Been There Got Out Podcast

Chris & Lisa
  • 4.5 (27)
  • Self-Improvement
  • Updated Semiweekly

Chris and Lisa of BeenThereGotOut.com both survived toxic marriages with narcissistic partners and the legal and co-parenting nightmares that go hand-in-hand with all of that.If you are struggling in a high-conflict relationship, divorce, custody battle, or co-parenting hell which requires PERSONALIZED attention, let us HOLD YOUR HAND along the way, while providing EXPERT, STRATEGIC guidance based on one's years of success (representing myself in court!), coupled with the other's High Conflict Divorce Coach certification.Our podcast features interviews with lawyers, therapists, co-parenting coordinators, guardians ad litem, and other subject matter experts, as well as other content, all with one goal in mind: Let us teach you how to HELP YOURSELF!

  1. 3d ago

    He Was Alienated From All 4 Kids... Then His Daughter Made This Call

    He hadn't heard from one of his four daughters in four years. Then she reached out. And the first thing she said changed everything. Jon McKenzie, founder of @malevictimsoffemalenarcissists (IG) and a returning BTGO guest, joins Lisa to share something that happened just two weeks before this recording: his adult daughter reached out after four years of complete silence, asked to rebuild their relationship, and opened with the words every alienated parent needs to hear: "I'm very sorry for the words I said. My words were very hurtful and disrespectful." If you've been told to "just wait," or you're wondering whether your adult children will ever come back, this conversation is the living proof that they can. And it gives you a philosophy and a framework for surviving the wait. IN THIS CONVERSATION: The two types of parental alienation — legally imposed separation vs. the quiet, psychological erosion that's often more devastating Why Jon chose not to divorce until his kids were out of high school — and whether, looking back, that was the right call The prodigal son framework: how Jon made peace with not chasing his children — and what 'waiting with open arms' actually costs a parent emotionally What his daughter said the moment she reached out — and why Jon didn't pull his punches in their first conversation How reconciliation with one adult child is opening a possible door with a second — while a third may be permanently enmeshed with their mother Why Jon refused to badmouth his ex to his children — even after years of alienation — and why he believes that was the single most important thing he did What he says to the client who says: 'If one more person tells me the kids will just figure it out, I'm going to lose my mind' GUEST INFO: Jon McKenzie Male Victims of Female Narcissists https://malevictimsoffemalenarcissists.com Jon's Instagram: @malevictimsoffemalenarcissists

    39 min

  2. 6d ago

    How to Negotiate with a Toxic Ex When You Feel Powerless

    Facing a negotiation with your high-conflict ex can feel like showing up to a battle already defeated — especially when they have more money, more confidence, or a better attorney. But corporate negotiation expert Lynn Price says the power imbalance you're feeling may be less real than you think. What IS real is whether you make the ask. Lynn spent 25 years as in-house corporate counsel and completed over 11,000 negotiations. In this conversation with Lisa Johnson, she breaks down her Three Rs Framework — Ready, Relatable, and Reasonable — and explains exactly how to apply it when you're co-parenting with someone determined to make your life miserable. In this episode, you'll learn: - The one mindset shift that lets you make the ask even when you feel powerless - How to use the 'have to haves / helpful haves / hopeful haves' system to walk into mediation with a clear, strategic game plan - Why you must stop talking after you make a request — and how to handle the silence - The acting technique that protects your most important priorities (your ex will never see it coming) - How to build enough rapport with a difficult person to actually move the negotiation forward - A general rule from a retired army general that will keep you out of trouble in every difficult conversation - Why practicing out loud — even to your mirror or your dog — can change how you show up in mediation - How to use AI to prepare for your next difficult conversation with your co-parent Lisa and Lynn also explore the difference between negotiation and mediation, the psychology of letting the other side 'win' things that don't actually matter, and why knowing your 'walk-away' point before you sit down is one of the most powerful moves you can make. This isn't just theory — Lynn spent nearly 14 years in the construction industry, where her company had no leverage, going up against huge players and still getting what they needed. Her approach works on everyone from Fortune 500 executives to toxic co-parents. And it can work for you. If you're heading into custody mediation, a co-parenting negotiation, or just trying to get your ex to switch a weekend, this conversation will change how you approach it. About Lynn Price: Lynn Price is a negotiation speaker, trainer, and attorney. She spent over 25 years as in-house corporate counsel, completing more than 11,000 negotiations. Website: lynnpriceconsulting.com Book: 'Negotiate It!' on Amazon 📲 FOLLOW US: Instagram: @been_there_got_out #negotiationtips #highconflictdivorce #custodymediation #coparenting #toxicex #narcissistdivorce #custodybattle #divorcecoach #parentalalienation #familycourt

