So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast

FIRE
  • 4.6 (203)
  • POLITICS
  • UPDATED SEMIMONTHLY

So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast takes an uncensored look at the world of free expression through the law, philosophy, and stories that define your right to free speech. Hosted by FIRE's Nico Perrino. New episodes post every other Thursday.

  1. Ep. 261: Thomas Paine's rise and fall

    2D AGO

    Ep. 261: Thomas Paine's rise and fall

    Thomas Paine arrived in America in 1774 with little to his name and a long record of personal failure behind him. Within a year, he wrote Common Sense, one of the most influential political pamphlets in history, helping to ignite the American Revolution and catapulting Paine into the American history hall of fame. But by the end of his life, he was widely reviled, politically isolated, and personally abandoned. Once celebrated as the voice of liberty, he died an outcast, mourned by only six people at his funeral. How does one man become the voice of the American Revolution and end up forgotten? To explore Paine's complicated legacy, we are joined by Richard Bell, professor of history at the University of Maryland and author of The American Revolution and the Fate of the World. Timestamps:  00:00 Intro   02:41 Thomas Paine's early life 10:32 Paine's arrival in America 20:02 What did Paine argue in Common Sense? 25:11 Why Common Sense was so revolutionary 36:31 The American Crisis and the Revolutionary War 41:35 Why Paine returned to London and wrote The Rights of Man 49:19 Exile from Britain, imprisonment in France, and writing The Age of Reason 01:01:27 Why America turned its back on Paine 01:12:09 Paine's final days 01:18:50 How should we understand Paine's legacy today? 01:26:58 Outro Enjoy listening to the podcast? Donate to FIRE today and get exclusive content like member webinars, special episodes, and more.  If you became a FIRE Member through a donation to FIRE at thefire.org and would like access to Substack's paid subscriber podcast feed, please email sotospeak@thefire.org.

    1h 29m
  2. Ep. 260: Remembering 'free-thinking' writer Nat Hentoff

    12/19/2025

    Ep. 260: Remembering 'free-thinking' writer Nat Hentoff

    On January 7, 2017, The Associated Press announced that "Free-thinking author and columnist Nat Hentoff is dead at 91." For well over 60 years, Hentoff was a one of America's foremost public intellectuals and a familiar byline to free speech advocates and jazz aficionados. The First Amendment was a way of life for Nat Hentoff. He would have been 100 years old this year. To reflect on his life and legacy, we are joined by his son Nick Hentoff and filmmaker David Lewis, whose 2013 documentary, "The Pleasures of Being Out of Step," explored Nat Hentoff's embodiment of free expression as the defining characteristic of the individual. Timestamps:  00:00 Intro   00:52 Who was Nat Hentoff  03:48 Nat's early life & influences  18:20 Jazz, writing, & finding his voice 31:24 Free speech as a way of being 35:15 Being out of step: Controversy, courage, and consequences 41:56 Rage, compassion, & moral clarity 51:53 Nat Hentoff's legacy of dissent 55:20 Outro Read the transcript here. Enjoy listening to the podcast? Donate to FIRE today and get exclusive content like member webinars, special episodes, and more. If you became a FIRE Member through a donation to FIRE at thefire.org and would like access to Substack's paid subscriber podcast feed, please email sotospeak@thefire.org.

    59 min
  3. Ep. 259: FIRE answers your questions

    12/10/2025

    Ep. 259: FIRE answers your questions

    Changes at the Pentagon, Charlie Kirk and cancel culture, free speech and misinformation, globalized censorship, Indiana University, how to support FIRE, and more!   Timestamps: 00:00 Introductions 02:11 What is the Press Clause, and who does it apply to? 05:53 FIRE's position on Oklahoma student grading incident 08:50 What does FIRE need from Members besides financial support? 15:59 FIRE's College Free Speech Rankings and what they mean 19:44 What is the latest on the Ann Seltzer cases? 22:08 What is FIRE's view on the Pentagon press room changes? 24:50 What is the value of small donations? How can FIRE supporters volunteer? 29:21 Indiana University is good at football but bad at free speech 33:46 Are courts trending in a more speech-protective direction? 37:05 Charlie Kirk and cancel culture 39:20 Pro- and anti-Zionist speech and "hostile environment" harassment 43:48 Is "globalize the intifada" incitement? 45:07 How does FIRE distinguish between free speech and misinformation? 47:54 Can FIRE help supporters start free speech alumni groups? 48:55 Free speech, artificial intelligence, and copyright/trademarks 51:51 The sordid legacy of Hazelwood v. Kuhlmeier  53:22 Staying hopeful amidst so much hypocrisy 55:32 Global speech platforms and censorship 58:14 Differences between FIRE and the ACLU? 59:34 Does FIRE have a Substack? (The Eternally Radical Idea, So to Speak, Expression) 1:00:03 Closing remarks.   Read the transcript here.   Joining us: Alisha Glennon, chief operating officer Nico Perrino, executive vice president Greg Lukianoff, president and ceo Will Creeley, legal director    Become a paid subscriber today to receive invitations to future live webinars. If you became a FIRE Member through a donation to FIRE at thefire.org and would like access to Substack's paid subscriber podcast feed, please email sotospeak@thefire.org.

