Mutuality Matters

CBE International

Women, Men, Mutuality, and the Bible CBE’s Mutuality Matters podcast is part of CBE International’s online library of free resources! Hosts of CBE’s Mutuality Matters team offer weekly conversations with leaders, pastors, authors, scholars, activists, and humanitarians on women, men, shared leadership, and Scripture. CBE International (Christians for Biblical Equality) advances the gospel by equipping women and men of all cultures, races, and classes to lead and serve as equals. Founded in 1989, CBE has supporters and ministry partners in over 100 denominations and 65 countries, and offers annual conferences, adult and youth curricula, a curated bookstore, multi-media resources, award-winning publications, and a blog. Learn more at cbeinternational.org.

  1. Does Paul Contradict Himself? A Conversation with Rev. Dr. Michael F. Bird (Women and Words)

    JAN 16

    Does Paul Contradict Himself? A Conversation with Rev. Dr. Michael F. Bird (Women and Words)

    In this podcast, Rev. Dr. Michael F. Bird explores the crucial sociological context that often influences human interpretation of Scripture along with the complexities involved in reading passages from Paul who is considered both the ally of both egalitarians and complementarians. Spending significant time on Paul’s reference to Phoebe (Romans 16:1–2) as deacon in the church of Cenchrea. Too often we allow Paul’s passages that appear to silence women for all time (1 Timothy 2:11-15, Ephesians 5:22&FF and 1 Corinthians 14:34–36 ) overlooking the many women speaking, teaching and leading in the OT and NT, especially beside Paul and throughout Church History.  Mike considers the impact of sin on God’s original design for women and men in Gen 1:26–31. Because of sin, the mutuality enjoyed by women and men deteriorates into the male rule noted in Gen 3:16.   Supremely, Mike notes the victories of Christ in conquering sin on Calvary, along with the many passages in the New Testament that speak of the ontological mutuality and equal service of women and men, such as Proverbs 31, Galatians 3:28 but also a passage heavily cited by the Abolitionists that reads: “From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands,” Acts 17:26. Read full chapter.  Mike masterfully integrates biblical theology, church history, theology, and culture as he explores key topics impacting women, marriage, and service. His sense of humor, use of metaphor and his experiences working in the church and academy brings keen insights into the egalitarian conversation today. We hope you enjoy this episode with Dr. Mike Bird, a dear friend of CBE.     Guest Bio: The Rev. Dr. Michael F. Bird:  Mike is Deputy Principal and Lecturer in New Testament at Ridley College in Melbourne, Australia. He is an Anglican priest and is married with four children. He is the author of several books including the awarding winning The Gospel of the Lord: How the Early Church Wrote the Story of Jesus and with N.T. Wright, The New Testament in its World.    Books published by Michael F. Bird:  Whispers of Revolution: Jesus and the Coming King.  Romans: Greek-English Interlinear Paraphrase Study Notes    Books published by N.T. Wright and Michael F. Bird:  The New Testament in Its World: An Introduction to the History, Literature, and Theology of First Christians.  Jesus and the Powers: Christian Political Witness in an Age of Totalitarian Terro and Dysfunctional Democracies.  The New Testament in Its World Workbook: An Introduction to the History, Literature, and Theology of the First Christians.  The New Testament You Never Knew Bible Study Guide: Exploring the Context, Purpose, and Meaning of the Story of God.  The New Testament in Its World: An Introduction to the History, Literature, and Theology of the First Christians. The Gospel of the Lord: How the Early Church Wrote the Story of Jesus, by N.T. Wright and Michael F. Bird.  Related Resources: The Invasion of the Homoians: Trinity and Gender, Again! Fretting Over Phoebe

    36 min
  2. 11/20/2025

    Women in the Gospel of Luke with Dr. Joel B. Green: Part 2 (Women and Words)

