20 episodes

Too often business leaders are forced to choose between the needs of their company and the needs of their employees. It’s a lose/lose scenario leaving managers burned out and workers seeking other opportunities. At Work for Humans, we believe work can be designed differently. When you design work like products people love, your company wins. Work becomes irresistible, employees passionately buy into their roles every day, and your company takes measurable strides towards your vision.

Work For Humans Dart Lindsley

    • Business
    • 5.0 • 19 Ratings

Too often business leaders are forced to choose between the needs of their company and the needs of their employees. It’s a lose/lose scenario leaving managers burned out and workers seeking other opportunities. At Work for Humans, we believe work can be designed differently. When you design work like products people love, your company wins. Work becomes irresistible, employees passionately buy into their roles every day, and your company takes measurable strides towards your vision.

    Seeing Like a State: How Tops-Down Management Styles Create Disaster in Complex Systems | William Hurst

    Seeing Like a State: How Tops-Down Management Styles Create Disaster in Complex Systems | William Hurst

    William Hurst is all too familiar with the disasters that have resulted from tops-down governance. William has documented firsthand the chaos that ensues when decision-makers remain isolated from the realities of life on the ground in his decades of fieldwork in China and Indonesia. In this episode, Dart and William explore how companies experience similar problems when they try and optimize complex systems for narrow outcomes.

    William is the Chong Hua Professor of Chinese Development at Cambridge where his research focuses on Chinese and Indonesian politics. He is the author of Ruling Before the Law: the Politics of Legal Regimes in China and Indonesia and The Chinese Worker After Socialism.

    In this episode, Dart and William discuss:
    - Seeing Like a State, and other works from James C. Scott
    - How behavioral economics has reshaped our thinking of “the rational actor”
    - The failure of governments to optimize complex systems for specific outcomes
    - High modern authoritarianism, and how it shows up in our companies
    - The inseparable relationship between states, coercion, and violence
    - The limitations of tops-down management styles to govern at scale
    - How good intentions led to the starvation of 35 million people in China
    - The unstable future of China’s economy
    - The qualities that make work meaningful
    - And other topics…

    William Hurst is the Chong Hua Professor of Chinese Development at Cambridge where he works on labor politics, contentious politics, political economy, and the politics of law and legal institutions, principally in China and Indonesia. Prior to Cambridge, William spent 8 years at Northwestern University where he served as the Professor of Political Science. Before Northwestern, William was a postdoctoral fellow at Oxford and an assistant professor at the Universities of Texas and Toronto.

    William is the author of several books including Ruling Before the Law: the Politics of Legal Regimes in China and Indonesia, and The Chinese Worker After Socialism. He is currently completing a book manuscript on the comparative politics of law and legal institutions in China and Indonesia since 1949.

    Resources Mentioned:
    Seeing Like a State, by James C. Scott: https://www.amazon.com/Seeing-like-State-Certain-Condition/dp/0300078153
    Weapons of the Weak, by James C. Scott: https://www.amazon.com/Weapons-Weak-Everyday-Peasant-Resistance/dp/0300036418
    Moral Economy of the Peasant, by James C. Scott: https://www.amazon.com/Moral-Economy-Peasant-Rebellion-Subsistence/dp/0300021909
    Against the Grain, by James C. Scott: https://www.amazon.com/Against-Grain-History-Earliest-States-ebook/dp/B0747RTP2W
    Hidden Transcripts and the Arts of Resistance, by Richard A. Horsley: https://www.amazon.com/Hidden-Transcripts-Arts-Resistance-Applying/dp/9004130535
    Professor William Hurst at the University of Cambridge: https://www.devstudies.cam.ac.uk/ourpeople/williamhurst
    Scholarly publications by William Hurst: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=4YPbje4AAAAJ&hl=en&oi=sra

    • 1 hr 16 min
    The Number One Skill Organizations Will Need to Survive in the New Economy | Steve Cadigan

    The Number One Skill Organizations Will Need to Survive in the New Economy | Steve Cadigan

    Steve Cadigan’s boss at Electronic Arts was not happy when he resigned after one year to pursue what he saw as the opportunity of a lifetime – the chance to lead HR for a budding startup called LinkedIn. Unbeknownst to him, Steve was at the forefront of a new era of work – the era of high turnover and low tenure where employees are constantly hunting for new opportunities. According to Steve, how skillfully companies respond to this new norm will determine their survival in the new economy.

    Steve has spent more than 30 years in HR. He was named LinkedIn’s first Chief HR Officer and helped scale the company from 400 to 4,000 employees in less than four years. He later founded Cadigan Talent Ventures LLC, where he helps companies like Google and Twitter integrate learning into their work design to increase employee engagement and company growth.

