Today, Matt speaks with Katie Surma, reporter at Inside Climate News and one of the world’s leading journalists covering the rights of nature movement. Katie has covered the movement across four continents, and in this conversation she and Matt take stock of where things stand: the wins, the rollbacks, and the road ahead. They discuss the groundbreaking Indigenous-led treaty recognizing whales’ rights in New Zealand, scientists using AI to decode sperm whale language, and how Ecuador’s constitutional rights of nature have survived repeated political attacks. They also dig into why rights of nature laws keep getting preempted in the U.S., what a private attorney general model for nature’s rights could look like, and Katie’s recent reporting showing communities of color lose access to green space at three times the rate of white communities. Plus: what’s happening in Argentina under Milei, and where Katie is headed next on her reporting trips to South America. Read Katie’s work at Inside Climate News: https://insideclimatenews.org/profile/katie-surma/ Subscribe now on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get podcasts. Katie’s Bio: Katie Surma is a reporter at Inside Climate News, where she covers the rights of nature movement and international environmental justice. A former commercial litigator, she brought her legal training to investigative journalism after a mid-career switch and has since become one of the most recognized voices reporting on how courts, constitutions, and international law are being reshaped to recognize the rights of rivers, animals, and ecosystems. Her work has been recognized by the Overseas Press Club, the Society of International Journalists, and the Society of American Business Editors and Writers. Episode Resources Katie on Inside Climate News: https://insideclimatenews.org/profile/katie-surma/ A Climate Change on Apple: https://bit.ly/accapplepodcast A Climate Change on Spotify: https://bit.ly/accspotifypodcast A Climate Change on YouTube: https://bit.ly/ACCvids More About A Climate Change with Matt Matern A Climate Change with Matt Matern is a podcast dedicated to addressing the pressing issue of climate change while inspiring action and fostering a sustainable future. Each episode dives deep into the environmental challenges of our time, rising global temperatures, extreme weather events, and resource degradation, breaking down complex topics into digestible insights. The podcast goes beyond merely raising awareness. It serves as a trusted resource for practical, actionable solutions that empower listeners to reduce their carbon footprint and drive change in their communities. With a strong focus on environmental science and expert perspectives, host Matt Matern brings influential voices to the forefront, highlighting innovative ideas and collaborative efforts shaping global sustainability initiatives. More than just a source of information, A Climate Change is a movement. It builds a coalition of like-minded individuals committed to preserving the planet for future generations. Listeners are invited to participate actively in creating a legacy of positive environmental impact through informed decision-making and collective action. The podcast, available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube, provides a platform for science-backed discussions, global perspectives, and community building. Whether you want to learn about renewable energy, sustainable living practices, or climate policy, A Climate Change with Matt Matern equips you with the tools and knowledge to make a tangible difference. Tune in, take action, and join the fight for a brighter, greener future. Curated List of Episodes If you enjoyed this episode of A Climate Change, here is a list of some recent episodes curated especially for you: Simulating the Future: How Climate Models Shape Policy Decisions with Andrew Jones How Personal Change Sparks Global Impact: Joshua Spodek’s Sustainability Secrets Bill McKibben on Renewable Energy, Political Battles & Hope for the Planet