    38 min

  3. May 28

    Why Did the Judge Do That? A Former Family Court Judge Explains

    What does a family court judge actually think when you walk through those courtroom doors? If you have ever walked out of a hearing asking "why did the judge do THAT?" — this conversation is for you. Peggy Walsh spent 18 years as a family court judge — after first building her career representing parents, caregivers, and children as a family law attorney. Then she took off her robe. Not because she stopped caring, but because she believed that the people who love a child should be the ones making decisions for that child — not a stranger, however well-intentioned, in a black robe. Today, Peggy works as a co-parenting coach, helping parents stay out of court altogether — or, when court is unavoidable, understand exactly what to expect and how to show up effectively. In this conversation, Lisa and Peggy go deep on what family court actually looks like from the inside — and what most attorneys never tell their clients before they walk into that hearing. WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS INTERVIEW: ✅ Why judges assume BOTH parents are high conflict — and how that shapes everything they observe ✅ What judges really notice about demeanor (and why the person blurting things out in court isn't necessarily the problem outside of court) ✅ The one question you should always ask your attorney before your first court appearance — and why most attorneys forget to answer it ✅ What "forced resolution" vs. "compromised resolution" actually means — and why Peggy always preferred to help parents reach their own agreements ✅ The specific things only you know about your family that no judge ever could — and why that makes negotiated parenting plans almost always better ✅ What status conferences are, why Peggy loved using them, and how they can reduce conflict over time ✅ Why appearing to "want it all your way" in front of a judge rarely ends well — and what to do instead ✅ How to think about co-parenting communication as modeling behavior for your children — not just logistics management ✅ Why your child hears your tone of voice even when they are upstairs and cannot hear your words ✅ What it looks like to stop making your ex the "star of your show" — and why that shift changes everything THIS INTERVIEW IS ESSENTIAL IF YOU: - Are going to court and do not know what to expect - Are frustrated by a custody decision you do not understand - Are trying to build a parenting plan and wondering whether to negotiate or let the judge decide - Keep getting pulled back to court by a high-conflict co-parent - Want to understand what judges actually value — not what TV court dramas portray - Are ready to shift from reactive victim to proactive problem-solver in your case ABOUT PEGGY WALSH: Peggy Walsh is a retired family court judge who served for 18 years, primarily handling divorce and family law matters. Prior to her time on the bench, she represented parents, caregivers, and children as a family law attorney. She is now a co-parenting coach, helping parents navigate high-conflict situations, create workable parenting plans, and stay out of court whenever possible. Connect with Peggy Walsh: https://peggywalsh.com/

    30 min

  4. May 27

    What Reunification Therapy REALLY Is (And Why Courts Get It Wrong)

