Surfing the Quicksand

Kathy Vines

Helping midlife women get unstuck – at home, at work, in our relationships, from ourselves – one chat at a time. Host Kathy Vines explores all sorts of ways we can get stuck and brings us together to see the possibility and strike a path forward and get UNstuck. Come for education, inspiration, entertainment, and action! Podcast Engineer: Nate Winchell Music: "Take Off," Luke Bergs & Waesto (licensed material) Presented by Clever Girl Organizing, Inc.

  1. 1d ago

    Less Friction, More Energy: Making Your Home Work Better in Midlife (Ep 208)

    What if the reason your home feels harder to manage isn’t that you need to try harder but that your home hasn’t adapted to the life and energy you have now?  Cindy Hendler has spent more than 34 years helping people care for their homes. Known as Clean Snob to more than a million followers across social media, Cindy brings together cleaning, habits, systems, and clutter to help people create homes that work with them instead of against them. She’s also the author of the upcoming The Silent Shift: The Hidden Connection Between Midlife, Energy, and Your Home.   In this conversation, Cindy and Kathy explore how the demands of midlife (caregiving, changing bodies, busy careers, shifting family responsibilities, and plain old exhaustion) can make household tasks that once felt manageable suddenly feel much harder.  Cindy introduces the idea of thinking about our daily capacity in terms of “energy bars.” Every task costs something, and when we’re already depleted, something that normally takes four energy bars might suddenly take twenty. The solution isn’t always more discipline. Sometimes it’s finding and eliminating the small points of friction that make everyday tasks harder than they need to be.   They also talk about recognizing the clues our homes give us: the pile that keeps reappearing, the coat that never makes it to the closet, or the cleaning job we keep avoiding. Instead, we should be designing systems around how people actually behave rather than how we think they should behave.   And as we move through midlife, Cindy encourages us to reconsider not only our systems, but also our tools and household roles. The mop that worked ten years ago may not be the best tool today, and the division of labor that worked for a couple for decades may leave either partner vulnerable if circumstances change.   Ultimately, the goal isn’t a Pinterest-perfect home. It’s a home that requires less from us and gives something back, a place that helps us recharge for everything happening outside its walls.   In This Episode, We Discuss  Why cleaning is only one piece of maintaining a functional home and how cleaning, clutter, habits, and systems work together.   How small points of friction quietly consume our limited time and energy.   Cindy’s “energy bars” concept for understanding why the same task can feel easy one day and overwhelming the next.   Why recurring piles and problem spots are clues, not failures.   How to adapt cleaning tools and routines as our physical abilities and energy change.   Why couples should understand each other’s household roles before illness, caregiving, or other changes force them to.   Simple ways to make cleaning easier   How Cindy turned a pandemic shutdown into the beginning of Clean Snob and a social media audience of more than a million people.     Resources and Mentions:  Find Cindy as Clean Snob across TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, and YouTube. Get her great tips and stay tuned for her upcoming book: The Silent Shift: The Hidden Connection Between Midlife, Energy, and Your Home.   Website: https://www.cleansnobpro.com/  TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@cleansnob  Instagram: https://instagram.com/cleansnob Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Cleansnob YouTube: https://youtube.com/@cleansnob  About Cindy Hendler  Cindy Hendler, aka CleanSnob, has spent 34 years as a professional housekeeper, working in thousands of homes and discovering how clutter, habits, and home systems impact stress, time, and energy. Today, she helps busy women create homes that reduce mental load and support them through midlife with simple, practical systems. She’s also the author of the upcoming book The Silent Shift: The Hidden Connection Between Midlife, Energy & Your Home.

    Less Friction, More Energy: Making Your Home Work Better in Midlife (Ep 208)
  2. Oct 15

    Small Acts, Big Impacts: Building Community One “What if?” at a Time (Ep 207)

