who will share their success secrets, so you can take your bookkeeping enterprise and life to another level. Some of them include New York Times Best-Selling Author of E-Myth, Michael E. Gerber, Pure Bookkeeping Co-Founder, Debbie Roberts, the host of The Productive Woman podcast, Laura McClellan and the author of *I Know How She Does It*, Laura Vanderkam. If you're a bookkeeping business owner who is looking for an uplifting, entertaining and informative podcast exclusively for YOU then you have arrived at the right place! Get ready because your journey towards success begins — now. Your Host Michael Palmer is an acclaimed business coach who has helped hundreds of bookkeepers across the world push through their fears and exponentially grow their businesses and achieve the quality of life they've always wanted.

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