    1h 2m
  4. Ep. 258: Donor disclosure and campaign finance at SCOTUS

    11/25/2025

    Ep. 258: Donor disclosure and campaign finance at SCOTUS

    The Institute for Free Speech's Bradley Smith and Brett Nolan join the show to discuss two upcoming Supreme Court arguments involving donor disclosure (First Choice Women's Resource Centers, Inc. v. Platkin) and political party contributions to candidates (National Republican Senatorial Committee v. FEC). The conversation also explores the broader landscape for political speech and campaign regulation, what legal battles may be next for the Supreme Court, and how both guests found their way into First Amendment advocacy. Timestamps:  00:00 Intro 01:32 What is the Institute for Free Speech?  02:39 Personal paths into free speech work 05:10 First Choice Women's Resource Centers, Inc. v. Platkin 32:08 NRSC v. FEC 51:50 What's next for campaign finance at SCOTUS? 54:58 Outro Enjoy listening to the podcast? Donate to FIRE today and get exclusive content like member webinars, special episodes, and more. If you became a FIRE Member through a donation to FIRE at thefire.org and would like access to Substack's paid subscriber podcast feed, please email sotospeak@thefire.org.

    56 min
  5. Ep. 257: Conversion therapy at the Supreme Court

    11/13/2025

    Ep. 257: Conversion therapy at the Supreme Court

    FIRE's Ronnie London and Conor Fitzpatrick join the show to discuss the Supreme Court's oral argument in the conversion therapy case, the Pentagon's new press rules, Indiana University's censorship rampage, and where the situation stands with visa and green card holders who say things the feds don't like.   Timestamps:  00:00 Intro  01:19 Chiles v. Salazar, the conversion therapy case 30:03 The Pentagon's new press rules 48:48 What the hell is going on at Indiana University? 55:38 Feds boot noncitizens for Charlie Kirk speech 01:05:02 Outro Enjoy listening to the podcast? Donate to FIRE today (https://www.thefire.org/) and get exclusive content like member webinars, special episodes, and more. If you became a FIRE Member through a donation to FIRE at thefire.org and would like access to Substack's paid subscriber podcast feed, please email sotospeak@thefire.org.

    1h 6m
  6. Ep. 256: Ten arguments against free speech

    10/30/2025

    Ep. 256: Ten arguments against free speech

    We tackle ten common arguments against free speech. FIRE President and CEO Greg Lukianoff and FIRE Senior Fellow and former ACLU President Nadine Strossen are the co-authors of the new book, "War on Words: 10 Arguments Against Free Speech—And Why They Fail." Transcript Timestamps:  00:00 Intro  01:18 Book's origins 04:25 Argument #1: Words are violence 20:27 Argument #2: Words are dangerous 25:09 Argument #3: Hate speech isn't free speech 31:06 Argument #4: About shoutdowns 37:18 Argument #5: Free speech is outdated 45:41 Argument #6 Free speech is right-wing 50:14 Argument #7: About that crowded theater and marketplace of ideas 59:27 Argument #9: Misinformation and disinformation 01:03:53 Argument #8: Free speech protects power 01:09:30 Argument #10: About the Holocaust and Rwandan genocide 01:13:35 Outro Get the Book: Purchase War on Words: 10 Arguments Against Free Speech—And Why They Fail. Enjoy listening to the podcast? Donate to FIRE today (https://www.thefire.org/) and get exclusive content like member webinars, special episodes, and more. If you became a FIRE Member through a donation to FIRE at thefire.org and would like access to Substack's paid subscriber podcast feed, please email sotospeak@thefire.org.

    1h 14m
  7. Ep. 255: Authoritarians in the Academy

    10/15/2025

    Ep. 255: Authoritarians in the Academy

    FIRE Senior Scholar Sarah McLaughlin discusses her new book, "Authoritarians in the Academy: How the Internationalization of Higher Education and Borderless Censorship Threaten Free Speech."  Timestamps:  00:00 Intro 01:17 Book origins 03:38 How China censored speech on American campuses 18:36 COVID's impact for international students' speech 22:05 What is sensitivity exploitation? 25:35 Free speech at international satellite campuses 31:28 Attempted deportations of Mahmoud Khalil and Rümeysa Öztürk 36:52 Sarah's free speech inspirations: literature and people About the Guest: Learn more about Sarah McLaughlin and her work. Get the Book: Purchase Authoritarians in the Academy here.  Read the transcript here: https://www.thefire.org/research-learn/so-speak-transcript-authoritarians-academy Enjoy listening to the podcast? Donate to FIRE today (https://www.thefire.org/) and get exclusive content like member webinars, special episodes, and more. If you became a FIRE Member through a donation to FIRE at thefire.org and would like access to Substack's paid subscriber podcast feed, please email sotospeak@thefire.org.

    40 min
  8. Ep. 254: What is going on with the FCC?

    09/30/2025

    Ep. 254: What is going on with the FCC?

    What is the Federal Communications Commission, and why does its chairman think the agency can regulate Jimmy Kimmel's jokes? Note: Shortly after recording this episode, Nexstar and Sinclair announced they would return "Jimmy Kimmel Live!" to their stations. Joining us: Anna Gomez, FCC Commissioner  Ronnie London, FIRE General Counsel Bob Corn-Revere, FIRE Chief Counsel Timestamps:  00:00 Intro  04:46 What's the FCC? 07:35 What's the "public interest" standard? 14:20 What is the "fairness doctrine"? 25:21 What is the "broadcast hoax" rule? 28:55 What is "news distortion"? 35:31 Role of network affiliates 41:15 What happens now? Read the transcript here: https://www.thefire.org/research-learn/so-speak-podcast-transcript-what-going-fcc Enjoy listening to the podcast? Donate to FIRE today and get exclusive content like member webinars, special episodes, and more. If you became a FIRE Member through a donation to FIRE at thefire.org and would like access to Substack's paid subscriber podcast feed, please email sotospeak@thefire.org.

    48 min
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So to Speak: The Free Speech Podcast takes an uncensored look at the world of free expression through the law, philosophy, and stories that define your right to free speech. Hosted by FIRE's Nico Perrino. New episodes post every other Thursday.

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