    What happens when one bottle of water turns into a nonprofit?  When Christina Cheng-Patel's young son noticed a man standing in the Texas heat without water, she didn't know that a simple act of kindness would eventually grow into Under My Umbrella DFW, a grassroots nonprofit serving unhoused neighbors, families facing food insecurity, seniors, and children throughout the Dallas-Fort Worth area.  In this inspiring conversation, Christina shares how raising two sons shaped her philosophy of service, why she believes everyone deserves the dignity of choice, and how ordinary people can make an extraordinary difference without waiting for permission, funding, or perfect circumstances.  From creating holiday traditions for children living in shelters to mentoring teenage leaders and advocating for women through her "She Leads" workshops, Christina reminds us that meaningful change doesn't begin with resources. It begins with action.  Whether you're looking for ways to give back, raise compassionate children, or simply feel less overwhelmed by the world's biggest problems, this conversation offers a refreshing reminder that none of us has to solve everything. We just have to start somewhere.  In this episode, we discuss:  How one small act of kindness grew into a community-wide nonprofit   Why giving people choice is one of the greatest forms of dignity   Raising children who see service as a way of life, not a requirement  How children become leaders, and not just life-long helpers   The surprising statistic about funding for women and girls' programs   Why Christina believes everyone has something valuable to contribute, regardless of age or ability   The importance of taking care of yourself allows to continue taking care of others   Resources & Links  Visit Under My Umbrella DFW to learn more and to donate directly to programs that inspire you: https://www.under-my-umbrella.org/   FB: UnderMyUmbrellaDFW  IG: under_my_umbrella_dfw    Women and Girls’ Organizations receive about 2% of U.S. Philanthropy.    https://philanthropy.indianapolis.iu.edu/news-events/news/_news/2025/women-and-girls-2025.html   About Christina  Christina Cheng-Patel is the founder and Executive Director of Under My Umbrella DFW in Allen, Texas. She’s a single mother to the 2 sons who helped inspire the community service non-profit, daughter of immigrants, a pediatric researcher, and dog mom to a rescue pup.

    Small Acts, Big Impacts: Building Community One “What if?” at a Time (Ep 207)
  3. Oct 8

    Helped, Heard, or Hugged? How to Support a Friend Through Their Child's Gender Transition (Ep 206)

    When your child shares that they’re questioning their gender identity or beginning a gender transition, it can open up an entirely new journey for a parent, too, one that may bring love and support alongside surprise, confusion, fear, grief, and a lot of learning.  And when someone you care about is that parent, you may wonder: How do I show up? What should I say? What shouldn’t I ask? How can I support both my friend and their child?  In this episode of Surfing the Quicksand, Kathy talks with Wendy Williams, owner of Weave Wellbeing, a Mayo-trained and board-certified health and wellness coach who helps people navigate major life transitions. Wendy also facilitates support groups for parents of transgender and gender-diverse children, work informed by her own experience after her adult child came out as nonbinary.  Wendy shares what parents may experience as their child transitions, from adjusting long-held expectations and navigating names and pronouns to managing family dynamics and making space for their own emotions while continuing to support their child.  Kathy and Wendy also explore the role friends and family can play: listening without trying to solve, respecting privacy, avoiding intrusive questions, following the transitioning person’s lead, and sometimes simply asking, “Do you want to be helped, heard, or hugged?”  It’s a compassionate conversation about supporting someone through a transition you may not fully understand, without needing to have all the answers.  KEY TAKEAWAYS  A child’s transition is also a family transition. The transitioning person remains at the center, but parents, siblings and extended family are adapting too.  Complicated feelings can coexist with love and support. Surprise, confusion, fear, grief and a sense of loss can all be part of a parent's experience.  Good friends don't need to be experts; they need to be safe people. Listen, ask what your friend needs, respect privacy and don't rush to solutions. Wendy offers a helpful filter: “Do I need this information to do my job as a good friend?”  Don't get too far ahead of the family. While friends may be thinking about holidays, grandparents, school or legal changes, the family may still be dealing with tomorrow morning. Stay present and take things one step at a time.  RESOURCES AND LINKS  Wendy’s Website: https://www.weavewellbeing.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/wendy-williams-mm-nbc-hwc-2145671b6/  Wendy’s journal: https://www.weavewellbeing.com/journal  Families in transition: https://www.weavewellbeing.com/gender-transitions  TransFamily Support Services: https://transfamilysos.org  TransFamilies: https://transfamilies.org/  Human Rights Campaign — Supporting Transgender, Non-binary, and Gender-Expansive Children: https://www.hrc.org/resources/supporting-trans-non-binary-gender-expansive-children  Recommended Books  Gender: Your Guide, 2nd Edition, The Gender-Friendly Primer on What to Know, What to Say, and What to Do in the New Gender Culture, Lee Airton, PhD  It's About You Too, Tracy Whitmore  Raising Trans Kids, Rebecca Minor  The Conscious Parent's Guide to Gender Identity, Darlene Tando, LCSW  ABOUT WENDY WILLIAMS  Wendy Williams is a Mayo-trained, board-certified health and wellness coach and owner of Weave Wellbeing. She helps individuals, couples and groups navigate major life transitions, with a special focus on supporting parents of children going through gender transitions. She is also a trained facilitator with Transforming Families MN, helping lead support groups for parents of transgender children of all ages.