    In this episode of Mutuality Matters, host Dr. Mimi Haddad continues her interview with guest Dr. Joel B. Green, an expert on the Gospel of Luke, about the portrayal of women in Luke's writings. Together they explore how these depictions challenge traditional gender roles and the importance of translation choices in understanding biblical messages about authority and equality. Dr. Green highlights the radical nature of Jesus' teachings and shares insights on how women in early Christianity were active participants in ministry. 00:00 Welcome to Mutuality Matters 00:26 Exploring the Gospel's View on Women 01:31 Mary: A Prototypical Disciple 04:03 Women in Luke's Gospel 06:20 Men and Women in Luke's World 13:02 The Role of Women in Early Christianity 14:42 Challenges in Complementarian Contexts 21:13 Translation Issues in Key Biblical Passages 29:47 Favorite Women-Friendly Bible Translations 34:36 Concluding Thoughts and Prayer Guest Bio  Joel B. Green joined Fuller’s faculty in 2007 and has served several administrative posts: associate dean for the Center for Advanced Theological Studies (2008–2016, 2019–present), dean of the School of Theology (2014–2018), and provost (2016–2018). Prior to coming to Fuller, Dr. Green served for ten years at Asbury Theological Seminary as professor of New Testament interpretation, as dean of the School of Theology, and as provost. Previous faculty and academic-administrative appointments include the American Baptist Seminary of the West / Graduate Theological Union (1992–1997) and New College for Advanced Christian Studies Berkeley (1985–1992).  Green has written or edited some 55 books, including 8 that have won awards: Connections: A Lectionary Commentary for Preaching and Worship, Year C, Volume 1, Advent through Epiphany (with Thomas Long, Luke Powery, and Cynthia Rigby, 2018), Dictionary of Jesus and the Gospels (2nd ed., 2013), Common English Bible Study Bible (2013), Dictionary of Scripture and Ethics (2011), In Search of the Soul: Four Views of the Mind-Body Problem (2nd ed., 2010), Introducing the New Testament: Its Literature and Theology (with Paul J. Achtemeier and Marianne Meye Thompson, 2001), The Gospel of Luke (1997), and Dictionary of Jesus and the Gospels (with Scot McKnight, 1992). Among his recent publications are Discovering Luke (2021), Luke as Narrative Theologian (2020), Conversion in Luke-Acts: Divine Initiative, Human Cognition, and the People of God (2015), Why Salvation? (2013), and The World of the New Testament: Cultural, Social and Historical Contexts (with Lee Martin McDonald, 2013).  He is the editor of the New International Commentary on the New Testament, as well as the Two Horizons New Testament Commentary, and serves on the editorial boards of the Journal of Theological Interpretation, Theology and Science, and Science and Christian Belief. Green has been elected to membership in both Studiorum Novi Testamenti Societas (SNTS) and the International Society for Science and Religion (ISSR).  Related Resources  Teach us, Mary: The Authority of Women Teachers in the Church in Light of the Magnificat (Luke 1:46–55): https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/teach-us-mary/ The Significance of Three Narrative Parallels of Men and Women in Luke 1, John 3–4, and Acts 9: https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/raised-obscurity-narratival-and-theological-study-characterization-women-luke-acts/ Whose Wife Will She Be? A Feminist Interpretation of Luke 20:27–38: https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/whose-wife-will-she-be-feminist-interpretation/

    38 min
  3. 10/31/2025

    (Women and Words) Inside the Bible Translation Room with Dr. Joel B. Green: Part 1

