Humans in the Loop

Seb Agertoft

Humans in the Loop, hosted by Seb Agertoft, is a podcast for thoughtful technologists asking the hard questions at the intersection of technology and society. Guests include founders, investors, researchers, artists, policymakers and even a Zen Master, covering topics like the AI bubble debate, tech sovereignty, the Chinese tech industry, radicalisation and conspiracy theories, AGI, quantum computing, technology and democracy, the future of work, and much more. Seb is a coach to tech company founders and leadership teams. You can find out more about his work at www.theuncommonfounder.com

  1. Jul 14

    Stochastic Parrots | Emily M. Bender - Professor of Computational Linguistics

    Few people understand language quite like today's guest. Emily M. Bender is a Professor of Computational Linguistics at the University of Washington. She's also the person who coined the term 'Stochastic Parrots' in the now infamous paper that saw Google fire its Ethical AI lead; and the co-author of The AI Con, a book which is unflinching in its criticism of both AI boosterism and doomerism (in fact she objects to the term AI). I sat down with Emily to discuss topics such as: How language really worksWhat LLMs are actually doingWhat Stochastic Parrots really meansWhy doomers and boosters are two sides of the same, misleading coin Where else you can listen ⁠⁠⁠Youtube⁠⁠⁠ - https://www.youtube.com/@HumansintheLoopPod ⁠Apple podcasts⁠⁠⁠ - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humans-in-the-loop/id1831285114 ⁠Spotify⁠ - https://open.spotify.com/show/4BbslJR0KA5bfqrcYRhJER?si=b5a46211098b4f3e Or wherever you get your podcasts! Chapters 00:00 Introduction to AI and Linguistics 02:54 Understanding Computational Linguistics 05:47 The Stochastic Parrots Paper 08:32 The Implications of AI Terminology 10:57 Skepticism Towards AI Claims 12:58 The Illusion of Intelligence in AI 15:55 The Dangers of AI in Professional Settings 18:33 Democratization and Distrust in AI Development 28:02 Doomers vs. Boosters: The AI Narrative 32:57 Skepticism in AI: A Personal Journey 36:30 The Rapid Evolution of AI: Are We Outdated? 40:13 The Role of Software Engineering in AI 48:14 Automation vs. Human Expertise: A Balancing Act 53:02 Geopolitical Narratives: The AI Arms Race 56:33 The Future of AI: Regulation and Ethical Use 57:44 Pride in Expertise: Understanding Our Value Get in touch ⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠ - https://www.instagram.com/humansinthelooppod/ Email: ⁠seb@theuncommonfounder.com⁠ Website: ⁠https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