    Helped, Heard, or Hugged? How to Support a Friend Through Their Child's Gender Transition (Ep 206)
  4. Oct 1

    Before It Becomes a Family Feud: The Power of Elder Mediation (Ep 205)

    When aging parents need more support, family relationships can become strained quickly. Siblings disagree about caregiving, parents resist difficult conversations, emotions run high, and important decisions become harder to make.  Most people know elder law attorneys exist, but few have heard of elder mediation, a growing field designed to help families navigate conflict before it turns into litigation.  In this episode, Kathy talks with attorney, social worker, and elder mediator Sherri Elder about how mediation helps families move beyond arguments and toward productive conversations. Together they explore the difference between positions and interests, why communication often breaks down during caregiving, and how a neutral third party can help families preserve relationships while making difficult decisions.  Whether you're currently caring for aging parents or simply want to avoid future family conflict, this conversation introduces a resource that could change the way your family approaches some of life's hardest conversations.  Key Takeaways  Elder mediation is one of the best-kept secrets in caregiving.  Many families don't realize there's an option between struggling on their own and hiring litigators. Elder mediation creates a structured conversation that helps families work through conflict before relationships become permanently damaged.  Positions create conflict. Interests create solutions.  One sibling may insist Dad stay home while another believes he belongs in a nursing home. Those are positions. The shared interest, however, is usually much simpler:  "We all want Dad to be safe."  Once families identify shared interests, entirely new solutions often become possible.  Communication usually breaks down long before families ask for help.  By the time many families seek mediation, resentment has been building for years.  Sherri encourages families not to wait for crisis mode. Mediation can strengthen communication before relationships reach a breaking point.  The goal isn't winning. It's preserving relationships.  Unlike litigation, mediation isn't about defeating another family member.  It's about creating decisions everyone can live with while protecting relationships that will continue long after today's conflict has passed.  The older adult deserves a voice whenever possible.  Even when someone is experiencing cognitive decline or dementia, that doesn't automatically mean they should be excluded from important conversations.  Mediation intentionally works to include older adults whenever it's appropriate.    About Sherri Elder  Sherri Elder is an attorney, licensed social worker, and certified elder mediator based in Indianapolis. After more than 30 years practicing elder law, she expanded her work into elder mediation to help families navigate conflict surrounding aging parents, caregiving, estate issues, and family communication.  Unlike legal representation, elder mediation provides a neutral space where families can work together toward solutions while preserving important relationships.  Learn more at: https://elder-legal.com/

    Before It Becomes a Family Feud: The Power of Elder Mediation (Ep 205)
  5. Sep 24

    The Onion Years: Peeling Back the Layers of Caregiving

    What happens when life piles multiple challenges on top of each other before you've had time to process the first one?  In this deeply personal conversation, Kathy sits down with digital productivity coach and entrepreneur Deb Lee to talk about navigating a season filled with grief, caregiving, unexpected trauma, and personal growth.  Deb shares what it's like to live in a multicultural, multigenerational household while caring for her widowed mother, raising a teenager, supporting her husband's business, and running her own company. She reflects on the loss of her father, the complexities of supporting a grieving parent while managing her own grief, and the lessons she's learned about communication, control, and asking for help.  She also courageously shares, for the first time publicly, the story of surviving a violent carjacking and how that experience transformed her understanding of resilience, strength, and the kindness of strangers.  Throughout the conversation, Deb offers powerful insights about navigating uncertainty, leaning on your village, and discovering what you're truly capable of when life pushes you beyond your comfort zone.  If you've ever found yourself carrying multiple responsibilities while facing your own challenges, this episode is a reminder that strength isn't about avoiding hardship but finding your way through it.  In This Episode, We Discuss:  Living in a multicultural, multigenerational household   Supporting an aging parent through grief and transition   Navigating the loss of a parent while caregiving for another   Learning when and how to ask for help   Finding unexpected kindness from strangers   Managing a business during personal crises   Why communication matters in every relationship   Discovering resilience through life's hardest moments   Resources and Links:  Deb Lee’s Digital Productivity Consulting business: https://www.dallisonlee.com  Deb Lee’s Thrive Hive, her co-working and productivity community for solopreneurs  https://dallisonlee.com/thrive-hive-membership/   Instagram.com/dallisonlee  Facebook.com/dallisonlee  LinkedIn.com/in/dallisonlee  About Deb Lee:  Deb Lee is a digital productivity coach and founder of D. Allison Lee. She helps entrepreneurs and business leaders create systems, workflows, and habits that reduce overwhelm, prevent burnout, and make work feel more manageable and sustainable.  She is also the creator of Thrive Hive, a coworking and community space designed to help solo business owners stay focused, connected, and supported.

