Divergent Conversations

Megan Anna Neff & Patrick Casale
  • 4.9 (416)
  • MENTAL HEALTH
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Dr. Megan Neff and Patrick Casale are two Neurodivergent therapists in a neurotypical world. During this podcast, they’ll talk about their own personal experiences as Autistic-ADHDers. They will reflect on their lived experience as AuDHD mental health professionals, and entrepreneurs, as well as offer clinical guidance, and support. Episodes will be conversational in nature, and they’ll interview other ND Folx to amplify the voices of other neurodivergent advocates and individuals as they share their authentic stories. New episodes will come out weekly, on all major platforms. Megan told Patrick, ”I’ll bring the chaos, You organize it.” This perfectly sums up their working relationship and friendship. Reflections of two neurodivergent clinicians. Raw, Vulnerable, Affirmative As Hell. Follow on instagram.com/divergentconversations Topics include Autism, ADHD, Sleep struggles, Chronic Illness, RSD, Alexithymia, Autistic burnout, Intersectionality, Neuroqueer, Creativity, OCD, Neurodivergence, Affirming Language, Small business ownership, Unpacking Internalized Ableism, and so much more. If you love the podcast, please leave us a 5 star review https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/divergent-conversations/id1662009631 Visit our website for all podcast episodes and sponsorship opportunities divergentpod.com Legal Disclaimer: The content provided in this podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered medical advice. Always consult a qualified healthcare provider or medical professional for personalized advice regarding any medical condition or treatment.

  1. 8M AGO

    FLASHBACK — Neurodivergent Realities, Rupture & Repair, and Podcast Updates

    Prioritizing wellness and authentic connection is essential for neurodivergent individuals, especially during times of low energy or change. This episode highlights how embracing interdependence, rest, and honest communication can support deeper well-being and resilience within both friendships and professional collaborations. In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, candidly discuss what led them to take a break from the podcast and how that pause deepened their understanding of self-care, boundaries, and the value of neurodivergent connection. Together, they share personal experiences of attachment wounds, rupture and repair, community building, and new season plans—without guest speakers, focusing on honest, relatable conversations between friends and colleagues. Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Discover a realistic and neurodivergent-affirming approach to wellness that acknowledges low energy periods, demand avoidance, and the vital importance of community and interdependence.Learn practical tools for navigating and repairing relationship ruptures, including how to get beneath content-driven arguments to the underlying attachment needs and emotions.Find validation and actionable self-care frameworks, from balancing self-soothing with self-nourishment to reimagining community as “mile deep, inch wide”—especially relevant in the current climate of heightened stress and activism. While reflecting on your own wellness and connections, consider how you might honor your needs for both rest and community support. Listen to this episode for an open, compassionate look at what real, sustainable neurodivergent wellness can look like. Articles and essays mentioned in this podcast: Dr. Neff’s article on rupture repair (written shortly after the experience discussed in this episode): https://neurodivergentinsights.com/rupture-repairIdentity Development Model Article (also discussed in this episode): https://neurodivergentinsights.substack.com/p/neurodivergent-identity-arcsTwo Forms of Self-Care by Dr. Daniel Wendler: https://neurodivergentinsights.com/two-forms-self-care Divergent Conversations Underground (a space to continue and deepen the conversation together) Divergent Conversations Underground: If you’d like to go deeper with us this season, we’re excited to stretch into more nuanced, searching conversations in community. https://divergentconversations.substack.com ———————————————————————————————— 🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast 🎙️a href="https://open.spotify.com/show/4yQhemvtxdBuLmHqtU7H2k"...

    49 min

  2. DEC 19

    FLASHBACK — Autistic Burnout City: Perpetual Sensory Hell

    Living with perpetual Autistic burnout can feel like navigating a world that’s always just a little too overwhelming, exhausting, or out of sync. For neurodivergent people, teasing apart burnout from depression and understanding how chronic sensory and emotional overload shapes daily life is not just challenging but key for self-advocacy and well-being. In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the lived experience of Autistic burnout. They share personal stories about perpetual exhaustion, reflect on the nuances that differentiate Autistic burnout from depression, and illustrate how life stressors, health challenges, and environmental demands converge to create what they jokingly call “perpetual sensory hell.” With humor and candor, they explore how burnout can signal deeper misalignment and the importance of understanding personal triggers, as well as highlight why these conversations matter so much for late-identified Autistic adults. Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Gain clarity on the difference between Autistic burnout and depression through real-life examples and practical markers—vital for anyone navigating neurodivergent mental health.Hear validating stories about sensory struggles, task exhaustion, and the havoc that chronic burnout can wreak, along with the role of major life changes, masking, and health conditions.Pick up concrete advice for recognizing your own burnout triggers, interpreting external and internal signals, and beginning to build a more resilient, neurodivergent-affirming life. If you’re navigating burnout or are curious about what “Autistic burnout” really means, this episode offers honest validation, practical wisdom, and a sense of solidarity. Discover how being seen and understood can be the first step out of perpetual burnout. Resources Neurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resources Divergent Conversations Podcast Episodes: Episode 2: Autistic Burnout (divergentpod.com/2)Episode 47: Autistic Burnout (Part 2): A Deep Dive Into The Diversity of Burnout (divergentpod.com/47) ———————————————————————————————— 🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast 🎙️Spotify 🎙️Apple 🎙️YouTube Music ▶️ a href="https://www.youtube.com/@divergentconversations" rel="noopener noreferrer"...