    In this episode, Dart and Steve Discuss:
    - The current speed of innovation, and its threat to traditional companies
    - Hiring for adaptability instead of experience
    - The modern roots of workplace dissatisfaction
    - How Tesla, Amazon, and Microsoft leverage short tenure to their advantage
    - Ways to adapt in a culture of high turnover
    - The future value of specialization and generalization
    - Creating systems to grow talent internally
    - The value of traditional education in the new economy
    - Seven models for developing talent
    - And other topics…

    Steve Cadigan has been a cutting-edge expert in global human resources and talent strategy for 30 years, working with clients like Google, Twitter, BBC, Cisco, and GoPro. He is a keynote speaker, advisor, author, and the founder of Cadigan Talent Ventures LLC, where he works with fast-growing organizations to increase their sustainability, improve company culture, and adapt to the ever-changing future of work and talent acquisition.

    Before launching his firm, Steve became LinkedIn’s first Chief HR Officer, scaling the company from 400 to 4,000 employees in less than four years. His work has since led him to build talent solutions across six industries in 3 countries, from Silicon Valley to across the globe. Steve is a highly-coveted expert for news stations and publications as a regular contributor to Forbes and guest on CNBC and Bloomberg West. He has also spoken at conferences at the Harvard Business Review Summit, Stanford University, Google, The Ivey School of Business in Shanghai, and the University of Sydney, among others.

    Resources Mentioned:
    Workquake, by Steve Cadigan: https://www.amazon.com/Workquake-Embracing-Aftershocks-COVID-19-Working/dp/1645434265
    Development, social norms, and assignment to task, by Marcel Fafchamp: https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1019457108
    Get Talent, by Dr. Paul Green: https://www.amazon.com/Get-Talent-Interview-Actions-Results/dp/097714142X
    The Inside Gig, by Edie Goldberg: https://www.amazon.com/Inside-Gig-Boundaries-Unleashes-Organizational/dp/1928055605

    Connect with Steve:
    Steve Cadigan LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cadigan/
    Steve Cadigan website: https://stevecadigan.com/
    Steve Cadigan TikTok: @stevecadigan

    • 1 hr
    Future-Proof Your Skillset: How to Navigate the Changing Landscape of Work | Jim Carrick-Birtwell

    Future-Proof Your Skillset: How to Navigate the Changing Landscape of Work | Jim Carrick-Birtwell

    Imagine that you have two applicants for the same job. One is an Ivy-league graduate who is book-smart and has average soft skills. The second went to a college you’ve never heard of but can read a room, present with confidence, and solve interpersonal team issues. Your choice likely depends on the role, but Jim Carrick-Birtwell believes the second applicant has something every business should want.

    Jim is the CEO of Future Talent Learning, a brand that produces virtual learning programs for employers around the world. His work focuses on exploring the skills, mindsets, and behaviors businesses need to navigate the changing world of work. He aims to incorporate both humanness and the humanities to improve business outcomes.

    In this episode, Dart and Jim discuss the need for diversity and transferable soft skills in business, especially for students and young adults entering the workforce. They dive into how teams can improve skills like communication and empathy, as well as how managers can measure marginal gains in each area. Jim also talks about the effects of B Corp organizations, the importance of disagreements in the workplace, and how to optimize a business for multiple outcomes.

    Topics Include:
    -  The key to effective speeches and presentations
    -  Why education isn’t preparing young adults for employment
    -  How managers can teach soft skills
    -  The metric to measure human skill development
    -  Why businesses need spaces for thinking and emotional processing
    -  The facets of a B Corp
    -  Improving your work by being with non-like minded people
    -  Creating responsible leadership, businesses, and workplaces
    -  And much more…

    Jim Carrick-Birtwell has been an advocate of the humanities since he studied English Literature at Oxford University. Over the years, he began to see a divide between what students learn in school and what employment requires of them to succeed.

    To support education-to-employment initiatives, Jim became the CEO of Plotr CIC from 2012 to 2016, a platform for students and young adults backed by the Cabinet Office. He also forms part of the Barclays LifeSkills Advisory Council and The Foundation for Education Development Advisory Council.

    In 2004, Jim co-founded and became the CEO of Changeboard, now known as Future Talent Learning. This purpose-driven organization offers transformational learning experiences by increasing emotional intelligence, teaching soft skills, and creating more inclusive workplaces for over 50 employers around the world.