    Stochastic Parrots | Emily M. Bender - Professor of Computational Linguistics

  2. Jun 23

    The AI Bubble | Paul Kedrosky - Investor, Researcher, MIT Fellow

    I sat down with Paul Kedrosky - investor, researcher and one of the smartest voices out there on the economics of AI and the risks of a bubble. Here are a few of the questions we talked about: What is a bubble?Is AI a bubble?How does it compare to past bubbles?What would cause the bubble to burst?Why should the average person care?Will we see a bull market in laser tag in all the abandoned data centres?What needs to be true for AI to NOT be a bubble? More info about Paul Paul Kedrosky is an investor, writer, and researcher. He has been a regular on-air contributor at CNBC and Bloomberg, and has written for the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, and publications around the world. Paul started as an engineer, became a quota-carrying salesperson, then a technology equity analyst on Wall Street, and eventually a venture capitalist. He has started companies, held academic positions in the U.S. and Canada, has a popular newsletter, and is a research fellow at MIT's Institute for the Digital Economy. His Ph.D. research focused on risk, adoption, and path dependence in finance and technology. Where else you can listen ⁠⁠Youtube⁠⁠ - https://www.youtube.com/@HumansintheLoopPod Apple podcasts⁠⁠ - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humans-in-the-loop/id1831285114 Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/show/4BbslJR0KA5bfqrcYRhJER?si=b5a46211098b4f3e Or wherever you get your podcasts! Chapters 00:00 The AI Bubble Debate 06:44 Understanding Bubbles and Their Characteristics 12:04 Historical Context: Railroads and AI 17:51 The Call Option on AI's Future 19:29 The Necessity of Bubbles for Progress 25:31 Consequences of Stranded Assets 26:51 The Dilemma of Data Centers 28:46 The AI Bubble Dynamics 31:20 The Impact of Economic Bubbles on Society 34:06 The Interconnectedness of Global Financial Systems 36:17 Public Sentiment Towards AI and Job Security 38:18 The Fallacy of Technological Inevitability 40:20 Regulatory Challenges in a Globalized Economy 42:50 Predicting the Burst of the AI Bubble 45:37 Market Sentiment and AI Valuations 49:21 The Token Economy and Its Implications 52:28 Possibilities of Change in the Current Landscape 54:57 The Future of Work and Economic Stability Links https://paulkedrosky.com/ Get in touch ⁠Instagram⁠ - https://www.instagram.com/humansinthelooppod/ Email: ⁠seb@theuncommonfounder.com⁠ Website: ⁠https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

    The AI Bubble | Paul Kedrosky - Investor, Researcher, MIT Fellow

  3. Jun 9

    Epstein, Conspiracy and How Ideas Spread | Investigative Journalist James R Ball

    How do ideas, however crazy they might seem, spread? Who's a true believer vs. a grifter following the money? Can you talk about Epstein and QAnon without losing your rational mind? How can investigative journalism move with the times? These are just some of the questions I sat down to discuss with award-winning journalist and author James R Ball. He has worked as the global editor of TBIJ, a special correspondent at BuzzFeed UK and special projects editor at The Guardian, where he played a key role in the Pulitzer Prize-winning coverage of the NSA leaks by Edward Snowden, as well as the offshore leaks, HSBC Files, Reading the Riots and Keep it in the Ground projects. At WikiLeaks he was closely involved in Cablegate – the publication of 250,000 classified US embassy cables in 2010 – as well as working on two documentaries based on the Iraq War Logs. James is the author of multiple books, including Post-Truth: How B******t Conquered The World and The Tangled Web We Weave: Inside The Shadow System That Shapes the Internet. His most recent book, The Other Pandemic: How Qanon Contaminated The World, was published by Bloomsbury in July 2023. Where else you can listen ⁠Youtube⁠ ⁠Apple podcasts⁠ Or wherever you get your podcasts! Chapters 00:00 The Evolution of Information Sharing 08:41 Understanding QAnon: Origins and Impact 28:37 The Social Dynamics of Conspiracy Theories 29:34 Navigating Adolescence and Online Radicalization 34:20 The Manosphere and Young Men's Perspectives 37:01 Moral Panics and Information Overload 40:04 The Epstein Connection and Conspiracy Theories 52:37 The Future of Information in the Digital Age Links https://bsky.app/profile/jamesrball.com https://www.jamesrball.com/about Get in touch Instagram Email: ⁠seb@theuncommonfounder.com⁠ Website: ⁠https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

    Epstein, Conspiracy and How Ideas Spread | Investigative Journalist James R Ball

  4. May 26

    Eric Ries | Is it even possible to build an Incorruptible company?

