Original Jurisdiction

David Lat
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Original Jurisdiction, a podcast about law and the legal profession, features host David Lat interviewing some of the most interesting, influential, and important people in the world of law. It's the companion podcast to Lat's Substack newsletter of the same name. You can follow David on Twitter (@DavidLat) or email him at davidlat@substack.com, and you can subscribe to his newsletter at davidlat.substack.com. davidlat.substack.com

  1. 2H AGO

    Build Windmills, Not Walls: Michael Gerstenzang

    Last month, Michael Gerstenzang concluded a nine-year run as managing partner of Cleary Gottlieb, one of the world’s leading law firms. During his tenure, he guided the firm through the Covid-19 pandemic, geopolitical turbulence, and the early stages of the AI transformation—an area where Cleary has emerged as an industry leader, reflected in its development of ClearyX and acquisition of Springbok AI. In this episode, Michael shares insights on firm leadership, the increasingly active lateral market, and how AI is already transforming—and will continue to transform—the hiring, training, and day-to-day work of lawyers. I learned a tremendous amount from our conversation, and I’m grateful to Michael for his thoughtful perspectives. Show Notes: * Michael A. Gerstenzang bio, Cleary Gottlieb Steen & Hamilton LLP * Thoughts on Managing the AI Transformation, by Michael A. Gerstenzang for Cleary Gottlieb * Cleary Makes Generative AI Play With Springbok Legal Tech Buy, by Roy Strom for Bloomberg Law Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below. Sponsored by: NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit davidlat.substack.com/subscribe

    47 min

  2. FEB 4

    On Vigilantism And Violence: Elliot Williams

    If you’re my age, you’ll recall the story of Bernhard Goetz. On a New York City subway car on December 22, 1984, Goetz shot four Black teenagers from the Bronx at point-blank range. Accused of attempted murder, Goetz went to trial—and was acquitted on the most serious charges, after claiming he acted in self-defense. Goetz became internationally famous—or infamous, as the case may be—and folks who were around in the ‘80s will surely be interested in looking back on his case, seeing where he is now, and the like. But even if you’re not familiar with Bernie Goetz, the issues his actions raised remain very relevant to our current moment. If you’re interested in exploring these important subjects, I have a reading recommendation for you: Five Bullets: The Story of Bernie Goetz, New York’s Explosive ‘80s, and the Subway Vigilante Trial That Divided the Nation, by Elliot Williams. A former prosecutor turned CNN legal analyst, Williams is perfectly positioned to delve into the Goetz case—and connect it to current controversies. Thanks to Elliot for writing Five Bullets. And thanks to him for joining me—for a wide-ranging discussion covering his fascinating career as a lawyer turned journalist, his compelling new book, the Goetz case, and what’s going on right now in Minnesota (Elliot is a former senior official at ICE)—on the Original Jurisdiction podcast. Show Notes: * Elliot Williams bio, Penguin Random House * Five Bullets: The Story of Bernie Goetz, New York’s Explosive ‘80s, and the Subway Vigilante Trial That Divided the Nation, Amazon * The Subway Vigilante Who Never Left Is Back (gift link), by David Segal for The New York Times Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below. Sponsored by: NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit davidlat.substack.com/subscribe

    53 min

  3. JAN 21

    Launching A Boutique In Turbulent Times: Timothy Heaphy

    This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com How would you react if you saw Jack Smith, the former special counsel who prosecuted Donald Trump, at Costco? It might just happen. Last week, Jack Smith launched his own litigation boutique, along with three other former federal prosecutors: Timothy Heaphy, David Harbach, and Thomas Windom. A new law firm is like a startup, where the founders have to do many things themselves—so on Tuesday of last week, Tim Heaphy and two of his partners went to Costco to buy paper towels. Jack Smith didn’t join them—he was busy preparing for his testimony before the House Judiciary Committee, taking place tomorrow—but according to Heaphy, Smith’s on deck for the next Costco run. This was one of several fun tidbits that Tim Heaphy (pronounced HAY-fee) shared with me in the latest episode of the OJ podcast. We covered a number of interesting subjects, including Heaphy’s service as both a U.S. attorney (W.D. Va.) and as chief investigative counsel to the House Select Committee to Investigate the January 6th Attack; what Heaphy, a former partner at Willkie Farr, thought about the firm’s settlement with the Trump administration; and what the mysterious Jack Smith is like as a person. This is an episode you won’t want to miss—especially if you’re interested in the intersection of law and politics during the second Trump administration. Show Notes: * Timothy J. Heaphy bio, Heaphy, Smith, Harbach & Windom LLP​ * Jack Smith’s New Venture Shuns Label as Anti-Trump Attack Dog, by Justin Henry for Bloomberg Law * Jack Smith’s New Law Firm Opens Its Doors, by Abigail Adcox for Law.com Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below. Sponsored by: NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com.