    Resources Mentioned:
    Future Talent Learning: www.futuretalentlearning.com
    Jim Carrick-Birtwell LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimcarrickbirtwell/?originalSubdomain=uk
    Seeing Like a State, by James C. Scott: https://www.amazon.com/Seeing-like-State-Certain-Condition/dp/0300078153
    Larry Fink’s annual letter to CEOs: https://www.blackrock.com/corporate/investor-relations/larry-fink-ceo-letter
    Values: Building a Better World for All, by Mark Carney: https://www.amazon.com/Values-Building-Better-World-All/dp/0771051557
    Rebel Ideas, by Mathew Syed: https://www.amazon.com/Rebel-Ideas-Power-Diverse-Thinking/dp/B088MH93MS

    • 1 hr 2 min
    Love Your Customers: How Customer Loyalty Trumps Profit Accounting As A Measurement of Longterm Business Health | Fred Reichheld

    Love Your Customers: How Customer Loyalty Trumps Profit Accounting As A Measurement of Longterm Business Health | Fred Reichheld

    Today we are featuring Fred Reichheld. Named by The Economist as the "high priest" of loyalty, Fred is the creator of the Net Promoter Score (NPS).

    More than two-thirds of Fortune 1000 companies have reportedly used the Net Promoter Score to measure customer experience including household names like Apple, Netflix, and Disney. According to Fred, however, the vast majority of companies are using it wrong.

    Today, Fred shares what businesses can do differently to create a truly successful, fulfilling, and energized organization that prioritizes its customers and energizes its employees.

    In this episode, Dart and Fred talk about viewing a company’s progress through the experience of its customers. They discuss why Fred believes organizations are built to love customers and enrich their lives, while leaders are meant to respect and recognize their employees. Fred also speaks about the importance of maximizing value in a business by creating value for its customers.

    Topics Include:
    - Mistakes companies make when measuring progress
    - The ideas behind Fred’s new book, Winning on Purpose
    - How to use emotional relationships to propel your business
    - Why Fred hopes "earned growth" will replace NPS
    - What creates energized employees
    - How to track net revenue retention
    - The best way to increase a company’s value
    - And other topics…

    Fred Reichheld is the creator of the Net Promoter Score and pioneer of the loyalty business model. His work guides two-thirds of Fortune 1000 companies that use the Net Promoter Score to outline their customer success.

    Fred is a New York Times best-selling author. As a Harvard alum, he also shares his knowledge through eight Harvard Business Review articles. He is a current Fellow at Bain & Company and has previously been named one of the top 25 consultants in the world by Consulting Magazine. His work has been covered by publications like The Wall Street Journal, New York Times, Fortune, Business Week, The Economist, and more.

    Fred’s groundbreaking concepts of “customer loyalty” and “Earned Growth Rate” have allowed him to restructure outdated business models. His teachings promote customer retention, repetition, and referrals spanning different industries. He continues to research, write, and speak about these topics across the country.

    Resources Mentioned:
    Winning on Purpose, by Fred Reichheld: https://www.amazon.com/Winning-Purpose-Unbeatable-Strategy-Customers/dp/1647821789/
    Fred Reichheld's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fredreichheld
    Net Promoter System: netpromotersystem.com
    NPSx System, by Bain: https://www.npsx.com/
    The Cold Start Problem, by Andrew Chen: https://www.amazon.com/The-Cold-Start-Problem/dp/B08MKNHSWC/

    • 59 min
    Physical Spaces and the Experience of Work: Reimagining the Future of Workspaces | Jeremy Neuner

    Physical Spaces and the Experience of Work: Reimagining the Future of Workspaces | Jeremy Neuner

    When we think about the experience of work, one thing to consider is the space work happens in. And for many of us, the space we work in has changed since the pandemic, opening an opportunity for companies to rethink their approach to workspaces.

    Meet Jeremy Neuner. Jeremy is the former CEO and co-founder of NextSpace, one of the first coworking spaces in the world. During Jeremy's time at NextSpace, he discovered that the experience of a space has as much to do with cultural norms and how the space is used as it does with the actual building design.

    In this episode, Dart and Jeremy discuss how to use language, rituals, and iconography to foster community at work. They also discuss the challenges of replicating quirkiness at scale while retaining authenticity, creating spaces that bolster a knowledge economy, the current state of our workplaces post-COVID, and much more.