    The Onion Years: Peeling Back the Layers of Caregiving
  6. Sep 17

    It’s Finally My Turn: How an Empty-Nest Hobby Opened a Whole New Chapter

    What happens when the hobby you pick up as an empty nester unexpectedly becomes the foundation for an entirely new chapter of your life?  When Janis Daly’s youngest son was preparing to graduate from college, she started wondering what she would do with the time that had once been filled with parenting, work, and weekends traveling to her sons’ sporting events. A longtime history lover, Janis decided to finally explore a branch of her family tree she knew little about.   That curiosity led her to an ancestor, William Shannon Peirce, a Philadelphia lawyer, judge, abolitionist, and founder of the Woman’s Medical College of Pennsylvania. One discovery led to another, and Janis became fascinated by the pioneering women who became doctors at a time when fewer than five percent of physicians were women. She knew their stories deserved to be told.   There was just one problem: Janis had never planned to become a writer.  She learned how to write historical fiction while researching her first novel, eventually publishing The Unlocked Path all while continuing her full-time career in marketing and sales. Then, just weeks before the release of her second book, an unexpected corporate restructuring eliminated the job she’d held for 18 years.   Instead of allowing someone else to decide her career was finished, Janis began putting the pieces of her seemingly separate experiences together: marketing, sales, networking, public speaking, genealogy, historical research, and writing.   This conversation is about curiosity, lifelong learning, and the surprising ways one chapter of our lives can prepare us for the next, even when we have no idea where the story is going.  In This Episode  How approaching the empty nest prompted Janis to ask, “What’s next for me?”   The genealogy discovery that introduced her to the forgotten history of America’s early women physicians   Why Janis chose historical fiction as the way to bring those women’s stories to a wider audience   Learning an entirely new craft later in life and becoming a first-time novelist   How skills from her previous career became the building blocks for her next one   Resources and Mentions:   Janis shares information about her books, speaking engagements, genealogy workshops, newsletter, and Women’s History Month historical-fiction program through her website. Her novels are available in multiple formats and can also be requested through bookstores and libraries. She can also be found on Facebook and Instagram.   Janis’ books are available in multiple formats on Amazon: https://amzn.to/4gDUmB4 (ad link) and can be requested through bookstores and libraries.   website: www.janisrdaly.com newsletter sign-up: www.janisrdaly.com/newsletter Facebook: @janisrobinsondalyauthor Instagram: @janisrdaly_writer  YouTube: @JanisDaly  About Janis Robinson Daly:   Inspired by discovering an ancestor founded the Woman’s Medical College of PA in 1850, Daly published her first novel at the age of 60.   The Unlocked Path celebrates pioneering women doctors at the turn of the 20th Century.   The Path Beneath Her Feet, honors the work of the American Women’s Hospitals in rural America during the 1930s.   Her third book, Under Two Flags, is a retelling of a memoir of a young Boston woman who travels to Berlin in 1916 to study opera. The original memoir, With Old Glory in Berlin, published in 1918, was ghostwritten by Daly's grandfather, Eliot H. Robinson, Sr.  Her annual literary citizenship program, #31titleswomeninhistory, has gained recognition from historical fiction authors and avid readers as an innovative way to celebrate Women's History Month in March.  Daly is a sought-after speaker for book clubs, women’s groups, libraries, and writers’ groups. In addition, she leverages her career in corporate sales and marketing to offer authors marketing consultancy service to assist other writers navigate book marketing.