    In this episode of Mutuality Matters, hosted by CBE International, Dr. Joel B. Green joins the conversation to discuss the importance of Bible translation and interpretation, emphasizing the inclusion of women in the process. Dr. Green, a seasoned Bible scholar and faculty administrator, shares his extensive career and insights on the subject. He underscores the necessity of diverse perspectives in translation teams, discusses common biases in Bible translations, and offers advice on how English readers can detect and overcome these biases. The episode also delves into the significance of various successful Bible translations, the training of translators, and the impact of denominational and gender diversity on the integrity of translations.  00:00 Introduction to Mutuality Matters  00:38 Meet Dr. Joel Green  02:22 Joel Green's Academic Journey  05:38 Challenges in Bible Scholarship  06:48 The Importance of Women in Bible Translation  12:23 Overcoming Translation Bias  19:38 Training and Selecting Bible Translators  27:13 Successful Bible Translations  34:38 Conclusion and Call to Action    Guest Bio  Joel B. Green joined Fuller’s faculty in 2007 and has served several administrative posts: associate dean for the Center for Advanced Theological Studies (2008–2016, 2019–present), dean of the School of Theology (2014–2018), and provost (2016–2018). Prior to coming to Fuller, Dr. Green served for ten years at Asbury Theological Seminary as professor of New Testament interpretation, as dean of the School of Theology, and as provost. Previous faculty and academic-administrative appointments include the American Baptist Seminary of the West / Graduate Theological Union (1992–1997) and New College for Advanced Christian Studies Berkeley (1985–1992).  Green has written or edited some 55 books, including 8 that have won awards: Connections: A Lectionary Commentary for Preaching and Worship, Year C, Volume 1, Advent through Epiphany (with Thomas Long, Luke Powery, and Cynthia Rigby, 2018), Dictionary of Jesus and the Gospels (2nd ed., 2013), Common English Bible Study Bible (2013), Dictionary of Scripture and Ethics (2011), In Search of the Soul: Four Views of the Mind-Body Problem (2nd ed., 2010), Introducing the New Testament: Its Literature and Theology (with Paul J. Achtemeier and Marianne Meye Thompson, 2001), The Gospel of Luke (1997), and Dictionary of Jesus and the Gospels (with Scot McKnight, 1992). Among his recent publications are Discovering Luke (2021), Luke as Narrative Theologian (2020), Conversion in Luke-Acts: Divine Initiative, Human Cognition, and the People of God (2015), Why Salvation? (2013), and The World of the New Testament: Cultural, Social and Historical Contexts (with Lee Martin McDonald, 2013).  He is the editor of the New International Commentary on the New Testament, as well as the Two Horizons New Testament Commentary, and serves on the editorial boards of the Journal of Theological Interpretation, Theology and Science, and Science and Christian Belief. Green has been elected to membership in both Studiorum Novi Testamenti Societas (SNTS) and the International Society for Science and Religion (ISSR).  Green has 12 years of pastoral ministry experience.  Related Resources  Intersectionality: Words Matter! Freedom through Lectionary and Bible Translation with Rev. Dr. Wilda C. Gafney: https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/intersectionality-words-matter/    Women and Words: Comparing Bible Translations with Rev. Dr. Aída Besançon Spencer:   https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/women-and-words-comparing-bible-translations/    Women and Words: Exploring Women’s Biblical Equality Through Bible Translation with Dr. Roy Ciampa  https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/women-and-words-exploring-womens-biblical-equality-through-bible-translation/    Disclaimer  The opinions expressed in CBE’s Mutuality Matters’ podcast are those of its hosts or guests and do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of CBE International or its members or chapters worldwide. The designations employed in this podcast and the presentation of content therein do not imply the expression of any opinion whatsoever on the part of CBE concerning the legal status of any country, area or territory or of its authorities, or concerning the delimitation of its frontiers.