    51 min

  4. JAN 14

    Running A Global Law Firm In 2026: Jon Van Gorp

    This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com Welcome to the first Original Jurisdiction podcast episode of the new year, an opportune time to both reflect on 2025 and look ahead to 2026. To kick things off, I decided I wanted to interview a Biglaw leader, to get a sense of both the challenges and opportunities facing large law firms today. I was delighted to be joined by Jon Van Gorp, who has served as the chair of Mayer Brown since 2021. A member of both the Am Law 100 and the Vault 100, Mayer Brown has around 2,000 lawyers, $2 billion in revenue, and 150 years of history. As for Jon, he’s a Chambers-ranked, leading practitioner in structured finance—and we began our conversation by discussing his distinguished career in practice. We then moved on to discuss his leadership of Mayer Brown, which Jon views as a way of giving back to an institution that has given so much to him. We covered his approach to leadership, the firm’s strategic plan, and its approach to AI adoption. But Jon was also willing to tackle topics that other Biglaw leaders have been avoiding, such as partner pay and the (rather fraught) relationship between the Trump administration and large law firms. Thanks to Jon for his time, insight, and willingness to discuss delicate—but incredibly important—issues. Show Notes: * Jon D. Van Gorp bio, Mayer Brown LLP * Beyond cold hard cash, warm fuzzies are the way to a lawyer’s heart, firm chair says, by Jenna Greene for Reuters * Mayer Brown Chair On Why Law Leaders Need To Listen More, by Kevin Penton for Law360 Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below. Sponsored by: NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com.

    51 min

  5. 12/11/2025

    AI Data Center Dealmaking: Steven Messina

    This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com Every time you ask a question of your AI assistant, it gets sent to a data center, where the response is generated before getting sent back to you. These data centers are critical to the AI revolution. The biggest data-center campuses occupy dozens of acres, span millions of square feet, and cost billions of dollars. And they wouldn’t exist without the work of lawyers. For insight into the complex transactions that bring these data centers into existence, I interviewed Steven Messina, a longtime partner at Skadden Arps and global head of the firm’s banking group (soon to be renamed the finance group, reflecting the evolution of the sector beyond commercial banks). In our conversation, Steve and I discussed how these billion-dollar data centers get financed. But we covered a number of other topics as well, including the evolution of both the finance industry and Biglaw over the past three decades. If you’re interested in technology, business, or law, this is an episode you won’t want to miss. Show Notes: * Steven Messina bio, Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom LLP * Hyperscaler Data Centers: Financing Solutions for Large-Scale Projects, by Steven Messina, Aryan Moniri, David L. Nagler, and Jared S. Dub Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below. Sponsored by: NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com.

    44 min

  6. 12/03/2025

    Serving On A State High Court: Justice David Wecht

    This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com During the three-plus years that I’ve been hosting this podcast, I’ve welcomed a diverse range of guests. They’ve exhibited demographic diversity, of course, but also other forms of diversity—including diversity of opinion and experience. So I was embarrassed when I recently noticed that although I’ve interviewed more than a dozen current and former judges, only two have sat on state courts (and by the time I interviewed them, those judges—Rolando Acosta and Debra Wong Yang—had left the bench). Put another way, I have not, until today, hosted a sitting state-court judge—a considerable omission, considering the significance of state courts. As noted by the National Center for State Courts, “State courts play a critical role in our democracy, handling about 96 percent of all legal cases in the United States.” I set out to remedy this gap—and was delighted when Justice David Wecht, a longtime friend, agreed to join me. He’s a timely guest: last month, he and two of his colleagues were reelected to the Pennsylvania Supreme Court, for which I named them Judges of the Week. Why? Their court is one of the most important state courts in the country—for reasons I discussed with Justice Wecht on the episode. In our conversation, we also covered the justice’s interesting path to the Pennsylvania high court; why he believes young (and not-so-young) lawyers should get involved with their communities; certain unique features of the Pennsylvania Constitution, as well as its relationship to the U.S. Constitution; and, of course, his recent reelection to the Pennsylvania Supreme Court. Congratulations to Justice Wecht on his reelection—and thanks to him for joining me. Show Notes: * Justice David N. Wecht bio, The Unified Judicial System of Pennsylvania * Approach The Bench: Justice Wecht On Judicial Campaigns, by Cara Bayles and Steven Trader for Law360 * Law Day Shabbat: Address by Justice David Wecht, Temple Israel, Wilkes-Barre Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below. Sponsored by: NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com.