    48 min

  3. DEC 12

    FLASHBACK — Autistic Burnout City: How Sensory Input Impacts Burnout

    Burnout isn’t just about exhaustion—it’s a sensory experience that can leave neurodivergent people feeling stretched to the breaking point. When every sound, smell, or texture feels overwhelming, how do we navigate recovery and build resilience in a world that rarely slows down? In this flashback episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the connection between sensory processing and autistic burnout. They share candid reflections on their personal burnout cycles, explore how sensory overwhelm shapes emotional and cognitive well-being, and highlight the critical need for understanding individual sensory profiles. This conversation unpacks the realities of living through burnout—including the constant to-do lists, the elusive pursuit of “just right” sensory environments, and the importance of community support—while providing practical strategies for recovery and prevention. Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Discover how sensory overload and sensory needs play a major role in burnout for Autistic and ADHD people, and pick up strategies for managing sensory overwhelm even when "rest" isn’t an option.Hear honest, relatable insights from Patrick and Megan Anna about identifying sensory triggers, living with constant overwhelm, and unlearning narratives around "not being content"—plus the validating realization that everyone’s sensory profile and needs are truly unique.Get practical tools to help you map your own sensory landscape, communicate your needs, and take actionable steps toward burnout recovery and prevention—grounded in real-life experiences and evidence-based wisdom. If you’re feeling stretched thin by sensory and emotional demands, this episode is designed to help you understand why and start reclaiming what makes you feel safe, soothed, and genuinely well. Resources Neurodivergent Insights Resource on Autistic Burnout: neurodivergentinsights.com/burnout-resourcesThe Autistic Burnout Workbook by Dr. Megan Anna Neff: simonandschuster.com/books/The-Autistic-Burnout-Workbook/Megan-Anna-Neff/9781507223062Check out Neurodivergent Insights’ Library of Boundary Scripts (free resource): neurodivergentinsights.notion.site/Boundary-Statements-17da17a4bb8b80c9a45dc8ff9c651725 Sensory Checklists Sensory Preferences: neurodivergentinsights.com/sensory-preferences-the-complete-checklistSensory...

    53 min

  4. DEC 5

    Neurodivergent Identity Arc for Later-in-Life Discovery

    The journey to understanding and integrating a later-in-life neurodivergent identity is often filled with relief, confusion, pride, growth, and other complex emotions—all woven together in a unique, personal arc. In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the “neurodivergent identity arc”—a model that explores how people move from the state of not knowing they are neurodivergent to full integration into their identity. Drawing on Dr. Neff’s recent article, their own lived experiences, and patterns observed within neurodivergent communities, Patrick and Megan Anna unpack each stage’s challenges, risks, and transformative moments. Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Gain a nuanced understanding of the four phases many neurodivergent adults cycle through—from pre-encounter to integration. Hear how these arcs differ based on privilege, intersectionality, and support needs.Listen to deeply honest, relatable storytelling as both hosts openly share their own journeys with masking, diagnosis, community pride, and the tricky process of reconciling privilege with disability. Their vulnerability makes the conversation both illuminating and affirming.Discover practical insights on moving through identity formation at your own pace—including common pitfalls and growth points—and why showing yourself compassion for “wherever you are” matters more than fitting into a perfect idea of thriving. Whether you’re newly discovering your neurodivergent identity, feeling pride in community, or working toward greater self-acceptance, this episode offers an empathetic roadmap—and a reminder that your process is valid. Get insights about living, learning, and integrating neurodivergent identity in a complex world. Check out Dr. Neff’s Article on Neurodivergent Identity Arcs: neurodivergentinsights.substack.com/p/neurodivergent-identity-arcs ———————————————————————————————— 🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast 🎙️Spotify 🎙️Apple 🎙️YouTube Music ▶️ YouTube 💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground ———————————————————————————————— Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane & Resilient Mind Counseling✨ Jane: Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a...