    🔁 Dr. Premela Deck is back — and this time, she's going deeper. If you're navigating reunification therapy, supervised visitation, or simply trying to understand why court-ordered therapy isn't fixing anything, this is the conversation you've been waiting for. Dr. Premela Deck holds a rare trifecta of credentials: she's a family law attorney, a Licensed Independent Clinical Social Worker (LICSW), and a PhD-level social worker who has spent her career studying high-conflict families. Her practice, ST Family Services in Massachusetts, brings together psychologists, social workers, attorneys, and even a retired judge under one roof. In this episode, Lisa and Premela do something a little different: they brainstorm the questions that most parents in our community are too scared — or too confused — to ask. And what comes out of that conversation is some of the most practical, grounding guidance we've ever put on this channel. ⏱ TIMESTAMPS 00:00 Introduction — Dr. Premela Deck Returns 00:55 Real client case: the supervised visit that fell apart before it started 04:10 Why court orders and clinical interventions are often in conflict 06:30 The prep work that HAS to happen before any supervised visit 09:00 What you should ACTUALLY tell your child about supervised visitation 11:20 How removing the loyalty bind can unlock the relationship 13:10 Dr. Premela Deck introduces herself and ST Family Services 15:30 The collaborative model: why siloed professionals fail families 17:45 What should a child be told about supervised visits? (Full question) 20:00 How to handle transitions when a child is crying or dysregulated 22:15 "I can't force her — she's traumatized": how to respond to this message 25:10 How parenting plans (and their vagueness) impact reunification 27:30 The silver bullet strategy — and why it blows up cases 30:20 Your attorney is your employee: taking strategic oversight of your case 32:00 Coercive co-parenting: "my ex is abusive — what do I do?" 34:15 What to prepare before meeting a reunification therapist for the first time 36:40 When a child is a teenager: what force is (and isn't) in this work 38:50 Making a good impression on therapists and court professionals 40:30 Who should pay for therapy when "you're the problem"? 42:10 Will a charismatic, narcissistic ex fool the therapist? 44:20 What is a parentectomy? 46:00 "Breadcrumbs": how to keep the door open when you need to step back 48:30 Parental rights vs. children's best interest — when they collide 50:00 Looking ahead: webinars, court order strategy, and what's coming next #ParentalAlienation #ReunificationTherapy #HighConflictDivorce #CustodyBattle #FamilyTherapy #SupervisedVisitation #NarcissisticAbuse #CoParenting #FamilyCourt #BeenThereGotOut #DrPremelaDeck

    28 min

  5. May 7

    4 Expert Techniques That Keep You Calm in Family Court

    If you have a court date coming up, a difficult phone call with your ex on the calendar, or you're just sick and tired of going blank exactly when you need to be sharp, this conversation is for you. Lisa sits down with Annie Brook, a body-centered somatic psychologist who has trained therapists for decades and spent time in courtrooms testifying for children. Annie brings something genuinely different to this conversation: not just the why behind the freeze, the anger, and the exhaustion you've been feeling, but practical, body-based tools you can use covertly, right now, even with a judge watching. In this episode, Annie explains: - Why hopelessness after a toxic relationship is neurological, not a character flaw - How your birth experience and earliest attachment moments may have shaped the "blind spots" your ex exploited - The science behind why you freeze when you're attacked in conversation or in court, and how to break it - Four covert grounding techniques you can use during a custody hearing without anyone knowing - The "hula hoop" exercise that rebuilds your sense of personal space and power - What "middle tone" is and why it's the secret to staying credible and relational under pressure - How self-attack thinking is not just emotionally exhausting — it may be affecting your physical health Annie Brook's website: https://www.anniebrook.com #NarcissisticAbuse #NervousSystemHealing #SomaticTherapy #FamilyCourt #HighConflictDivorce #ParentalAlienation #TraumaHealing #CoParenting #CustodyBattle #AnnieBrook #BeenThereGotOut