    43 min

  7. 11/12/2025

    Judging The Justice System In The Age Of Trump: Nancy Gertner

    This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com Welcome to Original Jurisdiction, the latest legal publication by me, David Lat. You can learn more about Original Jurisdiction by reading its About page, and you can email me at davidlat@substack.com. This is a reader-supported publication; you can subscribe by clicking here. How are the federal courts faring during these tumultuous times? I thought it would be worthwhile to discuss this important subject with a former federal judge: someone who understands the judicial role well but could speak more freely than a sitting judge, liberated from the strictures of the bench. Meet Judge Nancy Gertner (Ret.), who served as a U.S. District Judge for the District of Massachusetts from 1994 until 2011. I knew that Judge Gertner would be a lively and insightful interviewee—based not only on her extensive commentary on recent events, reflected in media interviews and op-eds, but on my personal experience. During law school, I took a year-long course on federal sentencing with her, and she was one of my favorite professors. When I was her student, we disagreed on a lot: I was severely conservative back then, and Judge Gertner was, well, not. But I always appreciated and enjoyed hearing her views—so it was a pleasure hearing them once again, some 25 years later, in what turned out to be an excellent conversation. Show Notes: * Nancy Gertner, author website * Nancy Gertner bio, Harvard Law School * In Defense of Women: Memoirs of an Unrepentant Advocate, Amazon Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below. Sponsored by: NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com.

    52 min

  8. 10/30/2025

    Resolving The Unresolvable: Kenneth Feinberg

    This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit davidlat.substack.com Welcome to Original Jurisdiction, the latest legal publication by me, David Lat. You can learn more about Original Jurisdiction by reading its About page, and you can email me at davidlat@substack.com. This is a reader-supported publication; you can subscribe by clicking here. Yesterday, Southern California Edison (SCE), the utility whose power lines may have started the devastating Eaton Fire, announced its Wildfire Recovery Compensation Program. Under the program, people affected by the fire can receive hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars in compensation, in a matter of months rather than years—but in exchange, they must give up their right to sue. It should come as no surprise that SCE, in designing the program, sought the help of Kenneth Feinberg. For more than 40 years, often in the wake of tragedy or disaster, Feinberg has helped mediate and resolve seemingly intractable crises. He’s most well-known for how he and his colleague Camille Biros designed and administered the September 11th Victim Compensation Fund. But he has worked on many other headline-making matters over the years, including the Agent Orange product liability litigation, the Deepwater Horizon Oil Spill Trust, the multidistrict litigation involving Monsanto’s Roundup weed killer—and now, of course, the Eaton Fire. How did Ken develop such a fascinating and unique practice? What is the most difficult aspect of administering these giant compensation funds? Do these funds represent the wave of the future, as an alternative to (increasingly expensive) litigation? Having just turned 80, does he have any plans to retire? Last week, I had the pleasure of interviewing Ken—the day after his 80th birthday—and we covered all these topics. The result is what I found to be one of the most moving conversations I’ve ever had on this podcast. Thanks to Ken Feinberg for joining me—and, of course, for his many years of service as America’s go-to mediator in times of crisis. Show Notes: * Kenneth Feinberg bio, Wikipedia * Kenneth Feinberg profile, Chambers and Partners * L.A. Fire Victims Face a Choice, by Jill Cowan for The New York Times Prefer reading to listening? For paid subscribers, a transcript of the entire episode appears below. Sponsored by: NexFirm helps Biglaw attorneys become founding partners. To learn more about how NexFirm can help you launch your firm, call 212-292-1000 or email careerdevelopment@nexfirm.com.

    54 min
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Ratings & Reviews

4.7
out of 5
37 Ratings

About

Original Jurisdiction, a podcast about law and the legal profession, features host David Lat interviewing some of the most interesting, influential, and important people in the world of law. It's the companion podcast to Lat's Substack newsletter of the same name. You can follow David on Twitter (@DavidLat) or email him at davidlat@substack.com, and you can subscribe to his newsletter at davidlat.substack.com. davidlat.substack.com

Information

  • Creator
    David Lat
  • Years Active
    2022 - 2026
  • Episodes
    91
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © David Lat
  • Show Website
    Original Jurisdiction

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