    It’s Finally My Turn: How an Empty-Nest Hobby Opened a Whole New Chapter
  7. Sep 10

    College Is Just a Steppingstone. Adulting Is the Goal

    Preparing a teenager for life after high school has become one of the most stressful milestones many families face. Questions about college, careers, student debt, AI, gap years, and an uncertain future can leave both parents and teens feeling overwhelmed.  In this episode, Kathy talks with Shellee Howard, founder of College Ready and an award-winning college strategist with nearly two decades of experience helping families navigate this journey. Rather than focusing solely on admissions, Shellee challenges parents to think differently: the real goal isn't getting into college; it is helping young people become confident adults who know themselves and are prepared for whatever comes next.  Together they discuss why community service is such a powerful confidence-builder, how to help teens discover their strengths, why many students become paralyzed by fear, and how families can approach college planning without losing their minds or their money.  Whether you're raising a high school student, mentoring young adults, or simply interested in how today's generation is navigating an increasingly complex world, this conversation offers practical guidance and plenty of hope.  In This Episode  Why Shellee believes college is only a steppingstone—not the destination   Helping teenagers discover strengths before choosing a major   The surprising role community service plays in confidence and career clarity   Why today's teens often freeze instead of trying   Understanding the influence of social media, comparison, and fear of failure   The growing impact of AI on career planning   When a gap year makes sense and when it doesn't   How parents and teens can communicate more effectively about the future   Resources families can use to reduce stress around college planning   Resources Mentioned  Get Shellee’s Book, How to Send Your Student to College Without Losing Your Mind or Your Money, on Amazon: https://amzn.to/4fTUkno (ad link)   Free Strategy Call with Shellee: https://collegereadyplan.info/  Shellee’s Free Resources, including a Student Path Quiz and Student Aid Index Calculator: https://collegereadyplan.com/resources/   Shellee’s non-profit foundation and action organization: https://empowereducation.world/   Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/collegereadyplan/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/CollegeReadyPlan/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/college-ready Website: https://collegereadyplan.com/  About Shellee Howard  Shellee Howard is the founder and CEO of College Ready, a 2026 Global Educational Consultant of the Year, UC graduate, and mom of four debt-free college grads—including a Harvard pre-med alumnus. She’s helped families worldwide earn top-choice acceptances and over $80 million in scholarships.

    College Is Just a Steppingstone. Adulting Is the Goal
  8. Sep 3

    And We’re Back! Season 2 of Surfing the Quicksand is here! (Ep 201)

    After a summer spent meeting new people, recording new conversations, and thinking about what I want this next season to be, I’m excited to be back in your ears and on your screens for another “school year” together.  This season, we’ll continue exploring the challenges, transitions, and possibilities of midlife, with conversations about reinvention, resilience, caregiving, relationships, work, learning, community, and more.  But one idea is already emerging especially strongly for me: the quicksand is layered.  Rarely are we dealing with just one thing. Career frustration happens alongside caregiving. Parenting challenges arrive when life already feels heavy. Relationship changes, aging parents, menopause, questions about what’s next? They overlap. And sometimes it’s the weight of all those layers, rather than any single one, that leaves us feeling stuck.  Season 2 will make room for those layers, while also bringing you stories of hope, creativity, reinvention, and women who have looked at a need in their communities or their own lives and asked, “What if I could do something?”  My hope is that Surfing the Quicksand continues to be a place where you feel nurtured, inspired, educated, entertained, and a little less alone as you navigate this stage of life.  And I’d love your help shaping where we go next. If there’s a topic you want to hear about or an amazing woman you think I should meet, please reach out at Kathy@quicksandpod.com or find me on social media.  Welcome back. I’m so glad you’re here for Season 2.

    And We’re Back! Season 2 of Surfing the Quicksand is here! (Ep 201)
5
out of 5
14 Ratings

About

Helping midlife women get unstuck – at home, at work, in our relationships, from ourselves – one chat at a time. Host Kathy Vines explores all sorts of ways we can get stuck and brings us together to see the possibility and strike a path forward and get UNstuck. Come for education, inspiration, entertainment, and action! Podcast Engineer: Nate Winchell Music: "Take Off," Luke Bergs & Waesto (licensed material) Presented by Clever Girl Organizing, Inc.

You Might Also Like