    35 min
  4. 08/15/2025

    (Women and Words) Understanding "Wives Submit" and the Household Codes in 1 Peter 3:1–7 with Dr. Jeannine Brown

    In this episode of the Mutuality Matters podcast from CBE International, hosts Mimi and Charel speak with Dr. Jeannine Brown who discusses the pressing need to interpret the Biblical text of 1 Peter 3:1–7 within its first-century Greco-Roman context. Dr. Brown emphasizes the importance of understanding the cultural and historical background behind the passages on submission, particularly 1 Peter 3:1–7. She explores how Peter's household codes provide agency to often marginalized groups like wives and slaves, contrary to the hierarchical norms of the time. The conversation underscores the relevance today of recognizing and respecting context while interpreting Biblical texts—an essential factor for both scholars and modern readers.    00:00 Introduction to Mutuality Matters  00:02 Exploring the Context of Submission in 1 Peter  00:49 Welcome and Introductions  01:33 Reading and Analyzing 1 Peter 3:1-7  02:57 Cultural Background and Interpretation  03:37 Household Codes in the Greco-Roman World  07:24 Missional Moments and Divided Households  08:20 Challenges for Christian Wives in the First Century  10:03 Slavery and Moral Agency in 1 Peter  11:28 Understanding Peter's Use of Household Codes  16:50 Modern Interpretations and Misconceptions  27:46 The Role of Headings in Biblical Interpretation  30:15 Instructions for Husbands in 1 Peter 3:7  36:30 Exploring Social and Physical Vulnerability  37:19 Interpreting 'Weaker Vessel' in Context  38:02 Challenging Traditional Views on Gender Roles  40:18 Co-Heirs and Inheritance in Early Christianity  41:50 Family Metaphors in 1 Peter  43:37 Egalitarian Impulses in the New Testament  45:28 Household Codes and Their Implications  50:08 Suffering for Good and Loyalty to Jesus  52:47 Translation Challenges and Responsibilities  58:01 Applying 1 Peter in Modern Contexts  01:04:03 Conclusion and Further Resources    Guest Bio: Dr. Jeannine Brown   Jeannine Brown is professor of New Testament at Bethel Seminary and Program Director of Bethel Seminary’s Online programs. Jeannine received in MA from Bethel Seminary, Saint Paul, MN. and her PhD from Luther seminary, Saint Paul, MN. Dr. Brown has taught at Bethel Seminary for over 20 years. She teaches in the areas of New Testament, Greek, hermeneutics, and integration.    Dr. Brown has focused much of her research and writing on the Gospels, hermeneutics, and interdisciplinary integration. In addition to a book on biblical hermeneutics (Scripture as Communication, now in second edition) and two books on integration, she has published three commentaries on Matthew's Gospel and one on Philippians (Tyndale NT series). She is a member of the NIV translation team and is an editor for the NIV Study Bible, revised edition (2020). Her current writing projects include a commentary 1 Peter (NICNT) and book on themes in 1 Peter. Jeannine’s other published works include: Scripture as Communication (2021, 2007); The Gospels as Stories (2020); Relational Integration of Psychology and Christian Theology (2018); Becoming Whole and Holy: An Integrative Conversation about Christian Formation (2011); Embedded Genres in the New Testament: Understanding Their Impact for Interpretation and three commentaries on the Gospel of Matthew (2018, 2015, 2012). Jeannine Brown co-edited the second edition of Jesus and the Gospels (2013). She has published numerous journal articles and book essays on the Gospels of Matthew and John, 1 Peter, and topics of hermeneutics. Some of these have been published in Journal of Biblical Literature, New Testament Studies, Catholic Biblical Quarterly, and Horizons in Biblical Theology. Jeannine thoroughly enjoys teaching in churches and ministries on the topics of Bible interpretation and the New Testament. She is married to Tim Brown, singer-songwriter, and has two adult daughters.  Story Notes  Today’s podcast focused on 1 Pet 3:1–7. In the NIV it reads:  "Wives, in the same way submit yourselves to your own husbands so that, if any of them do not believe the word, they may be won over without words by the behavior of their wives, when they see the purity and reverence of your lives. Your beauty should not come from outward adornment, such as elaborate hairstyles and the wearing of gold jewelry or fine clothes. Rather, it should be that of your inner self, the unfading beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is of great worth in God’s sight. For this is the way the holy women of the past who put their hope in God used to adorn themselves. They submitted themselves to their own husbands, like Sarah, who obeyed Abraham and called him her lord. You are her daughters if you do what is right and do not give way to fear. Husbands, in the same way be considerate as you live with your wives, and treat them with respect as the weaker partner and as heirs with you of the gracious gift of life, so that nothing will hinder your prayers."   