    48 min

  5. NOV 28

    Navigating Suicidality and Safety for Neurodivergent Minds

    Content Warning: This episode talks about suicide and may be triggering. If you're in crisis or feeling unsafe, please reach out to a crisis line or local resources. We have provided some below. Suicidal ideation and risk are common among neurodivergent people, and talking openly about suicidality is hard, especially in a society where honesty about these thoughts is often met with fear, stigma, or misunderstanding. Navigating life with suicidal ideation can be an isolating experience, but knowing you're not alone and having resources and strategies at hand can make a life-saving difference. In this episode, Dr. Megan Anna Neff and Patrick Casale, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss suicidality in neurodivergent communities. They share personal stories, break down the spectrum from passive ideation to crisis, discuss the shortcomings of traditional mental health support systems, and offer practical tools for safety planning, reducing risk, and finding hope. Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Gain a clear, relatable understanding of the difference between chronic and acute suicidal ideation, including the nuanced ways this shows up for neurodivergent people.Learn practical and accessible tools: how to create a personalized safety plan, what “means reduction” really involves, and how to identify red flags in yourself or loved ones, all explained with sensitivity and real-world insight.Find validation and connection from hearing honest, stigma-free conversations about suicidality from mental health professionals who genuinely get it, and discover resources, grounding strategies, and hope for weathering difficult moments. If you or someone you care about has ever felt overwhelmed by thoughts of not wanting to exist, this episode offers education, real talk, and actionable strategies. Listen for life-affirming insight and ways to help yourself or others stay safe, seen, and supported. Resources Free Workbook by Neurodivergent Insights: neurodivergentinsights.com/free/the-neurodivergent-adapted-safety-planFor a list of US and International Crises Lines (including non-carceral lines): neurodivergentinsights.com/neurodivergent-crises-supportNational Mental Health Hotline: 988lifeline.orgInternational Association for Suicide Prevention: iasp.info/suicidalthoughtsCrisis Call Center: hopeline-nc.orgSeekHealing (North Carolina, USA): seekhealing.org International U.K.: Samaritans 116 123Canada: 988 or Talk Suicide Canada (1-833-456-4566)Australia: Lifeline 13 11 14 *Non-Carceral Lines Some crisis lines can lead to law enforcement involvement, which can put BIPOC and Trans people at risk. Here are non-carceral lines for BIPOC and Trans communities: Trans Lifeline Hotline: Call U.S. (877) 565-8860 or Canada (877) 330-6366BlackLine: Call 1 (800) 604-5841 or visit a href="https://www.callblackline.com/" rel="noopener noreferrer"...

    40 min

  6. NOV 21

    Is Everyone a Little Bit ADHD?

    The phrase "everyone’s a little bit ADHD" is coming up more and more lately—but for those who are genuinely ADHD, this can feel dismissive and invalidating. In a world speeding up with constant distractions and increasing demands, society has begun to blur the lines with what the actual difference is between experiencing ADHD traits and living with ADHD as a neurotype. In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the nuance behind “everyone's a little bit ADHD.” They unpack the social myths around distraction, impulsivity, and executive functioning in today’s society, share their own stories of late ADHD diagnosis, and reflect on the dangers of minimizing real challenges faced by ADHDers. With candid conversation, they differentiate between ADHD traits and diagnosis, explore the impact of undiagnosed ADHD, and discuss why oversimplification can be harmful. Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Learn the difference between ADHD traits that many may experience in a fast-paced world—and the lived disability of ADHD that involves real, sometimes dangerous, daily challenges.Hear personal stories from Patrick and Dr. Neff about late-in-life discovery, navigating shame and grief, and unpacking impulsivity, masking, and complicated relationships.Understand why phrases like “everyone’s a little bit ADHD” can be minimizing, and discover the real-world impact of misdiagnosis, missed support, and the need for greater societal awareness. If you’re curious about ADHD traits in non-ADHDers, or you want to better understand the real experiences of ADHDers, this episode offers insight into the “ADHD for everyone” myth. ———————————————————————————————— 🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast 🎙️Spotify 🎙️Apple 🎙️YouTube Music ▶️ YouTube 💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground ———————————————————————————————— Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane & Resilient Mind Counseling✨ Jane: Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves.  Jane helps with day-to-day admin, like scheduling, documentation, and billing, so you can stay focused on the care you give. Jane was built with clients in mind, too. With online booking and...

    35 min

  7. NOV 14

    Is Everyone a Little Bit Autistic?