    Topics Include:
    - The NextSpace coworking model
    - Selling people on a community
    - Examples of language, ritual, and iconography in the workplace
    - Designing workspaces
    - Creating a culture of autonomy, choice, and flexibility
    - Bonding versus bridging social capital
    - Prioritizing connection and collaboration over convenience
    - Google's experimentation with workspaces 
    - And other topics…

    Jeremy Neuner is the former CEO and co-founder of NextSpace, a collaborative coworking community where he and his team led the charge in the future of work. Jeremy is now the Startup Curriculum Lead and Head of Launchpad San Francisco at Google. Prior to this, he was a Navy pilot, a management consultant, and a local government official. Additionally, Jeremy spent time as a fellow at the Aspen Institute's Business and Society program where he studied the future of work with leaders of Fortune 500 companies.

    Books Mentioned:
    The Secret Lives of Buildings, by Edward Hollis: https://www.amazon.com/Secret-Lives-Buildings-Parthenon-Thirteen/dp/0312655363

    • 1 hr 6 min
    Bias Is Hurting Your Bottom Line, Here's How We Fix It | Anu Gupta

    Bias Is Hurting Your Bottom Line, Here's How We Fix It | Anu Gupta

    In this episode, we are joined by Anu Gupta, a sought-after expert in breaking bias, behavior change, and well-being.
    For the last 50 years or so, companies have spent billions of dollars and billions of hours trying to address the challenges of bias, inequity, diversity, and inclusion. Noticing this, Anu’s curiosity led him down a path to figure out why these companies weren’t making any headway.

    What he realized is that the work of addressing bias is one of behavior change — behavior change of individuals, teams, and of organizations.

    In this episode, Dart and Anu tackle the question of bias. They discuss what's being lost in our society, economy, and businesses because of bias, the difference between conscious and unconscious bias, the root causes of systemic racism in the U.S., interventions to measurably reduce bias in the workplace, the relationship between bias and belonging, and so much more.

    Topics Include:
    - Why should you care about bias as a leader
    - Bias in the legal system
    - Defining transitional justice
    - Four foundations of mindfulness
    - Examples of how biases are unique to different societies
    - The Racial Empathy Gap
    - Prosocial behavior
    - PRISM — The Five Tools to Break Bias
    - Corporate structure models for L3C’s and B Corps
    - And other topics…

    Anu Gupta is a lawyer, educator, scientist, and the Founder of BE MORE with Anu. He founded BE MORE in 2014 after seeing the social and financial harms of bias to individuals, organizations, and communities firsthand. He foresaw the numerous possibilities available when people have access to mindfulness practices and scientific wisdom. He synthesized his skills as an attorney, research scientist, and a meditation teacher to build programs centered on advancing equity and belonging unlike any that existed before.

    A peer-reviewed author and the principal investigator behind BE MORE’s research, Anu is a sought-after expert in breaking bias, behavior change, and well-being. He has extensively written and spoken about this work, including on the TED stage, SXSW, the Oprah Conversation, Fast Company, and Newsweek. Prior to founding BE MORE, he worked as an attorney, a research scientist, and a middle school teacher in the United States, Europe, and Asia. Anu is a trained mindfulness and yoga teacher (500-hours) and his meditations can be found on the Insight Timer, Open, and the Ten Percent Happier meditation apps. He also serves as a Systems Designer for Penn State Dickinson Law’s Antiracist Development Institute (ADI).

    REGISTER FOR THE BREAKING BIAS SUMMIT:
    Nov 3 & 4, 2022: https://breakingbiassummit.vfairs.com/

    Resources Mentioned:
    BE MORE with Anu: https://bemorewithanu.com/
    @bemorewithanu on all social channels
    Harvard Implicit Association Test (IAT): https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/takeatest.html
    Sapiens: A Brief History of Humankind, by Yuval Noah Harari: https://www.amazon.com/Sapiens-Humankind-Yuval-Noah-Harari/dp/0062316095

    • 1 hr 13 min

Customer Reviews

5.0 out of 5
19 Ratings

19 Ratings

Shalverm ,

Incredible podcast

Absolutely fascinating, thought provoking and educational episodes with thought leadership and practical tools and techniques to create the ultimate work experience as a product…ways to maximize productivity and wellbeing.

Gaming mamma ,

Feed your brain and your soul

I love Dart’s podcast! Besides being a great interviewer and conversationalist, he is well-read and intelligent, making the conversations among my favorites to listen to. I am also passionate about brining humanity into the workplace, but even moreso, I’m passionate about learning and broadening my perspectives. I can count on Dart to help me do that in every episode!

scha3521 ,

Superb!

This podcast provides such rich insights across so many domains and serves up transformative ideas for anyone in HR. Dart is a superb interviewer and makes the people he talks to come alive. Can’t recommend this podcast enough.

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