Exploring the cultural background, Jeannine suggests that Peter is calling Christians to display behaviors that reflect Christ even as male dominance was a given. Jeannine explained that in the first century, Roman interest in well-organized households should mirror a well-organized Rome. Roman citizens were to live harmoniously within a well-organized Roman household. Where the passage makes a surprising move is in the call for husbands to have empathy for their wives with a consequence: that God will hear their prayers. Further Christian wives should view themselves beyond the cultural standard of female beauty. As the passage states: it’s not the adorning of women’s outer selves but their inner lives of faith in God. Doing right, and with faith that does not give into fear given God is ultimately in control. This passage is countercultural in its emphasis on Christian faith and the development of a peaceful inner life both of which acknowledge God’s supremacy versus that of emperor’s.     This passage calls both husbands and wives to do what is right: to be brave, to have faith in God who rules over all of Rome’s emperors, verse 7, to live within a culture with very differing values that offend Christian moral life. In this passage there is a tension in negotiating life lived in a culture at odds with Christian values, supremely concerning the divinity Jesus, or that of an emperor. While Jesus died on a Roman cross, even so, the passage evokes faith and courage in Christian households. The passage is helpful to missionaries in similar circumstances. How to live with courage and faith, elevating the gospel with behavior more often than words in a culture that exploited slaves and women.     Turning to 1 Peter 3:7 that reads:  "Husbands, in the same way be considerate as you live with your wives, and treat them with respect as the weaker partner and as heirs with you of the gracious gift of life, so that nothing will hinder your prayers."     The Petrine texts lean into sibling language, especially that of children, which overall is very egalitarian in the cultural context of first century. Further, the language of “father” was not very much present in NT as it was in 1st century non-Christian texts. God’s children in Christ were to face each other in humility and this very egalitarian impulse in relating to one another. God is father, but in Christ we’re all siblings. Women and men are co-heirs is throughout NT. Leadership structure are notes but not ones in the NT.     The whole Petrine text is a significant challenge to the top-down rule from emperor as God down throughout the household structure which was central. Given what Peter is doing with family metaphors—of believers as children / siblings who are to love earnestly as family love each other, and as the elders are a group too much have wisdom but must lead by example. These impulses, leader on top, and wife below: this does simplify decisions, but this is not the texture of Peter. As he thinks of his context, and the household code, it is not a prescription but a triage—a pathway for healing top-down leadership. It’s what Christians do in an emergency. Emergency advice to the Christian community so it can survive. It’s about survival for the most vulnerable. The thrust of text is a call to attentiveness to the most vulnerable. In light of Tom Holland’s book—Dominion: How the Christian Revolution Remade the World—in brutal detail reveals the cruelty of Rome. In thinking of our next, the advice is that even if you suffer for doing good, you are blessed. And take comfort in that truth and knowledge that even those who slanders you, remain loyal to Christ, if you suffer as Jesus did, you will also share in his glory.  In fascinating detail, Jeannine describes the history of Bible translation and the canonical review that follows. For the NIV team, on which she contributes, their voting policy requires a 75% majority in approving translation choices. Thus, the team must make a compelling case to change something, so for 1 Peter, and the NT generally, it’s always wise to examine and read many translations to see differences.     In considering the backdrop in which the text arises, submission is not a new requirement. What is new for this culture is to ask that all behavior must be Christ-like. While believers are clearly frightened by opposition to Christian faith, the text calls them to act in ways that others will recognize their soul-allegiance to Christ. Win others over to Christ not out of fear but confident behavior that imitates Christ’s live. Jeannine recommends entering the text with a disciplined imagination that brings implications of texts to life then and now. Idolatry is key issue underlining the concerns in this text which encourages faith and living life not with words but by example.   Jeannine points listeners