    Hearing "everyone is a little bit Autistic" can feel invalidating and diminish the distinct experiences of Autistic individuals. These comments, often rooted in misunderstanding or attempted empathy, reveal how language shapes—and sometimes distorts—public understanding of Autism. In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the common phrase and idea that “everyone is a little bit Autistic.” They explore why this phrase is so prevalent, the intentions and real impacts behind such statements, and the crucial differences between having “Autistic traits” and living with the full Autistic experience. You’ll hear honest stories about disclosure, invalidation, and what “context sensitivity” really means in identifying Autism—and why language matters when advocating for neurodivergent needs. Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Gain a deeper understanding of why the phrase “everyone is a little bit Autistic” can be harmful, and get clear language for differentiating between having Autistic traits and being Autistic.Hear personal reflections from Patrick and Megan Anna on invalidation, masking, disclosure in professional and personal life, and what it’s like to receive common microaggressions—even from therapists and family members.Explore what truly defines the Autistic experience, including insightful discussion of “context sensitivity” as a key factor in proper identification, and how this impacts access to support, accommodations, and authentic self-acceptance. This conversation helps to unpack the phrase “everyone is a little Autistic,” and explores the difference between possessing “Autistic traits” and living with the unique neurological, sensory, and social realities of Autism. ———————————————————————————————— 🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast 🎙️Spotify 🎙️Apple 🎙️YouTube Music ▶️ YouTube 💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground ———————————————————————————————— Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane & Resilient Mind Counseling✨ Jane: Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves.  Jane helps with day-to-day admin, like scheduling, documentation, and billing, so you can stay focused on the care...

    33 min

  8. NOV 7

    Why ADHD Isn’t About Being Lazy or Unmotivated

    Struggling with being labeled "lazy" or "unmotivated" as someone with ADHD can fuel deep shame and misunderstanding. These stereotypes overlook the real challenges and complexities neurodivergent people face every day, especially when it comes to executive functioning and self-worth. In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the pervasive myth that ADHD is simply about lack of motivation or laziness. Through candid discussion, they explore the realities of inconsistent motivation, the role of shame and internalized ableism, the overlap and differences between ADHD and Autism, and their own personal experiences managing daily life, self-care, and executive functioning struggles. Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode: Gain real insight into why ADHDers often internalize harmful labels and what’s actually happening neurologically and emotionally beneath the surface of "laziness" or "lack of motivation."Hear honest stories from Patrick and Megan Anna about managing shame, tackling everyday executive functioning challenges, and embracing self-compassion as a neurodivergent adult.Explore how living with both ADHD and Autism can shape self-understanding, coping strategies, and the ongoing negotiation between passion, energy, and daily life demands. If you’ve ever wrestled with shame or frustration over "simple" tasks, or if you want to better understand the ADHD experience beyond stereotypes, this episode will help you rethink what motivation really looks like and why you’re not alone. ———————————————————————————————— 🎙️Listen to more episodes of the Divergent Conversations Podcast 🎙️Spotify 🎙️Apple 🎙️YouTube Music ▶️ YouTube 💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground ———————————————————————————————— Thanks to Our Sponsors: Jane & Resilient Mind Counseling✨ Jane: Jane is a practice management software and EMR that helps you balance caring for clients while growing your business. Co-founded by a multidisciplinary clinic owner and a developer with an eye for design, it’s built to fit the way that you work, supporting your practice as it grows and evolves.  Jane helps with day-to-day admin, like scheduling, documentation, and billing, so you can stay focused on the care you give. Jane was built with clients in mind, too. With online booking and secure online appointments (telehealth), your care stays accessible and easy to keep up with. To learn more about...

    39 min
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4.9
out of 5
416 Ratings

About

Dr. Megan Neff and Patrick Casale are two Neurodivergent therapists in a neurotypical world. During this podcast, they’ll talk about their own personal experiences as Autistic-ADHDers. They will reflect on their lived experience as AuDHD mental health professionals, and entrepreneurs, as well as offer clinical guidance, and support. Episodes will be conversational in nature, and they’ll interview other ND Folx to amplify the voices of other neurodivergent advocates and individuals as they share their authentic stories. New episodes will come out weekly, on all major platforms. Megan told Patrick, ”I’ll bring the chaos, You organize it.” This perfectly sums up their working relationship and friendship. Reflections of two neurodivergent clinicians. Raw, Vulnerable, Affirmative As Hell. Follow on instagram.com/divergentconversations Topics include Autism, ADHD, Sleep struggles, Chronic Illness, RSD, Alexithymia, Autistic burnout, Intersectionality, Neuroqueer, Creativity, OCD, Neurodivergence, Affirming Language, Small business ownership, Unpacking Internalized Ableism, and so much more. If you love the podcast, please leave us a 5 star review https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/divergent-conversations/id1662009631 Visit our website for all podcast episodes and sponsorship opportunities divergentpod.com Legal Disclaimer: The content provided in this podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered medical advice. Always consult a qualified healthcare provider or medical professional for personalized advice regarding any medical condition or treatment.

Information

  • Creator
    Megan Anna Neff & Patrick Casale
  • Years Active
    2022 - 2025
  • Episodes
    137
  • Rating
    Explicit
  • Copyright
    © Copyright 2022 All rights reserved.
  • Show Website
    Divergent Conversations

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