    Many of us have a sense that even well-meaning companies and institutions lose their way, sometimes becoming downright evil.Eric Ries is a legend when it comes to building tech companies and his new book is written from the perspective of someone whose been 'on the frontlines in the battle for the soul of our economy'.Incorruptible is a new blueprint for companies that will prosper and endure without losing their soul. Now more than ever we need great organisations, institutions and companies. Things that bring us together, not that tear us apart. That we can trust in to put shared human interests and values at the heart of what they do.If you're going to listen to one Humans in the Loop episode, make it this one. Buy the book now. Where else you can listen Youtube Apple podcastsOr wherever you get your podcasts! Chapters 00:00 The Core Thesis of 'Incorruptible' 02:52 The Urgency of the Moment 07:13 Understanding Financial Gravity 12:21 The Concept of Shareholder Primacy 17:54 The Misconception of Capitalism 23:13 Examples of Resilient Companies 26:59 The Value of Innovative Corporate Structures 28:59 AI Governance and Corporate Responsibility 30:35 The Role of Governance in AI Companies 32:50 Integrity and Mission in Corporate Governance 35:45 The Importance of Principles in Business Decisions 38:30 The Role of Integrity in Governance 40:49 The Consequences of Corporate Mission Statements 43:28 Balancing Lean Startup Principles with Governance 46:35 The Right Time for Founders to Implement Governance 49:23 An Optimistic Vision for the Future of BusinessLinks https://www.linkedin.com/in/eries/ https://x.com/ericries https://www.instagram.com/ericriesactual/ https://www.tiktok.com/@ericriesactual https://news.theleanstartup.com/ https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow Get in touch Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/humansinthelooppod⁠ Email: ⁠seb@theuncommonfounder.com⁠ Website: ⁠https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

    Eric Ries | Is it even possible to build an Incorruptible company?

  5. May 19

    Can you lift a country out of poverty? | Nick Allardice, CEO GiveDirectly

    How to lift an entire country out of poverty? Does philanthropy make a difference? What if wealthy tech founders gave away their money? Will AI make poor countries even poorer? How does technology help a country to develop? Those are some of the questions discussed into today's episode of Humans in the Loop featuring Nick Allardice, CEO of GiveDirectly, a non-profit that's sent over $1 billion in cash, directly to those living in poverty. Where else you can watch/listenYoutube - youtube.com/channel/UC1KEYtwPKr5yUv86f7YDB7g/Apple podcasts - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humans-in-the-loop/id1831285114Or wherever you get your podcasts! Chapters 00:00 Introduction to GiveDirectly and Philanthropy 02:35 Identifying Communities in Need 06:18 Technology and Cash Transfers 12:10 Empowering Recipients: No Strings Attached 17:45 Community Impact and Economic Growth 23:46 Limitations of Cash Transfers 27:15 Conclusion and Future of Philanthropy 27:33 Skepticism of Central Planning in Local Economies 28:40 The Ineffectiveness of Traditional Teaching Methods 30:38 The Role of Wealthy Individuals in Alleviating Poverty 32:52 The Potential of Cash Transfers to Lift Living Standards 35:37 The Importance of Urgency in Philanthropy 39:26 The Impact of AI on Job Markets in Developing Countries 42:46 Balancing Optimism and Fear in the Age of AI 47:49 Innovative Approaches to Education and Healthcare 50:06 Leveraging AI for Disaster Preparedness 54:05 A Call to Action for the Wealthy to Invest in ChangeLinksGiveDirectly The experiment in Malawi Rutger Bregman's call for the world's billionaires to pick up the phone to NickGet in touch Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/humansinthelooppod⁠ Email: ⁠seb@theuncommonfounder.com⁠ Website: ⁠https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