    43 min

  6. May 4

    Your Child Refuses Therapy: What an Art Therapist Says Do Instead

    Finding the right therapist for your child during a high-conflict divorce is one of the most important and misunderstood decisions you'll make. Most parents want immediate results. They want their child to sit down in session one and start processing everything that's been happening at home. But experienced art therapist Ahimsa Luciano has seen this expectation backfire again and again, and she has a more effective approach to share. In this conversation, Ahimsa breaks down what effective therapy for children in high-conflict situations actually looks like, why it takes longer than parents expect, and why that's not a bad thing. She explains how to match your child's personality to a therapeutic style, what to say when the other parent has told your child therapy means something is wrong with them, and exactly why the therapist can't be your source of custody intel, even when you desperately want updates. WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS EPISODE: - Why AI will never replace a human therapist, and what the 7-38-55 communication rule reveals about what's really missing - What makes an experienced intake truly different and why this first step is the most important one - How to give a resistant child space to open up, even when their world feels like it's in chaos - Why it can take months (or longer) before a child talks, and why that's not failure - How to handle a child who's been told therapy means they're damaged - a trauma-informed response that actually works - The truth about "parentification" in high-conflict families and its long-term impact on relationships and boundaries - Why children tell each parent something different and why that doesn't mean anyone is lying - What 'your child is fine with both parents' in an evaluation actually means, and why it's not the betrayal it feels like - Why custody exchanges are a major anxiety trigger for children and the specific harm of using kids as tools at handoffs - Questions to ask when choosing a therapist for your child including how to match personality type to therapeutic style - Why your child's therapy space must be private and what the therapist will and won't share with you ABOUT AHIMSA LUCIANO: Ahimsa Luciano is an art therapist licensed in New York State and the co-founder and co-owner of Pleasantville Wellness Group, a multidisciplinary therapy practice in Pleasantville, NY serving children through adults, couples, and families. She began her career at a domestic violence and sexual assault agency as the children's therapist — an experience that gave her deep roots in working with kids navigating high-conflict separations, divorce, and trauma. Pleasantville Wellness Group offers a broad range of therapeutic modalities including art therapy, play therapy, and individual and group services, and is currently in-network with NYSHIP, United Healthcare, and Oxford for New York State clients. Some therapists in the practice are also licensed in additional states.    https://www.pleasantvillewellnessgroup.com/home #highconflictdivorce #childtherapy #parentalalienation #coparenting #arttherapy #custodybattle #parentification #divorceandkids #traumainformedparenting #beentheregotout #kidsanddivorce #therapyforchildren

    40 min

  7. Apr 30

    What to Do the Moment Your Child Discloses Abuse

    If your child just told you something terrible — or if you're afraid they're trying to — this conversation is for you. Lisa sits down with Julia Hochstadt, a licensed clinical social worker specializing in trauma, childhood sexual abuse, sexual assault, and domestic violence. Julia works with adolescents (15+) and adults, including many parents navigating high-conflict custody situations where their children may be in danger. She also testifies as an expert witness in DV and intimate partner violence cases. This interview was recorded during Sexual Assault Awareness Month — but Julia's guidance is something every protective parent needs to hear, no matter what month it is. In this conversation, you'll hear: → The #1 thing Julia urges parents to do immediately when a child discloses abuse — and the exact words to say → Why disclosures can sound unbelievable — and why that doesn't mean they're not true → How years of gaslighting from an abusive partner erode your ability to trust your own instincts (and what to do about it) → The behavioral signs that should prompt a protective parent to lean in — not wait and watch → A practical, age-appropriate framework for building a child's safety plan — including how to plan for different times of day, different scenarios, and changing circumstances → Why Julia compares child safety planning to how the fire department talks about home fire safety — and why you should revisit it every time life transitions happen → What research says about the #1 protective factor for a child whose abuse was not properly addressed by the legal system → How to comfort a terrified child when you have to send them on a court-ordered exchange you know is unsafe Lisa also shares a real situation she encountered that same morning: a mother whose child disclosed the worst kind of abuse, survived two investigations that were not acted upon, and is now being forced into a form of reunification therapy that's making things dramatically worse. Julia's guidance for this mother, and for the many parents in this community who are living this nightmare, is both clinically grounded and deeply human. ABOUT JULIA HOCHSTADT, LCSW Julia is a licensed clinical social worker licensed to practice in New York and New Jersey. She specializes in primary and secondary survivors of childhood sexual abuse, sexual assault, and domestic violence. She does training, education, and outreach nationally, and testifies as an expert witness in DV and IPV cases. She is also available for consultation to individuals and clinicians nationwide. Website: https://therapywithjulia.com #ChildAbuse #ChildSafety #ParentalAlienation #HighConflictDivorce #ProtectiveParent #DomesticViolence #SafetyPlanning #ChildDisclosure #SexualAssaultAwarenessMonth #CustodyBattle #CoParenting #TraumaTherapist #BeenThereGotOut