    1h 9m
  5. 07/31/2025

    (Women and Words) The Intersection of Culture and Bible Translation with Mayra Ugalde: Part 5

    In episode of Mutuality Matters, hosted by Mimi Haddad and produced by CBE International, guest Mayra Ugalde addresses the importance of women's leadership and service in the church, as guided by biblical teachings. She emphasizes the necessity of obedience to Jesus over cultural obstacles and discusses the significance of both Old and New Testament scriptures in supporting women’s roles in ministry. The episode also explores the impact of failed interpretations and translation errors on women's roles in religious contexts. Additionally, it underscores the importance of personal biblical study and the need for Bible translations accessible to all languages and cultures. The conversation encourages women to fulfill their God-given purpose without fear of societal judgment. 00:00 Introduction and Opening Remarks 00:23 Encouragement for Women in Ministry 00:56 Challenges in Biblical Interpretation 03:24 Biblical Support for Women's Leadership 03:49 The Importance of Service and Obedience 08:29 Recommendations for Bible Translations 11:53 Women in Scripture and Mission 12:31 Transformation Through Biblical Teachings 22:39 Concluding Thoughts and Farewell Related Resources Women and Words: From Oppression to Empowerment with Mayra Ugalde: Part 1 Women and Words: The Intersection of Culture and Bible Translation with Mayra Ugalde: Part 2 Women and Words: The Intersection of Culture and Bible Translation with Mayra Ugalde: Part 3 Women and Words: The Intersection of Culture and Bible Translation with Mayra Ugalde: Part 4 The opinions expressed in CBE’s Mutuality Matters’ podcast are those of its hosts or guests and do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of CBE International or its members or chapters worldwide. The designations employed in this podcast and the presentation of content therein do not imply the expression of any opinion whatsoever on the part of CBE concerning the legal status of any country, area or territory or of its authorities, or concerning the delimitation of its frontiers.

    29 min
  6. 07/17/2025

    (Women in Scripture and Mission) The East African Revival Moment with Bishop Emily Onyango

    In this episode, Kim talks to Rt. Rev. Dr. Emily Onyango about the East Africa Revival Movement that began in 1927 and is still reverberating through East Africa today. Begun by two people praying for true faith in the Anglican church, the movement grew among laypeople to denominations across East Africa, challenging patriarchy, tribalism, and racism. Because one priest oversaw six or seven churches, women empowered by the spirit preached, shared their testimonies and lead their churches. They dressed in white to mark their new way of living, and today a few of these very elderly women still challenge and influence church leadership today. At the time of the revival, Kenya’s practice of polygamy was at an all-time high, yet these believers lived monogamous, egalitarian marriages. They sent their daughters to school in addition to their sons, and the changed the fabric of society. Today, the leaders against government corruption and tribal sectarianism have their roots in the East Africa Revival Movement. Guest Bio  Right Rev. Dr. Emily Onyango is the first woman in the history of the Anglican Church in Kenya to be elected as bishop. She serves as senior lecturer and dean of students at St. Paul’s University in Limuru, Kenya. She earned a PhD from the University of Wales, as well as a Master of Theology from the Asian Center for Theological Studies and Mission in Seoul, South Korea, and a bachelor's degree from St. Paul’s University, Limuru. She is the author of Gender and Development: A History of Women’s Education in Kenya. CBE Resources: Women's History Month: The African Face of Global Evangelicalism by Mimi Haddad https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/womens-history-month-the-african-face-of-global-evangelicalism/ by Emily Onyango: Read: The Negative Consequences of Dowry Payment on Women and Society https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/negative-consequences-dowry-payment-women-and-society/ Watch: Working Towards Mutuality as a Mark of Christian Identity: A Case of the Work of the African Church for Biblical Equality https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/working-towards-mutuality-mark-christian-identity-case-work-african-church/ Listen: The Challenge of Gender Based Violence in Kenya and the Response of the Church https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/challenge-gender-based-violence-kenya-and-response-church/ The Challenge of the Resurgence of Negative Aspects of African Cultural Practices Among Christians in Kenya https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/challenge-resurgence-negative-aspects-african-cultural-practices-among/ Global Impact: The Work of Service Not Power in the Anglican Church of Kenya with Rt Rev Dr Emily Onyango https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/global-impact-work-service-not-power-anglican-church-kenya-rt-rev-dr-emily-onyango/ Disclaimer : The opinions expressed in CBE’s Mutuality Matters’ podcast are those of its hosts or guests do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of CBE International or its members or chapters worldwide. The designations employed in this podcast and the presentation of content therein do not imply the expression of any opinion whatsoever on the part of CBE concerning the legal status of any country, area or territory or of its authorities, or concerning the delimitation of its frontiers.