    Can you lift a country out of poverty? | Nick Allardice, CEO GiveDirectly

  6. May 5

    The Chinese Tech Economy | Selina Xu - AI & China Researcher

    China is shaping the world.In direct ways, like innovation, foreign policy, investment.And indirectly, by provoking a response from countries such as the US who see it as a competitor.China's transformation into one of the world's superpowers is the most remarkable transformation of a single country in the history of the world.And yet it's still poorly understood (including by me).Selina Xu is a writer, researcher and AI & China policy lead in the office of former Google CEO, Eric Schmidt and is here to shed light on China and its technology industry, dispelling some myths along the way.Where else you can listen: Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/show/4BbslJR0KA5bfqrcYRhJER?si=d0edc1049eac4f39 Apple podcasts - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humans-in-the-loop/id1831285114Or wherever you get your podcasts! Chapters 00:00 The Evolution of China's Tech Industry 03:38 Debunking the Copycat Narrative 06:16 The Role of the State in Innovation 09:51 Xi Jinping's Vision for Technology 12:44 The Return of Jack Ma 15:35 China's Perspective on Global Competition 19:28 Defining Winning in the Superpower Race 22:40 China's Unique Approach to Technology Deployment 26:50 The Role of the State in AI Development 30:03 DeepSeek and the Evolution of Chinese AI 34:19 Agentic AI: Trends and Trajectories 36:57 Emerging Frontiers in AI Research 40:12 Infrastructure and Support for Tech Industries 43:44 Geopolitical Implications of Taiwan and Semiconductors 46:03 Cultural Perspectives on China and Tech 48:53 Optimistic Visions for the Future of AILinks: Selina's website China's AI+ initiative Involution Suspension of ANT's IPO Common prosperity Deepseek moment Chin AI substack - Jeffrey Ding Get in touch Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/humansinthelooppod⁠ Email: ⁠seb@theuncommonfounder.com⁠ Website: ⁠https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

    The Chinese Tech Economy | Selina Xu - AI & China Researcher

  7. Mar 24

    Zen Master Henry Shukman on tech & what it means to be human

    Henry Shukman is a Zen Master, a meditation teacher, and co-founder of The Way meditation app.As AI poses some hard questions about what it means to be human, I thought Henry might help make some sense of things. Chapters 00:00 Understanding Zen: A Personal Journey 03:52 The Need for Spirituality: A Personal Crisis 10:07 Living Zen in the Modern World 13:36 Navigating Modern Existence: Technology and Spirituality 18:38 The Motivations Behind Meditation 23:15 Technology's Role in Meditation: The Way App 32:06 Ambition and Spirituality: Finding Balance 39:47 AI and the Nature of Consciousness 45:04 Optimism for the Future: Meditation's Impact Links⁠ The Way App⁠ - https://www.thewayapp.com/ Get in touch Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/humansinthelooppod⁠ Email: ⁠seb@theuncommonfounder.com⁠ Website: ⁠https://www.theuncommonfounder.com

    Zen Master Henry Shukman on tech & what it means to be human

  8. Mar 10

    The Creative Process with Fuser Co-Founders Dalena Tran & Hirad Sab

    My guests today are artists, film makers, educators, technologists and founders of Fuser, a company building an AI workspace for creatives. With so much noise around what AI should or shouldn’t be used for, and where human creativity starts and ends, I wanted to get Dalena and Hirad on to talk more about the creative process in this technological moment. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Fuser and Its Founders 03:40 The Vision Behind Fuser 06:12 Creative Applications of Fuser 08:35 The Role of AI in Creative Processes 11:24 Navigating the Challenges of AI in Art 13:29 The Future of Creativity with AI 15:48 Investor Relations and Company Integrity 19:00 The Evolving Landscape of Art and Technology 20:52 Conclusion and Future Aspirations Links Fuser Brand video Get in touch ⁠Instagram⁠ ⁠⁠https://www.theuncommonfounder.com⁠ seb@theuncommonfounder.com⁠

    The Creative Process with Fuser Co-Founders Dalena Tran & Hirad Sab
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About

Humans in the Loop, hosted by Seb Agertoft, is a podcast for thoughtful technologists asking the hard questions at the intersection of technology and society. Guests include founders, investors, researchers, artists, policymakers and even a Zen Master, covering topics like the AI bubble debate, tech sovereignty, the Chinese tech industry, radicalisation and conspiracy theories, AGI, quantum computing, technology and democracy, the future of work, and much more. Seb is a coach to tech company founders and leadership teams. You can find out more about his work at www.theuncommonfounder.com

Information

  • Creator
    Seb Agertoft
  • Years Active
    2025 - 2026
  • Episodes
    17
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © Seb Agertoft
  • Show Website
    Humans in the Loop

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