    43 min

  8. Apr 27

    My Ex Is Using the Court System as a Weapon. What Can I Do?

    If you've ever sat in a courtroom waiting for a judge to address what your ex is doing... and walked out with nothing... AGAIN, you already know this truth in your bones: justice delayed is justice denied. Criminal defense attorney, legal analyst, and law professor James Porfido has spent more than 35 years watching the American legal system from every angle: as a prosecutor in the Morris County Prosecutor's Office, as a certified criminal trial attorney, and as a defense attorney for people caught in a system that often seemed designed to work against them. His book, Unequal Justice, is a frank accounting of what he witnessed. In this conversation with Lisa, James brings that rare "both sides of the courtroom" perspective to the world of high-conflict divorce and custody — and what he sees mirrors exactly what our community lives every day. In this episode, you'll learn: - Why family court cases drag on for months and years, and why judges often feel they have no choice - How a toxic ex uses court delays strategically to wear you down, separate you from your children, and drain your finances - What "parental alienation" looks like through the eyes of a criminal attorney who has represented falsely accused parents - How coached child testimony works and what it means for your case - The single most important thing to look for when hiring an attorney (hint: it's not their fees) - Why knowing the "lay of the land" in your local court system is as important as knowing the law - How court staff relationships can quietly determine whether your case moves forward... or stalls - James's framework for what questions to ask when interviewing a potential attorney About James Porfido   James Porfido is a New Jersey-based attorney with over 35 years of experience as both a prosecutor and criminal defense attorney. He is a Certified Criminal Trial Attorney, certified by the Supreme Court of New Jersey. He is currently of counsel at a 65-attorney New Jersey firm, an adjunct law professor teaching advocacy and persuasion at Seattle Law School, and a legal analyst who has provided commentary on high-profile cases including OJ Simpson, the Menendez brothers, and Scott Peterson. His book, Unequal Justice, is available on Amazon and Barnes & Noble. #HighConflictDivorce #FamilyCourt #ParentalAlienation #JusticeDelayed #CustodyBattle #FalseAllegations #DomesticViolence #CoerciveControl #BeenThereGotOut #UnequalJustice

    39 min
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4.5
out of 5
27 Ratings

About

Chris and Lisa of BeenThereGotOut.com both survived toxic marriages with narcissistic partners and the legal and co-parenting nightmares that go hand-in-hand with all of that.If you are struggling in a high-conflict relationship, divorce, custody battle, or co-parenting hell which requires PERSONALIZED attention, let us HOLD YOUR HAND along the way, while providing EXPERT, STRATEGIC guidance based on one's years of success (representing myself in court!), coupled with the other's High Conflict Divorce Coach certification.Our podcast features interviews with lawyers, therapists, co-parenting coordinators, guardians ad litem, and other subject matter experts, as well as other content, all with one goal in mind: Let us teach you how to HELP YOURSELF!

Information

  • Creator
    Chris & Lisa
  • Years Active
    2022 - 2026
  • Episodes
    359
  • Rating
    Clean
  • Copyright
    © 2026 BTGO, LLC
  • Show Website
    Been There Got Out Podcast

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