    42 min
  7. 06/13/2025

    (Women and Words) The Intersection of Culture and Bible Translation with Mayra Ugalde: Part 4

    This episode of Mutuality Matters, hosted by CBE International, interviews Mayra Ugalde who delves into the significant role women played in Paul's ministry and offers insights into commonly misunderstood biblical passages used to limit women's roles in church and society. The discussion emphasizes the importance of understanding the cultural context of scripture, the equality in Christ beyond gender, and the mutual submission in Christian marriage. Various translations of key texts like Ephesians 5 and Genesis 3:16 are compared to highlight biases and interpretations. The episode concludes with a call to read the Bible holistically to grasp its true message of equality and mutuality in Christ. Timestamps 00:00 Introduction to Mutuality Matters 00:35 The Importance of Bible Translations 02:53 Women in the Bible: Lessons from Mark 03:54 Jesus' Acceptance of Women's Offerings 08:01 Encouragement for Women in Ministry 09:38 Women as Witnesses and Apostles 15:40 Addressing Difficult Bible Passages 24:46 Equality in Christ 25:37 Phoebe and Women Leaders in the Early Church 28:42 Biblical Texts on Marriage and Mutual Submission 39:36 Interpreting Genesis 3:16 43:17 The Role of Sin and Grace in the Bible 46:21 The Church as a Demonstration of God's Kingdom 48:35 Conclusion and Call to Action   Related Resources Women and Words: From Oppression to Empowerment with Mayra Ugalde: Part 1 https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/women-and-words-from-oppression-to-empowerment-women-in-scripture/ Women and Words: The Intersection of Culture and Bible Translation with Mayra Ugalde: Part 2 https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/women-and-words-the-intersection-of-culture-and-bible-translation/ Women and Words: The Intersection of Culture and Bible Translation with Mayra Ugalde: Part 3 https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/women-and-words-the-intersection-of-culture-and-bible-translation-part-3/   Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in CBE’s Mutuality Matters’ podcast are those of its hosts or guests and do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of CBE International or its members or chapters worldwide. The designations employed in this podcast and the presentation of content therein do not imply the expression of any opinion whatsoever on the part of CBE concerning the legal status of any country, area or territory or of its authorities, or concerning the delimitation of its frontiers.

    49 min
  8. 05/09/2025

    (Women in Scripture and History) The Women of Exodus with Dr. Carmen Joy Imes

    In this episode, Kim talks to Dr. Carmen Joy Imes about the women of Exodus. Dr. Imes brings her deep knowledge of Exodus to the average Christian audience, explaining how the structure and literary parallels of Exodus to show how the women are the rescuers of Moses, who then rescues the Hebrews. She provides the details of the midwives’ spiritual work of saving lives. She demonstrates how Pharaoh’s daughter displayed God’s character as she sees Moses’ misery, heard his cry, and took pity on him. She explains the Hebrew that illustrates how Miriam took a stand at the river to address Pharaoh’s daughter just as Moses later took a stand to address Pharaoh. And she explains how Zipporah literally saved Moses’ life as he decided which people group he belonged. Amidst these detailed portrayals of the Exodus women, Dr. Imes also points out the narrator’s use of humor to depict the bumbling and nameless Pharaoh.    00:00 Introduction to Mutuality Matters  00:02 Exploring the Role of Zipporah in Exodus  01:04 Meet Dr. Carmen Joy IMEs  02:06 The Mystery of Exodus 4:24-25  03:26 Theological and Structural Significance of Zipporah  14:33 The Role of Women in the Early Chapters of Exodus  21:49 Elevating Women in Scripture  22:00 A Word from CBE  22:37 The Women of Exodus: Zipporah, Pua, and Shiphrah  22:52 The Story of Moses' Birth and the Women Who Saved Him  32:07 Moses' Identity and His Encounter with God  39:37 Closing Thoughts and Resources  41:20 Final Remarks and How to Stay Connected       Guest Bio   Dr. Carmen Joy Imes is associate professor of Old Testament at Talbot School of Theology, Biola University, in Southern California. She is the author of Bearing God's Name: Why Sinai Still Matters, Being God's Image: Why Creation Still Matters, and the forthcoming Becoming God's Family: Why the Church Still Matters. Carmen has a YouTube channel where she releases weekly Torah Tuesday videos and you can find her writing on various websites, including Christianity Today, The Well, and The Politics of Scripture blog. Carmen is passionate about equipping the church to engage the Old Testament well and to see its relevance for the Christian life.    Find Dr. Carmen Imes at:    X: @carmenjoyimes  Bluesky: @carmenjoyimes.bsky.social  YouTube – Torah Tuesday: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6bwfe08fufzGaY2YImWQK12Ye7VX15X2  Resources Mentioned in the Interview:    Becoming God's Family: Why the Church Still Matters  Being God's Image: Why Creation Still Matters  Bearing God's Name: Why Sinai Still Matters  Every Woman’s Bible published by Tyndale    Other CBE Resources:    Defiant: What the Women of Exodus Teach Us About Freedom by Kelley Nikondeha.  “Rational and Emotional Faith” by Megan Greulich in Mutuality  “Who’s Who? Biblical Models of Women in Leadership” by Gracy Ying May in Priscilla Papers  “Black is Blessed: A Study of Black/African Women and Men in Scripture” by Catherine Clark Kroeger in Priscilla Papers  “Defiant: What the Women of Exodus Teach us about Freedom” by Mary Lou Wiley a Book Review on Defiant  Women in Scripture and Mission: Zipporah by Kimberly Dickson  Women in Scripture and Mission: Miriam by Kimberly Dickson  Women in Scritpure and History: Puah and Shiphrah by Kimberly Dickson      Disclaimer   The opinions expressed in CBE’s Mutuality Matters’ podcast are those of its hosts or guests do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of CBE International or its members or chapters worldwide. The designations employed in this podcast and the presentation of content therein do not imply the expression of any opinion whatsoever on the part of CBE concerning the legal status of any country, area or territory or of its authorities, or concerning the delimitation of its frontiers.

    44 min
5
out of 5
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Women, Men, Mutuality, and the Bible CBE’s Mutuality Matters podcast is part of CBE International’s online library of free resources! Hosts of CBE’s Mutuality Matters team offer weekly conversations with leaders, pastors, authors, scholars, activists, and humanitarians on women, men, shared leadership, and Scripture. CBE International (Christians for Biblical Equality) advances the gospel by equipping women and men of all cultures, races, and classes to lead and serve as equals. Founded in 1989, CBE has supporters and ministry partners in over 100 denominations and 65 countries, and offers annual conferences, adult and youth curricula, a curated bookstore, multi-media resources, award-winning publications, and a blog. Learn more at cbeinternational.org.

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